EPTShit happens. Im not gonna get on riots case for patch day issues. It will merely get in the way of my crusade for esports features.
General Discussion/Off-topic - Page 1020
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Two_DoWn
United States13684 Posts
Shit happens. Im not gonna get on riots case for patch day issues. It will merely get in the way of my crusade for esports features. | ||
TheYango
United States47024 Posts
On July 09 2011 12:10 Two_DoWn wrote: I have a sneaking suspicion that mpen blues are really damn good, especially if you plan to stack drings. MPen is way more slot-effective on quints than on blues. If you're getting MPen on blues, you should have a good reason for not getting them on quints (e.g. you have a specific need for MS or flat HP quints)--or be running both. | ||
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Niton
United States2395 Posts
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Phrost
United States4008 Posts
On July 09 2011 12:13 57 Corvette wrote: So, is Leona 6300? I read on the forums she was 3150 but it could be wrong | ||
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Lanzoma
Mexico813 Posts
EDIT: He already did but was quite reserved about it. Don't be shy dude. | ||
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TL Blazeraid
566 Posts
mres|increase in damage from mpen blue 30 3.08% 50 2.29% 70 1.78% 90 1.42% 110 1.16% 130 0.96% 150 0.81% 170 0.70% 190 0.60% So, assuming a spell has a 1:1 ap ratio and 100 base damage vs 30 mres, AP runes would have to add >3 damage to beat mpen. edit: base damage//damage sans ap runes | ||
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Two_DoWn
United States13684 Posts
On July 09 2011 12:31 Niton wrote: 5.13 MPen vs 1.53/level (27) AP seems like a really tough sell. Because I can buy AP very easily late game. The real question is does having 5 MPen deal more damage than an extra 1.5 ap every level. Im inclined to think that it does since each point of ap isnt equal to an extra point of damage, while I believe each point of mpen is another point of damage. It seems to me at least that Mpen should be more potent early game. I guess the real question is what level does ap/lvl overtake mpens damage, and how much ap itemization am I going to have at that point. | ||
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BlueBird.
United States3889 Posts
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57 Corvette
Canada5941 Posts
I need help on the runes/masteries/builds/playstyle, so experienced Gragasers please help. | ||
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rwrzr
United States1980 Posts
On July 09 2011 12:43 TL Blazeraid wrote: Here's a quickly strewn mpen/mres graph. Mpen runes are listed in % increase, to compare match the increase in damage from ap runes over the damage sans ap runes vs the % and see if it is an increase or decrease mres|increase in damage from mpen blue 30 3.08% 50 2.29% 70 1.78% 90 1.42% 110 1.16% 130 0.96% 150 0.81% 170 0.70% 190 0.60% So, assuming a spell has a 1:1 ap ratio and 100 base damage vs 30 mres, AP runes would have to add >3 damage to beat mpen. edit: base damage//damage sans ap runes Does this take into account the free 15% magic penetration you get from masteries? It benefits Mpen more than to AP | ||
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Qualm
721 Posts
On July 09 2011 12:59 rwrzr wrote: Does this take into account the free 15% magic penetration you get from masteries? It benefits Mpen more than to AP You also need to consider the fact that the deathcap you eventually build will increase your AP by 30%, and that the void staff you might get will reduce the power of spellpen. | ||
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Parametric
Canada1261 Posts
On July 09 2011 12:59 rwrzr wrote: Does this take into account the free 15% magic penetration you get from masteries? It benefits Mpen more than to AP I'll use brand 9/0/21 with a deathcap and sorc shoes @ lvl 18 vs annie with a Bveil Annie's resistance after reduction With mpen blues 28% resistance Without mpen blues 30% 2% difference y = damage x = ap 2.35 = brand's ratios (not including passive and only including 1 bounce of R) 1120 = base damage from spells 82.25 = extra damage gained from 35ap (deathcap * ap/lvl blues) 1.3 = Deathcap y = (1120 + 2.35x(1.3))1.02 y = 82.25 + 1120 + 2.35x(1.3) x = 1123.02 AP for 2% difference to overtake Ap/lvl blues with Deathcap Flat pen gets worse with higher MR targets and it also detracts from your 49% (mastery + void) magic pen since Flat is applied before Percent penetration. Also, with sorc shoes and mpen reds you waste mpen until they buy extra MR because as i understand it you can't bring someone below 0 MR with penetration done while watching nasl so this is all subject to being completely wrong. | ||
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Two_DoWn
United States13684 Posts
On July 09 2011 13:16 Qualm wrote: You also need to consider the fact that the deathcap you eventually build will increase your AP by 30%, and that the void staff you might get will reduce the power of spellpen. This is a bit of a misconception I think. Void staff does not reduce the power off spell pen, it just doesnt penetrate in the most effective way (ie void staff then mpen), instead going mpen then void staff. You reduce the magic resist, then penetrate 40% of whatever remains. | ||
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TL Blazeraid
566 Posts
edit: On July 09 2011 13:22 Two_DoWn wrote: This is a bit of a misconception I think. Void staff does not reduce the power off spell pen, it just doesnt penetrate in the most effective way (ie void staff then mpen), instead going mpen then void staff. You reduce the magic resist, then penetrate 40% of whatever remains. It reduces the cost efficiency, you're penetrating more mres but each point penetrated costs more than no magicpen+void staff. -effeciency(makes each point of flat pen worth less vs ap) | ||
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Two_DoWn
United States13684 Posts
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De4ngus
United States6533 Posts
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rwrzr
United States1980 Posts
The only variables we should be concerned with when deciding MPen vs AP are: 1) MR 2) AP Ratios 3) MPen 4) AP 5) Free 15% from masteries 6) OPTIONAL: Items and Level 18 We really should narrow down what level range we are talking about Here's some simple maths in a recentish thread: http://www.leagueoflegends.com/board/showthread.php?t=630999 Edit: If you run Flat CDR Blues, 9/0/21, @ Level 1 you have ~15% CDR And @ Level 18 with blue you have 40% Some more food for thought and alternatives for low cooldown spammy AP casters | ||
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Psyonic_Reaver
United States4336 Posts
On July 09 2011 13:26 Two_DoWn wrote: Im in the game Hate | ||
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WaveofShadow
Canada31494 Posts
On July 09 2011 13:39 rwrzr wrote: I don't think this is a proper comparison you bring in too many other variables. The only variables we should be concerned with when deciding MPen vs AP are: 1) MR 2) AP Ratios 3) MPen 4) AP 5) Free 15% from masteries 6) OPTIONAL: Items and Level 18 We really should narrow down what level range we are talking about Here's some simple maths in a recentish thread: http://www.leagueoflegends.com/board/showthread.php?t=630999 So...simply put, as I'm sure many of us have figured before... MPen > AP on low mres targets and vice versa? | ||
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Two_DoWn
United States13684 Posts
On July 09 2011 13:42 WaveofShadow wrote: So...simply put, as I'm sure many of us have figured before... MPen > AP on low mres targets and vice versa? Thats the conclusion I came to. And since early game means low mr, not to mention the fact that ap/lvls are really nonexistant at that point, mpen is really good early game, so you prolly want it for any burst caster like annie or brand. | ||
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