• Log InLog In
  • Register
Liquid`
Team Liquid Liquipedia
EST 23:31
CET 05:31
KST 13:31
  • Home
  • Forum
  • Calendar
  • Streams
  • Liquipedia
  • Features
  • Store
  • EPT
  • TL+
  • StarCraft 2
  • Brood War
  • Smash
  • Heroes
  • Counter-Strike
  • Overwatch
  • Liquibet
  • Fantasy StarCraft
  • TLPD
  • StarCraft 2
  • Brood War
  • Blogs
Forum Sidebar
Events/Features
News
Featured News
[ASL22] Finals Preview: Sweet Victory!12[ASL22] Ro4 Preview: Mirror Mirror6[ASL22] Ro8 Preview: Within Reach5[ASL22] Ro8 Preview: In A Tizzy11[ASL22] Ro16 Preview: Holy Diver5
Community News
Weekly Cups (Oct 26 - Nov 1): MaxPax, herO, Solar win0Weekly Cups (October 19-25): Clem triples first in 5.0.175Evil Geniuses - shutting down23ISSL (IntoTheTV x SOOP SC2 League): Premier7Weekly Cups (October 12-18): 5.0.17 era begins1
StarCraft 2
General
[D] Hacker peak in sc2 ? No more SC2 streamers on team liquid? Username Change Request - Toxickej Kapr Liquibets sc2 season 30 Evil Geniuses - shutting down
Tourneys
Sparkling Tuna Cup - Weekly Open Tournament WardiTV Mondays ISSL (IntoTheTV x SOOP SC2 League): Premier Stellar Fest TWO the Moon (Dec 16-20) RSL goes to London! 2026 Offline Finals Nov 21-22
Strategy
[H] ZvP Mid-Late Game: Stalkers Collossi HT
Custom Maps
Starcraft 2 Advance [D] the control group Simple Questions/Answers [G] How to playtest arcade maps
External Content
Mutation # 550 Graveyard Shift The PondCast: SC2 News & Results Mutation # 549 Endless Sparkles Mutation # 548 Shining Bright
Brood War
General
SC4ALL II Brood War Complete Invited Player Lineup Rollback Netcode in Brood War BGH Auto Balance -> http://bghmmr.eu/ Sagi.gg Launcher Released Top Players of October 2026 (EBPD Rankings)
Tourneys
[$1250] International ShieldBattery League [Megathread] Daily Proleagues KCM Race Survival 2026 Season 4 [Mixed-Gender CK] Rush+4 vs Best+4
Strategy
50,000-Word Terran Builds Memo 2026-10-22 Cliff Jump Revisited (1 in a 1000 strategy) Simple Questions, Simple Answers
Other Games
General Games
Stormgate/Frost Giant Megathread Deus Ex 3!? Nintendo Switch Thread Mobile Legends: Bang Bang Armies of Exigo - YesYes?
Dota 2
Dota 2 Champions League Season 3 Begins April 25!
League of Legends
[TL LoL EUW IHs] Teemo shall perish
Heroes of the Storm
Heroes of the Storm 2.0
Hearthstone
Deck construction bug
TL Mafia
TL Mafia Community Thread
Community
General
Things Aren’t Peaceful in Palestine US Politics Mega-thread Canadian Politics Mega-thread Russo-Ukrainian War Thread The Chess Thread
Fan Clubs
Fan Club Resource Thread Reynor Fan Club The Flash Fan Club
Media & Entertainment
Anime Discussion Thread Movie Discussion! [Manga] One Piece
Sports
Football (Soccer) Thread TeamLiquid Health and Fitness Initiative For 2023 MLB/Baseball 2023
World Cup 2022
Tech Support
Computer Build, Upgrade & Buying Resource Thread
TL Community
Recent Gifted Posts
Blogs
Why I built Repalyzer (1.1.…
BlueStar
Innovate or Game Over?
TrAiDoS
ShieldBattery on Mac
Kraekkling
[ASL22] Ro4 Day1 Ticket Giv…
bITt.mAN
Can Bots Beat Pros?? Starcr…
namkraft
Customize Sidebar...

Website Feedback

Closed Threads



Active: 30714 users

[Patch 1.0.0.134: Nautilus] General Discussion - Page 62

Forum Index > LoL General
Post a Reply
Prev 1 60 61 62 63 64 178 Next
Same rules apply, per usual. Please use the appropriate threads (QQ, Brag, Champion, etc) whenever appropriate. Keep the resident Banling content.

Thanks. Happy Gaming.
Two_DoWn
Profile Blog Joined October 2009
United States13684 Posts
February 17 2012 20:51 GMT
#1221
Which is why getting a group of people together and then hard randoming is a perfect way to improve ones understanding of the game.

And really really fun.
"What is the air speed velocity of an unladen courier?" "Dire or Radiant?"
Mogwai
Profile Blog Joined January 2009
United States13274 Posts
February 17 2012 20:52 GMT
#1222
Would have to do it in ranked to actually learn much, but that's actually far from the worst idea I've ever heard.
mogwaismusings.wordpress.com
gtrsrs
Profile Joined June 2010
United States9109 Posts
February 17 2012 20:53 GMT
#1223
On February 18 2012 04:47 Shiv. wrote:
Show nested quote +
On February 18 2012 04:46 wei2coolman wrote:
Hmm, jungle cho loooks pretty viable, or is it cause SV is such a boss?

It's baus and it's been for a good while now, people don't use it because of the flawed argument that Cho is better off top.
Speaking of top, why does nobody play Skarner top anymore?


he is easily countered if you firstpick him, and his mana costs are prohibitive to constant harass
he's not bad top lane, he's just a lot worse than other picks top lane, and a lot better than a lot of picks in the jungle

same reason you don't see AP yi a ton. viable? sure, in a sense. impossible to beat in lane? yep. completely outclassed by both AD yi and most "real" AP champs? absolutely
i play ... hearthstone =\^.^/= Winterfox
Seuss
Profile Blog Joined May 2010
United States10536 Posts
Last Edited: 2012-02-17 20:54:17
February 17 2012 20:53 GMT
#1224
On February 18 2012 05:27 Shiv. wrote:
Show nested quote +
On February 18 2012 05:23 Seuss wrote:
On February 18 2012 04:47 Shiv. wrote:
On February 18 2012 04:46 wei2coolman wrote:
Hmm, jungle cho loooks pretty viable, or is it cause SV is such a boss?

It's baus and it's been for a good while now, people don't use it because of the flawed argument that Cho is better off top.
Speaking of top, why does nobody play Skarner top anymore?


There's a catch-22 of sorts that also contributes. Because a champion isn't regularly jungled the community knowledge of that champion as a jungler is limited. Because the information is limited it's harder to learn to jungle that champion or place them in a team composition. Because the champion is hard to learn or place they aren't picked as a jungler, and so on.

This sort of thing ends up happening not just in the jungle, but for any underplayed champion or champion/role combination (e.g. nobody plays Skarner top anymore for similar reasons).

So to cut it short, people are sheep and incapable of researching functioning setups on their own. Meh, it's really sad. I think this game still has so much stuff left to be discovered, yet the community is incapable of accepting non-standard choices even in normals.


That's a cynical way to look at it. I prefer to look at it another way.

What makes someone a "sheep" isn't the act of copying, but willful, incurious ignorance. When someone learns painting or other arts it's extremely common to copy the masters as a way of learning their techniques and reasoning. So the sin of the "sheep" is avoiding the lessons they could be learning, not copying better players.

The problem with the community isn't that it consists mostly of "sheep", but mostly of people who are still learning the game. Yes, you have your players who actively refuse to improve themselves, but most players aren't like that. They may be slow learners, or they may not be dedicating huge amounts of time and mental energy into their play, but they are nonetheless interested and participating in improving themselves and the game.

It's an issue whose solution is time and patience. 2 years seems like forever, but it's a flash in the pan when it comes to building a knowledgeable community. It will take a long time, but eventually the playerbase will mature past the current phase where explorers, tinkers, and thinkers are few, far between, and lost in the sea of the internet.
"I am not able to carry all this people alone, for they are too heavy for me." -Moses (Numbers 11:14)
mordek
Profile Blog Joined December 2010
United States12705 Posts
February 17 2012 21:02 GMT
#1225
Seuss so wise.
It is vanity to love what passes quickly and not to look ahead where eternal joy abides. Tiberius77 | Mordek #1881 "I took a mint!"
Celial
Profile Blog Joined June 2006
2602 Posts
February 17 2012 21:03 GMT
#1226
I havent seen the TSM streams online for a few days now, is there a tournament going on that I can watch? Also, where do you keep yourself updated on current tournaments and stuff?
Do not regret. Always forward, never back.
TheYango
Profile Joined September 2008
United States47024 Posts
Last Edited: 2012-02-17 21:08:18
February 17 2012 21:04 GMT
#1227
On February 18 2012 05:53 Seuss wrote:
It's an issue whose solution is time and patience. 2 years seems like forever, but it's a flash in the pan when it comes to building a knowledgeable community. It will take a long time, but eventually the playerbase will mature past the current phase where explorers, tinkers, and thinkers are few, far between, and lost in the sea of the internet.

TBH I also don't think that the "explorers, tinkers, and thinkers" with the right mindset about exploring new ideas are that uncommon. It's just that the majority of them (and of the playerbase in general) don't have the proper fundamentals on which to build their ideas.

This is especially true with regards to the fundamentals of champion selection, because outside the top few teams scrimming against one another, nobody practices the skill of drafting team compositions with any regularity (solo queue is hardly proper practice when everyone else just picks what they want, and ranked 5s is still woefully underplayed).
Moderator
Seuss
Profile Blog Joined May 2010
United States10536 Posts
Last Edited: 2012-02-17 21:10:24
February 17 2012 21:08 GMT
#1228
On February 18 2012 06:04 TheYango wrote:
Show nested quote +
On February 18 2012 05:53 Seuss wrote:
It's an issue whose solution is time and patience. 2 years seems like forever, but it's a flash in the pan when it comes to building a knowledgeable community. It will take a long time, but eventually the playerbase will mature past the current phase where explorers, tinkers, and thinkers are few, far between, and lost in the sea of the internet.

TBH I also don't think that the "explorers, tinkers, and thinkers" with the right mindset about exploring new ideas are that uncommon. It's just that the majority of them (and of the playerbase in general) don't have the proper fundamentals on which to build their ideas.


I agree, I could have qualified that last statement a little better. The reason we'll see more of them in the future isn't because they'll magically pop into existence between now and then, but because the ones who already exist will get good enough at the game to have a strong foundation for their talents.

Edit: Figuring out how to make ranked 5s more important/prominent than solo queue is probably the holy grail for LoL as an esport, equally if not more important than replays.
"I am not able to carry all this people alone, for they are too heavy for me." -Moses (Numbers 11:14)
Two_DoWn
Profile Blog Joined October 2009
United States13684 Posts
Last Edited: 2012-02-17 21:10:32
February 17 2012 21:10 GMT
#1229
On February 18 2012 06:08 Seuss wrote:
Show nested quote +
On February 18 2012 06:04 TheYango wrote:
On February 18 2012 05:53 Seuss wrote:
It's an issue whose solution is time and patience. 2 years seems like forever, but it's a flash in the pan when it comes to building a knowledgeable community. It will take a long time, but eventually the playerbase will mature past the current phase where explorers, tinkers, and thinkers are few, far between, and lost in the sea of the internet.

TBH I also don't think that the "explorers, tinkers, and thinkers" with the right mindset about exploring new ideas are that uncommon. It's just that the majority of them (and of the playerbase in general) don't have the proper fundamentals on which to build their ideas.


I agree, I could have qualified that last statement a little better. The reason we'll see more of them in the future isn't because they'll magically pop into existence between now and then, but because the ones who already exist will get good enough at the game to have a strong foundation for their talents.

Like once I learn how to play top lane without losing my tower every game!


Oh and CLG.EU/US scrim.
"What is the air speed velocity of an unladen courier?" "Dire or Radiant?"
BlackMagister
Profile Joined October 2008
United States5834 Posts
Last Edited: 2012-02-17 21:12:03
February 17 2012 21:10 GMT
#1230
On February 18 2012 06:03 Celial wrote:
I havent seen the TSM streams online for a few days now, is there a tournament going on that I can watch? Also, where do you keep yourself updated on current tournaments and stuff?

TSM going underground until the CRS tournament where they play CLG at 6est. I'm sure you could find info about the CRS tournament elsewhere but twitter seems the only place where TSM has said they're not streaming even if their reason wasn't stated explicitly.

I don't know if there one good place for finding info about tournaments, I check multiple sources and don't always find about every tournament. Twitter, reddit, TL and Riot LoL news is what I check, but I'm guessing some LoL dedicated sites might be better for just news.
Terranasaur
Profile Joined May 2011
United States2085 Posts
February 17 2012 21:22 GMT
#1231
NA:
Kog
Nocturne
Ryze
Cho
Janna

EU:
Sona
Irelia
Urgot
Ali
Brand


http://solomid.net/livestream.php?s=5
Decisions Determine Destiny - Terranasaur#1719 D3 #557 SC2 3DS FC: 2423-3623-8068
Craton
Profile Blog Joined December 2009
United States17303 Posts
February 17 2012 21:27 GMT
#1232
I vote we make using the term "sheep" prohibited.
twitch.tv/cratonz
Alaric
Profile Joined November 2009
France45622 Posts
February 17 2012 21:29 GMT
#1233
Cho was one of the junglers I saw the most with WW on my way to 30 (I started LoL in late June last year). Udyr was almost non-existent, Lee Sin and Xin Zhao still popular, Fiddlesticks too.
Cant take LMS hipsters serious.
phyvo
Profile Blog Joined April 2009
United States5635 Posts
Last Edited: 2012-02-17 21:32:55
February 17 2012 21:30 GMT
#1234
On February 18 2012 06:08 Seuss wrote:
Edit: Figuring out how to make ranked 5s more important/prominent than solo queue is probably the holy grail for LoL as an esport, equally if not more important than replays.


I think I said something akin to this ages ago and people laughed at me on GD.

On February 18 2012 05:27 Shiv. wrote:
Show nested quote +
On February 18 2012 05:23 Seuss wrote:
On February 18 2012 04:47 Shiv. wrote:
On February 18 2012 04:46 wei2coolman wrote:
Hmm, jungle cho loooks pretty viable, or is it cause SV is such a boss?

It's baus and it's been for a good while now, people don't use it because of the flawed argument that Cho is better off top.
Speaking of top, why does nobody play Skarner top anymore?


There's a catch-22 of sorts that also contributes. Because a champion isn't regularly jungled the community knowledge of that champion as a jungler is limited. Because the information is limited it's harder to learn to jungle that champion or place them in a team composition. Because the champion is hard to learn or place they aren't picked as a jungler, and so on.

This sort of thing ends up happening not just in the jungle, but for any underplayed champion or champion/role combination (e.g. nobody plays Skarner top anymore for similar reasons).

So to cut it short, people are sheep and incapable of researching functioning setups on their own. Meh, it's really sad. I think this game still has so much stuff left to be discovered, yet the community is incapable of accepting non-standard choices even in normals.



I'm pretty sure that people don't experiment in LoL partialy because of the current community but mostly because of the structure of LoL itself.

-> It's a team game so your teammates, random internet people you don't know, need to be OK with the experiment.
-> They're usually not because they want to tryhard and care too much about a number next to their name.
-> Many experiments actually require a team with some kind of coordination or ability to adjust to a different style.
-> When they do deviate from this in solo queue it's less because there's a solid underlying principle or reason and more because they just feel like it.
-> Both ranked 5s and solo queue have no real incentives behind them except making your number go up, but queuing as 5 is much harder for the lazy and/or time deprived.
"BE A MANGO TO SLEEP LIKE A SNORING TIGER" - Monte
Navi
Profile Joined November 2009
5286 Posts
February 17 2012 21:33 GMT
#1235
jiji's ryze is looking clean, good to see him back in form :D
Hey! Listen!
Terranasaur
Profile Joined May 2011
United States2085 Posts
February 17 2012 21:38 GMT
#1236
Remember when we were talking about LoL being more "realistic" so that Sona couldn't be silenced and Lee Sin couldn't be blinded and stuff?

I don't think you should be able to Knock Up a fully feasted Cho. He takes up half the screen. Your ground slam can REALLY knock him in the air?
Decisions Determine Destiny - Terranasaur#1719 D3 #557 SC2 3DS FC: 2423-3623-8068
Navi
Profile Joined November 2009
5286 Posts
February 17 2012 21:38 GMT
#1237
giving some RP incentive to the top X places in ranked 5s seems simple and a easy way to generate casual interest in 5s, perhaps wouldn't get the top 10 or so teams to play any more than they already do but for the general playerbase there are many that would appreciate a little RP

or seeding in monthly tournaments as hosted by riot, etc.

lots of opportunities, its only up to riot and the constraints of their system or management to deal with :o
Hey! Listen!
Terranasaur
Profile Joined May 2011
United States2085 Posts
February 17 2012 21:47 GMT
#1238
On February 18 2012 06:38 Navi wrote:
giving some RP incentive to the top X places in ranked 5s seems simple and a easy way to generate casual interest in 5s, perhaps wouldn't get the top 10 or so teams to play any more than they already do but for the general playerbase there are many that would appreciate a little RP

or seeding in monthly tournaments as hosted by riot, etc.

lots of opportunities, its only up to riot and the constraints of their system or management to deal with :o



There are a lot of ways they could make ranked 5s more fun. Remember War3 daily tournaments? Something like that with a cool skin on the line would be awesome. I love the idea of prizes for the ladder. They don't even have to make new Skins. They can just award Retired Skins or give RP or something. There is a lot Riot can do to make their ladder more interesting. Right now, I could care less about ELO because its something that I don't feel is 100% in my control. A ranked team league with a Prize would motivate to do some ranked 5s and get a whole lot better at the game...
Decisions Determine Destiny - Terranasaur#1719 D3 #557 SC2 3DS FC: 2423-3623-8068
turdburgler
Profile Blog Joined January 2011
England6749 Posts
February 17 2012 21:49 GMT
#1239
On February 18 2012 06:08 Seuss wrote:
Show nested quote +
On February 18 2012 06:04 TheYango wrote:
On February 18 2012 05:53 Seuss wrote:
It's an issue whose solution is time and patience. 2 years seems like forever, but it's a flash in the pan when it comes to building a knowledgeable community. It will take a long time, but eventually the playerbase will mature past the current phase where explorers, tinkers, and thinkers are few, far between, and lost in the sea of the internet.

TBH I also don't think that the "explorers, tinkers, and thinkers" with the right mindset about exploring new ideas are that uncommon. It's just that the majority of them (and of the playerbase in general) don't have the proper fundamentals on which to build their ideas.


I agree, I could have qualified that last statement a little better. The reason we'll see more of them in the future isn't because they'll magically pop into existence between now and then, but because the ones who already exist will get good enough at the game to have a strong foundation for their talents.

Edit: Figuring out how to make ranked 5s more important/prominent than solo queue is probably the holy grail for LoL as an esport, equally if not more important than replays.


give a small amount of rp based on ladder rank to people who have played atleast 10 ranked 5 games in the last week
red_
Profile Joined May 2010
United States8474 Posts
February 17 2012 21:49 GMT
#1240
Hotshot is first person to decommit from baron: "I don't know why we didn't just finish baron."

Real classic CLG moments.
How did the experience of working at Mr Burns' Nuclear Plant influence Homer's composition of the Iliad and Odyssey?
Prev 1 60 61 62 63 64 178 Next
Please log in or register to reply.
Live Events Refresh
OSC
08:00
OSC Elite Rising Star #21
CranKy Ducklings SOOP35
CranKy Ducklings25
Liquipedia
[ Submit Event ]
Live Streams
Refresh
StarCraft 2
WinterStarcraft388
RuFF_SC2 198
EnDerr 16
StarCraft: Brood War
Rain 2783
GuemChi 1837
Dewaltoss 201
ProTech164
Hyuk 140
Mong 41
Force[name] 7
Icarus 7
League of Legends
Doublelift5225
Counter-Strike
taco 505
Other Games
summit1g11261
singsing1328
Coldzera 829
JimRising 572
XaKoH 364
C9.Mang0293
Maynarde109
NeuroSwarm71
ViBE69
Fuzer 52
Organizations
Other Games
BasetradeTV149
Counter-Strike
PGL110
[ Show 13 non-featured ]
StarCraft 2
• davetesta20
• AfreecaTV YouTube
• intothetv
• Kozan
• IndyKCrew
• Laughngamez YouTube
• Migwel
StarCraft: Brood War
• BSLYoutube
• STPLYoutube
• ZZZeroYoutube
League of Legends
• Lourlo534
• Rush331
• Stunt138
Upcoming Events
IntoTheTV X SOOP
1d 6h
Reynor vs Solar
ByuN vs SHIN
Clem vs MaxPax
herO vs Rogue
IPSL
1d 12h
WorsT vs nOmaD
Dewalt vs andersOn
AI Arena Tournament
1d 14h
IntoTheTV X SOOP
2 days
IPSL
2 days
Azhi_Dahaki vs ggnore13
Double vs WIZARD
Replay Cast
2 days
Replay Cast
3 days
Sparkling Tuna Cup
4 days
WardiTV Invitational
4 days
YoungYakov vs Lambo
SHIN vs TBD
Percival vs Shameless
Solar vs TBD
PiGosaur Cup
4 days
[ Show More ]
The PondCast
6 days
KCM Race Survival
6 days
WardiTV Invitational
6 days
Liquipedia Results

Completed

Proleague 2026-11-04
Blizzard Classic Cup 2026
HCC Season 3

Ongoing

Acropolis #5
KCM Race Survival 2026 Season 4
International ShieldBattery League
BSL Season 23
IPSL Winter 2026-27
Calamity Cup Div. A Season 8
IEM Beijing 2026
PGL Masters Bucharest 2026
Stake Ranked Episode 5
1win Private Club #2
Thunderpick World Champ. '26
ESL Pro League Season 24
Stake Ranked Episode 4
1win Private Club #1
Logitech G Play Connect 2026
SL StarSeries Fall 2026
FISSURE Playground #3
BLAST Open Fall 2026

Upcoming

Sector 951
SC4ALL II: Brood War
BSL 23: Non-Korean Championship
HSC XXX
Stellar Fest 2: Lunar Cup
SC4ALL II: StarCraft II
Kung Fu Cup 2026 Grand Finals
RSL Offline Finals
Underdog Cup 2026 Div 2-3
PGL Bucharest 2027
BLAST Bounty Winter 2027
eXTREMESLAND 2026
PGL Major Singapore 2026
Stake Ranked Episode 6
BLAST Rivals Fall 2026
TLPD

1. ByuN
2. TY
3. Dark
4. Solar
5. Stats
6. Nerchio
7. sOs
8. soO
9. INnoVation
10. Elazer
1. Rain
2. Flash
3. EffOrt
4. Last
5. Bisu
6. Soulkey
7. Mini
8. Sharp
Sidebar Settings...

Advertising | Privacy Policy | Terms Of Use | Contact Us

Original banner artwork: Jim Warren
The contents of this webpage are copyright © 2026 TLnet. All Rights Reserved.