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Same rules apply, per usual. Please use the appropriate threads (QQ, Brag, Champion, etc) whenever appropriate. Keep the resident Banling content.
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Riven's stun and Volibear's move are both aoe, does aoe generate a call for help?
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On February 24 2012 02:07 Juicyfruit wrote:Show nested quote +On February 24 2012 01:52 wei2coolman wrote:On February 23 2012 17:56 gtrsrs wrote:On February 23 2012 17:21 wei2coolman wrote:On February 23 2012 16:53 gtrsrs wrote:On February 23 2012 16:33 SnK-Arcbound wrote:
Huge lux buff. Always loved her but she just was never good enough to be able to solo lane. Maybe she'll eventually get to the point of being a good ap. lux is perfectly viable as a solo laner and is a good counterpick to ryze atm Lux was very strong from early to mid game, then her power drops considerably. lategame lux's ult is on one of the shortest cooldowns in the game, especially relative to its damage level. it is so short that it is MORE rare that you DON'T get 2 ults in one fight than you do. she has the second longest-ranged stun in the game and can check brushes with a skill lategame is not lux's weak point On February 23 2012 17:43 TwoToneTerran wrote:On February 23 2012 16:53 gtrsrs wrote:On February 23 2012 16:33 SnK-Arcbound wrote:
Huge lux buff. Always loved her but she just was never good enough to be able to solo lane. Maybe she'll eventually get to the point of being a good ap. lux is perfectly viable as a solo laner and is a good counterpick to ryze atm In what way is Lux a counter to Ryze? I'm genuinely curious because I think it's the other way around, but I want to hear your reasoning. ryze's strength lies in his extremely long ranged Q, which is very hard to counterharass against. lux's spells are both longer range than his Q, and both (at least partially) can hit behind creeps. ryze has a very hard time approaching lux to harass - when he does get in range, her shield can negate part of his first Q with it's outward motion, and part of his second Q with it's return pattern, assuming he casts WQEQ and she shields immediately after he snares; this negates a large chunk of his damage and although he will come out ahead with repeated engages like this, her shield combined with her range should make it so this sort of exchange doesn't happen frequently enough that he can kill her by the time he has tear and cata he can bully her in lane as she tends to build a bit more glass-cannon, but who doesn't ryze bully at that point? Her damage out put in late game is very week, the strength of AP casters is either 1) ridic sustained damage, like cass, karthus, ryze, ziggs, ahri. or 2) super burst, like annie, brand, sion, and so on. When it hits late game, Lux does neither of these well. Hmm... what lux lacks isn't burst damage. Her burst damage on enemy backrow is probably one of the most reliable out of the AP carries because you just E R properly and BAM, their two carries are at half health But regarding her spells, they're just too impractical to use and the payoff isn't worth the conditional constraints to being able to use all her spells to their full potential. I'd venture a guess that a perfectly played Lux is much stronger than most commonly played AP carries, but on the flipside, you have very little room for error with any of your spells, what with the fairly long cooldown and her being complete deadwhile while her spells are on cooldown.
My brother has some Lux build that gets her ult cooldown to like 30 something seconds. Sorry for the double post.
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Well, Lux's ult can be like 24seconds minimum last time I checked, but hitting the R is one of the easier parts of playing Lux.
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On February 24 2012 02:07 Sabin010 wrote:
Riven's stun and Volibear's move are both aoe, does aoe generate a call for help?
No, if you stun or fear a creep they will re-aggro whatever's closest to them or whatever is attacking an allied creep/champion. So if you stun a bunch of minions but don't autoattack, you can still draw aggro for a second if you're the closest thing to the creeps. It can also happen if you accidentally use a single target stun/fear on a creep from a misclick, too, I suppose. AoE cc is just the most likely reason.
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On February 24 2012 02:07 Sabin010 wrote:
Riven's stun and Volibear's move are both aoe, does aoe generate a call for help?
Repost from the previous page in case you missed it:
On February 24 2012 02:07 midnight.tokyo wrote:Show nested quote +On February 24 2012 02:04 Sabin010 wrote:On February 24 2012 01:57 midnight.tokyo wrote:On February 24 2012 01:54 Sabin010 wrote:
So moves that apply on hit effects, autos, and moves that cause you to auto all force you to draw minion aggro which also pushes the lane. So walking into Singed's poison won't cause him to draw aggro, not that he cares if he has aggro, just an example. Riven's q spam won't draw aggro as long as you don't auto attack? What about creeps priority of target? After the creep kills the other creep what will decide if the creeps aggro you or go to the next creepy, and how can you tell which creepy it will be targeted by each creepy? This type of thing will help me with my last hitting and probably increase my Elo by 25 points in two minutes. http://leagueoflegends.wikia.com/wiki/Minion#BehaviorThe answers you seek lie within. Copy and pasted from the wikia. I think everybody here should know this, and if you already know it well it's just going to reaffirm what you already know. Minions prioritize targets in the following order: An enemy champion designated by a call for help from an allied champion. (Enemy champion attacking an Allied champion) An enemy minion designated by a call for help from an allied champion. (Enemy minion attacking an Allied champion) An enemy minion designated by a call for help from an allied minion. (Enemy minion attacking an Allied minion) An enemy turret designated by a call for help from an allied minion. (Enemy turret attacking an Allied minion) An enemy champion designated by a call for help from an allied minion. (Enemy champion attacking an Allied minion) The closest enemy minion. The closest enemy champion. Note: Single-target spells such as Disintegrate or Null Sphere will not generate a call for help, however spells that applies On-Hit effects like Parrrley or Mystic Shot will generate a call for help. Because they are continuously reevaluating their target, minions will lose interest in an enemy champion if that champion breaks off an engagement with them, provided that there is any other target left for them to choose within range. Minions will only reevaluate their target every few seconds. This means that if your champion initiates an attack against an enemy champion, your champion will continue to be viewed as the most threatening target for a short time after you have broken off the attack. This is true even if one of your allied champions has joined the fight, since minions always prioritize their current target over a new target of equal priority. Note that if you leave the minions sight they will automatically reevaluate their target and will carry on walking or attacking something else, and they will not attack you again unless you attack a enemy champion in their sight The only question I have now is regarding AOE attacks and the call for help. From what I understand, if the enemy minions are already attacking allied minions they'll ignore you unless you hit an enemy champion. Unless you continue to attack the enemy champion though they'll reevaluate their target soon after and go back to allied minions.
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Alright, I've decided. I'm going to spend the next couple days playing nothing but AP carries to get better, unless it's really unfeasible to the team.
My roster of such includes Brand, Viktor, TF (AP build), Fiddle, Lux, Orianna, Kennen, and Ryze (though I don't know if he's feasible without having a mana page for him, which I don't).
Who should I focus on (for whatever reason you see fit), and are their pages on here up to date?
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Ryze can perfectly be played with a standard AP carry runepage. It's not optimal, of course, but it'll do the job. Worse case, you play him typical tanky runes with mpen instead of arpen and it'll go along with his tanky nature.
Orianna can be tricky and requires subtlety so you should perhaps avoid playing her at first since you say you're not too used to them. Fiddle doesn't do really lane well (he's annoying, and helps ganks really well, but he can't push so no roaming either and there's no element of surprise).
Brand, Viktor and Lux are pretty straightfoward I guess, if only lacking escapes. Viktor, Kennen and Ryze can easily be played tanky if you wish so (Viktor is a bit trickier because of his passive and higher cooldowns than the other to), to go along with your bruiser mentality. Ryze is probably best for that, as even tho he lacks their mobility he's often described as a mage bruiser.
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On February 24 2012 02:35 Requizen wrote:
Alright, I've decided. I'm going to spend the next couple days playing nothing but AP carries to get better, unless it's really unfeasible to the team.
My roster of such includes Brand, Viktor, TF (AP build), Fiddle, Lux, Orianna, Kennen, and Ryze (though I don't know if he's feasible without having a mana page for him, which I don't).
Who should I focus on (for whatever reason you see fit), and are their pages on here up to date?
Fiddle in the middle because it rhymes. Our Fiddle page seems to be a jungle only page.
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On February 24 2012 02:07 Juicyfruit wrote:Show nested quote +On February 24 2012 01:52 wei2coolman wrote:On February 23 2012 17:56 gtrsrs wrote:On February 23 2012 17:21 wei2coolman wrote:On February 23 2012 16:53 gtrsrs wrote:On February 23 2012 16:33 SnK-Arcbound wrote:
Huge lux buff. Always loved her but she just was never good enough to be able to solo lane. Maybe she'll eventually get to the point of being a good ap. lux is perfectly viable as a solo laner and is a good counterpick to ryze atm Lux was very strong from early to mid game, then her power drops considerably. lategame lux's ult is on one of the shortest cooldowns in the game, especially relative to its damage level. it is so short that it is MORE rare that you DON'T get 2 ults in one fight than you do. she has the second longest-ranged stun in the game and can check brushes with a skill lategame is not lux's weak point On February 23 2012 17:43 TwoToneTerran wrote:On February 23 2012 16:53 gtrsrs wrote:On February 23 2012 16:33 SnK-Arcbound wrote:
Huge lux buff. Always loved her but she just was never good enough to be able to solo lane. Maybe she'll eventually get to the point of being a good ap. lux is perfectly viable as a solo laner and is a good counterpick to ryze atm In what way is Lux a counter to Ryze? I'm genuinely curious because I think it's the other way around, but I want to hear your reasoning. ryze's strength lies in his extremely long ranged Q, which is very hard to counterharass against. lux's spells are both longer range than his Q, and both (at least partially) can hit behind creeps. ryze has a very hard time approaching lux to harass - when he does get in range, her shield can negate part of his first Q with it's outward motion, and part of his second Q with it's return pattern, assuming he casts WQEQ and she shields immediately after he snares; this negates a large chunk of his damage and although he will come out ahead with repeated engages like this, her shield combined with her range should make it so this sort of exchange doesn't happen frequently enough that he can kill her by the time he has tear and cata he can bully her in lane as she tends to build a bit more glass-cannon, but who doesn't ryze bully at that point? Her damage out put in late game is very week, the strength of AP casters is either 1) ridic sustained damage, like cass, karthus, ryze, ziggs, ahri. or 2) super burst, like annie, brand, sion, and so on. When it hits late game, Lux does neither of these well. Hmm... what lux lacks isn't burst damage. Her burst damage on enemy backrow is probably one of the most reliable out of the AP carries because you just E R properly and BAM, their two carries are at half health But regarding her spells, they're just too impractical to use and the payoff isn't worth the conditional constraints to being able to use all her spells to their full potential. I'd venture a guess that a perfectly played Lux is much stronger than most commonly played AP carries, but on the flipside, you have very little room for error with any of your spells, what with the fairly long cooldown and her being complete deadwhile while her spells are on cooldown.
But look at all other AP carries, they just own any squihies, and still do substantial damage to bruisers/ Sure lux has long range, but generally tehre's a bruiser/tank line. realistically in late game, you'll probably only land the lazer on desired target, and that alone isn't enough damage. Or you could just be cass and just kill everything.
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On February 24 2012 02:35 Requizen wrote:
Alright, I've decided. I'm going to spend the next couple days playing nothing but AP carries to get better, unless it's really unfeasible to the team.
My roster of such includes Brand, Viktor, TF (AP build), Fiddle, Lux, Orianna, Kennen, and Ryze (though I don't know if he's feasible without having a mana page for him, which I don't).
Who should I focus on (for whatever reason you see fit), and are their pages on here up to date?
You wanna play some 1v1 lane matchups? Whenever I get to play APs, I always fall back on my Kennen so I suck with everyone else. :<
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On February 24 2012 02:55 dottycakes wrote:Show nested quote +On February 24 2012 02:35 Requizen wrote:
Alright, I've decided. I'm going to spend the next couple days playing nothing but AP carries to get better, unless it's really unfeasible to the team.
My roster of such includes Brand, Viktor, TF (AP build), Fiddle, Lux, Orianna, Kennen, and Ryze (though I don't know if he's feasible without having a mana page for him, which I don't).
Who should I focus on (for whatever reason you see fit), and are their pages on here up to date? You wanna play some 1v1 lane matchups? Whenever I get to play APs, I always fall back on my Kennen so I suck with everyone else. :<
I'd not be opposed. I'm working for the next 5-6+ hours, of course, but if you're on US and I'm not pulled in by IRL friends, I'm usually up for it.
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On February 24 2012 02:52 wei2coolman wrote:Show nested quote +On February 24 2012 02:07 Juicyfruit wrote:On February 24 2012 01:52 wei2coolman wrote:On February 23 2012 17:56 gtrsrs wrote:On February 23 2012 17:21 wei2coolman wrote:On February 23 2012 16:53 gtrsrs wrote:On February 23 2012 16:33 SnK-Arcbound wrote:
Huge lux buff. Always loved her but she just was never good enough to be able to solo lane. Maybe she'll eventually get to the point of being a good ap. lux is perfectly viable as a solo laner and is a good counterpick to ryze atm Lux was very strong from early to mid game, then her power drops considerably. lategame lux's ult is on one of the shortest cooldowns in the game, especially relative to its damage level. it is so short that it is MORE rare that you DON'T get 2 ults in one fight than you do. she has the second longest-ranged stun in the game and can check brushes with a skill lategame is not lux's weak point On February 23 2012 17:43 TwoToneTerran wrote:On February 23 2012 16:53 gtrsrs wrote:On February 23 2012 16:33 SnK-Arcbound wrote:
Huge lux buff. Always loved her but she just was never good enough to be able to solo lane. Maybe she'll eventually get to the point of being a good ap. lux is perfectly viable as a solo laner and is a good counterpick to ryze atm In what way is Lux a counter to Ryze? I'm genuinely curious because I think it's the other way around, but I want to hear your reasoning. ryze's strength lies in his extremely long ranged Q, which is very hard to counterharass against. lux's spells are both longer range than his Q, and both (at least partially) can hit behind creeps. ryze has a very hard time approaching lux to harass - when he does get in range, her shield can negate part of his first Q with it's outward motion, and part of his second Q with it's return pattern, assuming he casts WQEQ and she shields immediately after he snares; this negates a large chunk of his damage and although he will come out ahead with repeated engages like this, her shield combined with her range should make it so this sort of exchange doesn't happen frequently enough that he can kill her by the time he has tear and cata he can bully her in lane as she tends to build a bit more glass-cannon, but who doesn't ryze bully at that point? Her damage out put in late game is very week, the strength of AP casters is either 1) ridic sustained damage, like cass, karthus, ryze, ziggs, ahri. or 2) super burst, like annie, brand, sion, and so on. When it hits late game, Lux does neither of these well. Hmm... what lux lacks isn't burst damage. Her burst damage on enemy backrow is probably one of the most reliable out of the AP carries because you just E R properly and BAM, their two carries are at half health But regarding her spells, they're just too impractical to use and the payoff isn't worth the conditional constraints to being able to use all her spells to their full potential. I'd venture a guess that a perfectly played Lux is much stronger than most commonly played AP carries, but on the flipside, you have very little room for error with any of your spells, what with the fairly long cooldown and her being complete deadwhile while her spells are on cooldown. But look at all other AP carries, they just own any squihies, and still do substantial damage to bruisers/ Sure lux has long range, but generally tehre's a bruiser/tank line. realistically in late game, you'll probably only land the lazer on desired target, and that alone isn't enough damage. Or you could just be cass and just kill everything.
Well, the price Lux pays for her range is fairly substantial, but it's worth what it's worth, really. Casseiopia isn't the embodiment of all that's good in an AP carry, strong as she is.
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I hate lux with a fiery burning passion. no other AP carry is even close to as useless at 20 kills as she is. like, seriously, any other AP carry is going 8/1 on my team and I'm like, "ok, we got this game," lux is 15/0 and I'm like, "yea, we're probably going to lose."
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On February 24 2012 02:59 Juicyfruit wrote:Show nested quote +On February 24 2012 02:52 wei2coolman wrote:On February 24 2012 02:07 Juicyfruit wrote:On February 24 2012 01:52 wei2coolman wrote:On February 23 2012 17:56 gtrsrs wrote:On February 23 2012 17:21 wei2coolman wrote:On February 23 2012 16:53 gtrsrs wrote:On February 23 2012 16:33 SnK-Arcbound wrote:
Huge lux buff. Always loved her but she just was never good enough to be able to solo lane. Maybe she'll eventually get to the point of being a good ap. lux is perfectly viable as a solo laner and is a good counterpick to ryze atm Lux was very strong from early to mid game, then her power drops considerably. lategame lux's ult is on one of the shortest cooldowns in the game, especially relative to its damage level. it is so short that it is MORE rare that you DON'T get 2 ults in one fight than you do. she has the second longest-ranged stun in the game and can check brushes with a skill lategame is not lux's weak point On February 23 2012 17:43 TwoToneTerran wrote:On February 23 2012 16:53 gtrsrs wrote:On February 23 2012 16:33 SnK-Arcbound wrote:
Huge lux buff. Always loved her but she just was never good enough to be able to solo lane. Maybe she'll eventually get to the point of being a good ap. lux is perfectly viable as a solo laner and is a good counterpick to ryze atm In what way is Lux a counter to Ryze? I'm genuinely curious because I think it's the other way around, but I want to hear your reasoning. ryze's strength lies in his extremely long ranged Q, which is very hard to counterharass against. lux's spells are both longer range than his Q, and both (at least partially) can hit behind creeps. ryze has a very hard time approaching lux to harass - when he does get in range, her shield can negate part of his first Q with it's outward motion, and part of his second Q with it's return pattern, assuming he casts WQEQ and she shields immediately after he snares; this negates a large chunk of his damage and although he will come out ahead with repeated engages like this, her shield combined with her range should make it so this sort of exchange doesn't happen frequently enough that he can kill her by the time he has tear and cata he can bully her in lane as she tends to build a bit more glass-cannon, but who doesn't ryze bully at that point? Her damage out put in late game is very week, the strength of AP casters is either 1) ridic sustained damage, like cass, karthus, ryze, ziggs, ahri. or 2) super burst, like annie, brand, sion, and so on. When it hits late game, Lux does neither of these well. Hmm... what lux lacks isn't burst damage. Her burst damage on enemy backrow is probably one of the most reliable out of the AP carries because you just E R properly and BAM, their two carries are at half health But regarding her spells, they're just too impractical to use and the payoff isn't worth the conditional constraints to being able to use all her spells to their full potential. I'd venture a guess that a perfectly played Lux is much stronger than most commonly played AP carries, but on the flipside, you have very little room for error with any of your spells, what with the fairly long cooldown and her being complete deadwhile while her spells are on cooldown. But look at all other AP carries, they just own any squihies, and still do substantial damage to bruisers/ Sure lux has long range, but generally tehre's a bruiser/tank line. realistically in late game, you'll probably only land the lazer on desired target, and that alone isn't enough damage. Or you could just be cass and just kill everything. Well, the price Lux pays for her range is fairly substantial, but it's worth what it's worth, really. Casseiopia isn't the embodiment of all that's good in an AP carry, strong as she is.
Well like I said, she excels in midgame. She's so strong pre18. It's scary. But once everyone gets a little bit of resistance, she just ends up going to shit, more or less. Her Q and E cd's are long, sure they do burst, but they don't do enough dmg per cd. In late game Lux is only good for some damage, and teamfights that result in a lot of kiting.
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On February 24 2012 03:06 Mogwai wrote:
I hate lux with a fiery burning passion. no other AP carry is even close to as useless at 20 kills as she is. like, seriously, any other AP carry is going 8/1 on my team and I'm like, "ok, we got this game," lux is 15/0 and I'm like, "yea, we're probably going to lose."
What champs do you NOT hate with a firey burning passion?
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I think the real problem with Lux is that by around mid game her burst is no longer lethal. Which makes her about the only AP carry in the game that can't just straight 100 -> 0 a squishy.
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On February 24 2012 03:06 Mogwai wrote:
I hate lux with a fiery burning passion. no other AP carry is even close to as useless at 20 kills as she is. like, seriously, any other AP carry is going 8/1 on my team and I'm like, "ok, we got this game," lux is 15/0 and I'm like, "yea, we're probably going to lose."
Whenever I play lux I plan on winning by 20-30 minute mark. If I can't win by that time, team is probably screwed.
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On February 24 2012 03:09 Two_DoWn wrote:Show nested quote +On February 24 2012 03:06 Mogwai wrote:
I hate lux with a fiery burning passion. no other AP carry is even close to as useless at 20 kills as she is. like, seriously, any other AP carry is going 8/1 on my team and I'm like, "ok, we got this game," lux is 15/0 and I'm like, "yea, we're probably going to lose." What champs do you NOT hate with a firey burning passion?
Pantheon and Xin. loloololololololololol
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all aps fall off late game as everyone has atleast 1 tanky item
aoe slow double snare and an ap shield dont fall off. apart from sustained dps mages like cass lux's kit on paper is 1 of the best for a late game aps. better than say a brands
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On February 24 2012 02:43 Alaric wrote:
Ryze can perfectly be played with a standard AP carry runepage. It's not optimal, of course, but it'll do the job. Worse case, you play him typical tanky runes with mpen instead of arpen and it'll go along with his tanky nature.
Orianna can be tricky and requires subtlety so you should perhaps avoid playing her at first since you say you're not too used to them. Fiddle doesn't do really lane well (he's annoying, and helps ganks really well, but he can't push so no roaming either and there's no element of surprise).
Brand, Viktor and Lux are pretty straightfoward I guess, if only lacking escapes. Viktor, Kennen and Ryze can easily be played tanky if you wish so (Viktor is a bit trickier because of his passive and higher cooldowns than the other to), to go along with your bruiser mentality. Ryze is probably best for that, as even tho he lacks their mobility he's often described as a mage bruiser.
even better, ryze can be played with flat MRS and go mid and be hard to move in lane
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EPT
