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Goumindong
United States3529 Posts
On February 27 2013 14:28 triangle wrote: I end up putting 9 in utility when I ashe, which feels a bit silly >_> I end up with 11, though I tend to play Ashe passively in lane. The ability to come into lane with 9% lifesteal (with quints) just feels very strong to me | ||
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Shotcoder
United States2316 Posts
On February 27 2013 16:13 Craton wrote: 200 CS with a 0 threat build. What exactly is the enemy team doing during all of this? Zero threat? You are completely fine because of your ult. Yes you dont have the same damage, but you're 800 gold behind? Is that really back breaking in a lane where you're main focus is farming? Dorans>Avarice>BF is completely viable and barely puts you behind if you play passive. | ||
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UniversalSnip
9871 Posts
On February 27 2013 16:19 Shotcoder wrote: Zero threat? You are completely fine because of your ult. Yes you dont have the same damage, but you're 800 gold behind? Is that really back breaking in a lane where you're main focus is farming? Dorans>Avarice>BF is completely viable and barely puts you behind if you play passive. you're going places man. | ||
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Shotcoder
United States2316 Posts
On February 27 2013 16:23 UniversalSnip wrote: what are you guys's thoughts on swift boots atm? you're going places man. Sorry I try to play differently and try and make shortcuts. It works and mathematically puts you ahead if you manage to keep even in cs. It's fine if you don't try it or anything. I'll just play my way. | ||
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iCanada
Canada10660 Posts
On February 27 2013 13:59 Sermokala wrote: He's refering to the 30%as that bortk has on the pbe right now and should be going in the next patch on the 28th when maintinence was annouced today. Not sure on the change as patch notes arnt out yet ofc. Adcs now have a really weak mid game for a strong early and late game. So champs are being picked up that have a super charged mid game to throw off the adc. Garen vi hec j4 still can't touch a 6 item adc tho. Nasus on the other hand makes a 6 item AD worthless. Wither make them move so slow, do no damages. Just manage to get your team to stall till 40 minute mark you win erry game. Be a 5k HP 200/200 resistances freak who makes their AD useless and has a Q that does like +800 damage. In addition, gets AoE 5% per second Hp burn (which also gives him increased AD) on his ult. Nasus R so strong in League of Warmogs, even if you just sticking to one tank for one second you prolly going to hit the max AD bonus from his R, if you running at their AD you probably going to get like +500 AD with everyone trying to peel you. You can win 45 minute games where other team like 10-15k gold ahead. On February 27 2013 16:19 Shotcoder wrote: Zero threat? You are completely fine because of your ult. Yes you dont have the same damage, but you're 800 gold behind? Is that really back breaking in a lane where you're main focus is farming? Dorans>Avarice>BF is completely viable and barely puts you behind if you play passive. How you going to stop a Taric, Thresh, Alistar, Lulu, Lux, Nautilus, Blitz, Sona, Leona or Zyra from just poking your balls off / just hard engaging on you? You can't use arrow every trade... Its not like you can expect your jungler to pressure bottom that hard either because bottom ridiculously hard to gank always 2+ wards down there unless one just expire. I don't buy it, think you just get totally crushed by any competent bot lane if you rush Avarice while having no trading ability. Only Support I could see not just totally zoning you is like Soraka, but no one plays Soraka anymore. | ||
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Gahlo
United States35150 Posts
On February 27 2013 16:25 Shotcoder wrote: Sorry I try to play differently and try and make shortcuts. It works and mathematically puts you ahead if you manage to keep even in cs. It's fine if you don't try it or anything. I'll just play my way. The issue with it is that Ashe doesn't have great laning. By going with an early Avarice Blade you're mistiming the optimal way to build the ADC stat trinity. If you are already hard pressed to stop somebody in a fight, how are you going to stop them from zoning you? The only reliable long distance farming Ashe can do is Volley, but that just pushes the wave farther from you, eats up mana, and has a long CD if you aren't making it a priority. I like Ashe(Basically only played her till level 17), I like cute builds(was playing AP Varus earlier today), but don't pretend CashAshe is good. | ||
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Cedstick
Canada3336 Posts
iamthatis (12:38): support kayle dies to tristana at level 2 iamthatis (12:38): "wow i didnt expect the burst" KissBlade (12:38): lololol KissBlade (12:39): would've been even better if a sona was involved Categorist (12:39): support kayle chokes on sausage at level 2 Categorist (12:39): "wow I didn't expect the wurst" KissBlade (12:39): .. KissBlade (12:39): ... iamthatis (12:39): it was a tristana/zilean vs tristana/kayle iamthatis (12:39): T_T KissBlade (12:39): .... Navitar (12:39): loooool iamthatis (12:39): LOL cate Categorist (12:39): support kayle dies alone and dehydrated in the middle of a desert Categorist (12:39): "wow I didn't expect the thirst" Navitar (12:39): PLS iamthatis (12:39): omg iamthatis (12:39): stahp KissBlade (12:39): stahp Categorist (12:40): support kayle gets an unhelpful reply on an internet forum Categorist (12:40): "wow I didn't expect the first" iamthatis (12:40): lolol Categorist (12:40): support kayle gets hit by a car carrying the recently deceased Categorist (12:40): "wow I didn't expect the hearse" DCWasabi (12:41): support kayle dies iamthatis (12:41): you've started something here iamthatis (12:41): that cannot be stopped DCWasabi (12:41): "wow akyle can die" Categorist (12:41): support kayle gets killed at level 2 by an akali with a skin Categorist (12:41): "wow I didn't expect the nurse" iamthatis (12:41): riot pls WaveofShadow (12:41): god damn it iamthatis (12:41): make him stop Support Kayle is stunned by Taric. "Wow, didn't expect the purse." | ||
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DCWasabi
United States368 Posts
"Wow, didn't expect to be submersed." | ||
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DCWasabi
United States368 Posts
"Wow, didn't expect the burst." Support Kayle walks into a bar: "Wow, didn't expect the punchline." | ||
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jcc
United States472 Posts
On February 27 2013 16:40 Gahlo wrote: The issue with it is that Ashe doesn't have great laning. By going with an early Avarice Blade you're mistiming the optimal way to build the ADC stat trinity. If you are already hard pressed to stop somebody in a fight, how are you going to stop them from zoning you? The only reliable long distance farming Ashe can do is Volley, but that just pushes the wave farther from you, eats up mana, and has a long CD if you aren't making it a priority. I like Ashe(Basically only played her till level 17), I like cute builds(was playing AP Varus earlier today), but don't pretend CashAshe is good. Actually Cash Ashe is very good and thus far I've had a 100% win rate with it in every game, me being upper diamond 2 low diamond 1 currently. I also fielded it at a LAN. Ashe is assumed by the general community to have a weak laning phase. But the more I play her the more I feel that is false. Pair her win sona or zyra and you have a very strong lane with a devastating level 6. Every game I have gone WEWEWRWEWQEQQQ etc, doran's first, shove real hard level 1-3, abusing your LVL 1 dominance, and with that early shove shop fast at 800 gold. This doesn't put you behind lane trade wise because they either are still in lane or are backing too cuz you shoved fast. Q is unneeded due to double cc ults for optimum gank support. The average bonus gold I get is 900-1200 by 18-20 minutes without a TF on my team, it's about 1200-1600 with a TF. If you manage a kill or two you're astronomically ahead of the enemy adc. People doubt cash Ashe but I've beaten folks like maplestreet and others in lane and just farmed hard and had a whole item up on the enemy adc even though they had more kills or towers, early E max and early avarice is broke as fuck on Ashe. Also in regards to her trading ability, the most they'd have up on you during that avarice buy I'd a longsword or boots, which are both minimal. With sona or zyra cash Ashe is amazingly broken, and is only susceptible to heavy all in lanes, which then become free lanes when you both hit 6 and get free kills with jungler on command whenever you desire cuz all in lanes have to overextend to maintain lane control. To do this you also have to understand ashes power curves and how to appropriately abuse her range and auto W counter initiate harass. | ||
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Cedstick
Canada3336 Posts
"Wow, didn't expect the slurs." Edit: Ggod was playing CashAshe yesterday. He's pretty high-ranked, isn't he? He made it work. | ||
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BlackPaladin
United States9316 Posts
On February 27 2013 16:23 UniversalSnip wrote: what are you guys's thoughts on swift boots atm? you're going places man. Swiftness boots + ancient golem makes nasus basically unkiteable. Love it. Also on ashe vs actually good players, you maxing hawkshot ends up with you getting +a little gold on that 1-2 creeps you might get per wave because you do no damage and can't actually do anything in lane ever. Good players punish you for that. Good players don't care that you're playing passive. Good players get their j4 buddy to shove his 6 foot spear so far up your tiny frosted hole that you cough out popsicles, even if you're sitting at your tower going "look at the extra 5 gold i'm getting from the single creep!" Edit: granted, ggod, you had a cait that somehow seriously lost lane hard, so I wouldn't consider all the people you play with as good ;p Although you do play super fricken safe. From your ahri game just how safe you played on someone with 3 blinks built in was mind boggling lol. Also tour scenario, minus the 0 q lvls, isn't as bad as what the other guy was proposing (from the looks of it). Maxing e second is different than e max first, you still have max w so you can trade and wave clear just like a normal ashe build. The only think you're sacrificing is small percentage changes in q's slow. | ||
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remedium
United States939 Posts
"Wow, I didn't expect the curse." | ||
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Cr4zyH0r5e
Peru1308 Posts
"Wow, I didn't expect the horse" | ||
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kainzero
United States5211 Posts
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BlackPaladin
United States9316 Posts
"Wow, I didn't expect the porsche!" | ||
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dae
Canada1600 Posts
On February 27 2013 16:07 Shotcoder wrote: why wish when you can? Seriously rushing Avarice blade on her is so retarded when you max e first. If you skip Shiv for PD and you get 180-200 CS at the 25-28 minute mark. You end up with an extra 2k+ gold which pays for the blade and gives you extra for another BF or starting your LW. And it doesnt matter if you lose lane early, you come back so fast because of the passive gold it's like you werent behind in the first place. The math is +7 gold per minion with full E and avarice. That a 1/3 ranged creep every CS. That's not even including the fact you might have a TF on your team. If I faced this, ashe would end up looking sad and zoned as the lane is frozen and shes too weak to stop me from freezing it. | ||
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Goumindong
United States3529 Posts
I mean do you ever get into lane as Ashe and just say "I want to fight them"? Unless you're laning against vayne/soraka probably not. This means that being a bit weaker early probably isn't that big of a deal you were t going to engage anyway so losing a bit of strength does not prevent you from making plays. You were always going to try to disengage against an enemy fight so having a bit less damage doesn't really stop you from doing that and since you're weak in and extended fight every enemy wants to fight you so you're not making it so you can be engaged upon | ||
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Sufficiency
Canada23833 Posts
Support Kayle gets killed at level 2 by a bard. "Wow, I didn't expect the verse!" | ||
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Serelitz
Netherlands2895 Posts
On February 27 2013 18:25 remedium wrote: Support Kayle gets nerfed after "Wow, I didn't expect the curse." Seriously though, the nerfs for pretty much all OP champs atm that are on PBE don't seem harsh enough. I main jungle Vi and I don't think 8 AD will do enough, same with xin/kayle q etc. Nerfs need to be harsher imo. I also don't really agree with all the people whining about how ADC is useless now but o well. | ||
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