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On November 24 2012 01:54 Inschato wrote:Show nested quote +On November 24 2012 01:30 koreasilver wrote:
If you open with vamp scepter on Nasus against me when I'm playing Yorick I'm just going to max Q and fuck you up. I had a Nasus in a game a while back who went vamp scepter -> vamp scepter -> vamp scepter. Yeah, he died a couple times but eventually he was allowed to farm and became an unstoppable force mid-late game. It was funny. (I'm sure it was just because the other team didn't properly take advantage of his stupidity)
I'm pretty sure that's 100% the opposing team being dumb as balls. Nasus already has a ton of innate lifesteal so even just logically it's better to build resistances which anyone that actually seems to do well on Nasus already does anyway. There's no value in having 50% lifesteal if you're just going to lose half of your health every time the opposing laner taps you. You can't sustain through that.
Especially at the beginning of the game, 3pots >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> vamp scepter. Even disregarding the utility of boots, 3pots will be giving you more sustain than vamp scepter at that point of the game.
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Nasus gets shit on by EVERYONE in the first few levels. Vamp Scepter is quite possibly the worst item to start with that I can think off.
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On November 24 2012 01:16 Sandster wrote:
That Ahri skin, wow.
Anyway - twitch/own3d and most streaming sites are blocked at work. Any good vods to watch from, say, youtube?
Do they have to be current stuff? Parts of tales of the lane are uploaded, personally, I really enjoy some of the Studio Daily stuff, then there's the world finals, some Vods of ECC Poland, Vods of basically every IEM ever... Youtube's got plenty of stuff.
On November 24 2012 02:00 Alaric wrote:
I remember someone saying that Fiora crushes Panth at level 1, which is a rare thing (Q->aa->Q->aa, ~240 damage with ~20 bonus AD, and you heal around 50 HP from passive).
Then I remembered Darius does 100 + bonus AD damage with his Q at level 1, outruns you through his passive and apply bleed stacks for 50+ magic damage (that is with 3 stacks).
Fuck Darius, really. But I've been ranting about that a lot recently.
Not sure if you need a counter or not, but Lee shits on Darius. You run him OOM quite fast by maxing W and you can dictate engages easily. It's one of the easier lanes, actually.
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Lee shits on almost everyone. Please stop talking about it.
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On November 24 2012 02:29 OutlaW- wrote:
Lee shits on almost everyone. Please stop talking about it.
He's a pretty obnoxiously strong champion
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Also Darius isn't a great laner since he needs to push the lane with his Q.
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On November 24 2012 02:33 obesechicken13 wrote:
Also Darius isn't a great laner since he needs to push the lane with his Q.
which is why he's often considered broken by people in lower levels better because junglers dont always come
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On November 24 2012 02:29 OutlaW- wrote:
Lee shits on almost everyone. Please stop talking about it.
There's a bunch of popular top lane champions who give Lee a really hard time, also he's supposed to shit on people in lane. If he didn't, he had even less of an impact late game than it already is. Iunno, maybe it's just me, but there's a fuckton of bullshity champions that make me QQ at the moment and Lee isn't really one of them.
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On November 24 2012 02:13 Sandster wrote:
Nasus gets shit on by EVERYONE in the first few levels. Vamp Scepter is quite possibly the worst item to start with that I can think off.
wat
good luck trying to shit on someone who has an auto attack reset and 24% lifesteal at level 1
junglers rape nasus early game, his levels 1-3 are pretty strong, then people get their damage abilities and then he's weak until like level 7, but mostly it's just jungler forcing him to play passive because he has no escape.
the problem wiht vamp sceptre is they can harass off creeps and it might be a bait for jungler so you can't do shit really need pots
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Cruzerthebruzer's lee guide puts Irelia and Udyr as the hardest matchups he mentions (7.5/10) - Irelia's stun can win her trades because it takes too long to activate EE to slow her AS before she stuns you, AND she can auto reset with Q as well to continue putting in the hurt after you slow her. She can also use the stun as a hard disengage, and doesn't mind building some armor in lane since she only needs to farm well to "win" vs lee.
Think what you may of cruzer, but he plays really strong as both Irelia and Lee, he knows what he's talking about here.
Also, @ nasus, if he really does something like vamp scep at level 1, just trade with him HARD, use and abuse your pots heavily, and keep trading hard. If you can't hit creeps you can't sustain off lifesteal.
Also, vamp scep nerf inc.
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Well if you're going to say "Yorick isn't a great laner since he needs to push the lane with his W", yeah sure you can camp him and destroy him before he gets rolling, but he's still a bullshit champ to play against and lame/boring as all hell. x)
Darius is snowbally, extremely binary and I don't find him rewarding to play as/against because it's pretty much "Do I outtrade him? ALL-IN! Do I not? Well I'm screwed unless he fucks up and I can ult for the kill." on his side. There's a distinct lack of... uh, how to say it... "finesse"? In his laning.
Granted I play Jax/Irelia/Wukong/Pantheon/Olaf/Swain/Nunu top, who have (except for Nunu) a rather tough time against him, when not losing outright even with jungle help. I know there are counters to him but I don't play them and having to pick and learn yet another champ just to deal with him (and still be annoyed by it, unless it's a complete and brainless counter that'll allow me to focus on the actually interesting parts of the game) doesn't seem worth it.
I used to hate Kennen back when he was popular and the weeks leading to it because he was a kinda annoying/difficult match-up for the tops I played then (mainly Olaf) but I acknowledged that I was bad at dealing with him and that those were match-ups where I'd be able to win/outplay him if I improved.
It's not about losing to Darius, it's about him being too binary to bring interest to the lane/game, and as such being a hindrance to having fun.
I guess I'm just experiencing what older people experienced back when Xin was OP at all levels and faceroll at the same time. 
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Every champion is super strong. Stop lying to yourselves and saying they aren't! XD
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Are you serious? Irelia, Jax, Jayce, Darius, Shen all absolutely crap on Nasus. Vamp Scept means you have 0 sustain outside of hitting creep while they have boots and 3 bots, so you are completely zoned until wave hits your tower. A lot of Nasus matchups are only possible because Wither is one of the best gank-assist abilities in the game.
That's completely ignoring the fact that if I as a jungler see vamp scept start I will immediately level 2/3 gank top before the wave can hit your tower. You have no boots or pots, so even if the gank fails you will have <1/2 hp and no flash.
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irelia and jayce,shen not really. Darius/jax yes because they have even more bullshit level 1's
I don't normally go vamp scpetre but id have no problem picking nasus into shen irelia or jayce except for the fact that shen has global presence which you cant interrupt so i might take tp on him.
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If you let Nasus get some levels in wither, he'll put a lot on hurt on Jax too. x_x That'll slow his Q farm but it can be worth it.
Darius you can't disengage from (Q->passive MS buff to reach you, so he can hold on apprehend until after you've withered him and tried to run) so if you can't outtrade/sustain him you'll lose. Hard.
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You guys. Fiora beats so many people. She curbstomps Riven. She beats Jax and Teemo and she at least CAN beat Darius if you pick your engages carefully/Darius makes a mistake or two, but you also lose it if you make a mistake. You're also about as useful in teamfights. (Disclaimer: I've only played Darius like twice, Jax I'm pretty sure on but see below, Teemo is close, all top lane matchups are jungler dependant, I haven't played top lane in like 3 months.)
The people Fiora loses (and she loses HARD) to are armor stacking free-damage tanky dudes. Olaf gets stomped early but once he gets a Chainmail your damage noticeably drops off. Shen and Singed just don't even care. Jax can buy a chainmail and start winning everything post 6 because he has so much free mixed damage.
However, even in a losing matchup, Fiora does roam pretty well, so you can try to trade top tower for some kills and maybe a dragon. Late game, she has problems teamfighting but she's a pretty good splitpusher (she just eats towers absurdly fast).
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On November 24 2012 02:56 Alaric wrote:
Well if you're going to say "Yorick isn't a great laner since he needs to push the lane with his W", yeah sure you can camp him and destroy him before he gets rolling, but he's still a bullshit champ to play against and lame/boring as all hell. x)
That's a good point. I think Darius pushes faster but that's because Dar Q does more damage than Yorick W.
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On November 24 2012 02:56 Alaric wrote:
Granted I play Jax/Irelia/Wukong/Pantheon/Olaf/Swain/Nunu top, who have (except for Nunu) a rather tough time against him, when not losing outright even with jungle help.
Wait really? I mean the Darius' at my level are probably not skilled by any means, but I've just shit on every Darius I've seen as Swain.
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On November 24 2012 03:16 Tooplark wrote:
You guys. Fiora beats so many people. She curbstomps Riven. She beats Jax and Teemo and she at least CAN beat Darius if you pick your engages carefully/Darius makes a mistake or two, but you also lose it if you make a mistake. You're also about as useful in teamfights. (Disclaimer: I've only played Darius like twice, Jax I'm pretty sure on but see below, Teemo is close, all top lane matchups are jungler dependant, I haven't played top lane in like 3 months.)
The people Fiora loses (and she loses HARD) to are armor stacking free-damage tanky dudes. Olaf gets stomped early but once he gets a Chainmail your damage noticeably drops off. Shen and Singed just don't even care. Jax can buy a chainmail and start winning everything post 6 because he has so much free mixed damage.
However, even in a losing matchup, Fiora does roam pretty well, so you can try to trade top tower for some kills and maybe a dragon. Late game, she has problems teamfighting but she's a pretty good splitpusher (she just eats towers absurdly fast).
Pretty sure Riven can win this lane. It's not easy, but it's a skill matchup. Riven has so many ways to dictate fights, how is Fiora supposed to ever make use of her E? How does she stick on Riven? I don't know, she's a decent laner, but I see no appeal in picking her. Irelia can win against each and every of these champs (Jax&especially Darius being hard matchups) and to me seems incredibly more useful once laning ends. I'd rather not rely on my team being able to handle me splitpushing late game, either.
How does she beat Jax by the way? In your first paragraph you said she beats him, then in the second he wins the lane post 6 (and honestly, relying on 1-5 to win your lane seems dicey). I don't see her ever being able to kill him post 6, and most Jax players I know have no issues whatsoever chilling in lane till you hit 6 and then start taking over.
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United States37500 Posts
On November 23 2012 23:44 cascades wrote:
Well we need the Lol drama thread back so it doesn't pollute GD. Neo plz.
As for Ahri, looks better than many official champions and skins. I don't mean to look down on what riot's artists have accomplished, but this skin...
No. Never.
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EPT
