• Log InLog In
  • Register
Liquid`
Team Liquid Liquipedia
EDT 08:22
CEST 14:22
KST 21:22
  • Home
  • Forum
  • Calendar
  • Streams
  • Liquipedia
  • Features
  • Store
  • EPT
  • TL+
  • StarCraft 2
  • Brood War
  • Smash
  • Heroes
  • Counter-Strike
  • Overwatch
  • Liquibet
  • Fantasy StarCraft
  • TLPD
  • StarCraft 2
  • Brood War
  • Blogs
Forum Sidebar
Events/Features
News
Featured News
Team Liquid Map Contest #21 - Presented by Monster Energy5uThermal's 2v2 Tour: $15,000 Main Event14Serral wins EWC 202549Tournament Spotlight: FEL Cracow 202510Power Rank - Esports World Cup 202580
Community News
Weekly Cups (Aug 4-10): MaxPax wins a triple5SC2's Safe House 2 - October 18 & 195Weekly Cups (Jul 28-Aug 3): herO doubles up6LiuLi Cup - August 2025 Tournaments5[BSL 2025] H2 - Team Wars, Weeklies & SB Ladder10
StarCraft 2
General
#1: Maru - Greatest Players of All Time RSL Revival patreon money discussion thread Team Liquid Map Contest #21 - Presented by Monster Energy Lambo Talks: The Future of SC2 and more... uThermal's 2v2 Tour: $15,000 Main Event
Tourneys
RSL: Revival, a new crowdfunded tournament series SEL Masters #5 - Korea vs Russia (SC Evo) Enki Epic Series #5 - TaeJa vs Classic (SC Evo) ByuN vs TaeJa Bo7 SC Evo Showmatch Global Tourney for College Students in September
Strategy
Custom Maps
External Content
Mutation # 486 Watch the Skies Mutation # 485 Death from Below Mutation # 484 Magnetic Pull Mutation #239 Bad Weather
Brood War
General
Google Play ASL (Season 20) Announced ASL20 Pre-season Tier List ranking! New season has just come in ladder BW General Discussion BSL Polish World Championship 2025 20-21 September
Tourneys
KCM 2025 Season 3 Small VOD Thread 2.0 [Megathread] Daily Proleagues [ASL20] Online Qualifiers Day 2
Strategy
Simple Questions, Simple Answers Fighting Spirit mining rates [G] Mineral Boosting Muta micro map competition
Other Games
General Games
Stormgate/Frost Giant Megathread Total Annihilation Server - TAForever Nintendo Switch Thread Beyond All Reason [MMORPG] Tree of Savior (Successor of Ragnarok)
Dota 2
Official 'what is Dota anymore' discussion
League of Legends
Heroes of the Storm
Simple Questions, Simple Answers Heroes of the Storm 2.0
Hearthstone
Heroes of StarCraft mini-set
TL Mafia
TL Mafia Community Thread Vanilla Mini Mafia
Community
General
Things Aren’t Peaceful in Palestine US Politics Mega-thread Russo-Ukrainian War Thread The Games Industry And ATVI Bitcoin discussion thread
Fan Clubs
INnoVation Fan Club SKT1 Classic Fan Club!
Media & Entertainment
Anime Discussion Thread [\m/] Heavy Metal Thread [Manga] One Piece Movie Discussion! Korean Music Discussion
Sports
2024 - 2025 Football Thread TeamLiquid Health and Fitness Initiative For 2023 Formula 1 Discussion
World Cup 2022
Tech Support
Gtx660 graphics card replacement Installation of Windows 10 suck at "just a moment" Computer Build, Upgrade & Buying Resource Thread
TL Community
TeamLiquid Team Shirt On Sale The Automated Ban List
Blogs
Gaming After Dark: Poor Slee…
TrAiDoS
[Girl blog} My fema…
artosisisthebest
Sharpening the Filtration…
frozenclaw
ASL S20 English Commentary…
namkraft
from making sc maps to makin…
Husyelt
StarCraft improvement
iopq
Customize Sidebar...

Website Feedback

Closed Threads



Active: 605 users

[Patch 1.0.0.136: Lulu] General Discussion - Page 30

Forum Index > LoL General
Post a Reply
Prev 1 28 29 30 31 32 339 Next
Remember guys, this is the general discussion thread. Keep whine/QQ posts in the appropriate QQ memorial thread! Thanks!
nojitosunrise
Profile Joined August 2011
United States6188 Posts
March 21 2012 19:01 GMT
#581
On March 22 2012 03:59 Caphe wrote:
TSM just got demolished by CLG.eu. FF after 26 mins. They really need to work on their team co-ordination.


I hate to say it but...

TSM went from being a Top rated NA team to a B rated EU team.

fcgog
Profile Joined October 2011
United Kingdom876 Posts
March 21 2012 19:03 GMT
#582
TSM are so quiet when playing compared to CLG.eu
Beyonder
Profile Blog Joined September 2002
Netherlands15103 Posts
March 21 2012 19:04 GMT
#583
Enjoying TSM being dismantled hahh

TOO never feels like he does anything.. He just farms up his stuff, but he is never ever a threat.

They need a leader, especially in fights. "KILL X". Just look at the M5 coordination skills..

its a sad story, feels like NA in SC2 XD
Moderator
Caphe
Profile Blog Joined May 2007
Vietnam10817 Posts
March 21 2012 19:06 GMT
#584
On March 22 2012 04:01 nojitosunrise wrote:
Show nested quote +
On March 22 2012 03:59 Caphe wrote:
TSM just got demolished by CLG.eu. FF after 26 mins. They really need to work on their team co-ordination.


I hate to say it but...

TSM went from being a Top rated NA team to a B rated EU team.


Yeah, but not to this bad. That earlier arguement really brought their morale down. I think they should just stop playing after this bo3, just chill for the rest of the day and get a fresh start tomorrow.
CLG.eu was not playing brilliant at all. Just some very typical ganks and dragon timing and thats enough to pick TSM apart.
Terran
UniversalSnip
Profile Blog Joined July 2010
9871 Posts
Last Edited: 2012-03-21 19:09:15
March 21 2012 19:07 GMT
#585
On March 21 2012 19:40 HazMat wrote:
Show nested quote +
On March 21 2012 17:08 UniversalSnip wrote:
On March 21 2012 15:37 nyxnyxnyx wrote:
can someone teach me the ways of the twisted treeline please...have a tourney coming up


It's pretty simple.

Rule 0) Call the timers. 4 5 6, minor buffs 4 minutes, red 5 minutes, dragon 6 minutes (you can remember this because you already know SR is 5 6 7 buffs dragon baron)

1) You need a jungler. Jungler is more like a roamer that picks up jungle farm and they need to be very durable early because the creeps hit like a fucking truck. Lots of ganks early and often.

2) If you come out behind in the level 1 fight you will lose unless they're completely retarded. If your comp is worse lvl 1 or you're not confident about getting a good engage or they have better summoners for a level 1 fight don't risk it, just sit at towers.

3) Singed is S tier, pick or ban.

4) Most other popular heroes are counterpickable. For example vs tryndamere pick nasus, vs hard engage teams pick nidalee. Counterpicking is very significant.

5) Keep red and dragon warded as soon as possible, pinks are good.

6) Dragon is about as good as baron is in 5s. As soon as somebody is close to wriggles it must be warded all the time, no exceptions and don't send two bot if you risk losing dragon. The best way to win a dragon fight is poke, this is typically how you beat a hard engage comp: someone goes back and buys some pinks and greens, then just go top and poke them down at dragon. They can't leave or you win.

7) Having your lane pushed is better and it doesn't really make you more vulnerable to ganks if you have wards, and only slightly more vulnerable if you don't for some reason. Also if you are pushing your lane the chance of killing someone or forcing them back based on popping a level earlier than them is fairly high. Since the lanes are so long killing someone 1 vs 1 is much more realistic than in 5s.

8) If your tanky guy gets fed oracles is the fastest way to shut the game out. It's a risk but there is no way to win vs a team that keeps an oracles up.

Minor buffs are 3 mins, liz 4, dragon 5...
Also don't pick Nasus. Wither vs trynd isn't enough to justify picking him. There's also an insane amount of op heroes in 3 atm. Shyv, Shen, Shaco, WW, Skarner, Singed, Mundo and Lee Sin. Singed used to be the god of 3v3 but honestly just pick lane dominatora and kiters vs him and you'll be fine. Just teamfight and keep buffs under control and you'll be fine.


er whoops. 3 4 5. It's been a while.

I don't know what people play lately on the map, I find it unlikely that nasus isn't still good as a late pick though. He's better than anyone else at just removing a melee guy from the game while still fighting their other two picks well.
"How fucking dare you defile the sanctity of DotA with your fucking casual plebian terminology? May the curse of Gaben and Volvo be upon you. le filthy casual."
arnath
Profile Joined May 2010
United States1317 Posts
March 21 2012 19:08 GMT
#586
Can someone explain to me why people run AP quints on Maokai? The explanation I heard was that the 15 AP allowed you to kill wraiths instantly but as far as I can tell you kill wraiths with 3 acorns with or without 15 AP.
Sandster
Profile Joined November 2006
United States4054 Posts
March 21 2012 19:08 GMT
#587
On March 22 2012 04:00 Seuss wrote:
Show nested quote +
On March 22 2012 03:22 Sandster wrote:
Yeah I meant TOO was great to watch because he talked through his thought process when playing, which helped me learn the jungle from a top-level jungler. He's also hilarious when he talks trash because he doesn't get pissed off, just makes snide remarks about how awful some people are. And beyond that - he openly admits when he screws up.

Then the jungle patch came and I started seeing some gaping holes in his play, and now it's really tough to watch him play because he just isn't as good anymore, and I sure as heck don't want to adopt his style into my jungling.


There are a lot of junglers who were born and bred in the old jungle who have had problems with the new jungle. It's akin to the difference between Super Mario Brothers and Super Mario Brothers 2. They look sort of the same, have the same characters, and even have vaguely similar mechanics, but beyond those shallow comparisons they're entirely different.


My point is that, as a professional player, you take the changes in stride and adapt. Problem is he hasn't been able to successfully do so, and it saddens me because he was a very informative player.
Alaric
Profile Joined November 2009
France45622 Posts
March 21 2012 19:11 GMT
#588
You need to send the 3rd sapling so that he lands right when the wraiths spawn, dealing those damage too, and then punch the big wraith once to kill him. With 15 AP, you don't need the punch so you send the 3rd from over the wall, at mid, and gain a few seconds that allow you to be at the blue buff before 1:55. I usually get there around 1:58 (I use MS quints). No biggie, but eh.
Cant take LMS hipsters serious.
Two_DoWn
Profile Blog Joined October 2009
United States13684 Posts
March 21 2012 19:14 GMT
#589
On March 22 2012 04:00 Seuss wrote:
Show nested quote +
On March 22 2012 03:22 Sandster wrote:
Yeah I meant TOO was great to watch because he talked through his thought process when playing, which helped me learn the jungle from a top-level jungler. He's also hilarious when he talks trash because he doesn't get pissed off, just makes snide remarks about how awful some people are. And beyond that - he openly admits when he screws up.

Then the jungle patch came and I started seeing some gaping holes in his play, and now it's really tough to watch him play because he just isn't as good anymore, and I sure as heck don't want to adopt his style into my jungling.


There are a lot of junglers who were born and bred in the old jungle who have had problems with the new jungle. It's akin to the difference between Super Mario Brothers and Super Mario Brothers 2. They look sort of the same, have the same characters, and even have vaguely similar mechanics, but beyond those shallow comparisons they're entirely different.

Only TOO is literally THE ONLY jungler who has had this problem. Hell, even you and I adapted better than he did.
"What is the air speed velocity of an unladen courier?" "Dire or Radiant?"
JackDino
Profile Joined July 2010
Gabon6219 Posts
March 21 2012 19:15 GMT
#590
On March 22 2012 03:59 Caphe wrote:
TSM just got demolished by CLG.eu. FF after 26 mins. They really need to work on their team co-ordination.

They need to work on their mid lol, should 4man gank him irl.
This isnt Broodwar so I dont owe anyone respect for beating me. -arb
ibreakurface
Profile Joined June 2010
United States664 Posts
March 21 2012 19:19 GMT
#591
On March 22 2012 04:14 Two_DoWn wrote:
Show nested quote +
On March 22 2012 04:00 Seuss wrote:
On March 22 2012 03:22 Sandster wrote:
Yeah I meant TOO was great to watch because he talked through his thought process when playing, which helped me learn the jungle from a top-level jungler. He's also hilarious when he talks trash because he doesn't get pissed off, just makes snide remarks about how awful some people are. And beyond that - he openly admits when he screws up.

Then the jungle patch came and I started seeing some gaping holes in his play, and now it's really tough to watch him play because he just isn't as good anymore, and I sure as heck don't want to adopt his style into my jungling.


There are a lot of junglers who were born and bred in the old jungle who have had problems with the new jungle. It's akin to the difference between Super Mario Brothers and Super Mario Brothers 2. They look sort of the same, have the same characters, and even have vaguely similar mechanics, but beyond those shallow comparisons they're entirely different.

Only TOO is literally THE ONLY jungler who has had this problem. Hell, even you and I adapted better than he did.

...

You should read your posts before you submit them.
:) I play zerg. FOX AND KT ROLSTER COASTER FAN! Because I love everyone. Except bisu.
Ruken
Profile Blog Joined April 2009
United States858 Posts
Last Edited: 2012-03-21 19:23:02
March 21 2012 19:21 GMT
#592
I highly suggest EVERYONE from LiquidParty change their league password immediately. Someone has obtained a large amount of PWs for TL people. I'm getting messaged in game by some TL regulars, they're obviously hacked because the messages are in broken english and asking for passwords to "smurf accounts" or other high elo accounts.
MIK Terran
Ruken
Profile Blog Joined April 2009
United States858 Posts
Last Edited: 2012-03-21 19:22:03
March 21 2012 19:21 GMT
#593
edit double post
MIK Terran
Two_DoWn
Profile Blog Joined October 2009
United States13684 Posts
March 21 2012 19:23 GMT
#594
On March 22 2012 04:19 ibreakurface wrote:
Show nested quote +
On March 22 2012 04:14 Two_DoWn wrote:
On March 22 2012 04:00 Seuss wrote:
On March 22 2012 03:22 Sandster wrote:
Yeah I meant TOO was great to watch because he talked through his thought process when playing, which helped me learn the jungle from a top-level jungler. He's also hilarious when he talks trash because he doesn't get pissed off, just makes snide remarks about how awful some people are. And beyond that - he openly admits when he screws up.

Then the jungle patch came and I started seeing some gaping holes in his play, and now it's really tough to watch him play because he just isn't as good anymore, and I sure as heck don't want to adopt his style into my jungling.


There are a lot of junglers who were born and bred in the old jungle who have had problems with the new jungle. It's akin to the difference between Super Mario Brothers and Super Mario Brothers 2. They look sort of the same, have the same characters, and even have vaguely similar mechanics, but beyond those shallow comparisons they're entirely different.

Only TOO is literally THE ONLY jungler who has had this problem. Hell, even you and I adapted better than he did.

...

You should read your posts before you submit them.

What did I say that was wrong?
"What is the air speed velocity of an unladen courier?" "Dire or Radiant?"
HazMat
Profile Blog Joined October 2009
United States17077 Posts
March 21 2012 19:24 GMT
#595
Wait what? Just liquidparty or TLers in general?
www.youtube.com/user/ShakeDrizzle | League and SSBM content creator | Armada's Youtube Editor
Ruken
Profile Blog Joined April 2009
United States858 Posts
Last Edited: 2012-03-21 19:30:26
March 21 2012 19:26 GMT
#596
On March 22 2012 04:24 HazMat wrote:
Wait what? Just liquidparty or TLers in general?

I don't know but I got a text that my account was hacked, logged in immediately and changed all my info. Numbers account is for sure hacked as well as some other people. I also got a message asking something about your account (shakedrizzle) or your smurf or something.
So yeah I would assume it's going around TL. I don't know if he keylogged people or if he is seriously getting people to give up their friend's passwords but obviously since all the accounts I've seen that were hacked are TL people, it's probably a good idea for all of us to change PWs.
I don't have a keylogger but lots of people knew my PW. When I logged in it said my account has been accessed from another location and logged me off, that's when I changed everything.
MIK Terran
Ryuu314
Profile Joined October 2009
United States12679 Posts
March 21 2012 19:30 GMT
#597
On March 22 2012 04:14 Two_DoWn wrote:
Show nested quote +
On March 22 2012 04:00 Seuss wrote:
On March 22 2012 03:22 Sandster wrote:
Yeah I meant TOO was great to watch because he talked through his thought process when playing, which helped me learn the jungle from a top-level jungler. He's also hilarious when he talks trash because he doesn't get pissed off, just makes snide remarks about how awful some people are. And beyond that - he openly admits when he screws up.

Then the jungle patch came and I started seeing some gaping holes in his play, and now it's really tough to watch him play because he just isn't as good anymore, and I sure as heck don't want to adopt his style into my jungling.


There are a lot of junglers who were born and bred in the old jungle who have had problems with the new jungle. It's akin to the difference between Super Mario Brothers and Super Mario Brothers 2. They look sort of the same, have the same characters, and even have vaguely similar mechanics, but beyond those shallow comparisons they're entirely different.

Only TOO is literally THE ONLY jungler who has had this problem. Hell, even you and I adapted better than he did.

to be fair, SV was playing a carry-oriented jungling style even before the jungle remake. no clue about the other top junglers. TOO was always played a much more support-style jungler so it'll take longer for him to adapt. I do agree that TOO is taking far far too long to adapt to new jungle, altho I'd imagine it has something to do with how TRM/Regi are so used/need to having a jungle babysitter to do well. It really shows in both TOO and Regi's play. Regi isn't getting nearly the same level of babysit he used to be getting because of the jungle remake, so the flaws in his play are even more apparent now. This creates a vicious cycle between TOO sucking and Regi sucking.
HazMat
Profile Blog Joined October 2009
United States17077 Posts
March 21 2012 19:31 GMT
#598
On March 22 2012 04:26 Ruken wrote:
Show nested quote +
On March 22 2012 04:24 HazMat wrote:
Wait what? Just liquidparty or TLers in general?

I don't know but I got a text that my account was hacked, logged in immediately and changed all my info. Numbers account is for sure hacked as well as some other people. I also got a message asking something about your account (shakedrizzle) or your smurf or something.
So yeah I would assume it's going around TL. I don't know if he keylogged people or if he is seriously getting people to give up their friend's passwords but obviously since all the accounts I've seen that were hacked are TL people, it's probably a good idea for all of us to change PWs.

How would they get this info? I don't understand how they could he getting more than 1 Tl'ers passwords since it's not like we share our info or anything.
www.youtube.com/user/ShakeDrizzle | League and SSBM content creator | Armada's Youtube Editor
Flicky
Profile Blog Joined December 2008
England2662 Posts
March 21 2012 19:33 GMT
#599
On March 22 2012 04:04 Beyonder wrote:
They need a leader, especially in fights. "KILL X". Just look at the M5 coordination skills..


So true. Have you seen a TSM team fight recently? They're all hitting different targets and killing no one.
Liquipedia"I was seriously looking for a black guy" - MrHoon
HazMat
Profile Blog Joined October 2009
United States17077 Posts
Last Edited: 2012-03-21 19:36:34
March 21 2012 19:34 GMT
#600
On March 22 2012 04:31 HazMat wrote:
Show nested quote +
On March 22 2012 04:26 Ruken wrote:
On March 22 2012 04:24 HazMat wrote:
Wait what? Just liquidparty or TLers in general?

I don't know but I got a text that my account was hacked, logged in immediately and changed all my info. Numbers account is for sure hacked as well as some other people. I also got a message asking something about your account (shakedrizzle) or your smurf or something.
So yeah I would assume it's going around TL. I don't know if he keylogged people or if he is seriously getting people to give up their friend's passwords but obviously since all the accounts I've seen that were hacked are TL people, it's probably a good idea for all of us to change PWs.

How would they get this info? I don't understand how they could he getting more than 1 Tl'ers passwords since it's not like we share our info or anything.

Oh well I'm safe. Interested in what happened though.

edit: If you want to hack my smurf just ask for it you nerds. Haven't used it since November.
www.youtube.com/user/ShakeDrizzle | League and SSBM content creator | Armada's Youtube Editor
Prev 1 28 29 30 31 32 339 Next
Please log in or register to reply.
Live Events Refresh
WardiTV Summer Champion…
11:00
Group Stage 1 - Group B
WardiTV903
Rex152
IndyStarCraft 113
TKL 101
Liquipedia
[ Submit Event ]
Live Streams
Refresh
StarCraft 2
Rex 152
Harstem 150
IndyStarCraft 113
TKL 101
SC2_NightMare 18
StarCraft: Brood War
Britney 40696
Rain 13510
Bisu 1231
Jaedong 1056
Larva 527
Shuttle 508
EffOrt 503
BeSt 426
Mini 346
ggaemo 241
[ Show more ]
Last 236
Zeus 182
Hyun 155
ZerO 152
Snow 147
Soma 142
TY 121
Free 111
Rush 110
Aegong 72
Soulkey 63
Pusan 60
ToSsGirL 58
soO 41
Backho 36
sSak 32
Sharp 31
Icarus 29
sorry 27
yabsab 22
ajuk12(nOOB) 18
JulyZerg 18
Sexy 17
scan(afreeca) 17
Noble 16
IntoTheRainbow 13
SilentControl 12
ivOry 11
Bale 10
HiyA 10
Terrorterran 9
zelot 7
Hm[arnc] 4
Dota 2
XaKoH 427
XcaliburYe337
qojqva185
Counter-Strike
olofmeister1745
x6flipin714
Super Smash Bros
Mew2King60
Other Games
gofns8871
FrodaN3193
singsing2031
B2W.Neo1048
crisheroes388
DeMusliM373
hiko182
Fuzer 135
SortOf90
ZerO(Twitch)15
Organizations
StarCraft: Brood War
UltimateBattle 16
StarCraft 2
Blizzard YouTube
StarCraft: Brood War
BSLTrovo
sctven
[ Show 18 non-featured ]
StarCraft 2
• StrangeGG 38
• davetesta25
• Adnapsc2 6
• iHatsuTV 4
• Migwel
• AfreecaTV YouTube
• intothetv
• Kozan
• sooper7s
• IndyKCrew
• LaughNgamezSOOP
StarCraft: Brood War
• iopq 9
• STPLYoutube
• ZZZeroYoutube
• BSLYoutube
Dota 2
• WagamamaTV276
League of Legends
• Nemesis2259
• Jankos757
Upcoming Events
The PondCast
21h 38m
WardiTV Summer Champion…
22h 38m
Replay Cast
1d 11h
LiuLi Cup
1d 22h
Online Event
2 days
SC Evo League
2 days
uThermal 2v2 Circuit
3 days
CSO Contender
3 days
Sparkling Tuna Cup
3 days
WardiTV Summer Champion…
3 days
[ Show More ]
SC Evo League
3 days
uThermal 2v2 Circuit
4 days
Afreeca Starleague
4 days
Sharp vs Ample
Larva vs Stork
Wardi Open
4 days
RotterdaM Event
5 days
Replay Cast
5 days
Replay Cast
5 days
Afreeca Starleague
5 days
JyJ vs TY
Bisu vs Speed
WardiTV Summer Champion…
5 days
Afreeca Starleague
6 days
Mini vs TBD
Soma vs sSak
WardiTV Summer Champion…
6 days
Liquipedia Results

Completed

StarCon 2025 Philadelphia
FEL Cracow 2025
CC Div. A S7

Ongoing

Copa Latinoamericana 4
Jiahua Invitational
BSL 20 Team Wars
KCM Race Survival 2025 Season 3
BSL 21 Qualifiers
WardiTV Summer 2025
uThermal 2v2 Main Event
HCC Europe
BLAST Bounty Fall Qual
IEM Cologne 2025
FISSURE Playground #1
BLAST.tv Austin Major 2025

Upcoming

CSL Season 18: Qualifier 1
ASL Season 20
CSLAN 3
CSL 2025 AUTUMN (S18)
BSL Season 21
BSL 21 Team A
RSL Revival: Season 2
Maestros of the Game
SEL Season 2 Championship
PGL Masters Bucharest 2025
MESA Nomadic Masters Fall
Thunderpick World Champ.
CS Asia Championships 2025
Roobet Cup 2025
ESL Pro League S22
StarSeries Fall 2025
FISSURE Playground #2
BLAST Open Fall 2025
BLAST Open Fall Qual
Esports World Cup 2025
BLAST Bounty Fall 2025
TLPD

1. ByuN
2. TY
3. Dark
4. Solar
5. Stats
6. Nerchio
7. sOs
8. soO
9. INnoVation
10. Elazer
1. Rain
2. Flash
3. EffOrt
4. Last
5. Bisu
6. Soulkey
7. Mini
8. Sharp
Sidebar Settings...

Advertising | Privacy Policy | Terms Of Use | Contact Us

Original banner artwork: Jim Warren
The contents of this webpage are copyright © 2025 TLnet. All Rights Reserved.