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On November 27 2012 07:30 LoCicero wrote:
My prediction for S3 is that the current strongest bruisers are going to become overpowered, i.e. Jax. It seems they they are giving melees a lot more itemization options and also nerfing items and gameplay for ranged AD carries.
How would you itemize some of the bruisers differently with the new items? Take Jax for example. What items would you use?
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On November 27 2012 07:30 LoCicero wrote:
My prediction for S3 is that the current strongest bruisers are going to become overpowered, i.e. Jax. It seems they they are giving melees a lot more itemization options and also nerfing items and gameplay for ranged AD carries.
They can still nerf bruisers ^^
I for one would be happy if top was different
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On November 27 2012 06:56 tobi9999 wrote:Show nested quote +On November 27 2012 06:19 Treadmill wrote:On November 27 2012 06:05 thenexusp wrote:On November 27 2012 05:46 Requizen wrote:On November 27 2012 05:44 AsmodeusXI wrote:On November 27 2012 05:38 Knighthawkbro wrote:On November 27 2012 05:24 phyvo wrote:
It's kind of sad that the only remotely abusable case for tiamat seems to be Fiora. Other than that it's a pretty boring farm item. + Show Spoiler + WOWW 2 OP. I assume that was set up for him to try that, right? Gotta find the full video, they grouped up like three times prior baiting him out, then they all hit Zhonya's. Yes, 5 Zhonya's on one team just to fuck with Wings. According to a youtube comment it worked (i.e. they couldn't hourglass) because of the surprise sej ult (obviously this was a custom and everyone was just generally dicking around anyway) It wasn't a custom it was a ranked game right before the s2 queue went down. it was a custom trust me....
Confirmed. I was watching it live. He was refusing to skype with AL or someone and the whole thing was totally troll.
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So, I have a season 3 prediction:
Yorick is going to get nerfed.
The base movespeed bonus is big for him because he already doesn't start boots all the time. He can start with a mana charm or whatever its called and a flask for crazy regen and build straight into a Muramana which will give him all the damage his build will need, and then just build tanky.
The new defense tree is way better for him with all the CC reduction, makes it much easier for him to just walk into the enemy team.
I think he will be very OP. Anybody concur?
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They're also making armor more expensive which just helps people with flat armor penetration(quite a few bruisers) even more, no? (eg. Chain Vest costs 20g more and provides 5 armor less. Even cloth armor lost 3 armor. Warden's mail being less desirable without the movespeed proc too.)
Not to mention the new Black Cleaver as an additional flat armor penetration option.
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There's less armor on the items, but there's more armor from masteries in the defense tree and less armor pen on the armor pen items and armor pen masteries. Not totally sure how it all adds up together, end result might be more or less the same.
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Most bruisers have %armor reduction, anyway, which isn't so much affected by the armor nerfs (early game at least, while the armor values are still rather low) as flat ArPen (which noone has, champs have reduction, most items have penetration except for Abyssal for MR and BC for armor).
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On November 27 2012 07:54 Ketara wrote:
There's less armor on the items, but there's more armor from masteries in the defense tree and less armor pen on the armor pen items and armor pen masteries. Not totally sure how it all adds up together, end result might be more or less the same.
According to the item site the armor penetration values on the items are the same, admittedly there are a few additional options for armor deep in the defense tree, but those are very slight and don't make up for the losses suffered on items.
Bla bla Alaric wrote:
which noone has
Olaf throws his axe at you.
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On November 27 2012 07:34 xDaunt wrote:Show nested quote +On November 27 2012 07:30 LoCicero wrote:
My prediction for S3 is that the current strongest bruisers are going to become overpowered, i.e. Jax. It seems they they are giving melees a lot more itemization options and also nerfing items and gameplay for ranged AD carries. How would you itemize some of the bruisers differently with the new items? Take Jax for example. What items would you use?
Mainly I feel that the nerfs to slows for range carries (phage/triforce not as strong) and exhaust and buffs to defensive tree might make them a pain in the ass. Warden's mail also seems like it could be pretty strong (if decent numbers) and the QSS + BF Sword seems like it would make it REALLY hard to escape from a bruiser. Also there are a lot more +movespeed options on the table so it would make it difficult for ADs or APs without mobility to live against a beefy bruiser. But, you may be right, with the changes to the cost (AD less expensive) it might be alright. Just a preliminary prediction.
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Been picking up Malzahar a bit again, awesome fun ^^ The AoE silence and %hp pool can just rock teams in the right comp, and while the ult is a little iffy it can be a nice tool to pick up running stragglers or defend yourself in skirmishes. Good fun!
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On November 27 2012 07:57 Alaric wrote:
Most bruisers have %armor reduction, anyway, which isn't so much affected by the armor nerfs (early game at least, while the armor values are still rather low) as flat ArPen (which noone has, champs have reduction, most items have penetration except for Abyssal for MR and BC for armor).
Actually there are a few champions who have Penetration. Olaf has Flat Penetration on his ultimate, and Darius has % Penetration on his E. Then there's Xerath for % Magic Penetration.
Granted that's not many, but champions with Penetration exist.
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On November 27 2012 07:57 Inschato wrote:Show nested quote +On November 27 2012 07:54 Ketara wrote:
There's less armor on the items, but there's more armor from masteries in the defense tree and less armor pen on the armor pen items and armor pen masteries. Not totally sure how it all adds up together, end result might be more or less the same. According to the item site the armor penetration values on the items are the same, admittedly there are a few additional options for armor deep in the defense tree, but those are very slight and don't make up for the losses suffered on items.
Armor's not gonna be godlike vs minions anymore in S3 without the masteries but penetration runes and the masteries were nerfed too (31 total in S2 -> 24 total in S3). Moreover if ADCs don't run armor pen runes the power of tank armor is actually going to increase late game because of the % pen nerf on LW unless a teammate has BC.
It's a confusing mess of crap because there are just so many changes in both directions, honestly, it will be interesting to see what happens when the dust settles.
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I still stand by my assumption that "true" AD casters/assassins are actually going to be hurt/weakened from this because their early game ArPen is lower, which will make up for the lower armor (chain vest will harm them just as hard) and late game LW is going to be weaker, which means that to actually "penetrate" more armor than currently they'll have to itemize flat ArPen (since they usually rely on combos and as such don't make good use of new BC), which detracts them from their "optimal" build path.
Iirc BT is more expensive too (the pice was reduced from 3350 but is still higher than currently) which will make it harder to reach, and it's their main alternative to builds like LW rush or bruta->LW. BFS being cheaper arguably makes up for it (esp. with it being their biggest expense).
Also GA nerf gonna hurt their mid and late game, since it's more or less their only defensive item (and they have to heavily itemize AD in order to stay relevant late game to counteract HP values after level ~13 when their combo's strength starts to fall off).
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I dunno
-armour and resists nerfed
-Shurelyas nerfed
-Frozen heart nerf
-Wits end nerfed (again)
-GA nerfed
Most bruisers are getting fucked hard by the changes except the ones with free resist steriods and don't need to build tank items like xin and jax.
It's the "op" guys like shen/malphite etc who were already borderline too strong are not getting hurt much because they can get sunfire and shit and rely on their skillset without needing to be really tanky with items and do damage with autos and stuff.
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Ah fair enough I didn't think to check runes...
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On November 27 2012 07:48 Ketara wrote:
So, I have a season 3 prediction:
Yorick is going to get nerfed.
The base movespeed bonus is big for him because he already doesn't start boots all the time. He can start with a mana charm or whatever its called and a flask for crazy regen and build straight into a Muramana which will give him all the damage his build will need, and then just build tanky.
The new defense tree is way better for him with all the CC reduction, makes it much easier for him to just walk into the enemy team.
I think he will be very OP. Anybody concur?
He's annoying enough in his current form, new manamune gunna be very strong on him. Also considering how cheap chalice is gunna be, ~700 gold, it's worth just grabbing it for lane phase.
I could see a lot of the items being VERY powerful on him, but tbh a lot of those items look good on a whole bunch of champions, and synchro's well with plenty of champs.
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United States23745 Posts
On November 27 2012 08:26 Slayer91 wrote:
I dunno
-armour and resists nerfed
-Shurelyas nerfed
-Frozen heart nerf
-Wits end nerfed (again)
-GA nerfed
Most bruisers are getting fucked hard by the changes except the ones with free resist steriods and don't need to build tank items like xin and jax.
It's the "op" guys like shen/malphite etc who were already borderline too strong are not getting hurt much because they can get sunfire and shit and rely on their skillset without needing to be really tanky with items and do damage with autos and stuff.
Or Rengar *shiver*
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How are people going to build nocturne come S3. Right now I've been thinking spirit stone->vamp+boots->finish tank spirit stone+zerks->hydra->resists would probably be the more selfish carry orientated build, while the current wriggles phage+aegis+wits mercs is better for teamfighting. (all theorycraft, I haven't actually played PBE).
How large is the AoE on hydra anyways, is it roughly equivalent to nocturne's passive AoE?
EDIT: Wow, at 400 range on that AoE passive according to wiki, I think hydra is going to be a must-buy for noct. Given that with hydra alone he'll have over 200 AD with Q up, that's a massive amount of incoming lifesteal.
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On November 27 2012 08:23 Alaric wrote:
I still stand by my assumption that "true" AD casters/assassins are actually going to be hurt/weakened from this because their early game ArPen is lower, which will make up for the lower armor (chain vest will harm them just as hard) and late game LW is going to be weaker, which means that to actually "penetrate" more armor than currently they'll have to itemize flat ArPen (since they usually rely on combos and as such don't make good use of new BC), which detracts them from their "optimal" build path.
Iirc BT is more expensive too (the pice was reduced from 3350 but is still higher than currently) which will make it harder to reach, and it's their main alternative to builds like LW rush or bruta->LW. BFS being cheaper arguably makes up for it (esp. with it being their biggest expense).
Also GA nerf gonna hurt their mid and late game, since it's more or less their only defensive item (and they have to heavily itemize AD in order to stay relevant late game to counteract HP values after level ~13 when their combo's strength starts to fall off).
Fun Fact: Even if we assume identical armor values between Season 2 and 3, LW + APen Marks + Masteries is roughly equivalent up until you're attacking targets with very high Armor.
Season 2: 21 + 46% Armor Penetration
Season 3: 16.5 + 40% Armor Penetration
Effective Penetration at Various Armor Levels (Season 2 | Season 3): - 50: 34.34 | 36.5
- 100: 57.34 | 56.5
- 150: 80.34 | 76.5
- 200: 103.34 | 96.5
- 250: 126.34 | 116.5
So really unless your targets are sporting significantly more than 100 Armor you're not going to notice the difference. If your champion has a % Reduction/Penetration effect there's never a point where you aren't better off in Season 3.
Also the current price of BT on the PBE is identical to Live. So really the only nerf to AD casters/assassins is the GA nerf, which (given that they tend to have better health scaling and itemization to beginwith) isn't the end of the world (and in fact helps them as GA is also a favorite of their primary targets).
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is awesome32277 Posts
On November 27 2012 02:54 nafta wrote:Show nested quote +On November 27 2012 02:51 TwoToneTerran wrote:On November 27 2012 01:12 Celial wrote:On November 27 2012 01:04 Simberto wrote:On November 27 2012 01:00 Taktik wrote:
Got a newb question xd How to bind /laugh /joke etc. to keys? Couldnt find that option ;/ They are already bound to ctrl + 1-4 by default, and i seem to recall an option for that being in the menu. Edit: Please don't spam those, its annoying. Except when you are Blitzcrank, Lux or Singed. Laughing is mandatory to perform well with these champions. Lulu #1 laugh. Been reported a few times for spamming it in lane :D.
LeBlanc has one of the most annoying laughs.
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EPT
