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On February 02 2015 14:48 xDaunt wrote:Show nested quote +On February 02 2015 14:27 Brian333 wrote:
What I am saying is that these people could easily be better than you in an organized group queue of any size if they play with someone who can manage their lack of judgement. So, that they would be a high MMR or a high rank is not inconceivable. They might play with people who tell them what to do or groups that they can follow. If you pointed out clear deficiencies in skill, then I would find it more puzzling than clear deficiencies in judgement. Maybe. Generally speaking, though, I do not see micro and mechanics as the limiting factors to good or even professional play. Tactics and strategy are far more important. Even presuming that these individuals who are afflicting me were carried to high ranks by leaders who could completely negate their lack of judgment by calling all of the shots, I find it hard to believe that some of their leaders' wisdom would not rub off on them. For the most part, I am talking about very fundamental issues that are awry.
At high levels you gotta take risks to get an edge, if you're with a team of really mechanically skilled guys then those risks tend to pay off. If they can't execute or are indecisive then those risks just turn into fails and 'why did you do that?' kind of moments.
Not saying that's the case with the guys you're running into but there's certainly a lot of judgement calls that are less clear-cut and more situational and actually need someone to process all the information. Without seeing a replay it's hard to say if these guys are just brain dead or are making calls for the wrong situation.
And for the record I've seen some practice matches where team members are basically bots for the shot caller, down to the talent choices. So it's not inconceivable that some people are just really lost without their leader. This is of course assuming a lot (namely that these guys actually play without said leader).
But actually I wanted to throw out this observation, there's been a massive, massive influx of players. I'm regularly the only guy that's been playing longer than a month in my quick match games and I'd say the vast, vast majority of players are using someone from the free rotation. I wouldn't think this is the case as a Hotslog Platinum (yes I know that's not leet, but it's far from the bottom is my point). So I suspect that the entire player pool has been diluted with new players which is why we're all seeing more 'questionable' players / judgements lately.
But for me, the new players are pretty receptive to learning how to play the maps as long as you don't yell at them or what not. And it's not like the other team isn't similarly handicapped. Especially Arthas' that drain their mana on Frozen Tempest while laning so you swoop in and they're helpless, that's always fun.
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On February 02 2015 15:58 kingjames01 wrote:
What's EG's current line-up? Anything recent that I can watch?
They played on a tournament 2 days ago, zoia or jakeGG (¿?) should have some VODs. I watched them getting wrecked hard by C9. I don't know, NA plays weird.
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On February 02 2015 18:43 Wuster wrote:
But actually I wanted to throw out this observation, there's been a massive, massive influx of players. I'm regularly the only guy that's been playing longer than a month in my quick match games and I'd say the vast, vast majority of players are using someone from the free rotation. I wouldn't think this is the case as a Hotslog Platinum (yes I know that's not leet, but it's far from the bottom is my point). So I suspect that the entire player pool has been diluted with new players which is why we're all seeing more 'questionable' players / judgements lately.
But for me, the new players are pretty receptive to learning how to play the maps as long as you don't yell at them or what not. And it's not like the other team isn't similarly handicapped. Especially Arthas' that drain their mana on Frozen Tempest while laning so you swoop in and they're helpless, that's always fun.
ofcourse there has been. ive never had any experience with mobas whatsoever, and hotslog had me in gold league going from 1.8k to 2k mmr every few days. founders pack comes along, suddenly im plat with steady 2.3k mmr, yet my big winning and losing streaks are the same. there is no other explanation than a lot bigger player pool.
and it shows on other stuff too.
number of no-armor raynors, blue diablos and elf tyrande is off the charts. also, you can almost count on one of those 3 to either ignore the objectives completely and never leave their lane, do mercs all day, or do other weird stuff you're supposed to do in other mobas.
then there are also complete trash players. mostly raynors. one raynor tried to solo boss at level 9. im not talking accidentally shooting it and running away. no, this guy went down to 15% hp before giving up.
as someone who is forced to soloqueue, this game is starting to lose its charm. you either roflstomp or get roflstomped. i dont think that's fun...
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On February 02 2015 19:55 snailz wrote:Show nested quote +On February 02 2015 18:43 Wuster wrote:
But actually I wanted to throw out this observation, there's been a massive, massive influx of players. I'm regularly the only guy that's been playing longer than a month in my quick match games and I'd say the vast, vast majority of players are using someone from the free rotation. I wouldn't think this is the case as a Hotslog Platinum (yes I know that's not leet, but it's far from the bottom is my point). So I suspect that the entire player pool has been diluted with new players which is why we're all seeing more 'questionable' players / judgements lately.
But for me, the new players are pretty receptive to learning how to play the maps as long as you don't yell at them or what not. And it's not like the other team isn't similarly handicapped. Especially Arthas' that drain their mana on Frozen Tempest while laning so you swoop in and they're helpless, that's always fun. ofcourse there has been. ive never had any experience with mobas whatsoever, and hotslog had me in gold league going from 1.8k to 2k mmr every few days. founders pack comes along, suddenly im plat with steady 2.3k mmr, yet my big winning and losing streaks are the same. there is no other explanation than a lot bigger player pool. and it shows on other stuff too. number of no-armor raynors, blue diablos and elf tyrande is off the charts. also, you can almost count on one of those 3 to either ignore the objectives completely and never leave their lane, do mercs all day, or do other weird stuff you're supposed to do in other mobas. then there are also complete trash players. mostly raynors. one raynor tried to solo boss at level 9. im not talking accidentally shooting it and running away. no, this guy went down to 15% hp before giving up. as someone who is forced to soloqueue, this game is starting to lose its charm. you either roflstomp or get roflstomped. i dont think that's fun...
why you forced to solo ? i've been adding players i think are nice that i find playing ranked, so i can party with them :o
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Dunno, i am one of those founder's nekkid noobs and i am on 2,9k in hotslogs (even tho rising, but still terrible) and i play soloQ too. If you don't want to spend your time with the newbies and you find you can't improve your MMR to start getting matched with better people, get into heroes league. The lvl 30 / 10 chars barrier is enough to weed out the completely clueless or the ones who still think they are playing LoL.
Past some MMR, i don't find many of those players to be honest, every now and then, but rarely. And you can carry your team at those MMR too, since the oppossite team is equally bad.
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Hey guys, I'm new to HotS and mobas in general, maybe played 10 games of LoL / Dota2 and never really enjoyed.
Found I had access when they announced founders and I've been playing exclusively as Valla so far, maybe 6 games and I'm really enjoying it but have a few questions.
My previous, very limited, understanding of mobas was that laning was important but that doesn't seem the case here, as implied by comments above, and also witnessed in my own play. How would you, as someone like Valla, determine when to lane and when to group up? My understanding is that I should try to stick with a warrior or support in a lane, kill creeps, and wait for a warrior to initiate before I engage properly, outside of zoning other heroes I guess. I suppose it could be quite map / objective dependant and if that's the case I'll just try my best to learn that but any general tips would be appreciated.
With regards to hero choice, Valla so far is great and I've been using this resource to get some better understanding:
EQUINOX'S VALLA GUIDE
Would you guys recommend trying at least one warrior and support too? I'm not really sure what specialists are at the moment but I understand that Nazeebo is one and I love WD in D3 so I'm going to buy him for sure. I've heard Diablo and LiLi are pretty noob friendly but any other recommendations are welcome. I know generally people play more than one character, even if they have preference but do people often stick to one specialisation or try to keep it as varied as possible? My only reference here is SC2 where obviously random is fun and I play other races from time to time but you can't really get to grips with a race if you're spreading your time evenly across all 3, I just want to know if I should try and spread time to gain a wider knowledge base or focus on one thing for the time being.
And of course if anyone wants to give me a hand in game send me a message with your bnet info and I'll add you, I'm UK based and I'll be on occasionally at the weekends and maybe some weekday evenings. I might be new but I went from bronze to top 8 diamond in season 1 WoL so I know I can learn pretty quick, I'm not interested in ultra competitive play though, being 27 with an enjoyable full time job, mortgage and busy missus I have plenty of other things that get priority 
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On February 02 2015 22:19 adwodon wrote:Hey guys, I'm new to HotS and mobas in general, maybe played 10 games of LoL / Dota2 and never really enjoyed. Found I had access when they announced founders and I've been playing exclusively as Valla so far, maybe 6 games and I'm really enjoying it but have a few questions. My previous, very limited, understanding of mobas was that laning was important but that doesn't seem the case here, as implied by comments above, and also witnessed in my own play. How would you, as someone like Valla, determine when to lane and when to group up? My understanding is that I should try to stick with a warrior or support in a lane, kill creeps, and wait for a warrior to initiate before I engage properly, outside of zoning other heroes I guess. I suppose it could be quite map / objective dependant and if that's the case I'll just try my best to learn that but any general tips would be appreciated. With regards to hero choice, Valla so far is great and I've been using this resource to get some better understanding: EQUINOX'S VALLA GUIDE Would you guys recommend trying at least one warrior and support too? I'm not really sure what specialists are at the moment but I understand that Nazeebo is one and I love WD in D3 so I'm going to buy him for sure. I've heard Diablo and LiLi are pretty noob friendly but any other recommendations are welcome. I know generally people play more than one character, even if they have preference but do people often stick to one specialisation or try to keep it as varied as possible? My only reference here is SC2 where obviously random is fun and I play other races from time to time but you can't really get to grips with a race if you're spreading your time evenly across all 3, I just want to know if I should try and spread time to gain a wider knowledge base or focus on one thing for the time being. And of course if anyone wants to give me a hand in game send me a message with your bnet info and I'll add you, I'm UK based and I'll be on occasionally at the weekends and maybe some weekday evenings. I might be new but I went from bronze to top 8 diamond in season 1 WoL so I know I can learn pretty quick, I'm not interested in ultra competitive play though, being 27 with an enjoyable full time job, mortgage and busy missus I have plenty of other things that get priority
It can't hurt to try at least some of the rotation heroes while you are new. It becomes more painful when you are more highly ranked and can't jump in with a level one hero you have to do some super boring coop mode against the ai. It's also not easy to pick up what to watch out for from other heroes if you haven't played them at all. Diablo is considered bad I think and having got him with the founders pack he seems quite fun but does very low damage. Lili is pretty good but I would say is by far the most boring hero to play out of the ones I've tried which is 15/16 by now. I think the usual moba advice is to have a core of 5 to 10 heroes who you are comfortable using so you aren't useless in draft modes.
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I thought Alt+key was self-cast? I rebound my first skill to 1 but for Arthas Alt+1 does not self-cast Death Coil.
edit: i knew increased radius on the aoe slow was gonna be better TOO BAD ITS TALENT GATED the arthas on the other team is so much more useful
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On February 02 2015 05:59 Vaelone wrote:
I'm Diamond but my friends aren't so I'm actually pulling off higher win rates in solo ranked than by 2-3 stacking with them. When I solo queue I'm mostly getting teams where people pick well and then there's usually someone claiming leadership and calling the shots.
Fuck friends acquire rating.
I've had a similar experience. I am/was/is(?) Diamond in hotslogs prior to the open beta. Now that a bunch of my online friends are in the game they want to group up. So we 3 stack or so. Problem is my MMR is fairly high and I'm a pretty good player. They are not as good. So the game will try and balance out my percieved skill level by giving us 2 more mouth breathers and making the other team look like the world's best 5stack ever. I've had far, far better luck solo queue than grouping with anything less than 5.
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I'm pretty sure that I have a losing record in hero league when duo-queuing or tri-queuing.
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The toxicity in solo queue quick match is becoming nearly unbearable. It usually is not directed at me but having one person calling another person out just breeds a bad match. It is impossible to play well thinking someone else is critiquing every play and if you do screw up starts blasting you in chat. I knew it would eventually come that when the doors are mostly open you'll start getting this but it is a real shame. For the longest time the community felt like it was open to helping people and giving constructive advice to those who were lacking. But that seems gone. It is now back to "X player sucks. GG lets AFK." at like 6 minutes into the game. Despite Heroes having the easiest comeback mechanics where if you stomp a late-game 5v5 you can suddenly be back on equal footing. Even had this happen in hero league yesterday. Some guy was actually lying about his MMR on hotslogs and about his hero league rank so he could get on his soapbox and announce how bad all of us are at the game. Someone actually dug up his hotslogs and he was Gold despite saying he was Master :/
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On February 03 2015 02:55 Tenks wrote:
The toxicity in solo queue quick match is becoming nearly unbearable. It usually is not directed at me but having one person calling another person out just breeds a bad match. It is impossible to play well thinking someone else is critiquing every play and if you do screw up starts blasting you in chat. I knew it would eventually come that when the doors are mostly open you'll start getting this but it is a real shame. For the longest time the community felt like it was open to helping people and giving constructive advice to those who were lacking. But that seems gone. It is now back to "X player sucks. GG lets AFK." at like 6 minutes into the game. Despite Heroes having the easiest comeback mechanics where if you stomp a late-game 5v5 you can suddenly be back on equal footing. Even had this happen in hero league yesterday. Some guy was actually lying about his MMR on hotslogs and about his hero league rank so he could get on his soapbox and announce how bad all of us are at the game. Someone actually dug up his hotslogs and he was Gold despite saying he was Master :/
Yeah, I've seen people do that, too.
And yes, the community is more toxic than it used to be. I certainly am far less patient now and have flamed many a retard (who all absolutely deserved it), when I really shouldn't have.
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On February 03 2015 03:00 xDaunt wrote:Show nested quote +On February 03 2015 02:55 Tenks wrote:
The toxicity in solo queue quick match is becoming nearly unbearable. It usually is not directed at me but having one person calling another person out just breeds a bad match. It is impossible to play well thinking someone else is critiquing every play and if you do screw up starts blasting you in chat. I knew it would eventually come that when the doors are mostly open you'll start getting this but it is a real shame. For the longest time the community felt like it was open to helping people and giving constructive advice to those who were lacking. But that seems gone. It is now back to "X player sucks. GG lets AFK." at like 6 minutes into the game. Despite Heroes having the easiest comeback mechanics where if you stomp a late-game 5v5 you can suddenly be back on equal footing. Even had this happen in hero league yesterday. Some guy was actually lying about his MMR on hotslogs and about his hero league rank so he could get on his soapbox and announce how bad all of us are at the game. Someone actually dug up his hotslogs and he was Gold despite saying he was Master :/ Yeah, I've seen people do that, too. And yes, the community is more toxic than it used to be. I certainly am far less patient now and have flamed many a retard (who all absolutely deserved it), when I really shouldn't have.
How does someone deserve to be flamed when playing a computer game? This is part of what makes the community toxic, saying that such and such "deserves" flaming. Just play the game, and if some retard is flaming, ignore them.
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Yes people flaming are simply looking for a response and I find it best to simply not give them one. Or I'll try and defuse and calm down the situation to not let things go from bad to worse in an individual game. The flamers are also the type who will never actually get good at the game because they'll never self reflect and find holes in their own play rather they'll focus on external factors for their loss. I'd like to say if there was true MMR it would eventually go away but I know from DOTA/LoL it is just a fact of the genre.
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On February 03 2015 03:07 LaughingTulkas wrote:Show nested quote +On February 03 2015 03:00 xDaunt wrote:On February 03 2015 02:55 Tenks wrote:
The toxicity in solo queue quick match is becoming nearly unbearable. It usually is not directed at me but having one person calling another person out just breeds a bad match. It is impossible to play well thinking someone else is critiquing every play and if you do screw up starts blasting you in chat. I knew it would eventually come that when the doors are mostly open you'll start getting this but it is a real shame. For the longest time the community felt like it was open to helping people and giving constructive advice to those who were lacking. But that seems gone. It is now back to "X player sucks. GG lets AFK." at like 6 minutes into the game. Despite Heroes having the easiest comeback mechanics where if you stomp a late-game 5v5 you can suddenly be back on equal footing. Even had this happen in hero league yesterday. Some guy was actually lying about his MMR on hotslogs and about his hero league rank so he could get on his soapbox and announce how bad all of us are at the game. Someone actually dug up his hotslogs and he was Gold despite saying he was Master :/ Yeah, I've seen people do that, too. And yes, the community is more toxic than it used to be. I certainly am far less patient now and have flamed many a retard (who all absolutely deserved it), when I really shouldn't have. How does someone deserve to be flamed when playing a computer game? This is part of what makes the community toxic, saying that such and such "deserves" flaming. Just play the game, and if some retard is flaming, ignore them.
Agree with me or not, I hate to lose, and I especially hate to lose when someone else does something unbelievably stupid. It's just how I'm wired. The only things that I'll say is 1) I don't flame people that I queue with, and 2) I'm far harder on myself when I screw up.
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But what do you plan on accomplishing? If someone did something dumb chances are they know it. Or at least they didn't get a favorable outcome and may not be sure why. It is better to help the person than just insulting them. Not to mention it makes you out to be a huge dick. Now if you try and help and they are too defensive and refuse the help just ignore them and don't say anything more to them. It isn't like flaming someone will make the game turn around in your favor it will generally spiral the game even further out of your control.
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On February 03 2015 03:27 Tenks wrote:
But what do you plan on accomplishing? If someone did something dumb chances are they know it. Or at least they didn't get a favorable outcome and may not be sure why. It is better to help the person than just insulting them. Not to mention it makes you out to be a huge dick. Now if you try and help and they are too defensive and refuse the help just ignore them and don't say anything more to them. It isn't like flaming someone will make the game turn around in your favor it will generally spiral the game even further out of your control.
I don't plan to accomplish anything. It's not a rational choice that I'm making. Again, I'm not justifying anything. I'm just saying how it is.
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So far I have seen surprisingly little flaming. Did have one game where a player decided to let the garden terror timer run out because of too much flaming, not the most enjoyable game.
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On February 03 2015 03:39 xDaunt wrote:Show nested quote +On February 03 2015 03:27 Tenks wrote:
But what do you plan on accomplishing? If someone did something dumb chances are they know it. Or at least they didn't get a favorable outcome and may not be sure why. It is better to help the person than just insulting them. Not to mention it makes you out to be a huge dick. Now if you try and help and they are too defensive and refuse the help just ignore them and don't say anything more to them. It isn't like flaming someone will make the game turn around in your favor it will generally spiral the game even further out of your control. I don't plan to accomplish anything. It's not a rational choice that I'm making. Again, I'm not justifying anything. I'm just saying how it is.
But you do realize that you are contributing to the toxicity in game, right ?
Everybody who flames other person thinks the guy deserves it.
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On February 03 2015 03:39 xDaunt wrote:Show nested quote +On February 03 2015 03:27 Tenks wrote:
But what do you plan on accomplishing? If someone did something dumb chances are they know it. Or at least they didn't get a favorable outcome and may not be sure why. It is better to help the person than just insulting them. Not to mention it makes you out to be a huge dick. Now if you try and help and they are too defensive and refuse the help just ignore them and don't say anything more to them. It isn't like flaming someone will make the game turn around in your favor it will generally spiral the game even further out of your control. I don't plan to accomplish anything. It's not a rational choice that I'm making. Again, I'm not justifying anything. I'm just saying how it is.
That's fair, but you realize that when complaining about increased toxicity in the game that flaming people is adding to the problem at least right? Everyone gets emotional, that's understandable, personally just writing out the rant tends to make me feel better then I just clear message and go back to playing.
I will admit though, there have been a few games where I've AFK-ed out. Having a baby and family responsibilities does that to you. The few times it's happened before I always felt terrible and usually came back here to QQ about the reconnect system.
Last night it happened and I wasn't even sad, was almost a rage quit even. We had a Lurkablo raging on Blackheart's after we lost the first watch tower. Then he raged about how we didn't get all the coins (4/10 from first chest spawns) and how no one knew how to play the map. In response our bottom laner started doing nothing but solo camps despite being E.T.C. and predictably taking forever, ugh. Levels were 10-8 when I died then 12-9 when my kid started crying so I just shut my computer off lol.
I was extra salty because Blackheart's is a map I'm 14-2 on and feel I should never lose (can't explain it, I just feel untouchable no matter what my team comp is or what they're doing).
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EPT
