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On March 31 2016 06:26 Hellonslaught wrote:
But who is going to run Twilight Drake when there is Mini-Mage as T4 play.
I'm gonna get some salve for Acritter's burn, lololol.
But seriously, Twilight Drake getting divine shield is nuts. Paladin would sometimes use Twilight Drake before GvG gave them all the stuff they wanted early on, maybe they'll start using him again.
Faceless Shambler should also get the divine shield buff then, right? That card just got better too. Really excited to play new paladin decks after the launch now.
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![[image loading]](http://static.mnium.org/images/contenu/actus/HearthStone/Extensions/teasing_extension_2016/Prophet_skeram.png)
I really think the name is a translation error.
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Edit: Name should be Skeram Cultist.
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Prophet Skeram sounds like it should be a legendary, so yeah, probably translation error. Solid card though, has the stats of Mech-Bear-Cat, I think it'll certainly see play in C'Thun decks. Not much more to say, it's nothing mind-blowing, it just fills a hole, sometimes that's all a card needs to do.
Also that really sucks about Redemption synergy, it could have gone either way really. Paladins won't have any shortage of decks to play, though, so I'm not really worried.
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United Kingdom31255 Posts
On March 31 2016 08:04 NewSunshine wrote:
Prophet Skeram sounds like it should be a legendary, so yeah, probably translation error. Solid card though, has the stats of Mech-Bear-Cat, I think it'll certainly see play in C'Thun decks. Not much more to say, it's nothing mind-blowing, it just fills a hole, sometimes that's all a card needs to do.
Also that really sucks about Redemption synergy, it could have gone either way really. Paladins won't have any shortage of decks to play, though, so I'm not really worried.
Name has already been confirmed by a blue post: https://www.reddit.com/r/hearthstone/comments/4cn75g/new_card/d1jpuzr
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So from what I can tell, cthun decks are basically going to just like play really straightfoward, very slightly underpowered minions, with the omnipresent risk of absolutely wrecking your world from turn 10 onwards. So the goal will be to try and over power them before cthun, or just focus on somehow surviving cthun and then winning with your superior card quality down the line
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On March 31 2016 08:35 Real_Joy wrote:
So from what I can tell, cthun decks are basically going to just like play really straightfoward, very slightly underpowered minions, with the omnipresent risk of absolutely wrecking your world from turn 10 onwards. So the goal will be to try and over power them before cthun, or just focus on somehow surviving cthun and then winning with your superior card quality down the line
yeah, it seems really stupid tbh.
i really don't want to fire any shots when i say this, but it honestly surprises me how many people struggle to understand card text. there are definitely some interactions in Hearthstone that are not quite clear, but most things can be clearly understood by taking the card text in the most literal way possible (same as MTG). a Twilight Drake is a 4/1 with a battlecry that increases its health by a certain amount dependent on a certain condition, so you obviously summon it as a 4/1, which triggers the effect of that new card and gives it divine shield. Redemption may seem like an inconsistent case going only by the wording of the card, admittedly, but a redempted minion displays its 1 point of health in red (unless it is actually a 1-health minion) and can be healed up to the full amount, so it is clearly not a 1-health minion.
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On March 31 2016 09:23 Schelim wrote:Show nested quote +On March 31 2016 08:35 Real_Joy wrote:
So from what I can tell, cthun decks are basically going to just like play really straightfoward, very slightly underpowered minions, with the omnipresent risk of absolutely wrecking your world from turn 10 onwards. So the goal will be to try and over power them before cthun, or just focus on somehow surviving cthun and then winning with your superior card quality down the line yeah, it seems really stupid tbh. i really don't want to fire any shots when i say this, but it honestly surprises me how many people struggle to understand card text. there are definitely some interactions in Hearthstone that are not quite clear, but most things can be clearly understood by taking the card text in the most literal way possible (same as MTG). a Twilight Drake is a 4/1 with a battlecry that increases its health by a certain amount dependent on a certain condition, so you obviously summon it as a 4/1, which triggers the effect of that new card and gives it divine shield. Redemption may seem like an inconsistent case going only by the wording of the card, admittedly, but a redempted minion displays its 1 point of health in red (unless it is actually a 1-health minion) and can be healed up to the full amount, so it is clearly not a 1-health minion.
It's easy to say all this after the interactions in question have been confirmed. We know that, in general, battlecries resolve before the minion is truly summoned, Mirror Entity copies the stats of Twilight Drake and Blackwing Technician, and whatever boosts they got from the battlecry. So when we're dealing with a new card that has a new type of interaction with 1-health minions, no, it isn't exactly clear. You can say well duh, just read the cards literally, but what if you did that, and it was confirmed to work exactly the opposite way? You could have been totally wrong, because these interactions deal with ambiguous corner-cases that haven't been broached until now. So feel free to step down.
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Wait, did literally nobody pick up on the dripping sarcasm involved in talking about Mini-Mage with regards to a card that seems to demand that it be played in an aggro deck? I mean, Mini-Mage of all cards? Should I start putting /s after posts that talk about the sheer overpowering strength of Tauren Warrior?
Probably for the best that it doesn't mega-combo with Redemption, though. Oh, and the 6-drop is probably too expensive to be worth playing, especially when it has the added downside of dying to things like Fireball. Goodness knows I want more for 6.
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On March 31 2016 09:45 Acritter wrote:
Wait, did literally nobody pick up on the dripping sarcasm involved in talking about Mini-Mage with regards to a card that seems to demand that it be played in an aggro deck? I mean, Mini-Mage of all cards? Should I start putting /s after posts that talk about the sheer overpowering strength of Tauren Warrior?
Probably for the best that it doesn't mega-combo with Redemption, though. Oh, and the 6-drop is probably too expensive to be worth playing, especially when it has the added downside of dying to things like Fireball. Goodness knows I want more for 6.
It is a threatening body for 6 mana. Blizzard's starting to catch on that if you want aggro decks to pay attention to your board, that board needs to be capable of doing some real damage, like with Justicar or Ethereal Conjurer, this card is along the same line. If you use BGH on it, then you're not using it on C'Thun, and if you're using Fireball on it, you're not using it on my face, so I'm perfectly happy to eat whatever removal you've got lined up for it, considering I've already got the payoff of a +2/+2 on my C'Thun. It's a solid midgame threat, it'll probably see play for that.
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On March 31 2016 09:23 Schelim wrote:Show nested quote +On March 31 2016 08:35 Real_Joy wrote:
So from what I can tell, cthun decks are basically going to just like play really straightfoward, very slightly underpowered minions, with the omnipresent risk of absolutely wrecking your world from turn 10 onwards. So the goal will be to try and over power them before cthun, or just focus on somehow surviving cthun and then winning with your superior card quality down the line yeah, it seems really stupid tbh. i really don't want to fire any shots when i say this, but it honestly surprises me how many people struggle to understand card text. there are definitely some interactions in Hearthstone that are not quite clear, but most things can be clearly understood by taking the card text in the most literal way possible (same as MTG). a Twilight Drake is a 4/1 with a battlecry that increases its health by a certain amount dependent on a certain condition, so you obviously summon it as a 4/1, which triggers the effect of that new card and gives it divine shield. Redemption may seem like an inconsistent case going only by the wording of the card, admittedly, but a redempted minion displays its 1 point of health in red (unless it is actually a 1-health minion) and can be healed up to the full amount, so it is clearly not a 1-health minion.
Well to be fair there are contradictions in HS;
- Druid of the Claw and Ancient of War read exactly the same, yet for some reason one is a buff and the other is a transformation.
- Major inconsistencies with "at the end of your turn" cards. Remember the old self-reviving Kel'Thuzad vs Ragnaros glitch, and now for some reason Explosive Sheep and Poison Seeds is now a board clear when it wasn't before.
- Avenge been able to buff a minion that has been reduced to 0 health.
Lets be honest, HS card text is very intuitive, but it is never absolute, so it's no wonder people question it.
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On March 31 2016 09:56 Greendotz wrote:Show nested quote +On March 31 2016 09:23 Schelim wrote:On March 31 2016 08:35 Real_Joy wrote:
So from what I can tell, cthun decks are basically going to just like play really straightfoward, very slightly underpowered minions, with the omnipresent risk of absolutely wrecking your world from turn 10 onwards. So the goal will be to try and over power them before cthun, or just focus on somehow surviving cthun and then winning with your superior card quality down the line yeah, it seems really stupid tbh. i really don't want to fire any shots when i say this, but it honestly surprises me how many people struggle to understand card text. there are definitely some interactions in Hearthstone that are not quite clear, but most things can be clearly understood by taking the card text in the most literal way possible (same as MTG). a Twilight Drake is a 4/1 with a battlecry that increases its health by a certain amount dependent on a certain condition, so you obviously summon it as a 4/1, which triggers the effect of that new card and gives it divine shield. Redemption may seem like an inconsistent case going only by the wording of the card, admittedly, but a redempted minion displays its 1 point of health in red (unless it is actually a 1-health minion) and can be healed up to the full amount, so it is clearly not a 1-health minion. Well to be fair there are contradictions in HS; - Druid of the Claw and Ancient of War read exactly the same, yet for some reason one is a buff and the other is a transformation. - Major inconsistencies with "at the end of your turn" cards. Remember the old self-reviving Kel'Thuzad vs Ragnaros glitch, and now for some reason Explosive Sheep and Poison Seeds is now a board clear when it wasn't before. - Avenge been able to buff a minion that has been reduced to 0 health. Lets be honest, HS card text is very intuitive, but it is never absolute, so it's no wonder people question it.
like i kind of alluded to, there are definitely inconsistencies in Hearthstone's rules (even though one of the examples you give you immediately admit was a glitch yourself), and perhaps it is true that i didn't choose the right time to say this (also as a reply to Acritter). it was intended as more of a general comment, as i see even streamers or casters not understand much more straightforward interactions from time to time (and i don't mean forgetting having spellpower on the board when you Auchenai/Circle or something, which, while potentially a game-losing mistake, is admittedly an easy one to forget about).
about the Cthulhu decks, i honestly think they look very boring judging by what has been announced so far. it seems that you basically have to play some kind of control/combo deck that plays a bunch of somewhat underwhelming minions that are nothing but a body which buffs another body you want to play in the future, which then nukes the shit out of everything. not exactly the most exciting interaction i've ever seen.
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On March 31 2016 09:37 NewSunshine wrote:Show nested quote +On March 31 2016 09:23 Schelim wrote:On March 31 2016 08:35 Real_Joy wrote:
So from what I can tell, cthun decks are basically going to just like play really straightfoward, very slightly underpowered minions, with the omnipresent risk of absolutely wrecking your world from turn 10 onwards. So the goal will be to try and over power them before cthun, or just focus on somehow surviving cthun and then winning with your superior card quality down the line yeah, it seems really stupid tbh. i really don't want to fire any shots when i say this, but it honestly surprises me how many people struggle to understand card text. there are definitely some interactions in Hearthstone that are not quite clear, but most things can be clearly understood by taking the card text in the most literal way possible (same as MTG). a Twilight Drake is a 4/1 with a battlecry that increases its health by a certain amount dependent on a certain condition, so you obviously summon it as a 4/1, which triggers the effect of that new card and gives it divine shield. Redemption may seem like an inconsistent case going only by the wording of the card, admittedly, but a redempted minion displays its 1 point of health in red (unless it is actually a 1-health minion) and can be healed up to the full amount, so it is clearly not a 1-health minion. It's easy to say all this after the interactions in question have been confirmed. We know that, in general, battlecries resolve before the minion is truly summoned, Mirror Entity copies the stats of Twilight Drake and Blackwing Technician, and whatever boosts they got from the battlecry. So when we're dealing with a new card that has a new type of interaction with 1-health minions, no, it isn't exactly clear. You can say well duh, just read the cards literally, but what if you did that, and it was confirmed to work exactly the opposite way? You could have been totally wrong, because these interactions deal with ambiguous corner-cases that haven't been broached until now. So feel free to step down.
It's not as complicated as your making it. Summon minion, trigger on-summon effects but don't apply them, apply battle cries, apply on-summon effects. It's buried now but it's all in the hearthstone science videoI posted here and other places.
In fact your own example of Mirror Entity is exactly why a minion that ends up with more than 1 hp would get Divine Shield. Same deal with Hobgoblin and the old Warson Commander. I guess if you ever played those decks this isn't that odd or edge-case since it's always(?) worked the same.
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On March 31 2016 09:50 NewSunshine wrote:Show nested quote +On March 31 2016 09:45 Acritter wrote:
Wait, did literally nobody pick up on the dripping sarcasm involved in talking about Mini-Mage with regards to a card that seems to demand that it be played in an aggro deck? I mean, Mini-Mage of all cards? Should I start putting /s after posts that talk about the sheer overpowering strength of Tauren Warrior?
Probably for the best that it doesn't mega-combo with Redemption, though. Oh, and the 6-drop is probably too expensive to be worth playing, especially when it has the added downside of dying to things like Fireball. Goodness knows I want more for 6. It is a threatening body for 6 mana. Blizzard's starting to catch on that if you want aggro decks to pay attention to your board, that board needs to be capable of doing some real damage, like with Justicar or Ethereal Conjurer, this card is along the same line. If you use BGH on it, then you're not using it on C'Thun, and if you're using Fireball on it, you're not using it on my face, so I'm perfectly happy to eat whatever removal you've got lined up for it, considering I've already got the payoff of a +2/+2 on my C'Thun. It's a solid midgame threat, it'll probably see play for that.
The problem is, 6 mana is a really high-value slot. If this were a 6/5 for 5, I would say it was excellent, because there's not a ton of competition there with Sludge Belcher, Healbot, and Loatheb moving out. Even in Wild, it would be an acceptable choice over the big three. This fella is going to have to convince us that he's better than Sylvanas and Thaurissan at the very least, and possibly also Entomb, Cabal, Siphon Soul, Shieldmaiden in Wild, Justicar, Cairne, Reno if you want to be crazy, and The Black Knight. Hell, even Sunwalker has some things going for it. I'm not taking C'thun Secret Pally seriously as an option. Given that the kind of midrange deck we have in question is most likely going to be loath to run even three 6-mana cards, this guy is going to have to try real hard to fit in. If other decks have loose enough focus to not badly punish this deck for making a non-threatening turn 6 play (contrast with the other cards, which either strongly change the game state, demand an answer, or are Cairne), the card could be quite good. As-is, I'm getting the queasy feeling that he'll get hit with Ice Lance, Thaurissan will come down, and things will go extremely badly at high speeds. After all, barring some more targeted nerfs, Freeze Mage is only losing Mad Scientist.
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On March 31 2016 09:45 Acritter wrote:
Wait, did literally nobody pick up on the dripping sarcasm involved in talking about Mini-Mage with regards to a card that seems to demand that it be played in an aggro deck? I mean, Mini-Mage of all cards? Should I start putting /s after posts that talk about the sheer overpowering strength of Tauren Warrior?
Probably for the best that it doesn't mega-combo with Redemption, though. Oh, and the 6-drop is probably too expensive to be worth playing, especially when it has the added downside of dying to things like Fireball. Goodness knows I want more for 6.
I was being a sarcastic ass but ended up giving an "actual answer" regarding Mini Mage  That said Tauren Warrior is OP
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On March 31 2016 09:45 Acritter wrote:
Wait, did literally nobody pick up on the dripping sarcasm involved in talking about Mini-Mage with regards to a card that seems to demand that it be played in an aggro deck? I mean, Mini-Mage of all cards? Should I start putting /s after posts that talk about the sheer overpowering strength of Tauren Warrior?
And you just have been leveled. Welcome to Liquid foruns. HF.
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new card seems pretty underwhelming, only place for it is in a c'thun deck and even there it will just fit as a filler. wouldn't be surprised if people will try to circumvent him even in c'thun decks (his stat distribution is just horrible for dealing with c'thun deck weakness). Upside of this card though, is the possibility to make your c'thun value even more consistent and earlier: you trade minion value for c'thun value (tbh if all c'thun buffers would have good value by themselves the deck would become horribly OP)
At first thought the divine shield twilight seemed really op. on second thought though, the drake usually ends up being silenced and killed by a ping or 1/1 token. in this situation the divine shield wont be of any help. steward will probably need more minions targets in your deck to be viable, which often have low cost, ending up with a small hand, compensating in lesser health for the drake. For these reasons i think drake steward interaction won't be that bad (or good if you are playing it),
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Steward is a very good paladin card in wild, maybe even broken. Haunted creeper, muster, justicar-heropower, quartermaster making 3-3s with devine shield....
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On March 31 2016 18:38 Slydie wrote:
Steward is a very good paladin card in wild, maybe even broken. Haunted creeper, muster, justicar-heropower, quartermaster making 3-3s with devine shield....
It also costs 3, which is basically the only underpopulated mana slot for Paladin.
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United Kingdom31255 Posts
On March 31 2016 18:55 Dromar wrote:Show nested quote +On March 31 2016 18:38 Slydie wrote:
Steward is a very good paladin card in wild, maybe even broken. Haunted creeper, muster, justicar-heropower, quartermaster making 3-3s with devine shield.... It also costs 3, which is basically the only underpopulated mana slot for Paladin.
Gives a none control alternative to Aldor at the very least
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EPT
