EPTone time me and my friend both stole one each and were showing them to kids in our class later and they were all flipping out as if something crazy had happened then this girl told on us so we were forced to eat them and deny everything
easy game
Cracker taken hostage - Page 5
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Rekrul
Korea (South)17174 Posts
one time me and my friend both stole one each and were showing them to kids in our class later and they were all flipping out as if something crazy had happened then this girl told on us so we were forced to eat them and deny everything easy game | ||
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Ryot
Canada316 Posts
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Bill307
Canada9103 Posts
On July 11 2008 06:48 L wrote: Additionally; its not a cracker. Its called the host. If you went and started stealing menorahs from synagogues during passover, then saying "WHAT ITS ONLY A CANDLE STICK" you'd probably get a similar outrage, and people who knew nothing about judaism would probably go "rofl they're so angry over candles, dum morans". That's not a very good analogy. I think everyone would be pissed to have their candlesticks stolen, sacred or otherwise.  Seriously, though, the amount of attention this case is receiving is TOTALLY disproportionate with the nature of the crime. Kids steal things ALL THE TIME via shoplifting, etc. (With the outrage this is receiving, you'd think the kid stole the Priest's churchmobile or something.) People can't just assign arbitrary values to their possessions and require the rest of the world to abide by those values. If something is worth a little less or a little more to someone than usual, then it's right to respect that. But when something is grossly overvalued by someone, then it's generally wrong to respect that. E.g. imagine Proleague spoilers were so grossly overvalued that they weren't allowed to be posted for a month after the games were played. It would be stupid and wrong for us to agree with that even if some people truly believed it. I agree that what the kid did was wrong and that he should apologize. But if people are greatly offended and outraged by it, then that's just too bad: I have no sympathy for them. Edit: Obligatory bash.org: #17205 +(808)- [X] <Funk> Hey I have a question for your mother <zuKi> Sure thing, let me get her! <Funk> Ask her how many Communion wafers you'd have to eat to consume a whole Jesus | ||
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Lisk
Latvia376 Posts
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L
Canada4732 Posts
That's not a very good analogy. I think everyone would be pissed to have their candlesticks stolen, sacred or otherwise. Its a pretty damn good analogy. I'm fairly sure the issue wouldn't be the theft of a physical piece of property, but an item of religious value. Its fairly implicit in the theft that the person is disrespecting your belief system, period, which would be the primary source of anger, not the fact that someone stole a goddam candlestick. People can't just assign arbitrary values to their possessions and require the rest of the world to abide by those values. These aren't arbitrary values. Catholics didn't just magically decide that the host was magically important. The host is a symbol, much like a flag is a symbol, or the menorah is a symbol, or the kirpan is a symbol or the cookie monster is a symbol. Stealing the host, stealing the flag, stealing someone's kirpan or stealing a menorah is all the same thing. Its a direct assault on a symbol which people place value in. Kid fucked up. Period. If he did it out of ignorance, sure, I can understand people saying that he should get let off easy, but it really doesn't seem like he did. Its pretty obvious that this was fairly malicious. | ||
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HeadBangaa
United States6512 Posts
On July 11 2008 05:07 GeneralStan wrote: I think the Church has good right to be angry here. The Holy Communion (maybe indicated by the "holy" in front of it) is among the most holy rites in the Catholic religion. To take the cracker and not eat it is disrespecting that rite and the religion itself. Holding it "hostage" is infantile and extremely disrespectful I have to agree. This person was deliberately provoking them. No surprise, though; modern culture finds great humor in denegration and intolerance of wo they perceive to be "intolerant", usually, specifically, religions, and usually, specifically, Christianity. This is not about her "eating a cracker". They could see that they were being disrespected intentionally. If I wore white robes and a pointy hat to the Million Man March, and received a foul beating, who would you perceive as more unreasonable? Them or me? | ||
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randombum
United States2378 Posts
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Jibba
United States22883 Posts
On July 11 2008 09:35 L wrote: These aren't arbitrary values. Catholics didn't just magically decide that the host was magically important. The host is a symbol, much like a flag is a symbol, or the menorah is a symbol, or the kirpan is a symbol or the cookie monster is a symbol. Stealing the host, stealing the flag, stealing someone's kirpan or stealing a menorah is all the same thing. Its a direct assault on a symbol which people place value in. Symbols are arbitrary values. A symbol rests entirely on the group which has given it importance, which is based on an arbitrary perspective. Furthermore, there is no logic behind believing that a wafer is the host of Christ, only faith. I'm not saying it's wrong, but it is arbitrary. | ||
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kiero
Canada136 Posts
On July 11 2008 09:08 Bill307 wrote: But when something is grossly overvalued by someone, then it's generally wrong to respect that. E.g. imagine Proleague spoilers were so grossly overvalued that they weren't allowed to be posted for a month after the games were played. It would be stupid and wrong for us to agree with that even if some people truly believed it. I agree that what the kid did was wrong and that he should apologize. But if people are greatly offended and outraged by it, then that's just too bad: I have no sympathy for them. I can see where your going with that, but you also have to look at the context. If I made a site where a bunch of people gather and don't talk about proleague spoilers for a month, then so be it. But if someone were to come to my site, said my rule was stupid, and started spreading these spoilers everywhere, then I think we can both agree that person would be an asshole. It wouldn't be unreasonable if I were to become very upset. On the otherhand, I would say they may have over-reacted by trying to use physical force (considering we now live in a world where an accidental brush in an elevator can be seen as sexual harrasement). Despite how much of an asshole he was, that was not the way to react, especially when they are trying to preach love and compassion for everyone. | ||
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HeadBangaa
United States6512 Posts
On July 11 2008 09:49 Jibba wrote: Symbols are arbitrary values. A symbol rests entirely on the group which has given it importance, which is based on an arbitrary perspective. Furthermore, there is no logic behind believing that a wafer is the host of Christ, only faith. I'm not saying it's wrong, but it is arbitrary. It's not about being arbitrary or any other reasoning of the significance whatsoever of the cracker. Communion is an established instution that a particular group of people, however arbitrarily or reasonably or otherwise, hold as deeply important. It's not at all arbitrary as a practice; that could only be true if described not from their view, but your own. Communion is a known tradition based on a known idea. Even if you don't share those beliefs, I don't believe for a second that you can't understand the level of offense. | ||
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Jibba
United States22883 Posts
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Wizard
Poland5055 Posts
On July 11 2008 10:26 Jibba wrote: Which is why I didn't say it was wrong or right. The question I asked is would you condemn someone for attacking the church of scientology like this guy did? Yes. | ||
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NastyMarine
United States1252 Posts
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Mortality
United States4790 Posts
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Wizard
Poland5055 Posts
On July 11 2008 10:42 Mortality wrote: There should be a law that says you cannot start a thread asking people to discuss soemthing without first giving your own input. And a "that sucks" isn't input. he did give input but then he edited it out | ||
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pyrogenetix
China5098 Posts
dont fuck with them. you most likely will get killed. and they will most probably be able to get away with it. | ||
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MyLostTemple
United States2921 Posts
i remember being in class and asking my teacher over and over again to explain how the Eucharist became the body of Christ and she just couldn't make sense of it. that's probably because it doesn't make any sense at all. | ||
Klogon
MURICA15980 Posts
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alffla
Hong Kong20321 Posts
On July 11 2008 08:51 Rekrul wrote: its really sick how crazy catholics can be one time me and my friend both stole one each and were showing them to kids in our class later and they were all flipping out as if something crazy had happened then this girl told on us so we were forced to eat them and deny everything easy game rofl rekrul's stories hiilarious haha | ||
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Rekrul
Korea (South)17174 Posts
Ignorant stupid fat white folk with nothing better to do. | ||
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