EPTKhazix nerf incoming imo.
[Patch 1.0.0.148: Kha'Zix] General Discussion - Page 42
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wei2coolman
United States60033 Posts
Khazix nerf incoming imo. | ||
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OutlaW-
Czech Republic5053 Posts
to be honest he has quite a few flaws | ||
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wei2coolman
United States60033 Posts
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Alaric
France45622 Posts
People are so fucking dumb. @_@ I know it's not Elo hell, but they play so badly, are so stupid, suddenly it feels like a totally different world. But that's only 70-80 Elo, that shouldn't make any difference! And I can carry average games in that environment, judging from the opposing team. But I don't get average games, there are morons all around, the kind that start regrowth+manapot top, the botlane that tries to invade without warning, the dude that takes Orianna support with Ashe and tries a level 1 fight against Graves Leona. It's just frustrating, I want to play with people whose mechanics are on par with my mediocre ones, not guys that last hit better than me but are such morons that every game is a new game of "how much will they manage to baffle me this time?". Fuck this. I can do my part, I can sometimes carry 5v5, but I can't do it 4v6, or even 3v7 (give or take one if I'm do busy facepalming to play correctly with both hands). | ||
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Zess
Adun Toridas!9144 Posts
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obesechicken13
United States10467 Posts
On September 30 2012 07:35 xes wrote: Kha'Zix = no more need to play AP Trist for the super mario resets. Play AP yi, trist, kha'zix, and squishy Darius on the same team. Watch as no one wants to engage until someone on the enemy team is below quarter health. | ||
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cLutZ
United States19574 Posts
On September 30 2012 07:32 OutlaW- wrote: No way. I hope riot intends to change the meta a bit by releasing a good assassin. If they nerf him, bruiser/tanky meta gonna stayyyyyyyyyyyyyyyyyyyyyy to be honest he has quite a few flaws Well, to be honest, if they want to make assassins they should make assassins. There is no place in the game for assassins so long as Rengar exists in his current form. | ||
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ticklishmusic
United States15977 Posts
On September 30 2012 07:42 obesechicken13 wrote: Play AP yi, trist, kha'zix, and squishy Darius on the same team. Watch as no one wants to engage until someone on the enemy team is below quarter health. Throw in a Kayle for extra lulz. | ||
TheYango
United States47024 Posts
On September 30 2012 07:32 OutlaW- wrote: No way. I hope riot intends to change the meta a bit by releasing a good assassin. If they nerf him, bruiser/tanky meta gonna stayyyyyyyyyyyyyyyyyyyyyy to be honest he has quite a few flaws The thing is, in terms of competitive play, the usefulness of a melee who doesn't bring AoE teamfighting ability, and is explicitly not supposed to be a melee carry (e.g. designed to only be able to kill squishies) is just fairly limited unless they're blazingly op. This isn't a "metagame" issue, this is just the flaw in treating "assassin" as a proper role. | ||
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wei2coolman
United States60033 Posts
On September 30 2012 07:46 TheYango wrote: The thing is, in terms of competitive play, the usefulness of a melee who doesn't bring AoE teamfighting ability, and is explicitly not supposed to be a melee carry (e.g. designed to only be able to kill squishies) is just fairly limited unless they're blazingly op. This isn't a "metagame" issue, this is just the flaw in treating "assassin" as a proper role. Assassin also feel extremely unfun to play against, especially as a squishy. Since there's almost no counterplay against an a assassin, when you're a squishy. You either die in half a second, or you don't. It's a very binary feel. | ||
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TheYango
United States47024 Posts
Solo kill-based kits are just too binary. Either they can solo kill people based on being OP or extremely fed and snowball because of the threat they present, or they can't and they're useless because that's all they can do. | ||
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OutlaW-
Czech Republic5053 Posts
On September 30 2012 07:46 TheYango wrote: The thing is, in terms of competitive play, the usefulness of a melee who doesn't bring AoE teamfighting ability, and is explicitly not supposed to be a melee carry (e.g. designed to only be able to kill squishies) is just fairly limited unless they're blazingly op. This isn't a "metagame" issue, this is just the flaw in treating "assassin" as a proper role. And why? Because bruisers and tanky people are too strong in comparison. A 15k gold Cho at 30 min or a 15k gold khazix, cho gonna be 3x more useful almost no matter what. It's not just an issue of coordination. I would welcome a buff to assassins (who are rarely played anyways) like talon, akali, pantheon or a nerf to everyone tanky.. | ||
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wei2coolman
United States60033 Posts
On September 30 2012 07:49 TheYango wrote: The nature of what people define as "assassin" is such that the kit is geared specifically toward solo kills--and sacrifices general teamfighting ability (in comparison to melees that bring more AoE, CC, or utility). A champ that's solo-kill oriented is naturally either blazingly OP, or incredibly snowbally--neither of which are sustainable for an archetype in competitive play. Proof, pre-gunblade nerf Akali. Shit was so fucking stupid. It's not for balance issue, outlaw, it also has to do with "funness". How fun is it to be an AD carry in the backline, then all of a sudden one guy jumps on you, 100-0's you in halfsecond, with absolutely no counterplay option on your part? Now multiply that by the number of games you've played as AD-C. It gets real unfun, real quick. | ||
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TheYango
United States47024 Posts
On September 30 2012 07:49 OutlaW- wrote: And why? Because bruisers and tanky people are too strong in comparison. A 15k gold Cho at 30 min or a 15k gold khazix, cho gonna be 3x more useful almost no matter what. It's not just an issue of coordination. I would welcome a buff to assassins (who are rarely played anyways) like talon, akali, pantheon or a nerf to everyone tanky.. You're missing the point. You can't balance solo-kill based kits for competitive play because their balance is too binary. Either they can do their job and present too strong a threat because of it (even the worst case scenario of a suicide dive where an assassin trades themselves for an AD carry is worth it because then they're fighting a 4v4 without an AD carry), or they can't complete the kill and they're just a liability. There's not a middle ground because the typical assassin kit sacrifices CC/utility/AoE that conventional melees have (which allows even an under-farmed Cho'gath to maintain a teamfight presence), creating the "useless when behind, takes control of the game when ahead" gameplay that characterizes all assassins in the game, regardless of balance. Incidentally, every "assassin" kit that actually did have these CC/utility/AoE aspects to make them good teamfighters just end up not being considered assassins in the long run--see Diana. | ||
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barbsq
United States5348 Posts
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Razhil
Belgium208 Posts
On September 30 2012 07:50 wei2coolman wrote: Proof, pre-gunblade nerf Akali. Shit was so fucking stupid. It's not for balance issue, outlaw, it also has to do with "funness". How fun is it to be an AD carry in the backline, then all of a sudden one guy jumps on you, 100-0's you in halfsecond, with absolutely no counterplay option on your part? Now multiply that by the number of games you've played as AD-C. It gets real unfun, real quick. This so much... If you start a game and see something like Talon, Akali, Rengar in the enemy team and you're the AD carry (and maybe, even worse, you've chosen to NOT pick a AD carry with a build-in escape, like Ashe), you know you won't have fun this game. But like NO fun at all. | ||
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Alaric
France45622 Posts
THE. FUCK. Can't do any fucking thing against Kha'Zix. He's level 2 with red, jumps into lane, there's TF so I flash before the gold card, get stunned under my tower, Kha'Zix auto with his passive then Q, the Q does 145 damage thanks to the isolation bonus, and now I'm dead because that's a FUCKING THIRD of my HP bar. Because the range on isolation is fucking dumb. He is fucking utterly broken mid, with all the squishies. And the guy doesn't even run full AD runes. Stupid fucking broken shit, how do you expect that to be played against? He dives me everytime and kills me before I can do anything. Even the tower doesn't have the time to hit him more than once. If I'm lucky. He comes at 6, I see his ult, flash to go under my tower is down. I get stunned by flash TF and before the stun wears off I'm dead. Balanced. Fun to play against. 'k again, we're level 9. I put my stun under me as I run since TF wants to aggro. He flashes, stuns, Kha kills me before my stun stuns him (takes 1.5s). Bullshit champ. | ||
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wei2coolman
United States60033 Posts
On September 30 2012 08:03 Alaric wrote: WHAT. THE. FUCK. Can't do any fucking thing against Kha'Zix. He's level 2 with red, jumps into lane, there's TF so I flash before the gold card, get stunned under my tower, Kha'Zix auto with his passive then Q, the Q does 145 damage thanks to the isolation bonus, and now I'm dead because that's a FUCKING THIRD of my HP bar. Because the range on isolation is fucking dumb. He is fucking utterly broken mid, with all the squishies. And the guy doesn't even run full AD runes. Stupid fucking broken shit, how do you expect that to be played against? He dives me everytime and kills me before I can do anything. Even the tower doesn't have the time to hit him more than once. If I'm lucky. I'm glad I'm not the only one who fucking hates the damn champion, everyone feel my rage!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! Yeah, during towerdives he probably takes like 1 tower hit, if done correctly. | ||
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TheYango
United States47024 Posts
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JackDino
Gabon6219 Posts
On September 30 2012 08:01 Razhil wrote: This so much... If you start a game and see something like Talon, Akali, Rengar in the enemy team and you're the AD carry (and maybe, even worse, you've chosen to NOT pick a AD carry with a build-in escape, like Ashe), you know you won't have fun this game. But like NO fun at all. Like, if you start a game as talon or pantheon and you see the enemy AD is like ezreal, graves, tristana or corki you know you won't have any fun at all. Goddamn jumps. | ||
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