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chobopeon
United States7342 Posts
On June 23 2009 18:58 Eniram wrote: lol dude. Are you seriously surprised? Nothing that has happened so far has surprised me Oh. Can you please predict how this will all turn out? I know I've been surprised with the stamina of the protesters. It's been amazing. | ||
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Rev0lution
United States1805 Posts
The most important thing for Iran is to not make this into another Tienanmen Square. What I don't find cool though is people in the media asking for U.S intervention. See, U.S intervention makes us look like opportunistic bastards. Because we pick and choose which country to intervene in. Not for some ideological sense of democracy and freedom but for profit. We have yet to intervene in Darfur and we certainly did not intervene in China or when Egypt rigged its elections with 80% victory for the incumbent. We didn't like democracy back when Hamas won the elections in palestine. So at best, our administration's sense of what is a democracy comes down to whether it helps to benefit our interests. It seems to me that if we are gonna spread democracy all over the world, then we should be consistent about it. Remember the Saudis? They have the most backwards laws against women. Raping your wife is legal in Saudi Arabia, but since they supply a lot of our oil we keep our mouths shut about it. | ||
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{CC}StealthBlue
United States41117 Posts
RT RTfrom Iran - We have just returned and outside the city sky is full of teh sounds of 'Allah Akbar' from ppls on balconys - #Iranelection RT from Iran: all hospitals is surrounded by militia to check why ppl going in - if gun or baton injury - they arrest and beat #iranelection State TV deems Neda's killing 'staged' http://bit.ly/19yAaO #iranelection #despicable #iran #neda BBC Iran and the UK both expelling one another's diplomats. | ||
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VIB
Brazil3567 Posts
On June 23 2009 13:21 L wrote: Isn't it clear that the Ayatollah is the one more interested in this and manipulating the election? Or am I missing something? This post seem way too simple for L's standards Question at this point isn't 'were there irregularities', but rather who's responsible for them, and who gains the most from it.  | ||
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ultramagnetics
Poland215 Posts
On June 24 2009 07:57 VIB wrote: Isn't it clear that the Ayatollah is the one more interested in this and manipulating the election? Or am I missing something? This post seem way too simple for L's standards These are elections not for the Ayatollah but for Ahmadinejad. I feel as if the Ayatollah is just stepping in, because he would rather have Ahmadinejad lead the country. If something the clear thing is that it was Ahmandinejad and his party manipulating the elections, possibly with the support of the Ayatollah... | ||
Mystlord
United States10264 Posts
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Clasic
Bosnia-Herzegovina1437 Posts
Edit : before anyone gets their pant's in a not, I don't want to google their fucking names, I'm just typing what they sound like | ||
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PaeZ
Mexico1627 Posts
On June 24 2009 09:58 Clasic wrote: Wait, I haven't been keeping up with the news, whats happening, wtfs up with the protests? I assume its something about mekmed mekmedinajahd staying in office when the people voted for moozekawi. Edit : before anyone gets their pant's in a not, I don't want to google their fucking names, I'm just typing what they sound like Read the first 5 pages of the thread? -_- | ||
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Clasic
Bosnia-Herzegovina1437 Posts
I knew it. | ||
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L
Canada4732 Posts
On June 24 2009 07:57 VIB wrote: Isn't it clear that the Ayatollah is the one more interested in this and manipulating the election? Or am I missing something? This post seem way too simple for L's standards You realize there are more countries than Iran interested in Iran, right? | ||
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VIB
Brazil3567 Posts
On June 24 2009 10:36 L wrote: Of course, but those would rather want the opposition to win, right?You realize there are more countries than Iran interested in Iran, right? I cannot imagine why would someone other than Ahmadinejad + Ayatollah to rig the elections for themselves. Maybe I'm not being creative enough? :S | ||
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Eniram
Sudan3166 Posts
On June 24 2009 04:56 choboPEon wrote: Oh. Can you please predict how this will all turn out? I know I've been surprised with the stamina of the protesters. It's been amazing. Theres a difference between not being surprised and predicting the future, lol. | ||
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arsonist
Canada80 Posts
On June 24 2009 10:38 VIB wrote: Of course, but those would rather want the opposition to win, right? I cannot imagine why would someone other than Ahmadinejad + Ayatollah to rig the elections for themselves. Maybe I'm not being creative enough? :S Khamenei has, at least in the public eye, remained aloof from politics for, like, 20 years, and even allowed a reformist politician (Khatami) to be elected in the past... why suddenly "rig the election" for himself, when he has been much safer standing above it all? He supports Ahmadinejad because ideologically, they're conservative... just like Grand Ayatollah Montazeri supports Mousavi because they're reformist. The Guardian Council will go with the Supreme Leader, because he appoints them. What Khamenei has to worry about is the Assembly of Experts (i.e. Rafsanjani) growing a pair and dismissing him, because it has never been done before. | ||
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L
Canada4732 Posts
Of course, but those would rather want the opposition to win, right? If you rig an election, you are 100% assured the ability to make it public. Rigging an election then getting someone to tattle about it is a surefire way to destabilize a country. I cannot imagine why would someone other than Ahmadinejad + Ayatollah to rig the elections for themselves. Maybe I'm not being creative enough? :S So now think about people who would like Iran destabilized, how much capability they have, the payoffs, the cost and the risk of getting caught. | ||
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Mooga
United States575 Posts
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Eniram
Sudan3166 Posts
On June 24 2009 11:23 L wrote: If you rig an election, you are 100% assured the ability to make it public. Rigging an election then getting someone to tattle about it is a surefire way to destabilize a country. So now think about people who would like Iran destabilized, how much capability they have, the payoffs, the cost and the risk of getting caught. Was there any one specific person making claims of fraud though? From what I remember it was the people as a whole realizing things didn't add up. I think most people realized it didn't make sense that Mousavi lost in his home town and the margin of victory was so great even though there were record numbers of new voters who would likely vote for Mousavi. | ||
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Xeris
Iran17695 Posts
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VIB
Brazil3567 Posts
On June 24 2009 11:23 L wrote: Does makes sense, the US could pull that off. But then Ahmadinejad should have no reason to fear a recounting. He denied the recounting himself. Plus the Ayatollah himself also denied recounting and told Mousavi to shut up and accept the results.If you rig an election, you are 100% assured the ability to make it public. Rigging an election then getting someone to tattle about it is a surefire way to destabilize a country. So now think about people who would like Iran destabilized, how much capability they have, the payoffs, the cost and the risk of getting caught. Any kind of rigging could be confirmed/denied with a recounting. If Ahmadinejad knew he didn't rig it himself, then he would just do it and be done with the protests. | ||
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Clasic
Bosnia-Herzegovina1437 Posts
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Xeris
Iran17695 Posts
On June 24 2009 11:51 VIB wrote: Does makes sense, the US could pull that off. But then Ahmadinejad should have no reason to fear a recounting. He denied the recounting himself. Plus the Ayatollah himself also denied recounting and told Mousavi to shut up and accept the results. Any kind of rigging could be confirmed/denied with a recounting. If Ahmadinejad knew he didn't rig it himself, then he would just do it and be done with the protests. They actually allowed a partial recount, Moussavi and Karroubi denied it. Honestly, a recount would do absolutely nothing. The government has had the ballots for over a week at this point. Even if they recounted and they found that Ahmadinejad won again, people would claim that the government just made fake ballots, etc... a recount would not solve anything. That's why Moussavi has rejected the idea of a partial recount. Only a total re-voting overseen by an impartial 3rd party would be sufficient, but it remains to be seen whether the government would do such a thing (probably not). | ||
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