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Same rules apply, per usual. Please use the appropriate threads (QQ, Brag, Champion, etc) whenever appropriate. Keep the resident Banling content.
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United States47024 Posts
On March 04 2012 14:51 Seuss wrote:
Theoretically if you had a jungler whose only problem was sustain survivability quints could be used to patch that up. Whether Lifesteal Quints solve the problem or are the best option depends on the potential jungler.
I'm not aware of any such champions at the moment, but then it's not like we haven't been ignorant of viable options before.
If that were the case then the comparison to other rune choices wouldn't matter. How they compare mathematically to resist or hp5 is of no practical value if jungling with such a champ simply works with lifesteal quints and doesn't without them.
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I would just like to say...
Hot dayum Ziggs is soooo broken in ARAM. It is borderline impossible to get Ziggs and not have like 20 kills and 15K gold by the end of the game. SO much deeps, sooo much poke, so much AoE. Half the time you get a penta kill at level 6.
<3
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On March 04 2012 14:56 TheYango wrote:Show nested quote +On March 04 2012 14:51 Seuss wrote:
Theoretically if you had a jungler whose only problem was sustain survivability quints could be used to patch that up. Whether Lifesteal Quints solve the problem or are the best option depends on the potential jungler.
I'm not aware of any such champions at the moment, but then it's not like we haven't been ignorant of viable options before. If that were the case then the comparison to other rune choices wouldn't matter. How they compare mathematically to resist or hp5 is of no practical value if jungling with such a champ simply works with lifesteal quints and doesn't without them.
Might be worth a shot on some champions with naturally high AD or AD boost like nocturne or fiora, and the runes will scale.
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On March 04 2012 14:52 overt wrote:Show nested quote +On March 04 2012 14:06 Glaceau wrote:
i dont get how you beat anyone as annie if the other team isnt retarded. only thing she has going for her is the crazy lvl 1-3 harass, but most junglers can just lvl 2 gank your ass and you are now fucked for the rest of the game pretty much. wat. Her level 1-3 is where most APs who she struggles against shit on her. Her golden stage is from level 6 until enemy squishies start getting shit like BV. Annie will still sometimes get played at high elo and she was pretty popular in tournament play until not very long ago. She's just another champion who fell out of popularity but her laning phase and mid-late game strength is pretty solid.
its the opposite of what you just said
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Boots + MS quint annie is hard to deal with for pretty much any AP hero. I really don't think there's anyone who can beat her easily.
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I had the same problem as that Annie Guy while I was leveling up. Around level 20 or so I bought Rammus and went on a 26 game win streak. At the end I got CRUSHED playing anything but Ramm because he was all I knew.
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On March 04 2012 14:06 Glaceau wrote:
i dont get how you beat anyone as annie if the other team isnt retarded. only thing she has going for her is the crazy lvl 1-3 harass, but most junglers can just lvl 2 gank your ass and you are now fucked for the rest of the game pretty much.
Honestly, if you just get really good at annie, learn all her matchups, and are willing to gank with her then you can do really, really well. A guy on my IvyLoL team mains annie mid and hit ~2k season 1. I think he's lost his lane like three or four times since the beginning of beta season. We just played against a team we've met before-- their 1900 mid player remembered us and joked that he still had nightmares about laning against the annie.
Anyway, my point is if you're really good she's workable. Not great, but winning games against competent opponents is very possible.
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On March 04 2012 15:15 Juicyfruit wrote:Show nested quote +On March 04 2012 14:56 TheYango wrote:On March 04 2012 14:51 Seuss wrote:
Theoretically if you had a jungler whose only problem was sustain survivability quints could be used to patch that up. Whether Lifesteal Quints solve the problem or are the best option depends on the potential jungler.
I'm not aware of any such champions at the moment, but then it's not like we haven't been ignorant of viable options before. If that were the case then the comparison to other rune choices wouldn't matter. How they compare mathematically to resist or hp5 is of no practical value if jungling with such a champ simply works with lifesteal quints and doesn't without them. Might be worth a shot on some champions with naturally high AD or AD boost like nocturne or fiora, and the runes will scale.
But like, neither of them has any sustain problems in the jungle so other runes are just better right? I mean AS will let you clear faster ->which is less damage taken anyway. Or armor will let mean less damage taken both in the jungle or in ganks.
And in teamfights that extra 6% wouldn't really help that much in your survival to advocate taking them in place of other runes.
About annie: I'm shit at playing ap mid but whenever I play annie (like once in 100 games) I go stuff like 10/1/x in 20mins and I'm like ''holy fuck, why don't I play annie more?!'' and then I don't play her again.
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On March 04 2012 15:26 Eiii wrote:Show nested quote +On March 04 2012 14:06 Glaceau wrote:
i dont get how you beat anyone as annie if the other team isnt retarded. only thing she has going for her is the crazy lvl 1-3 harass, but most junglers can just lvl 2 gank your ass and you are now fucked for the rest of the game pretty much. Honestly, if you just get really good at annie, learn all her matchups, and are willing to gank with her then you can do really, really well. A guy on my IvyLoL team mains annie mid and hit ~2k season 1. I think he's lost his lane like three or four times since the beginning of beta season. We just played against a team we've met before-- their 1900 mid player remembered us and joked that he still had nightmares about laning against the annie. Anyway, my point is if you're really good she's workable. Not great, but winning games against competent opponents is very possible.
If anyone here is any good at annie please explain this, because I just dont understand how she could be played at all vs a competent team.
In lane her range is minuscule and she has no survivability, escape, initiate, or sustain. I've laned may times against Annies with Xerath and Viktor, and it feels like there is really nothing they can do...I just hit them with harass whenever I want and they cant respond. Flash is pretty much the only way they will ever hit you. Any decent team wont let her wander off to bot and get double kills, which is the only way i've seen her be successful.
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You don't need to constantly trade as Annie if it's unfavorable. You can just farm w/ auto attack (625 range) and sit on your stun so that if they try to come in and trade they eat a full combo and you only eat one spell. Forcing trades where you shouldn't is what often loses you lanes regardless of champs. In a gank, Annie can easily 100-0 you with a few hits from the jungler. If she get's a little ahead, she can nearly 100-0 on her own vs any soft mage if she has her ignite up, so e.g. sieging up as a Xerath can turn into an invitation to die. She can also pop over to a sidelane for a very easy kill.
In teamfights it's inevitable that some of your team is going to get clumped up because of how the map is designed. There's a lot of choke points near objectives (especially baron) and all she has to do is flash and blow everything at the right time to completely turn the fight around. Given her burst it can be worth dying to do huge damage to priority targets.
Yes she has some bad matches, but that doesn't mean she can't win games.
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On March 04 2012 15:54 Craton wrote:
You don't need to constantly trade as Annie if it's unfavorable. You can just farm w/ auto attack (600 range) and sit on your stun so that if they try to come in and trade they eat a full combo and you only eat one spell. Forcing trades where you shouldn't is what often loses you lanes regardless of champs. In a gank, Annie can easily 100-0 you with a few hits from the jungler.
She can also pop over to a sidelane for a very easy kill.
her auto is 625 range. and vs xerath, open boots and movespeed quints. if xerath misses his Q, he eats a Q-auto 100% of the time. Xerath is one of the safer lanes for annie pre-6. If xerath is only trying to harass from down town and just Wspeeds away, then you're effectively able to freefarm your lane with autos.
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Annie's a great snowballer and poor laner.
That she can't favorably trade without holding on to her stun usually leads to her getting outcs'd and pushed too often. She's easy as heck to gank for though so that's not always a problem.
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On March 04 2012 15:57 ItsFunToLose wrote:
her auto is 625 range.
Right, I was thinking of Ashe.
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On March 04 2012 15:57 TwoToneTerran wrote:
Annie's a great snowballer and poor laner.
That she can't favorably trade without holding on to her stun usually leads to her getting outcs'd and pushed too often. She's easy as heck to gank for though so that's not always a problem.
if you're getting out cs'd you have bigger problems than annie having bad matchups. go play bot games until you can last hit while holding your stun. I'd say thats actually one of annie's biggest advantages, in that if you have a bad match up, you can just hold on to your stun and just farm from 625 range. If a trade is forced, you're back to 2-3 charges of your passive (Q-EW-+optionalQ) leading to being quickly back at passive stun.
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It is quite often impossible to get every cs if your creeps are in tower and minion range. Has nothing to do with mechanics and everything to do with small damage windows and low attack speed on top of being unable to use your spell because you're sitting on stun.
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On March 04 2012 16:02 TwoToneTerran wrote:
It is quite often impossible to get every cs if your creeps are in tower and minion range. Has nothing to do with mechanics and everything to do with small damage windows and low attack speed on top of being unable to use your spell because you're sitting on stun.
I dunno, I still feel like she can hold her own against pushers and still farm under tower with her Q most of the time, just knowing little things like if one melee minion and 3 full health ranged minions enter tower range, knowing which ranged minion will be targeted first after the melee minion dies really helps prioritize which minions to auto in order to get most of the CS.
vs pushers, I'd recommend putting more points in W.
I'd say she has an easier time than say, leblanc when it comes to farming under tower. she might have to give up holding on to her stun, or running OOM, but its better than missing CS.
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How do you guys deal with people who spam call their lane before the game starts? I keep getting these shitters who call solo top or mid then get raped and lose us the game. I feel pretty confident in my top and would like to play it, but seems everyone wants that role and loses when they get it(so I get stuck playing jungle which I'm meh at, because nobody wants to play that).
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I find annie's range is just way too short. 625 on her q. Compared to someone like ahri with 880 range, or cassio you have to flash to fight, and flashing IN usually isn't that good of an idea as an ap (unless you're morg with zhonya's). If her combo just wins the fight it doesn't matter, but that's true for anything with large aoe burst, and annie isn't the only champion with it.
On March 04 2012 16:19 Mondeezy wrote:
How do you guys deal with people who spam call their lane before the game starts? I keep getting these shitters who call solo top or mid then get raped and lose us the game. I feel pretty confident in my top and would like to play it, but seems everyone wants that role and loses when they get it(so I get stuck playing jungle which I'm meh at, because nobody wants to play that).
So get good at jungling and you won't have a problem. Everyone gets games where you have retarded laners who lose their lane hard, blame anyone but themselves for losing a 1v1, and then you lose the game. It's how most of my losses go.
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I may be wrong here but:
Ahri and cass both are skillshot based. Your stuff as annie is still point and click.
You don't have to run into them to force a trade and eat all their spells. You throw your spells at them when their stuff is on cooldown when they tried to harass you or by baiting out their stuff first. Its not like you're being pressured to get kills.
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On March 04 2012 16:20 SnK-Arcbound wrote:I find annie's range is just way too short. 625 on her q. Compared to someone like ahri with 880 range, or cassio you have to flash to fight, and flashing IN usually isn't that good of an idea as an ap (unless you're morg with zhonya's). If her combo just wins the fight it doesn't matter, but that's true for anything with large aoe burst, and annie isn't the only champion with it. Show nested quote +On March 04 2012 16:19 Mondeezy wrote:
How do you guys deal with people who spam call their lane before the game starts? I keep getting these shitters who call solo top or mid then get raped and lose us the game. I feel pretty confident in my top and would like to play it, but seems everyone wants that role and loses when they get it(so I get stuck playing jungle which I'm meh at, because nobody wants to play that). So get good at jungling and you won't have a problem. Everyone gets games where you have retarded laners who lose their lane hard, blame anyone but themselves for losing a 1v1, and then you lose the game. It's how most of my losses go.
You're comparing skillshots to targeted spells. If annie is strafing at 880 range with 380 movespeed, ahri isn't going to hit 100% of the time. If you get within 625 range of annie, you're eating a QstunW auto and then she's walking away.
The theory crafting of skillshots is never useful. There's always a push and pull going on in lane. When ahri Q's, if she hits, good for her, if she misses, its like her opponent now has a window to be more aggressive until her skill shot is back up
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EPT
