• Log InLog In
  • Register
Liquid`
Team Liquid Liquipedia
EDT 08:58
CEST 14:58
KST 21:58
  • Home
  • Forum
  • Calendar
  • Streams
  • Liquipedia
  • Features
  • Store
  • EPT
  • TL+
  • StarCraft 2
  • Brood War
  • Smash
  • Heroes
  • Counter-Strike
  • Overwatch
  • Liquibet
  • Fantasy StarCraft
  • TLPD
  • StarCraft 2
  • Brood War
  • Blogs
Forum Sidebar
Events/Features
News
Featured News
Serral wins HomeStory Cup 2915Serral wins Maestros of the Game 243ByuL, and the Limitations of Standard Play3Team Liquid Map Contest #22: Results and Winners7Code S Season 2 (2026): RO4 and Finals Preview12
Community News
Weekly Cups (Aug 3-9): Protoss get shut out1RSL goes to London! 2026 Offline Finals Nov 21-2212Weekly Cups (July 27-Aug 2): SHIN's big week0SC4ALL II: Brood War - $2500 - Dec 5-69SC4ALL II announced - $10,000 prize pool, Dec 5-64
StarCraft 2
General
Weekly Cups (Aug 3-9): Protoss get shut out SC4ALL: II Talent Announcement! Protoss AoE skill expression August World Ranking: Clem climbs to #2 Balance hotfix patch 5.0.16b (July 16)
Tourneys
PIG STY FESTIVAL 8.0! (13 - 23 August) Sparkling Tuna Cup - Weekly Open Tournament RSL goes to London! 2026 Offline Finals Nov 21-22 RSL Revival: Season 6 - Qualifiers and Main Event Tasteless Time Warp: SC Evo Showmatch (May 25)
Strategy
[G] Having the right mentality to improve
Custom Maps
Nexus Wars 2021 GUIDE [M] (2) Industrial Park
External Content
Mutation # 538 Media Blackout The PondCast: SC2 News & Results Mutation # 537 Hostile Territory Mutation # 536 Railroad Switch
Brood War
General
BW General Discussion BGH Auto Balance -> http://bghmmr.eu/ ASL22 General Discussion Are you ready for ASL 22? NEW HYPE VIDEO How FlaSh Nearly Forfeited MSL Finals being late
Tourneys
[Megathread] Daily Proleagues 2v2v2v2 Tournament KCM Race Survival 2026 Season 3 Escore Tournament - Season 3
Strategy
Fighting Spirit mining rates Odyssey Mineral Stack Saturation Any training maps people recommend? Simple Questions, Simple Answers
Other Games
General Games
Nintendo Switch Thread General RTS Discussion Thread EVE Corporation Stormgate/Frost Giant Megathread Diablo 2 thread
Dota 2
Looking for a Dota Mentor Official 'what is Dota anymore' discussion
League of Legends
[TL LoL EUW IHs] Teemo shall perish TSM pausing esports and CLG Dead
Heroes of the Storm
Heroes of the Storm 2.0
Hearthstone
Deck construction bug
TL Mafia
TL Mafia Power Rank TL Mafia Community Thread NeO.D_StephenKing vs This Guy From 1 Million Dance
Community
General
US Politics Mega-thread Russo-Ukrainian War Thread Iain M Banks Says He Has Cancer And Months To Live European Politico-economics QA Mega-thread The Games Industry And ATVI
Fan Clubs
MarineLorD Fan Club The ShoWTimE Fan Club The herO Fan Club!
Media & Entertainment
Movie Discussion! Anime Discussion Thread Series you have seen recently... [Req][Books] Good Fantasy/SciFi books
Sports
Football (Soccer) Thread NBA General Discussion TeamLiquid Health and Fitness Initiative For 2023 Formula 1 Discussion MLB/Baseball 2023
World Cup 2022
Tech Support
Computer Build, Upgrade & Buying Resource Thread Simple Questions Simple Answers FPS when play League Of Legend on laptop
TL Community
The Automated Ban List Northern Ireland Global Starcraft
Blogs
Are High-Level Gamers more A…
TrAiDoS
Cathedral Of CS And NY pizza a…
FuDDx
Please support my new stand…
Peanutsc
Hello guys!
LIN1s
ASL S22 English Commentary…
namkraft
Poker (part 2)
Nebuchad
Customize Sidebar...

Website Feedback

Closed Threads



Active: 4049 users

[Patch 1.0.0.151: End of S2] General Discussion - Page 9

Forum Index > LoL General
Post a Reply
Prev 1 7 8 9 10 11 280 Next
Requizen
Profile Blog Joined March 2011
United States33802 Posts
November 13 2012 01:37 GMT
#161
On November 13 2012 10:33 Sufficiency wrote:
The thing about Flash nerf is that it makes champions with gap closers stronger, and this is already a huge problem in this game.

Yes, but gap closers should be a strength of the champion. If they need to be nerfed/buffed based on the power of that gap closer, it should be done independently from Flash, which isn't really possible. Now, it's hard to justify nerfing gap closers because "well, you can just Flash away from it most of the time", which doesn't seem like a good structure.
It's your boy Guzma!
Sufficiency
Profile Blog Joined October 2010
Canada23833 Posts
November 13 2012 01:39 GMT
#162
On November 13 2012 10:36 Dandel Ion wrote:
How about this: Slows also reduce Flash range by (half?) the slow%.

It's an idea I stole from GW2, where defensive rolls and whatever are also shorter if you are slowed. I like it cause it means you have to use them before you get CC'd, but it's not as punishing as completely disallowing them.


No that's a terrible idea. A lot of slowing effects are not visually obvious, so it's easy to make someone fail a Flash across the wall simply because he got "stealth-slowed".
https://twitter.com/SufficientStats
onlywonderboy
Profile Joined August 2012
United States23745 Posts
November 13 2012 01:42 GMT
#163
On November 13 2012 09:11 Ketara wrote:
Another big flash issue is that in regards to watching LoL as a spectator sport, flash is just cool. It creates all sorts of cool things.

It's obvious they don't WANT to get rid of it, because it is so cool. I think they really are stuck in their own hole until they decide to do a massive across the board champ rebalance just so flash won't be a requirement.

In regards to ghost and slows, they could do something like have the improved ghost mastery be "reduces the effect of slows by 50% while ghost is active" or something. That would make slows affect other movespeed boosts the same amount but not ghost.

Without flash we would have never had Snoopeh's epic rapture/flash/feast when he was getting tower dove during the WC. Such a sick play.

Also whoever said no one would use flash if it was on a 20 minute cooldown, of course not, but that's not likely to happen. They already said it would only be a slight nerf, I would guess 30 seconds max, but I expect it to be shorter. I didn't say it was impossible to nerf it into the ground, just not what Riot is planning at the moment.
RIP Ryan Davis / TL or Die / @onlywonderboy
Seuss
Profile Blog Joined May 2010
United States10536 Posts
November 13 2012 01:49 GMT
#164
On November 13 2012 09:09 Parnage wrote:
Show nested quote +
On November 13 2012 09:00 MooMooMugi wrote:
Why would they remove leashing from jungle? Is it because Riot wants to make this game so noob friendly the jungle will be completely destroyed?


Because jungle leashes end in two ways:
1. You got a good pull!
2. That singed just flipped blue golem over the wall and went to lane, have fun!"

I'd rather be given the ability to just do it myself. If that's noob friendly I welcome it.


What you fail to realize is that #2 happened even before there were leashes. :3

More seriously, the removal of leashing is perhaps the most baseless change I've seen from Riot. Leashing is arguably the best mechanic in the game. Consider:

  • Leashing miraculously brings random, bitter strangers together in an act of mutual cooperation, even in the three digit Elo brackets.
  • Leashing acts as a crucial stepping stone between the "Huh? Stuff happens before 2:00?" and "We must group up in case they invade!" stages of player development.
  • Removing leashing doesn't solve the problem of coordinated teams dealing enough damage for a jungler to save Smite or better preserve themselves.

My educated guess is that Riot is afraid champions will have too easy a time if they get a leash in the new jungle, hence it has to go. They might also be afraid that there will be too big a difference between junglers who get a leash, and junglers who don't. Both of these issues, however, can easily be solved by adjusting the damage on buff camps. It's not necessary to remove a mechanic which single-handedly informed more people about the needs and thoughts of a jungler than all of the Youtube jungle guides combined.
"I am not able to carry all this people alone, for they are too heavy for me." -Moses (Numbers 11:14)
Requizen
Profile Blog Joined March 2011
United States33802 Posts
November 13 2012 01:51 GMT
#165
http://na.leagueoflegends.com/board/showthread.php?t=2791208#31329458

I don't know exactly what this will change, I don't think wins really correlate to skill level.
It's your boy Guzma!
Dandel Ion
Profile Joined November 2010
Austria17960 Posts
November 13 2012 01:52 GMT
#166
On November 13 2012 10:51 Requizen wrote:
http://na.leagueoflegends.com/board/showthread.php?t=2791208#31329458

I don't know exactly what this will change, I don't think wins really correlate to skill level.

That's just pointless....
A backwards poet writes inverse.
Requizen
Profile Blog Joined March 2011
United States33802 Posts
November 13 2012 01:53 GMT
#167
Oh and this

http://na.leagueoflegends.com/board/showthread.php?t=2789840&page=2#31327801

Sorry for sort of double post, just catching up on red tracker.
It's your boy Guzma!
arb
Profile Blog Joined April 2008
Noobville17922 Posts
November 13 2012 01:55 GMT
#168
On November 13 2012 10:51 Requizen wrote:
http://na.leagueoflegends.com/board/showthread.php?t=2791208#31329458

I don't know exactly what this will change, I don't think wins really correlate to skill level.

Is this live on the official servers or just the test servers? also does it just apply to normals or ranked games also? o.O
Artillery spawned from the forges of Hell
NEOtheONE
Profile Joined September 2010
United States2233 Posts
Last Edited: 2012-11-13 01:57:44
November 13 2012 01:57 GMT
#169
It's live on NA currently and supposedly applying to all queues.
Abstracts, the too long didn't read of the educated world.
Irave
Profile Joined October 2010
United States9965 Posts
November 13 2012 01:57 GMT
#170
On November 13 2012 10:52 Dandel Ion wrote:
Show nested quote +
On November 13 2012 10:51 Requizen wrote:
http://na.leagueoflegends.com/board/showthread.php?t=2791208#31329458

I don't know exactly what this will change, I don't think wins really correlate to skill level.

That's just pointless....

Not really it was something that was being discussed here yesterday. That the placement elo range is quite unusual. Because sometimes you face the guy that needs to be 1800 or get the guy that's 500. If you have an amount of wins that should provide enough thought that you belong in the elo, you'll less likely face that scenario. Its a nice little improvement.
onlywonderboy
Profile Joined August 2012
United States23745 Posts
Last Edited: 2012-11-13 01:59:08
November 13 2012 01:58 GMT
#171
On November 13 2012 10:52 Dandel Ion wrote:
Show nested quote +
On November 13 2012 10:51 Requizen wrote:
http://na.leagueoflegends.com/board/showthread.php?t=2791208#31329458

I don't know exactly what this will change, I don't think wins really correlate to skill level.

That's just pointless....

It's not pointless for normals. I know several people playing normals who have sub-100 wins being matched up against people with 500+ wins. During that early level 400 more games of experience makes a big difference in level of play.

Edit: Even if their hidden elo or whatever is low enough to have them matched up with newer players, still makes a difference.
RIP Ryan Davis / TL or Die / @onlywonderboy
NEOtheONE
Profile Joined September 2010
United States2233 Posts
Last Edited: 2012-11-13 02:02:55
November 13 2012 02:00 GMT
#172
On November 13 2012 10:57 Irave wrote:
Show nested quote +
On November 13 2012 10:52 Dandel Ion wrote:
On November 13 2012 10:51 Requizen wrote:
http://na.leagueoflegends.com/board/showthread.php?t=2791208#31329458

I don't know exactly what this will change, I don't think wins really correlate to skill level.

That's just pointless....

Not really it was something that was being discussed here yesterday. That the placement elo range is quite unusual. Because sometimes you face the guy that needs to be 1800 or get the guy that's 500. If you have an amount of wins that should provide enough thought that you belong in the elo, you'll less likely face that scenario. Its a nice little improvement.


Not to mention the people around 1200 ELO who can be paired with all the newbies are now more likely to be matched with people who have been playing ranked for longer.
Abstracts, the too long didn't read of the educated world.
Craton
Profile Blog Joined December 2009
United States17303 Posts
November 13 2012 02:00 GMT
#173
I hope it's a low maximum threshold for ranked (e.g. 100 games).
twitch.tv/cratonz
Sufficiency
Profile Blog Joined October 2010
Canada23833 Posts
November 13 2012 02:01 GMT
#174
The matchmaking changes is going to change how smurfs work. Ha!
https://twitter.com/SufficientStats
NEOtheONE
Profile Joined September 2010
United States2233 Posts
November 13 2012 02:03 GMT
#175
On November 13 2012 11:01 Sufficiency wrote:
The matchmaking changes is going to change how smurfs work. Ha!


Indeed, also increases the chance that smurfs have to play each other.
Abstracts, the too long didn't read of the educated world.
Nikon
Profile Blog Joined May 2009
Bulgaria5710 Posts
Last Edited: 2012-11-13 02:07:37
November 13 2012 02:06 GMT
#176
On November 13 2012 10:51 Requizen wrote:
http://na.leagueoflegends.com/board/showthread.php?t=2791208#31329458

I don't know exactly what this will change, I don't think wins really correlate to skill level.


Well that's just dumb, I've been matched with people that have 300-400 more wins in my normal games regularly -.-;; I'm going to get bumped like some elo back just because. Eventually, I'll make it back, but why the fuck...

P.S. My ranked games aren't much different, it's just that the +- hasn't gone up post 200 this season.
qanik
Profile Joined May 2010
Denmark1899 Posts
November 13 2012 02:08 GMT
#177
On November 13 2012 11:03 NEOtheONE wrote:
Show nested quote +
On November 13 2012 11:01 Sufficiency wrote:
The matchmaking changes is going to change how smurfs work. Ha!


Indeed, also increases the chance that smurfs have to play each other.


I'd take that over having 30mins queue each game anyday!
Best Teemo World
Navi
Profile Joined November 2009
5286 Posts
November 13 2012 02:10 GMT
#178
On November 13 2012 11:08 qanik wrote:
Show nested quote +
On November 13 2012 11:03 NEOtheONE wrote:
On November 13 2012 11:01 Sufficiency wrote:
The matchmaking changes is going to change how smurfs work. Ha!


Indeed, also increases the chance that smurfs have to play each other.


I'd take that over having 30mins queue each game anyday!

YESSSSSSSSSSSSSSSSSSSSSSSSSSSSSSSSSSSSSSS
GREATEST
CHANGE
EVER
Hey! Listen!
VirgilSC2
Profile Blog Joined June 2011
United States6151 Posts
November 13 2012 02:11 GMT
#179
On November 13 2012 10:49 Seuss wrote:
Show nested quote +
On November 13 2012 09:09 Parnage wrote:
On November 13 2012 09:00 MooMooMugi wrote:
Why would they remove leashing from jungle? Is it because Riot wants to make this game so noob friendly the jungle will be completely destroyed?


Because jungle leashes end in two ways:
1. You got a good pull!
2. That singed just flipped blue golem over the wall and went to lane, have fun!"

I'd rather be given the ability to just do it myself. If that's noob friendly I welcome it.


What you fail to realize is that #2 happened even before there were leashes. :3

More seriously, the removal of leashing is perhaps the most baseless change I've seen from Riot. Leashing is arguably the best mechanic in the game. Consider:

  • Leashing miraculously brings random, bitter strangers together in an act of mutual cooperation, even in the three digit Elo brackets.
  • Leashing acts as a crucial stepping stone between the "Huh? Stuff happens before 2:00?" and "We must group up in case they invade!" stages of player development.
  • Removing leashing doesn't solve the problem of coordinated teams dealing enough damage for a jungler to save Smite or better preserve themselves.

My educated guess is that Riot is afraid champions will have too easy a time if they get a leash in the new jungle, hence it has to go. They might also be afraid that there will be too big a difference between junglers who get a leash, and junglers who don't. Both of these issues, however, can easily be solved by adjusting the damage on buff camps. It's not necessary to remove a mechanic which single-handedly informed more people about the needs and thoughts of a jungler than all of the Youtube jungle guides combined.

This is such a good post.
Clarity Gaming #1 Fan | Avid MTG Grinder | @VirgilSC2
Alaric
Profile Joined November 2009
France45622 Posts
November 13 2012 02:13 GMT
#180
I just supported a 2100 Elo Vayne in my last normal blind... wow. I'm bad with Vayne, and I she has a rough time in lane, and my mechanics are awful in general, but watching him play was... well, since because of the blind format we had the same supports, it was basically 1v1, or even 1v2 (since it was risky for me to engage and bait him, but easier for the opponent). He managed to keep up in cs without exposing himself, then pulled off some clutch and mechanically sound plays when the fights were close or I screwed up one way or the other.
Showed me a lot about how I could be playing Vayne to improve, but that gap was... wow. o_o

Also, his account only had a 2-3 record in normals, and he told me he got it level 30 (rather than leveling it with coops). That surprised me, I thought it was reserved to the Korean server (along with the champions unlocked thing).
Cant take LMS hipsters serious.
Prev 1 7 8 9 10 11 280 Next
Please log in or register to reply.
Live Events Refresh
PiG Sty Festival
12:00
Qualifier #2
PiGStarcraft611
IndyStarCraft 142
TKL 120
Liquipedia
Sparkling Tuna Cup
10:00
Weekly #141
Shameless vs Nicoract
CranKy Ducklings82
LiquipediaDiscussion
[ Submit Event ]
Live Streams
Refresh
StarCraft 2
SHIN 1104
PiGStarcraft611
mouzHeroMarine 253
Classic 244
ByuN (SOOP) 209
herO (SOOP) 186
Maru 173
IndyStarCraft 142
TKL 120
Cure 95
Rogue 93
Trap 64
StarCraft: Brood War
Shuttle 3715
Bisu 2238
Jaedong 1413
firebathero 857
EffOrt 850
Hyuk 553
Mini 503
Stork 377
Soulkey 374
Light 275
[ Show more ]
Snow 212
Barracks 163
hero 144
Killer 116
Pusan 97
soO 96
Rush 96
Sharp 62
Free 42
sorry 23
Terrorterran 19
yabsab 16
Sexy 15
IntoTheRainbow 14
zelot 11
Icarus 8
Dota 2
Dendi2481
XBOCT1453
qojqva764
Counter-Strike
olofmeister2087
byalli867
x6flipin518
kRYSTAL_17
Super Smash Bros
Mew2King61
Heroes of the Storm
Khaldor102
Other Games
singsing2384
B2W.Neo485
Lowko477
hiko473
crisheroes318
Liquid`LucifroN181
Sick173
KnowMe81
QueenE56
Livibee50
Organizations
StarCraft: Brood War
lovetv 10
[ Show 11 non-featured ]
StarCraft 2
• CranKy Ducklings SOOP7
• AfreecaTV YouTube
• intothetv
• Kozan
• IndyKCrew
• Migwel
StarCraft: Brood War
• BSLYoutube
• STPLYoutube
• ZZZeroYoutube
League of Legends
• TFBlade402
Other Games
• WagamamaTV233
Upcoming Events
PiGosaur Cup
11h 2m
Replay Cast
20h 2m
Kung Fu Cup
22h 2m
Replay Cast
1d 11h
The PondCast
1d 21h
Replay Cast
2 days
Escore
2 days
CranKy Ducklings
3 days
Sparkling Tuna Cup
4 days
Afreeca Starleague
5 days
Rush vs Hm
Bisu vs Shuttle
[ Show More ]
WardiTV Weekly
5 days
The Patches Monday
6 days
Afreeca Starleague
6 days
Sharp vs Shinee
Action vs Shine
Liquipedia Results

Completed

Proleague 2026-08-10
CranK Gathers Season 4: BW vs SC2 Team League
Eternal Conflict S2 Finale

Ongoing

KCM Race Survival 2026 Season 3
K-JUNGMAN
Acropolis #5
RSL Revival: Season 6
Esports World Cup 2026: LCQ
BLAST Bounty Summer 2026
BLAST Bounty Summer Qual
Stake Ranked Episode 3
XSE Pro League 2026
IEM Cologne Major 2026
Stake Ranked Episode 2

Upcoming

Escore Tournament S3: W7
CSLAN 4
ASL Season 22
Escore Tournament S3: W8
Acropolis #5 - TRS
Blizzard Classic Cup 2026
Acropolis #5 - GSA
HSC XXX
SC4ALL II: StarCraft II
Kung Fu Cup 2026 Grand Finals
RSL Offline Finals
PiG Sty Festival 8.0
Big Dog Cup 2026 Div 1
META DYMY #4
PGL Masters Bucharest 2026
Thunderpick World Champ.
ESL Pro League Season 24
Stake Ranked Episode 4
Logitech G Connect 2026
SL StarSeries Fall 2026
FISSURE Playground #5
BLAST Open Fall 2026
Esports World Cup 2026
TLPD

1. ByuN
2. TY
3. Dark
4. Solar
5. Stats
6. Nerchio
7. sOs
8. soO
9. INnoVation
10. Elazer
1. Rain
2. Flash
3. EffOrt
4. Last
5. Bisu
6. Soulkey
7. Mini
8. Sharp
Sidebar Settings...

Advertising | Privacy Policy | Terms Of Use | Contact Us

Original banner artwork: Jim Warren
The contents of this webpage are copyright © 2026 TLnet. All Rights Reserved.