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[Patch 3.07: Nerf Everything Not Nami] General Discussion…

Forum Index > LoL General
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Looks like we're back to status quo. Hope more of you lurkers unburrow and talk with us. :3

If you have any issues or comments about the new design, feel free to PM Neo.
AsnSensation
Profile Joined April 2011
Germany24009 Posts
June 07 2013 18:02 GMT
#6161
holy shit so it's real, CR$ Edward haha who would have expected that. I imagine he didn't even got that offer before the announcement of his departure from Gambit, because there was some talks on reddit from russian community members that he had a new russian team but it quickly disbanded which means Liquid probably proposed the deal 2-3 days ago and they quickly came to an agreement.

Russian KBG spy in NA LCS incoming
AsmodeusXI
Profile Blog Joined July 2007
United States15536 Posts
June 07 2013 18:04 GMT
#6162
AW MAN DO I HAVE TO REDO THE HYPE THREAD NAO?!

+ Show Spoiler +
lol no, next season... there's no guarantee the roster won't change again
WriterTL > RL. BNet: Asmodeus#1187 - LoL: DJForeclosure - Steam: asmodeusxi | www.n3rddimension.com
Sandster
Profile Joined November 2006
United States4054 Posts
Last Edited: 2013-06-07 18:10:46
June 07 2013 18:08 GMT
#6163
MMR is not a true indicator of overall skill. It only reflects how you reached that MMR. For example, compare someone below of equal MMR:

Someone who plays 80+% of their games on one champion, vs
Someone who plays all roles and several champs per role

The first person will probably beat the 2nd one in lane with his chosen champion, especially at lower leagues where people have very little experience in many lane matchups and have terrible feel for how to trade advantageously. However it doesn't mean he's an overall better player.

And I'm sorry if that guy is on your team when he doesn't get his only proficient champion.

EDIT: I don't mean that higher MMR doesn't mean higher overall skill level; just saying that, in any given game, two people of similar MMR can have vastly different skill levels in that matchup.
Numy
Profile Blog Joined June 2010
South Africa35471 Posts
June 07 2013 18:12 GMT
#6164
On June 08 2013 02:59 zer0das wrote:
Show nested quote +
On June 08 2013 02:28 TheYango wrote:
On June 08 2013 02:22 Numy wrote:
Seems I've hit the gold tier where everything thinks they the best thing ever and they just can't carry because their team is too heavy ;(

There's that middle band of players always that are terrible but aren't so terrible for it to be obvious how terrible they are, so they think they're good.


Gold league, where I get Malph players who build pure armor against AP tops and never ward and wonder why they're 1/6.

The sad thing is, when I check their division, they're about the same as me more often than not. I keep thinking to myself if people who can't even ward can make gold, surely I'm going to make plat one day (hopefully within the week).


I've fine with people being bad honestly. I mean I'm not that great at this game either but it's those people that think they gods gift to the game that annoy me to know end. Nothing they do is wrong and everyone else is at fault.
zer0das
Profile Blog Joined May 2007
United States8519 Posts
June 07 2013 18:15 GMT
#6165
If you get far enough along, they slowly start becoming a smaller percent of the people you encounter. You start encountering more ragers who are good though, so there's a bit of a trade off. >_>
Mensol
Profile Joined September 2012
14536 Posts
June 07 2013 18:23 GMT
#6166
On June 05 2013 05:53 Mensol wrote:
edward to fnatic? nope because nRated is fnatic's shotcaller.
edward to EG? nope cuz there is fkn krepo.
edward to NiP? nope, they have all-Denmark roster.
edward to SK? nope, you simply cant seperate candypanda and nyph.
edward to MYM? nope, they have all-Polish roster
edward to SNS? NO, because NO..
edward to ATN? maybe? Creaton is quite good, ed and creaton would be amazing.

Edward to Crs? most likely if he dont have visa issues.


WHERE IS MY MEDAL?
If you don't know what the fuck you are doing, how are your enemies supposed to know what the fuck you are doing. - imaqtpie on NA teams at Worlds.
Lylat
Profile Joined August 2009
France8575 Posts
June 07 2013 18:26 GMT
#6167
On June 08 2013 03:23 Mensol wrote:
Show nested quote +
On June 05 2013 05:53 Mensol wrote:
edward to fnatic? nope because nRated is fnatic's shotcaller.
edward to EG? nope cuz there is fkn krepo.
edward to NiP? nope, they have all-Denmark roster.
edward to SK? nope, you simply cant seperate candypanda and nyph.
edward to MYM? nope, they have all-Polish roster
edward to SNS? NO, because NO..
edward to ATN? maybe? Creaton is quite good, ed and creaton would be amazing.

Edward to Crs? most likely if he dont have visa issues.


WHERE IS MY MEDAL?

*doesn't
bmn
Profile Joined August 2010
886 Posts
June 07 2013 18:27 GMT
#6168
On June 08 2013 03:08 Sandster wrote:
MMR is not a true indicator of overall skill. It only reflects how you reached that MMR. For example, compare someone below of equal MMR:

Someone who plays 80+% of their games on one champion, vs
Someone who plays all roles and several champs per role

The first person will probably beat the 2nd one in lane with his chosen champion, especially at lower leagues where people have very little experience in many lane matchups and have terrible feel for how to trade advantageously. However it doesn't mean he's an overall better player.

And I'm sorry if that guy is on your team when he doesn't get his only proficient champion.

EDIT: I don't mean that higher MMR doesn't mean higher overall skill level; just saying that, in any given game, two people of similar MMR can have vastly different skill levels in that matchup.


There is no true indicator of overall skill, since "overall skill" is such a vague and loaded concept.

There are many ways to win games, and especially at lower levels, there are many very easy ways to lose games by having a particular deficiency in one area regardless of whether you're relatively good in the other areas. As a (made-up) example, consider "mechanical skill" (knowledge of champion cooldowns and damages, and hence knowing when to all-in and when not to), teamplay (coordinating with your team, communicating how to act before team fights, rallying people to dragon/baron at appropriate times), and just baseline social skills (not being a jerk, knowing how to deal with jerks, knowing how to deescalate raging teams).

If you're absolutely atrocious at the latter two, you'll lose plenty of games -- especially at lower ELOs where it's so easy to make a team degenerate into senseless bickering (I can't speak for higher levels) even if you win your lane.
If you're good at the latter two, you don't need to win lane to carry games. You'll win plenty even with bad KDA scores just by virtue of making your entire team play more effectively together.
onlywonderboy
Profile Joined August 2012
United States23745 Posts
June 07 2013 18:27 GMT
#6169
Wow, I'm pretty pumped that this all turned out to be true. I figured they were gonna keep Cop around since his play is solid, and having a beast support like Edward is something Curse needed to round out their Bot lane woes. Also I had become a pretty big Edward fan ever since he started used Twitter so win-win for me lol.
RIP Ryan Davis / TL or Die / @onlywonderboy
nafta
Profile Joined August 2010
Bulgaria18893 Posts
June 07 2013 18:28 GMT
#6170
On June 08 2013 03:23 Mensol wrote:
Show nested quote +
On June 05 2013 05:53 Mensol wrote:
edward to fnatic? nope because nRated is fnatic's shotcaller.
edward to EG? nope cuz there is fkn krepo.
edward to NiP? nope, they have all-Denmark roster.
edward to SK? nope, you simply cant seperate candypanda and nyph.
edward to MYM? nope, they have all-Polish roster
edward to SNS? NO, because NO..
edward to ATN? maybe? Creaton is quite good, ed and creaton would be amazing.

Edward to Crs? most likely if he dont have visa issues.


WHERE IS MY MEDAL?


Gratz.

You are a siren.
GhandiEAGLE
Profile Blog Joined March 2011
United States20754 Posts
June 07 2013 18:33 GMT
#6171
On June 08 2013 03:23 Mensol wrote:
Show nested quote +
On June 05 2013 05:53 Mensol wrote:
edward to fnatic? nope because nRated is fnatic's shotcaller.
edward to EG? nope cuz there is fkn krepo.
edward to NiP? nope, they have all-Denmark roster.
edward to SK? nope, you simply cant seperate candypanda and nyph.
edward to MYM? nope, they have all-Polish roster
edward to SNS? NO, because NO..
edward to ATN? maybe? Creaton is quite good, ed and creaton would be amazing.

Edward to Crs? most likely if he dont have visa issues.


WHERE IS MY MEDAL?

Pewter City badge.

See I connected to Pokemon. Am I e-sports yet?
Oh, my achin' hands, from rakin' in grands, and breakin' in mic stands
gtrsrs
Profile Joined June 2010
United States9109 Posts
June 07 2013 18:33 GMT
#6172
damn, poor rhux
back to rhux city for him

i'm gonna be the devil's advocate and say that this doesn't work out, neither initially nor in the long run. can't see another alpha-male being very compatible with saint, especially if he's yelling at him in a different language. crs has a bad start, they blame cop, replace cop with... rhux?, rhux doesn't work out on AD either, the season closes, curse is up for relegation, they survive relegation and then ditch edward and have to find a new bot lane entirely
i play ... hearthstone =\^.^/= Winterfox
WaveofShadow
Profile Blog Joined April 2010
Canada31495 Posts
June 07 2013 18:35 GMT
#6173
On June 08 2013 03:28 nafta wrote:
Show nested quote +
On June 08 2013 03:23 Mensol wrote:
On June 05 2013 05:53 Mensol wrote:
edward to fnatic? nope because nRated is fnatic's shotcaller.
edward to EG? nope cuz there is fkn krepo.
edward to NiP? nope, they have all-Denmark roster.
edward to SK? nope, you simply cant seperate candypanda and nyph.
edward to MYM? nope, they have all-Polish roster
edward to SNS? NO, because NO..
edward to ATN? maybe? Creaton is quite good, ed and creaton would be amazing.

Edward to Crs? most likely if he dont have visa issues.


WHERE IS MY MEDAL?


Gratz.

You are a siren.

Played an ARAM with a Nami and I was Siren Cassiopeia and the Nami was saying hilarious shit about us being Sirens all game.
twitch.tv/waveofshadow ||| Winner of AHGL's So You Think You Can Cast! ||| Juicy Dad for lyfe ||| 'idk i get a kick out of stupid things' - Jarms Yarng
nafta
Profile Joined August 2010
Bulgaria18893 Posts
June 07 2013 18:36 GMT
#6174
On June 08 2013 03:35 WaveofShadow wrote:
Show nested quote +
On June 08 2013 03:28 nafta wrote:
On June 08 2013 03:23 Mensol wrote:
On June 05 2013 05:53 Mensol wrote:
edward to fnatic? nope because nRated is fnatic's shotcaller.
edward to EG? nope cuz there is fkn krepo.
edward to NiP? nope, they have all-Denmark roster.
edward to SK? nope, you simply cant seperate candypanda and nyph.
edward to MYM? nope, they have all-Polish roster
edward to SNS? NO, because NO..
edward to ATN? maybe? Creaton is quite good, ed and creaton would be amazing.

Edward to Crs? most likely if he dont have visa issues.


WHERE IS MY MEDAL?


Gratz.

You are a siren.

Played an ARAM with a Nami and I was Siren Cassiopeia and the Nami was saying hilarious shit about us being Sirens all game.


Every game I've played last few days all chat is just "I am a siren" and other jokes about them 24/7 :D.
Gahlo
Profile Joined February 2010
United States35173 Posts
Last Edited: 2013-06-07 18:45:07
June 07 2013 18:36 GMT
#6175
On June 08 2013 01:17 JonGalt wrote:
+ Show Spoiler +
On June 08 2013 01:06 Lylat wrote:
Show nested quote +
On June 08 2013 00:50 GhandiEAGLE wrote:
On June 08 2013 00:42 Gahlo wrote:
+ Show Spoiler +
Justicar != Justiciar

Poll: Should the ranking system be a valid top in GD?

DEMACIA! (23)
 
53%

No. (10)
 
23%

Absolutely, I'm super dumb. (6)
 
14%

Yes, I'm dumb. (2)
 
5%

Maybe. (2)
 
5%

43 total votes

Your vote: Should the ranking system be a valid top in GD?

(Vote): No.
(Vote): Yes, I'm dumb.
(Vote): Absolutely, I'm super dumb.
(Vote): Maybe.
(Vote): DEMACIA!



100% legit poll. Neo, the choice is clear.

Pls ban Pokemon discussion


Blasphemes!! Heretic!! Ban him!!

On June 08 2013 01:03 AsnSensation wrote:
Show nested quote +
On June 08 2013 00:40 onlywonderboy wrote:
+ Show Spoiler +
On June 08 2013 00:36 AsnSensation wrote:
Show nested quote +
On June 07 2013 22:35 Lylat wrote:
On June 07 2013 16:33 wei2coolman wrote:
Cop is an upgrade to Genja, but not by too much.
Curse real threat now though; Edward can carry cop in lane. No real weaknesses on Curse anymore.

CONFIRMED ON SAINT'S STREAM. hue.

Meh, don't think Cop is an upgrade at all, don't know why Genja gets so much hate.. Maybe because he's the less good player in the team ?
I'd argue that Darien looked like the weakest player in GG last season


I like Wei2 but it's getting rather annoying to read at least twice a weak how NA carries supposedly >>> their european peers

Call me biased since I'm european but yeah I'll give God aka Doublelift >>> any EU AD

but the rest hasn't shown anything significant that warrants a NA ad > Eu ad generalisation. By significant I mean an apparent skillgap between e.g. Froggen, Peke and Bjergsen (alex has been rather derpy since week 10 of lcs and at allstars) compared to NA Mids. And even that statement might be so true anymore, while we make fun of reginald in LR threads for his shitty tf mechanics or randomy 1v1 deaths, he is still carrying tsm hard with arguably less practice ( not sure how much he plays the game compared the rest since he has many solomid.net commitments. ManCloud and Link look really solid, as well.

To come back to NA ad's, none of the "new guys" (turtle, Nien, Zuna, Mashme etc) will get credit in my book unless they've proven themselves in international matches like Doublelift and (rather unsuccesfully) qtpie and Cop. Sry but I just don't see how it's so easy to say that they are >>Genja, Yellowstar, Rekkles, Candypanda, Yellowpete and the other guys.

So calling Cop and improvement to Genja is really hilarious since both play the same pussy style but apparently Genja is Gambit's pick/bans mastermind and partly shotcaller.

Anyways, CRS EDWARD PLS


Sadly we can't base everyone on head to head results now that international tournaments are so few and far between. I generally get the sense NA Bot lanes are stronger because I see them carry LCS games more often than EU ADCs. But that might just because EU Mid laners are so strong they are just able to carry before the ADCs really get a chance to shine. Unfortunately there is no hard data to support either side so all of these opinions are just based on personal views and assessments.


you're completely right, and that's why I think from now on we should refrain from saying X position of Y region is better than Region Z, because at the end of the day it's still a 5v5 game. Like I won't even argue that Doublelift is much better than Yellowpete currently but clg hasn't won a tournament since august 2011 or in general a good tournament finish which wasn't NA only, while under clg.eu Pete & friends had, I don't know how many top4 results + #1 kings of europe, Dreamhack and LonestarClash.

You also just made me realize how 2 out curse, clg and Dig won't be able to go to worlds. ( I expect TSM to definitely qualify) Wouldn't even be surprised if it's TSM + C9/GGU going to worlds haha




On June 06 2013 18:41 JonGalt wrote:
1 week till LCS!! Here is my prediction:

End of Summer Split we have:
1) TSM
2) C9
3) Curse
4) Vulcun
5) GGU
6) Dignitas
7) CLG
8) Velocity (sorry guitar!)

Playoffs:
Vulcun > GGU
Curse > Dignitas

TSM > Vulcun
C9 > Curse

Vulcun > Curse
TSM > C9

Baylife.

Predictions?


I posted this a few pages ago and no one took the bait. Since you brought it up... WHO YA GOT??

1) TSM
2) C9
3) Curse
4) Dignitas +2
5) GGU
6) Vulcun -2

I have no clue where to place them tier:
1) CLG
2) Velocity

CLG and Velocity are wild cards in my opinion. I think they could go as high as 5th, depending on how the lineup shuffle works. Velocity played well enough to get in, but they didn't impress me. Who knows, it might been one of those days where both teams aren't having a good day and Velocity had less of a bad day and are better than they have shown. Depending on how Curse rebounds from their late season slump, it's possible they could steal second. I feel GGU should be higher, but cant' see my placing them above CRS or Dig atm. It all depends on if GGU is the team we say in the regular season or in the playoffs.

All in all, I'm super stoked about this split. So much more interest in the field of teams.

wei2coolman
Profile Joined November 2010
United States60033 Posts
June 07 2013 18:37 GMT
#6176
On June 08 2013 03:33 gtrsrs wrote:
damn, poor rhux
back to rhux city for him

i'm gonna be the devil's advocate and say that this doesn't work out, neither initially nor in the long run. can't see another alpha-male being very compatible with saint, especially if he's yelling at him in a different language. crs has a bad start, they blame cop, replace cop with... rhux?, rhux doesn't work out on AD either, the season closes, curse is up for relegation, they survive relegation and then ditch edward and have to find a new bot lane entirely

Edward gunna have drinking match against Saint for shot caller spot on Curse
liftlift > tsm
MoonBear
Profile Blog Joined November 2010
Straight outta Johto18973 Posts
June 07 2013 18:39 GMT
#6177
On June 07 2013 21:37 AsmodeusXI wrote:
Show nested quote +
On June 07 2013 21:35 Dusty wrote:
Not sure I agree with Justicar being mediocre, I think the colors and the model are quite nice and the effect on his E is pretty cool. But yeah I love the theme as well


The "mediocre" comment is almost entirely based on the splash art, which I know is silly, but the Syndra and Varus skins literally made me buy the champs to get the skins.

I have high standards for that skin theme.

+ Show Spoiler +
The Soraka one is great and all but I fucking hate Soraka with a burning passion.

I have mixed feelings about the latest Sorara skin. On one hand, the battle outfit is pretty cool. On the other hand the Pope hat is just silly. It seems really WoW-inspired or something. The balance was much better on Victorious Janna.


As for the recent Curse roster pick up I'm not sure what to think. On one hand, Edward is an excellent support. On the other hand, how will he fit in the rest of the team and will his input mean Curse finally start thinking about timings and map movements or will they just play like an NA team? Hm.
ModeratorA dream. Do you have one that has cursed you like that? Or maybe... a wish?
onlywonderboy
Profile Joined August 2012
United States23745 Posts
June 07 2013 18:40 GMT
#6178
On June 08 2013 03:37 wei2coolman wrote:
Show nested quote +
On June 08 2013 03:33 gtrsrs wrote:
damn, poor rhux
back to rhux city for him

i'm gonna be the devil's advocate and say that this doesn't work out, neither initially nor in the long run. can't see another alpha-male being very compatible with saint, especially if he's yelling at him in a different language. crs has a bad start, they blame cop, replace cop with... rhux?, rhux doesn't work out on AD either, the season closes, curse is up for relegation, they survive relegation and then ditch edward and have to find a new bot lane entirely

Edward gunna have drinking match against Saint for shot caller spot on Curse

Haha truthfully that's the only reason they brought him in. Dom is Saint's smoking buddy and Edward is his drinking buddy.
RIP Ryan Davis / TL or Die / @onlywonderboy
GhandiEAGLE
Profile Blog Joined March 2011
United States20754 Posts
June 07 2013 18:41 GMT
#6179
On June 08 2013 03:36 Gahlo wrote:
Show nested quote +
On June 08 2013 01:17 JonGalt wrote:
+ Show Spoiler +
On June 08 2013 01:06 Lylat wrote:
Show nested quote +
On June 08 2013 00:50 GhandiEAGLE wrote:
On June 08 2013 00:42 Gahlo wrote:
+ Show Spoiler +
Justicar != Justiciar

Poll: Should the ranking system be a valid top in GD?

DEMACIA! (23)
 
53%

No. (10)
 
23%

Absolutely, I'm super dumb. (6)
 
14%

Yes, I'm dumb. (2)
 
5%

Maybe. (2)
 
5%

43 total votes

Your vote: Should the ranking system be a valid top in GD?

(Vote): No.
(Vote): Yes, I'm dumb.
(Vote): Absolutely, I'm super dumb.
(Vote): Maybe.
(Vote): DEMACIA!



100% legit poll. Neo, the choice is clear.

Pls ban Pokemon discussion


Blasphemes!! Heretic!! Ban him!!

On June 08 2013 01:03 AsnSensation wrote:
Show nested quote +
On June 08 2013 00:40 onlywonderboy wrote:
+ Show Spoiler +
On June 08 2013 00:36 AsnSensation wrote:
Show nested quote +
On June 07 2013 22:35 Lylat wrote:
On June 07 2013 16:33 wei2coolman wrote:
Cop is an upgrade to Genja, but not by too much.
Curse real threat now though; Edward can carry cop in lane. No real weaknesses on Curse anymore.

CONFIRMED ON SAINT'S STREAM. hue.

Meh, don't think Cop is an upgrade at all, don't know why Genja gets so much hate.. Maybe because he's the less good player in the team ?
I'd argue that Darien looked like the weakest player in GG last season


I like Wei2 but it's getting rather annoying to read at least twice a weak how NA carries supposedly >>> their european peers

Call me biased since I'm european but yeah I'll give God aka Doublelift >>> any EU AD

but the rest hasn't shown anything significant that warrants a NA ad > Eu ad generalisation. By significant I mean an apparent skillgap between e.g. Froggen, Peke and Bjergsen (alex has been rather derpy since week 10 of lcs and at allstars) compared to NA Mids. And even that statement might be so true anymore, while we make fun of reginald in LR threads for his shitty tf mechanics or randomy 1v1 deaths, he is still carrying tsm hard with arguably less practice ( not sure how much he plays the game compared the rest since he has many solomid.net commitments. ManCloud and Link look really solid, as well.

To come back to NA ad's, none of the "new guys" (turtle, Nien, Zuna, Mashme etc) will get credit in my book unless they've proven themselves in international matches like Doublelift and (rather unsuccesfully) qtpie and Cop. Sry but I just don't see how it's so easy to say that they are >>Genja, Yellowstar, Rekkles, Candypanda, Yellowpete and the other guys.

So calling Cop and improvement to Genja is really hilarious since both play the same pussy style but apparently Genja is Gambit's pick/bans mastermind and partly shotcaller.

Anyways, CRS EDWARD PLS


Sadly we can't base everyone on head to head results now that international tournaments are so few and far between. I generally get the sense NA Bot lanes are stronger because I see them carry LCS games more often than EU ADCs. But that might just because EU Mid laners are so strong they are just able to carry before the ADCs really get a chance to shine. Unfortunately there is no hard data to support either side so all of these opinions are just based on personal views and assessments.


you're completely right, and that's why I think from now on we should refrain from saying X position of Y region is better than Region Z, because at the end of the day it's still a 5v5 game. Like I won't even argue that Doublelift is much better than Yellowpete currently but clg hasn't won a tournament since august 2011 or in general a good tournament finish which wasn't NA only, while under clg.eu Pete & friends had, I don't know how many top4 results + #1 kings of europe, Dreamhack and LonestarClash.

You also just made me realize how 2 out curse, clg and Dig won't be able to go to worlds. ( I expect TSM to definitely qualify) Wouldn't even be surprised if it's TSM + C9/GGU going to worlds haha




On June 06 2013 18:41 JonGalt wrote:
1 week till LCS!! Here is my prediction:

End of Summer Split we have:
1) TSM
2) C9
3) Curse
4) Vulcun
5) GGU
6) Dignitas
7) CLG
8) Velocity (sorry guitar!)

Playoffs:
Vulcun > GGU
Curse > Dignitas

TSM > Vulcun
C9 > Curse

Vulcun > Curse
TSM > C9

Baylife.

Predictions?


I posted this a few pages ago and no one took the bait. Since you brought it up... WHO YA GOT??

1) TSM
2) C9
3) Curse
4) Dignitas +2
5) GGU
6) Vulcun -2

I have no clue where to place them tier:
1) CLG
2) Velocity

CLG and Velocity are wild cards in my opinion. I think they could go as high as 5th, depending on how the lineup shuffle works. Velocity played well enough to get in, but they didn't impress me. Who knows, it might been one of those days where both teams aren't having a good day and Velocity had less of a bad day and are better than they have shown. Depending on how Curse rebounds from their late season slump, it's possible they could steal second.

All in all, I'm super stoked about this split. So much more interest in the field of teams.


1) TSM (although I think they will struggle the first few weeks)
2) Quantic (pls move into TSM house)
3) Curse (also going to struggle first few weeks)
4) Dignitas (a big chance to take an early lead with their experience and solid team)
5) GGU-CLG (GGU could very well beast everyone out. But let's wait and see)
7) Vulcan
8) Veloctiy (ilu guitar)
Oh, my achin' hands, from rakin' in grands, and breakin' in mic stands
mr_tolkien
Profile Blog Joined June 2010
France8631 Posts
June 07 2013 18:48 GMT
#6180
I just want to see matches. Edward is just so good he could even carry my terribad Graves ! :D

+ Show Spoiler +
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