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On May 02 2013 06:40 paladin8 wrote:
Hey guys, I'm pretty new to the game (not level 30 even) and play duo queue with a friend mostly. We're playing bot right now as nunu (me) and vayne. Previously we were playing an ezreal/sona lane that we did really well with, but after a handful of games we seem to be pretty lost as to how to lane as vayne/nunu. I understand that it's supposed to be a passive lane, but we get out-traded and out-harassed by virtually any composition to the point where we never get out of the laning phase in good shape.
So my question is, how do you go about laning as vayne/nunu without getting too far behind? Some comps we have gotten stomped by are: caitlyn/morgana, twitch/voli, MF/leona.
Vayne is hands down the weakest lane phase ADC in the game. So many ADCs can abuse her super hard. You usually need a support that can fight the enemy team for you or just keep you super safe (Lulu is decent).
Then you get to Nunu. The only support with a worse lane than Nunu is probably Soraka. His blood boil+ice ball combo is pretty powerful but he's kind of like Blitz in that he doesn't do much of anything for most of the lane so the ADC is forced to 1v2 but Nunu doesn't have a pull. Ice ball is decent harass but lots of ADCs can just get out of range and a lot of supports can punish Nunu if he tries to run up and ice ball someone (Thresh, Leona, Alistar, Blitz will just kill you).
If you and your duo partner aren't just straight up better than your opponents Vayne/Nunu is gonna lose lane phase every time. Caitlyn/Nunu is pretty solid if you really want to run Nunu support because Caitlyn actually can 2v1 some lanes if she plays careful enough and she abuses blood boil really hard.
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I just rolled Anivia in ARAM. After Lux the other time... I'll edit if I feel vindicated again. :<
I really wasn't a fan of ARAM at all previously, but after the awful day of ranked I've had today, it's... refreshing. Kinda. People don't group for fights. People refuse to take objectives. People don't understand the importance of farming when a fight isn't necessary. People facecheck in the jungle when the enemy team has Nocturne. You can't play mid for the life of you unless you're first pick.
And then in ARAMs you don't get annoyed with which champs to pick and you can practice teamfights and positioning and stuff, without worrying about all the rest that your dumb teammates can fuck up even when ahead (particularly when ahead, too busy gloating in their kda). In some way, it reduces what's annoying about them.
Verdict: she's retarded. Not as much as Lux offensively because it's true her range is far from the greatest, and her pre-6 is indeed pretty trash. But considering how we held against Jayce/Janna/Amumu/Nunu when we had Zed and Darius, and our Corki was terrible... yeah. She's pretty retarded and super easy to use in a defensive situation. Meh.
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On May 02 2013 07:25 kainzero wrote:
i think vayne is in a poor spot right now.
team comp wise i can only see her being viable in a pick-off style comp.
because of how the meta plays out, her range is a huge liability so you have to hope you can burst someone down. the old S2 days of teamfighting and fending off one diver are out the window when you have aoe comps and assassin/pick-off comps.
i see her being a very niche pick.
I always said vayne lategame was overrated and the most important stat for a lategame carry is range.
#hipster, or whatever you wanna call it.
People just get blinded by big damage numbers.
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stealthing in and out of a fight is a big deal. so is tumble being a mini jump
also gamecribs does a bad job of censoring their show. lots of missed curse words get through lol.
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On May 02 2013 06:45 TheYango wrote:Show nested quote +On May 02 2013 05:56 ItsFunToLose wrote:On May 02 2013 05:53 TheYango wrote:On May 02 2013 05:33 wei2coolman wrote:
I think that more so has to do with the fact it costs 800 for lifesteal now, instead of 450.
You're paying 400 for the lifesteal. Other than Zeke's, all other Vamp items were AD-based so you weren't buying a stat you wouldn't otherwise buy. Show me an item that gives me the lifesteal stat for 400 gold. or do you think longsword is somehow core on every jungler? Some junglers could start vamp scepter S2 and clear just fine. Well if you were buying the Wriggle's, you were buying the Longsword either way, which is the crux of this discussion.
Which was already part of Madreds. The absence of S3 jungle items made it necessary.
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On May 02 2013 07:32 wussleeQ wrote:
stealthing in and out of a fight is a big deal. so is tumble being a mini jump
also gamecribs does a bad job of censoring their show. lots of missed curse words get through lol.
Real question is why are they even censored?God help us if we hear a fuck that is every 3-rd word in any lol game  .
A lot of people also overrate range.Cait has a lot of range but when you don't do damage noone really cares if they can or can't get to you.
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On May 02 2013 07:31 Dandel Ion wrote:Show nested quote +On May 02 2013 07:25 kainzero wrote:
i think vayne is in a poor spot right now.
team comp wise i can only see her being viable in a pick-off style comp.
because of how the meta plays out, her range is a huge liability so you have to hope you can burst someone down. the old S2 days of teamfighting and fending off one diver are out the window when you have aoe comps and assassin/pick-off comps.
i see her being a very niche pick. I always said vayne lategame was overrated and the most important stat for a lategame carry is range. People just get blinded by big damage numbers.
That statement depends entirely on teamcomps.
Nobody is blinded, its just assassins are more popular which means vayne is always going to be less effective, she is anti tank, and in some cases anti anything in 1v1 if they rely on skillshots and vayne has q and stealth.
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On May 02 2013 07:43 nafta wrote:Show nested quote +On May 02 2013 07:32 wussleeQ wrote:
stealthing in and out of a fight is a big deal. so is tumble being a mini jump
also gamecribs does a bad job of censoring their show. lots of missed curse words get through lol. Real question is why are they even censored?God help us if we hear a fuck that is every 3-rd word in any lol game . A lot of people also overrate range.Cait has a lot of range but when you don't do damage noone really cares if they can or can't get to you.
I'm confident that Caitlyn, even today, has the single best lane phase of any ADC. I'm also confident that she's at least top 5 when it comes to strongest late game ADC. It doesn't matter that Caitlyn, on paper, deals less damage than nearly everyone else. Caitlyn is going to do more consistent dps than anyone save late game Tristana due to her range and her ability to peel for herself.
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Another way that beats Draven is deny river vision. He naturally pushes b/c he has to try and keep Q up. When he does, gank the shit out of him.
Pretty much agree, Cait is probably the best all-around AD. Range good skill to have. I mean, she can get gimped, but overall she has the smoothest and easiest "power curve", if that makes sense-- she can farm easy, fight easy, etc whereas Vayne has atrocious laning, Kog does as well to an extent, Trist has crap midgame, so forth.
Varus/ Kog probably the other two strongest AD's right now, though they all fit different team compositions.
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On May 02 2013 07:43 nafta wrote:Show nested quote +On May 02 2013 07:32 wussleeQ wrote:
stealthing in and out of a fight is a big deal. so is tumble being a mini jump
also gamecribs does a bad job of censoring their show. lots of missed curse words get through lol. Real question is why are they even censored?God help us if we hear a fuck that is every 3-rd word in any lol game . A lot of people also overrate range.Cait has a lot of range but when you don't do damage noone really cares if they can or can't get to you.
It's a gimmick to censor words you don't need to. People are trained to hear the bleep and think "oh man he must be cursing something fierce he must be edgy!" At least that's the thought on the matter from what I've gathered.
As far as range being important to late game adc strength that's entirely dependent on the team comps of both sides. Sometimes you need a vayne, sometimes you wish you had trist.
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Thanks for the advice guys. We'll maybe rethink our champs since the general consensus seems to be that vayne/nunu is just really weak in lane.
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On May 02 2013 07:58 paladin8 wrote:
Thanks for the advice guys. We'll maybe rethink our champs since the general consensus seems to be that vayne/nunu is just really weak in lane.
If you enjoy playing something you should play it even if it is weak.Unless you are pro level it really doesn't matter.
Also cait isn't good at peeling for herself she is good at sieging or defending towers.In a real teamfight your only escape is a small dash(which slows) and is easily interruptable.Your range doesn't make you immune to the infinity gap closers every champ has.
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I just started getting +4 and +5 pts for wins in GOLD I. How long until I actually get some decent points for wins? Or am I just going to have to win 20 straight games to get to a promo?
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On May 02 2013 08:05 GettingIt wrote:
I just started getting +4 and +5 pts for wins in GOLD I. How long until I actually get some decent points for wins? Or am I just going to have to win 20 straight games to get to a promo?
I vote this is a new banned topic.
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I have to say, I'm absolutely in love with Lissandra. I've been playing tons of Dota recently, but Liss still feels really, really good to play, so I'm probably going to stick to League again for a bit. Here's to hoping more releases end up like her (and that people don't ban her in ranked lolol)
Also, Trundle is pretty ridiculous. I had like 5k gold on him as Lee but he still out-dueled me easily (I escaped though). He had Botrk + some defensive item and he was unkillable and did so much damage. I'll probably pick him up
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On May 02 2013 08:08 sob3k wrote:Show nested quote +On May 02 2013 08:05 GettingIt wrote:
I just started getting +4 and +5 pts for wins in GOLD I. How long until I actually get some decent points for wins? Or am I just going to have to win 20 straight games to get to a promo? I vote this is a new banned topic.
Seconded
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Does Udyr tiger stance passive effect stack Muramana?
If so, I wonder how good it'd be... It at least gets stacked up quickly. I guess he cannot afford a full dmg item though but..
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On May 02 2013 08:24 Shikyo wrote:
Does Udyr tiger stance passive effect stack Muramana?
If so, I wonder how good it'd be... It at least gets stacked up quickly. I guess he cannot afford a full dmg item though but..
"Unique Passive - Mana Charge: Each time you attack, cast a spell or spend mana, your maximum mana increases by 4 "
so no
its a terrible idea anyway, there are so many good udyr items and muramana is FAR down the list
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On May 02 2013 08:08 sob3k wrote:Show nested quote +On May 02 2013 08:05 GettingIt wrote:
I just started getting +4 and +5 pts for wins in GOLD I. How long until I actually get some decent points for wins? Or am I just going to have to win 20 straight games to get to a promo? I vote this is a new banned topic.
No one's really gotten to the bottom of it yet and there probably is a good reason, so I don't see why it should be banned just yet. It's not confined to people near the top of their division.
Does it matter much? No. But it isn't derailing the thread for pages and pages like "what is a tank."
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EPT
