I can't call her medicore as late game kayle with Items could cut down peeps with E ezzpeez
Remowing her passive makes it not viable to farm and aim late game ...

What suprises me more is that RIOT put so mutch effort into champion who currently wasn't braking nor making game ...

zalz

Netherlands3704 Posts

July 26 2011 09:30 GMT

#2282

On July 26 2011 18:22 spinesheath wrote:

Show nested quote +

I wouldn't be so sure it's a nerf yet. That Q spam is most likely gonna hurt. She's definitely getting less interesting though.

But is that ever going to compensate for this

New Passive: Kayle's basic attacks against enemy champions now reduce their armor and magic resistance by 2% for 5 seconds (stacks up to 5 times)

I also don't see what you mean with "that Q spam is gonna hurt". Her Q is reckoning and that has gotten this:

Reckoning
Missile speed increased to 1300 from 1000
Ability power ratio increased to 1.0 from 0.8
Mana cost reduced to 70/75/80/85/90 from 80/85/90/95/100
Slow increased to 35% from 25%
Damage amplification reduced to 5% from 8/10/12/14/16%

More missile speed, more AP scale, lower mana cost and harder slow. Those 4 thing together make for a nice buff.

But then they proceed to nerf off 11% of the damage amplification effect.

How is she even a hybrid anymore? I don't see why she benefits from hybrid items anymore without her old passive.

Maybe if the enemy team is stupid and her AoE-Rightious fury blows apply her passive to everyone hit by the AoE then she can be a nice low elo pub stomper but i really doubt it. Maybe my theorycrafting is fail and it's in reality a huge buff but all i see is a big nerf wich leaves her more boring and also weaker then before.

---------------------

Lategame she could be strong but the same applies for Tryndamere. The fact is this game isn't just about the lategame and it should not be balanced around it.

Most games end long before people start to finish their builds.

arb

Noobville17921 Posts

July 26 2011 10:16 GMT

#2283

I wish they'd just put gangplank back to what he was before.

Id prefer that to the imba one that was or what they just did to him

spinesheath

Germany8679 Posts

July 26 2011 11:32 GMT

#2284

On July 26 2011 18:30 zalz wrote:
But then they proceed to nerf off 11% of the damage amplification effect.

That's why I talk about "Q spam", not Q -> E spam. Q will never amplify its own damage anyways.

Goshawk.

United Kingdom5338 Posts

July 26 2011 12:39 GMT

#2285

No change to GP's passive (imba slow) makes me sad, his raise morale got nerfed but it's still really good.

Haemonculus

United States6980 Posts

July 26 2011 12:43 GMT

#2286

Wait... so a 10% armor/magicres debuff... after being hit with 5 consecutive attacks?

I might be off, but that sounds more or less COMPLETELY worthless. Doesn't Jarman's Q do more armor shred at lvl1?

Therealdevil

Netherlands1021 Posts

July 26 2011 12:47 GMT

#2287

Yeah that's pretty shitty.
"O dude, I'm gonna own you I have 10% armor shred!"
"err, that still leaves me with 270 armor bro"
"; ;"

Haemonculus

United States6980 Posts

July 26 2011 12:57 GMT

#2288

I think she's still going to be played as a "stack AP and Q people in the face in lane over and over and over again" champ. That much will be fun at least, o.o;

zalz

Netherlands3704 Posts

July 26 2011 14:17 GMT

#2289

On July 26 2011 21:57 Haemonculus wrote:
I think she's still going to be played as a "stack AP and Q people in the face in lane over and over and over again" champ. That much will be fun at least, o.o;

From the only true hybrid champ in the game to an AP version of Pantheon.

Haemonculus

United States6980 Posts

July 26 2011 14:22 GMT

#2290

On July 26 2011 21:47 mercurial wrote:
Yeah that's pretty shitty.
"O dude, I'm gonna own you I have 10% armor shred!"
"err, that still leaves me with 270 armor bro"
"; ;"

Or in a lvl1 fight. Bwahahaha, I reduce your 20 armor to... 18! EAT IT

Juicyfruit

Canada5484 Posts

July 26 2011 14:26 GMT

#2291

You'd have to be pretty bad at balancing to take one of the best passives in the game and turning it into one of the worst

starfries

Canada3508 Posts

July 26 2011 14:31 GMT

#2292

I think Kayle's lategame was pretty overrated tbh, sure she gets tons of free stats and that damage amplification but being hybrid means she can't really use 3 of the multiplicative stats that ranged DPS can (crit chance, crit damage and that 40% armor pen). She's not bad by any means, but I don't think she melts things any faster than a lategame Trist or something.

I'm glad they fixed that vision thing on Cass too. I'd toss it into a bush that I know has someone in it and my teammate would think it gives vision and facechecks -_- No more buffs please, I think she's already one of the strongest APs and I don't need her at Orianna ban status

Southlight

United States11768 Posts

July 26 2011 14:41 GMT

#2293

The reason why she used both stats no matter what is because RFury has an AP Ratio, and adds the bonus + AP ratio damage to AD, so that when you were farmed with like IE you'd literally just smash people with like 200 AD + 30 RFury + 50 AP ratio, which was sickening amounts of damage. She fell out of favor primarily because they nerfed her movespeed boost too much so that she became the worst kiting ranged DPS (compared to Trist/Cait/Corki/MF), and because Cait and Corki don't quite rely on farm as much. Triple pot Kayle was hilarious because you'd get like an aggregate +30 damage on your attacks with RFury + crits.

Therealdevil

Netherlands1021 Posts

July 26 2011 14:44 GMT

#2294

Ya, I'm gonna pick up Cassiopia now as well, she's legitimately good now

zalz

Netherlands3704 Posts

July 26 2011 15:00 GMT

#2295

On July 26 2011 23:44 mercurial wrote:
Ya, I'm gonna pick up Cassiopia now as well, she's legitimately good now

She has always been kinda hovering between good and decent but i agree that this change will probably put her amongst the likes of Brand or Malz.

spinesheath

Germany8679 Posts

July 26 2011 15:27 GMT

#2296

On July 26 2011 23:44 mercurial wrote:
Ya, I'm gonna pick up Cassiopia now as well, she's legitimately good now

You had been playing her in normals back when I still was active on EU and did well, why did you ever stop playing her...

Seuss

United States10536 Posts

July 26 2011 16:10 GMT

#2297

My curiosity has been piqued by the Tryndamere changes. What stuck out to me the most was a notable reversal of his mechanics.

Before: Tryndamere gains crit as his health decreases, and damage as his stacks increase.
After: Tryndamere gains damage as his health decreases, and crit as his stacks(fury) increase.

I don't know how significant the reversal actually is given the switch to fury, but it's an interesting change.

Juicyfruit

Canada5484 Posts

July 26 2011 16:55 GMT

#2298

I think it means that now you build him a tanky DPS (Riot so good at creating diversity), since his ability to 2-shot people with farm is gone since he doesn't have the massive crit scaling from the old bloodlust, and you have no reason to fight at low health because you get crit% bonus as long as you have fury.

ArC_man

United States2798 Posts

July 26 2011 17:19 GMT

#2299

Awww yea more AP Ezreal buffs!

cascades

Singapore6122 Posts

July 26 2011 17:48 GMT

#2300

Except that it has been mathcrafted that u can do that with old Kayle and do more damage. I can call it mindboggling that Riot can't perform simple mathcraft, but I don't think they are that dumb. It's always hard to sell nerfs and shit.

So well, Kayle is going to do MASSIVE DAMAGE. You heard it here first.

Now I do play quite a bit of Tryndamere, as all the people who tell me to stop picking Tryn and a more tryhard jungler can attest. I am waiting on Tryn, as the hero has got a partial makeover, but Kayle is just a pure unadulterated nerf.