EPTWhat do you know about Brazil ? - Page 10
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TheFoReveRwaR
United States10657 Posts
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lokiM
United States3407 Posts
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Shuray
Brazil642 Posts
On June 19 2009 17:33 Mista wrote: I know cogu,btt,fnx,kiko and mibr and g3x =p I studied in the same school as cogu did, Colégio São José, at Liberdade neighborhood (Liberdade is a Japonese-like neighborhood http://pt.wikipedia.org/wiki/Liberdade_(distrito_de_São_Paulo)) in São Paulo-SP...he played football really well, he actually would turn into a professional player, he was playing in the base team of São Paulo, one of the most tradional football team in Brazil if wasn't for CS. | ||
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Shuray
Brazil642 Posts
On June 24 2009 07:16 InfeSteD wrote: notice I spelled Brasil with an S.. cuz of english but I know its Brazil lol Actually we Brazillians use Brasil with S, you're right dude  When speaking english we spell with Z | ||
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danieldrsa
Brazil523 Posts
On June 24 2009 10:30 VIB wrote: Not sure if you even deserve me, replying to you, since you make some really really dumb senseless accusations out of nothing. (no, I'm not a FHC supporter.... ¬¬) Normally I would just say "google it you worthless ignorant" and ignore it. But this link was bookmarked anyway, so lucky you: http://www.cic.unb.br/docentes/pedro/trabs/entrevistaTP.html Now you talk serious, thats better. Anyway, very nice interview. Ive bookmarked it to read it more carefully later. However this you wrote: - That all famous international election pooling companies officially quit making election pools in Brazil because every election is rigged and their pooling results are always inaccurate. Is a bit exagerated. On the great majority of places, the pools were the same as the official results. I think this guy only not had more attention because Lula won and its undeniable the majority of the people support him (as i said i hate them all). When the elections get cheated, them he will gain more attention by the media. | ||
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VIB
Brazil3567 Posts
 danieldrsa, read it, google it, etc. Our electronic voting machines have been proven fraudulent since it's conception. Contrary, to what you believe, our elections are joked about anywhere else in the world and our machines have already being banned from all the 40 countries that experimented it. Actually the company that manufactors it (DIEBOLD) have even been sued for it in the US. It have been on the media. There's info about it all around the internet. Just look it up yourself. http://votoseguro.org/ | ||
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D10
Brazil3409 Posts
for isntance, I used to live in Macae, and my father knew a mayor candidate over there. Well, after the elections were over, said candidate was visited by some kind of corrupt government hack specialized in rigging the machines. He offered his services but it was too late, he had already worked for the other candidate and the election was over lol. On the other hand, at least its damn fast =p | ||
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VIB
Brazil3567 Posts
On June 25 2009 05:23 D10 wrote: The last presidential election in Paraguay has had it's final result out faster than ours does. (granted it's a much smaller pool of voters, but you get the idea, our elections were only so slow before because of bureaucracy in most part) And it's done using traditional method. Because they tried our machines once, found flaws on it, and banned it for being bad. This video shows an underground test done by them to prove the brazilian voting machines are easily fraudable:On the other hand, at least its damn fast =p And that's a country that brazillians loves to mock, because of their high corruption Many brazillians political parties have asked TSE to allow for third parties to do this same test or similar to prove our machines are actually safe. But they deny it. Doing such is against the brazilian law. And as I said in my first post in this thread. Some parties tried to change those laws because they deem it unfair. But the ones who judge rather those are fair or not are the same ones who created those laws in the first place. Which is against the tri-partition of power that is the core of what a modern democratic republic is. This doesn't happen anywhere else in the world. Ask anyone here what they would think if their election system was run and administered by the judiciary power. That would be ridiculous and would turn into a media scandal. But here in Brazil, you prolly never even heard about it | ||
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Revabug
United Kingdom147 Posts
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danieldrsa
Brazil523 Posts
On June 25 2009 04:52 VIB wrote: danieldrsa, read it, google it, etc. Our electronic voting machines have been proven fraudulent since it's conception. Contrary, to what you believe, our elections are joked about anywhere else in the world and our machines have already being banned from all the 40 countries that experimented it. Actually the company that manufactors it (DIEBOLD) have even been sued for it in the US. It have been on the media. There's info about it all around the internet. Just look it up yourself. http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=0CFFogJqeKU http://votoseguro.org/ Like you can see in my previous post, i said i believe in it. However, as i said, because the press polls were the same as the final results everywhere, this argument lost power. Its a matter of time until we get a big scandal on one election. But until there, nothing will be done. Our voting machines are not fraudulent, as they are only machines, they are fraudable. Our elections are not mocked all around the world. You can say that of the machine system. Indeed, if you frequently read international realtionship press, you will know that now we have one of the most prestigious president of modernity, and the moment Brasil is living is reckonized all around the world. (as i said, i dont like him, its just a fact) The simple fact Lula won after so many years of PSDB on power is a testament to this. Our democracy is respected everywhere. (reiterating im against all politicians, its again a fact) On June 25 2009 05:49 VIB wrote: The last presidential election in Paraguay has had it's final result out faster than ours does. (granted it's a much smaller pool of voters, but you get the idea, our elections were only so slow before because of bureaucracy in most part) And it's done using traditional method. Because they tried our machines once, found flaws on it, and banned it for being bad. This video shows an underground test done by them to prove the brazilian voting machines are easily fraudable: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=dO5o6fObHYQ And that's a country that brazillians loves to mock, because of their high corruption Many brazillians political parties have asked TSE to allow for third parties to do this same test or similar to prove our machines are actually safe. But they deny it. Doing such is against the brazilian law. And as I said in my first post in this thread. Some parties tried to change those laws because they deem it unfair. But the ones who judge rather those are fair or not are the same ones who created those laws in the first place. Which is against the tri-partition of power that is the core of what a modern democratic republic is. This doesn't happen anywhere else in the world. Ask anyone here what they would think if their election system was run and administered by the judiciary power. That would be ridiculous and would turn into a media scandal. But here in Brazil, you prolly never even heard about it Being a lawyer i must say i dont see any problem in the election system being run by the judiciary. And no, this is not the motive of a media scandal. Our democratic system is different from the US (Common Law). We dont have elections for judges and prosecutors like them, and if you ask they will say our system is strange. I find election to judges very strange. You got a very good article, but put some bad arguments of yours with it. Thats all. | ||
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VIB
Brazil3567 Posts
On June 25 2009 10:33 danieldrsa wrote: I'm not gonna respond to the rest because it's completely irrelevant if you don't understand this. Look it is really really simple:Being a lawyer i must say i dont see any problem in the election system being run by the judiciary. And no, this is not the motive of a media scandal. - Separation of powers were created so one power can audit the other http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Separation_of_powers as a lawyer, you know this and agree with this up to this point right? - ok, so in Brazil the election is run by one of the 3 powers: the judiciary - which one of the 3 powers can audit them? According to brazilian law: the judiciary - the judiciary audits: themselves - therefore, our elections are legally: unverifiable, not auditable You understand this, right? You still cannot see anything, possibly, wrong with this? | ||
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danieldrsa
Brazil523 Posts
On June 25 2009 15:45 VIB wrote: I'm not gonna respond to the rest because it's completely irrelevant if you don't understand this. Look it is really really simple: - Separation of powers were created so one power can audit the other http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Separation_of_powers as a lawyer, you know this and agree with this up to this point right? - ok, so in Brazil the election is run by one of the 3 powers: the judiciary - which one of the 3 powers can audit them? According to brazilian law: the judiciary - the judiciary audits: themselves - therefore, our elections are legally: unverifiable, not auditable You understand this, right? You still cannot see anything, possibly, wrong with this? Sorry, but i already made my point. You saw your argument of Judiciary-driven election is bad and now try to discuss with me the separation of powers theory citing Wikipedia. Wikipedia is nothing, try to cite it on academic book and youll get what it deserves. Try to cite autors like J.J. Canotilho, Ingo Sarlet, José Afonso da Silva, Hans Kelsen among others. Im doing post graduation on State Law and can write a 50 page thread about this theme, but its useless. This scheme you put is nothing more than a wrong statement, the theme is hugely more complex than that. Its enough to say to you that, if Legislative dont like the way it is, they have the power to change it. They simply dont have enough competence (in the bad sense) to do. They have power to do an impeachment of a STF minister if they wish. So dont say the elections are completely unverifiable, not auditable, especially after the creation of the CNJ. This may sound hard, but please dont take it offensivelly as i have nothing against you, but you are talking about a theme i know very well and trying to justify it using wikipedia. | ||
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VIB
Brazil3567 Posts
http://www.pdt.org.br/diversos/acaourna.htm But guess what. Our elections have are not and have not been run under a law that we-might-change-to-someday. Our elections are run under the system described in the current law. As a lawyed, you know this right? And according to our current law: Our electoral system is unverifiable, TODAY. Because the TSE have both judiciary and legislative power in this country. "Lei 4.737/65 " Art. 152. As a lawyer, do you know that one? + Show Spoiler + "Lei 4.737/65 " Art. 152. Poderão ser utilizadas máquinas de votar, a critério e mediante regulamentação do Tribunal Superior Eleitoral." Nesta norma é evidente a delegação de poderes executivo e legislativo ao órgão judiciário. Por meio de atos normativos chamados Resoluções, o TSE define autonomamente todas as condições em que as fiscalizações são permitidas. E o TSE usa e abusa destes poderes acumulados como demonstram vários casos documentados. Um exemplo é o caso dos programas de computador fechados mantidos até hoje dentro das urnas eletrônicas. O Art. 66 da Lei 9.504/97 dizia que os partidos, como fiscais, tinham direito ao conhecimento antecipado de todos os programas de computador utilizados, mas a Secretaria de Informática do TSE decidiu comprar parte dos programas sem exigir que os fornecedores abrissem os códigos-fonte (programa de computador em forma legível para auditoria) para a fiscalização. Em 2000, o PDT, partido liderado justamente por Leonel Brizola e bem no estilo "gato escaldado tem medo de água fria", impugnou os programas alegando que parte deles era mantida secreta, contrariando a lei. O presidente do TSE, Min. José Nery da Silveira, como chefe do executivo eleitoral era o responsável por cumprir a lei e apresentar os programas aos partidos. Enfim, era o "réu da impugnação". Mas foi também o relator e juiz deste processo e se auto-inocentou. Sobrepôs a lei dos direitos autorais à lei eleitoral, declarando que o TSE não precisaria mostrar aos fiscais os programas cujos direitos autorais não detinha! - http://www.brunazo.eng.br/voto-e/textos/poderes1.htm | ||
AltaiR_
Korea (South)922 Posts
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{ToT}Strafe
Thailand7026 Posts
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VIB
Brazil3567 Posts
On June 26 2009 09:11 {ToT}Strafe wrote: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Fernando_de_noronhaIf I want to go on vacation to Brazil, where should I go and what should I do? :D And go swim with the dolphins  That's where I'm going to on my honey moon ^^ | ||
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danieldrsa
Brazil523 Posts
On June 26 2009 07:34 VIB wrote: Daniel, I'm saying the current law does not allow for verification. Then you reply saying "but the senators can change the law". There is the whole point, That is where I'm trying to get at. We should change our laws, because the current one is bad. That is what the PDT are trying to accomplish since year 2000 and failed so far: http://www.pdt.org.br/diversos/acaourna.htm But guess what. Our elections have are not and have not been run under a law that we-might-change-to-someday. Our elections are run under the system described in the current law. As a lawyed, you know this right? And according to our current law: Our electoral system is unverifiable, TODAY. Because the TSE have both judiciary and legislative power in this country. "Lei 4.737/65 " Art. 152. As a lawyer, do you know that one? + Show Spoiler + "Lei 4.737/65 " Art. 152. Poderão ser utilizadas máquinas de votar, a critério e mediante regulamentação do Tribunal Superior Eleitoral." Nesta norma é evidente a delegação de poderes executivo e legislativo ao órgão judiciário. Por meio de atos normativos chamados Resoluções, o TSE define autonomamente todas as condições em que as fiscalizações são permitidas. E o TSE usa e abusa destes poderes acumulados como demonstram vários casos documentados. Um exemplo é o caso dos programas de computador fechados mantidos até hoje dentro das urnas eletrônicas. O Art. 66 da Lei 9.504/97 dizia que os partidos, como fiscais, tinham direito ao conhecimento antecipado de todos os programas de computador utilizados, mas a Secretaria de Informática do TSE decidiu comprar parte dos programas sem exigir que os fornecedores abrissem os códigos-fonte (programa de computador em forma legível para auditoria) para a fiscalização. Em 2000, o PDT, partido liderado justamente por Leonel Brizola e bem no estilo "gato escaldado tem medo de água fria", impugnou os programas alegando que parte deles era mantida secreta, contrariando a lei. O presidente do TSE, Min. José Nery da Silveira, como chefe do executivo eleitoral era o responsável por cumprir a lei e apresentar os programas aos partidos. Enfim, era o "réu da impugnação". Mas foi também o relator e juiz deste processo e se auto-inocentou. Sobrepôs a lei dos direitos autorais à lei eleitoral, declarando que o TSE não precisaria mostrar aos fiscais os programas cujos direitos autorais não detinha! - http://www.brunazo.eng.br/voto-e/textos/poderes1.htm VIB i agreed with you about the machines, and the fragility of the voting system. You posted a very nice link about it. You missed the point about my previous post. You said judiciary driven election is bad and it contradicts the separation of powers, so it should be mocked. This is your error. I said the law can be changed because you said this system is wrong, wich i disagree. You said the judiciary audit themselves, what i disagreed again, and put an example of how Legislative and Executive audit the Judiciary. You appear to be a person linked or that is well informed of politics, and im happy with that. However my point is not about politics, but about the law. And heres your problem. TSE does not have the judiciary and legislative power in this country. The TSE decisions could be argued in the Supreme Tribunal (STF), wich is superior. TSE has the power to regulate the elections but its secondary to the Congress. You said: the judiciary audit themselves. This is another problem. Its true since they judge, but false since the other powers control the judiciary in some way also, and judge them. About this link: http://www.brunazo.eng.br/voto-e/textos/poderes1.htm I say again, it has no juridic relevance. The solution is to put the power on the congress? The legislative? You are serious? If there is a prize to the most corrupt power it would certainly go to the legislative. Thi would make the things even worse. | ||
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Kim_Hyun_Han
706 Posts
i'm amazed that the ppl from other countries arent that misinformed haha some facts are: *in internet(specially mmorpgs) brazilian are a cancer, (items plx?heal me? br? puta,viado hahahaueh) *many hot girls lololol *country is not poor at all, the corruption here is the problem=/ *Education system is bad *do not ever talk about progaming here, seriously, not joking. *Reason tried to cheese Savior in wcg lolololol + Show Spoiler + *not hard to find communist wannabes in universities, burn them all i say | ||
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Amber[LighT]
United States5078 Posts
On June 20 2009 05:51 VarsityUser wrote: any races girls can be hot. The only two things i've learned in this thread is that brazil has a crappy government and that they are only known for the same thing every other spanish country is, soccer. /nutshell I'm talking about an overwhelming majority. They have natural beauty that other cultures couldn't dream of. Colombian girls have nothing on Brazilian girls, same as any other South American country... even Americans, Europeans have nothing on Brazilian girls at times. | ||
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haduken
Australia8267 Posts
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