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On April 06 2016 02:31 Hellonslaught wrote:
Dude... Voltron never saw any play, why would they print this shit.
It is a Timmy/Johnny card:
http://magic.wizards.com/en/articles/archive/making-magic/timmy-johnny-and-spike-2013-12-03
It does not have to be competitive for it to works in this matter.
edit: cf next post for an example of a Timmy/Johnny player that is happy this card exists. ^^
Most players interested in cards review are Spike dominant but that doe snot mean all players are.
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Aviana + Emp Thaurissan from a previous turn would make it happen for a Druid. Toss in a couple of Faceless Manipulators in the deck to make it more likely to pop up.
Sure, there's about a half-dozen ways to wipe it out in any deck, but it'd be cool to pull off, like that triple Thaddius combo in Warlock.
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I don't see why they can't make a card that actually pleases all of those players. I am not talking about competitive, i am talking about releasing only decent cards that can be played.
I never saw Voltron, not even once in casual mode in the last 2 expansions. People tried him about 1 week after release, then gave up.
Voltron is a bad card but was somewhat playable. The Ancient One is not even close to Voltron. So what's the point in making cards no one will use after a while? I mean, what's the point in making those "fun" cards so garbage? Why they can't be a bit stronger to a least be interesting?
Edit: i get it now. Thanks for the link itchiko.
Funny, because i find myself as a Jonnhy/Spike hybrid.
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On April 06 2016 02:52 Hellonslaught wrote:
I don't see why they can't make a card that actually pleases all of those players. I am not talking about competitive, i am talking about releasing only decent cards that can be played.
I never saw Voltron, not even once in casual mode in the last 2 expansions. People tried him about 1 week after release, then gave up.
Voltron is a bad card but was somewhat playable. The Ancient One is not even close to Voltron. So what's the point in making cards no one will use after a while? I mean, what's the point in making those "fun" cards so garbage? Why they can't be a bit stronger to a least be interesting?
In this case the 30/30 would be able to kill every opponent unless he armored over 30 or had taunts in the way. So it's probably better to make it stupidly bad.
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As others said clearly not supposed to be a competitive card but still probably one of the first I'm gonna try when the expansion hits just so I can punch someone in the face with a 30/30. Might actually be my new favorite card just because of how cool getting a 30/30 minion is, probably will be if it gets a suitable awesome animation.
Reminds me a little of Dark Depths from MTG which has me slightly worried for the future of wild but I guess this one isn't indestructible so its probably pointless worrying on my part.
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Fair enough points. You guys are right.
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Funny thing is you'd probably rather have two 9/9's than a single 30/30. However, it takes 2 turns so you can trade the first one and lose half it's health and gain som value in that regard, but the card is not competitive at all.
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On April 06 2016 02:52 Hellonslaught wrote:
I don't see why they can't make a card that actually pleases all of those players. I am not talking about competitive, i am talking about releasing only decent cards that can be played.
I never saw Voltron, not even once in casual mode in the last 2 expansions. People tried him about 1 week after release, then gave up.
Voltron is a bad card but was somewhat playable. The Ancient One is not even close to Voltron. So what's the point in making cards no one will use after a while? I mean, what's the point in making those "fun" cards so garbage? Why they can't be a bit stronger to a least be interesting?
If it is playable on a regular basis then it is easy to pull off: that means there are no real value for the Johnny player. The goal here is to pull up something that should not happen and that has only little chance to works.
Without those type of cards there would be no Trollden videos (look at how many of those are about Voltron or Executus, now there will also be some about the Ancient One).
Some people just like playing bad cards with huge potential payback and they like to play those Because they are inconsistent and not competitive, and they find fun in finding a way to actually make something out of it.
For example: Anyfin can happen was probably a huge blunder. We can imagine that it was supposed to be Timmy/Jhonny card but instead the player bases found a way to make it consistent and competitive, so it became a Spike card instead. So on the ladder, you never see a clunky, 1 chance out of 100 to works anyfin deck. It is not a fun card to deckbuild around for Johnny players anymore because it has already been resolved and the deck is already working.
For those type of cards to succeed in pleasing the type of players they are aiming for, one essential component is for them to NOT be competitive.
Plus whether you or me agrees with that philosophy has little impact. It was created by years of marketing and survey studies of magic the gathering and will drives the hearthstone design team decision whether we like it or not.
edit: I should not try to write that quickly a page of text that long in a language that is not my mother tongue. Corrected most of it to makes it hopefully more readable.
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United Kingdom31255 Posts
I think the important thing to note is there is a very big difference between The Ancient One which is a fun card that will never be playable and The Boogymonster which is a boring card and will never be playable.
Card games need these fun gimmicks to give you something to try and achieve during times where the meta is stale. Like right now every streamer is just playing stupid decks like Astral Communion Druid / Casino Priest / OTK Rogue etc etc and tbh its pretty hilarious to watch. However none of these decks are going to be viable on the ladder and thats okay as it makes these decks more fun when we do get to see them.
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There is a card in MTG that discards your hand and nothing else. No Deathwing-esq effect, all it does is that you have to discard your hand.
So yeah, these are certainly Timmy cards. However if someone pull it off I'm sure Trolden will get a clip of it.
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United Kingdom31255 Posts
On April 06 2016 03:09 WindWolf wrote:
There is a card in MTG that discards your hand and nothing else. No Deathwing-esq effect, all it does is that you have to discard your hand.
So yeah, these are certainly Timmy cards. However if someone pull it off I'm sure Trolden will get a clip of it.
One with Nothing was built because WotC wanted to see if any player would manage to find a use for it. However I do believe there are some "combos" you can do with it in a self mill deck. I also believe it was a side deck for Owling mines?
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I'm going to giggle when I get to swing in for 30 damage, I don't know about you guys.
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I guess if you want fun with this card, the most logical reason I can find that combo's at all with this, would be having a deck with 2xFaceless and themed on that. Since if it for God knows which reason the Blood survives, you can trade and then Faceless and do something else that would somehow save it. You have to be VERY wishful if you're gonna do anything like this.
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Thanks again for your futher explanation itchiko and Drazerk. All makes sense now.
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On April 06 2016 03:07 Drazerk wrote:
I think the important thing to note is there is a very big difference between The Ancient One which is a fun card that will never be playable and The Boogymonster which is a boring card and will never be playable.
Card games need these fun gimmicks to give you something to try and achieve during times where the meta is stale. Like right now every streamer is just playing stupid decks like Astral Communion Druid / Casino Druid / OTK Rogue etc etc and tbh its pretty hilarious to watch. However none of these decks are going to be viable on the ladder and thats okay as it makes these decks more fun when we do get to see them.
I totally agree. The Ancient One is really neat. It's obviously incredibly bad, requiring tons of setup to ever happen and being very easy to counter even if you do get it into play, but it's a cute idea, very flavorful, and provides an exciting goal for players to reach for that doesn't involve just winning games. Overall, I'd say I prefer Elise, who is fun, flavorful, and powerful without being overwhelming, but I'm prepared to accept cards that only get the first two.
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United Kingdom31255 Posts
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People arguing vehemently about how a card doesn't deserve to exist, because it won't be competitive, feels like a direct attack on my inner child. The set has plenty of competitive-looking cards, you don't get to bitch because 100% of the set doesn't cater to you.
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On April 06 2016 02:44 Silverspud wrote:
Aviana + Emp Thaurissan from a previous turn would make it happen for a Druid. Toss in a couple of Faceless Manipulators in the deck to make it more likely to pop up.
I'm Spike/Johnny so yeah i'm gonna try that
EDIT: just read this http://magic.wizards.com/en/articles/archive/making-magic/timmy-johnny-and-spike-2013-12-03 more carefully and I do own a deck with 4x Basking Rootwalla lol, Spike/Johnny confirmed for me
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None of you are thinking about the big picture.
The ULTIMATE Druid Wombo Combo:
Aviana + Innervate + Innervate + BotAO + BotAO + Faceless Manipulator + Faceless Manipulator.
For 7 cards and 13 mana you can summon 4 Blood of the Ancient Ones in one turn, which at end of turn will give you 2 Ancient Ones.
2 30 attack minions would be pretty hard to deal with. Many people play one BGH, but who's gonna have two. Muwahahahahahahahaha!!!! (Descends into madness)
Obviously hard to assemble all of those cards in your hand without dying, but that's not going to stop me. Timmys and Johnnys unite!
Edit: You can also of course play BotAO with conceal in Rogue for a nearly guaranteed Ancient One in two turns.
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On a funny side not, since the Ancient Ones token card is costed at 9, you can't use Recombobulator to "heal" it to full health like you can with Mountain Giant or Molten Giant.
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EPT
