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Alzadar
Canada5009 Posts
On January 11 2012 10:40 TheYango wrote: Because dodging Vayne's, Annie's, and Janna's autoattacks is really that different from dodging just Vayne's. More importantly, Jax just has to cast the spell and the effect goes off, Teemo has to cast the spell on the person he wants to miss, and in the case of a ranged they'll have already hit him 1-3 times. | ||
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turdburgler
England6749 Posts
On January 11 2012 10:40 TheYango wrote: Because dodging Vayne's, Annie's, and Janna's autoattacks is really that different from dodging just Vayne's. lichbane is a good item i heard :D | ||
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wei2coolman
United States60033 Posts
On January 11 2012 10:41 Shiv. wrote: Yeah, if you only want to take damage reduction into account, it will probably be similar, depending on numbers. Also: we're bumping heads a lot today :D I'm not trying to pick on you, sorry if I came across that way. on a 2 minute cooldown. Dude. C'mon. Nah, it's all good, i like a healthy discussion! | ||
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Hidden_MotiveS
Canada2562 Posts
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Shiv.
3534 Posts
I'd rather dodge Tryndamere and Vayne instead of blinding Trynd and meanwhile getting raped by Vayne. It's not like there's not a lot scenarios where you have to be afraid of more than one autoattacker. | ||
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red_
United States8474 Posts
On January 11 2012 10:23 TheYango wrote: + Show Spoiler + On January 11 2012 09:33 Attakijing wrote: This came from the post earlier where a guy said that dota is not changing (which i also thought was true) and someone told him that in fact dota is changing faster than LoL. That completely changes my idea of what dota is...i thought LoL was the one where the meta changes every week because of huge buffs/nerfs and new champions like xerath or riven that go beyond what any champion was capable of before them. TBH, one of the biggest forces of short-term change in recent times in DotA has been the rapid pace at which the Chinese DotA teams have pushed the game forward. Just as Koreans have made Starcraft extremely dynamic without any outside influence on the game, so have the Chinese done so with DotA. The game moves so quickly that over the course of a little over a month, the "must-ban" heroes in a competitive game have almost completely rotated TWICE, and are now in a state where there's pretty much no must-ban hero simply because of how many powerful and flexible options are available to a team. + Show Spoiler + @ WDC 2011 (early November): Invoker, Shadow Demon, and Batrider are essentially "must-ban" heroes that almost never get through the 1st ban phase. Lycanthrope and Syllabear get some bans but are generally a first-pick. Slardar, Pandaren Brewmaster, and Dragon Knight are virtually unseen. @ SMM 2011 (December) Lycanthrope, Broodmother, and Syllabear are key bans from Chinese teams. Batrider and Invoker are still bannable, but are very often let through as high-priority picks. Shadow Demon is picked up by non-Chinese teams but virtually ignored by Chinese teams. iG makes big plays with Pandaren Brewmaster, Bounty Hunter, and Chaos Knight--heroes that have otherwise been somewhat uncommon. @ G-League 2011 (Late December/Beginning January) Pandaren Brewmaster is one of the biggest bans in the pool. Chaos Knight is a strong ban/pick, and Lycanthrope is still banned. Bounty Hunter is rarely banned, but is seen reasonably often. The game has shifted to a much faster tempo, and strength carries that were previously not heavily played like Slardar and Dragon Knight are ban/first-pick material. Late-game oriented carries such as Anti-Mage and Faceless Void are already increasingly uncommon picks. Even the dreaded Syllabear often goes through all 10 bans and 10 picks without getting touched, as with Invoker. Shadow Demon has dropped off the face of the planet. Icefrog is doing his best to make sweeping changes for the overall design of the game, but honestly most of the small-scale shifts come from the fact that the competitive community in DotA is much more dynamic and open-minded than in LoL, so that even when nothing changes for like 5 months (which is how long it's been since the last time the patch competitive games were played on had a significant change), people are trying new shit. Well if I knew you were literally writing a post with the details I couldn't provide in my somewhat ambiguous one before it, I would've just not done anything. THANKS! =p (no really, thanks, I don't follow the competitive scene nearly close enough to give a breakdown, I am just aware that they shift the meta CONSTANTLY on their own, like Clockwork being god tier not too long ago, and now considered one of the worst picks in the pool I think?) | ||
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nyxnyxnyx
Indonesia2978 Posts
1. laning (and everything else) in dota has a lot more potential outcomes than LoL. examples of why: stunning right before the animation of enemy's attack or skill completes, blinking/windwalking to pop projectiles, better denying, pulling jungle creeps (to deny). in addition to all of the above, dota frequently plays varying number of people in lanes, ranging from 2 top 1 mid 2 bottom to trilane / solo / solo to some mix of jungler/2 solos/another solo+roamer 2. dota is infinitely harder than LoL as a direct consequence of point 1. all dota-type games reward good decisionmaking as well as execution. due to increased potential outcomes as explained in 1, decisionmaking gets harder in dota. execution is also more difficult due to varying hero animations / cast points/ turning points / presence of denying/ fog of war. if you're new to dota and playing against experienced players, expect to get raped super hard. if they're any decent. on the contrary, i argue that LoL as a game is a lot easier to pick up (given, say, 2 weeks of playing 5hrs/day, i reckon i could teach a girl how to jungle or play ad or play a certain solo top/mid champ in a certain way and get pretty gud elo). 3. if dota 1 is anything to go by, it blows as a spectator sport. dota 2 tournament was only interesting because teams weren't 100% used to dota2 / limited hero pools, resulting in unsure games where teams made mistakes etcetc. icefrog's recent changes are geared towards encouraging early aggression instead of the typical farmfest china has popularized and it's a step in the right direction but we'll see if it works out. 4. dota changes, but LoL changes as well. i think they're about even at this point. dota probably changes SLOWER, just by virtue of how often LoL patches its stuff. 5. bonus point even though you didn't ask for this. drafting and counterpicking in dota has a lot more value / meaning as compared to LoL. LoL has pretty little room for counterpicks if you compare to dota when a certain pick can totally shut down a whole strategy or proper lane assignment can counter a hero totally. for example, a lich pick counters melee carries (due to frost armor being gh3y. it particularly fucks up centaur since frost armor on a lich hitting centaur = free skadi), while lich can be countered by multiple units (chen, illusions, broodmother spiderlings etc), while multiple units are countered by high aoe / earthshaker while that is in turn countered by vision/long range initiation/zeus etcetc. source: i've played dota for 7 years, dota2 beta and LoL for 2.5+ | ||
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wei2coolman
United States60033 Posts
On January 11 2012 10:47 Shiv. wrote: I'd rather dodge Tryndamere and Vayne instead of blinding Trynd and meanwhile getting raped by Vayne. It's not like there's not a lot scenarios where you have to be afraid of more than one autoattacker. I guess its a matter of, who benefits from it. If we're talking about a team fight, teemo's blind is more essential, especially if the enemy carry is focussing your squishies. EDIT: Real question is, how does a jax v jax battle look like? | ||
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nyxnyxnyx
Indonesia2978 Posts
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Two_DoWn
United States13684 Posts
In fact, Im 100% sure this is a nerf on Jax overall. Try to remember what it is like to hit a jax with 30% dodge as an ad hero. You just literally cant kill him, and you are pretty much guaranteed to kill yourself because you will proc his stun, he jumps to you and kills you. Now all you have to do is bait his e, change targets or have someone cc him, then just turn back to him when his timer is up. | ||
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Attakijing
United States693 Posts
i still dont get how dota can be fun with tp scrolls. it seems like you have to keep track of how many people on the other team have how many tp scrolls at all times in order to make sure you aren't getting into a long drawn out fight where their whole team and your whole team tp's in. It also seems like it would totally remove the LoL macro strategy, i.e. "cool theres 4 top lets defend it and push bot." edit: also how the fuck could you ever coordinate strategy like this with strangers | ||
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broz0rs
United States2294 Posts
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Jaso
United States2147 Posts
@above isn't it Dragonblade Talon? according to Riot's post at least. | ||
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Shikyo
Finland33997 Posts
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Alzadar
Canada5009 Posts
On January 11 2012 10:58 Two_DoWn wrote: Jax is going to be better because of a reliable stun, not the damage evasion. In fact, Im 100% sure this is a nerf on Jax overall. Try to remember what it is like to hit a jax with 30% dodge as an ad hero. You just literally cant kill him, and you are pretty much guaranteed to kill yourself because you will proc his stun, he jumps to you and kills you. Now all you have to do is bait his e, change targets or have someone cc him, then just turn back to him when his timer is up. What? The exact same strategy would work now: don't attack him to proc his Counter-Strike and have someone CC him, how is that in any way changed? Now Jax has the choice between pre-casting Counter-Strike to guarantee a stun as soon as his jump lands, losing the damage reduction or he can cast after he jumps, saving himself from damage but risking his target escaping before the stun. | ||
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seRapH
United States9719 Posts
On January 11 2012 11:17 Jaso wrote: Hey guys I need help finding the R on my keyboard.. @above isn't it Dragonblade Talon? according to Riot's post at least. Only because Strider Hiryu is copyrighted | ||
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Jaso
United States2147 Posts
Oh. Didn't know it was an actual game, lol. Typical of Riot, haha. | ||
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NotSorry
United States6722 Posts
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BlackMagister
United States5834 Posts
TSM: Teemo, Alistar, Skarner, Tristina, Gragas EDG:Vayne, Janna, Lee Sin, Ryze, GP | ||
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tobi9999
United States1966 Posts
ZzzZzzz I've done everything, updated my computer, repaired LoL, etcetc After this patch it still won't fucking let me log on. No idea what happened, didn't really do anything. | ||
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