Now that we have a new thread, in order to ensure that this thread continues to meet TL standards and follows the proper guidelines, we will be enforcing the rules in the OP more strictly. Be sure to give them a complete and thorough read before posting!
NOTE: When providing a source, please provide a very brief summary on what it's about and what purpose it adds to the discussion. The supporting statement should clearly explain why the subject is relevant and needs to be discussed. Please follow this rule especially for tweets.
Your supporting statement should always come BEFORE you provide the source.
On April 09 2025 16:27 iPlaY.NettleS wrote: Regarding the 104% tariff on China, the factories there will really be feeling the heat.Nobody is going to buy an iPhone if you could potentially get it 1000$+ cheaper in a month or two when the tariffs are gone.
What Trump should be doing now is negotiating trade deals with both Thailand and Vietnam.Do that and the stream of factories leaving China for those two countries becomes a flood forcing China to make a move.
Pretty huge gamble but those government jobs eliminated by DOGE aren't coming back so if he can replace those jobs with productive roles it'd be a huge win.
If Trump worked his ass off right now to get manufacturing into the US to replace the job cuts due to DOGE, those factories would open after Trump is out of office. Kind of a problem.
Not only DOGE cuts, he also would need to open up even more factories to replace the jobs currently being cut due to his trade war. Doesn't make sense for companies to retain factory workers to build widgets when the raw materials being imported to make those widgets are now prohibitively expensive. Many companies have already announced layoffs.
That flood of factories leaving China would also take years to get up and running. Do you really think factories are going to pick up and leave China for Thailand and Vietnam when the US will fold the second a non-imbecile takes office? So again, they'll do their best to weather the storm while the US suffers. Long term, they may diversify their manufacturing.
However, they also have an advantage over the USA. America is a huge market, but it's not China's only market. There is no global trade war. It's the USA versus everybody. Everybody else is still trading. In fact, they are making stronger trade deals with each other. China can dump their excess goods on Europe, Canada, Mexico, Australia, South America, Africa, and the rest of Asia for small losses or small profits. Not as lucrative as the US market, but they can stay afloat for quite awhile and
they know they just have to wait it out until there are riots in the streets in the US.
Also to be on topic: WTF is happening with the deportation case? The door feels open for Trump to just start throwing anyone he doesn't like in prisons far from any country they are a citizen of.
Also to be on topic: WTF is happening with the deportation case? The door feels open for Trump to just start throwing anyone he doesn't like in prisons far from any country they are a citizen of.
Its another frustrating example of laws only existing as-written without any consideration of intent.
As it currently stands, the US government can legally create a situation where someone is beyond their reach as a form of imprisonment. Somehow, delivering someone to a place where the person can't be tracked, against their will, is not the fault or responsibility of the government.
I think in this case there isn't much a court can or should do. The courts are there to uphold the law, and it's too late to do that. Expecting the courts to intervene in diplomacy with a foreign country is just not going to happen.
The gross miscarriage of justice happened before, when he was deported without due process. Heads should roll because of that. But that is not the court's place. That is congress' role, and they should probably be impeaching Kristi Noem (over this and about a billion other things, but definitely this). And congress is dropping the ball. They have been dropping the ball for ages, and they are definitely not changing that now.
Your next option is to stand up for your rights and protest. But you forgot how to do that too. So... gg.
We had riots when some lowlife got his neck kneeled on. Hell, we riot every time our local sports team wins the championship. The idea that we don't riot is ignorant. The problem is that as a country we don't give a shit about the rights of others, only our own. We're a selfish country. However, when we feel it ourselves, when we are the victim or see ourselves in the victim, that's when we blow.
People haven't really felt the pain of this shit yet. Numbers in a retirement account going down sucks, but doesn't hurt in the immediate and doesn't hurt people living paycheck to paycheck with no savings. When people can't afford basic shit due to mass inflation caused directly by tariffs, they'll feel it. If the tariffs keep up for long, it'll blow.
Poor choice of words and perfect way to skew what actually happened. Kind of pathetic and sickening, if we're being honest.
On April 09 2025 21:38 Timebon3s wrote: Yeah that's what I thought, but aren't politicians influenced by corporations? And if they suffer greatly for this, will this somehow impact their behaviour towards Trump?
They absolutely are.
The problem is that their support base is ride and die Trump. There is a reason why they fly Trump flags and not American flags. They for the most part don’t really care about their representative, Trump is the only person who can save America and he’s doing God’s work right now.
If they go against Trump, they’re in trouble in more than one way. Trump isn’t really known for forgiveness and decorum, he will absolutely send his crowd to harass any Republican that goes against him. If that harassment goes too far, well not Trump’s problem that representative shouldn’t have pissed off the wrong crowd.
So we’re in a world where Republicans just don’t want to do anything because they either love this shit, are terrified, or are in “fuck you got mine” mode. The end result is that America, a country that cried like a child the minute they collectively couldn’t get a hair cuts, is playing a game of chicken against China, a country that literally locked people inside for months on end for the greater good of the country.
On April 09 2025 18:01 Gorsameth wrote: Netanyahu went to Trump and kissed his ass, they agreed to a 0 for 0 tariff deal. A day later Trump changed his mind. Therefor it makes no sense for individual countries, or blocks of countries like the EU, to try and make a deal with Trump.
Trump needs his political 'wins' too. If the trade war escalates, there will definitely be countries trying to get out of the firing line as soon as possible.
On April 09 2025 16:27 iPlaY.NettleS wrote: Regarding the 104% tariff on China, the factories there will really be feeling the heat.Nobody is going to buy an iPhone if you could potentially get it 1000$+ cheaper in a month or two when the tariffs are gone.
What Trump should be doing now is negotiating trade deals with both Thailand and Vietnam.Do that and the stream of factories leaving China for those two countries becomes a flood forcing China to make a move.
Pretty huge gamble but those government jobs eliminated by DOGE aren't coming back so if he can replace those jobs with productive roles it'd be a huge win.
If Trump worked his ass off right now to get manufacturing into the US to replace the job cuts due to DOGE, those factories would open after Trump is out of office. Kind of a problem.
Not only DOGE cuts, he also would need to open up even more factories to replace the jobs currently being cut due to his trade war. Doesn't make sense for companies to retain factory workers to build widgets when the raw materials being imported to make those widgets are now prohibitively expensive. Many companies have already announced layoffs.
That flood of factories leaving China would also take years to get up and running. Do you really think factories are going to pick up and leave China for Thailand and Vietnam when the US will fold the second a non-imbecile takes office? So again, they'll do their best to weather the storm while the US suffers. Long term, they may diversify their manufacturing.
However, they also have an advantage over the USA. America is a huge market, but it's not China's only market. There is no global trade war. It's the USA versus everybody. Everybody else is still trading. In fact, they are making stronger trade deals with each other. China can dump their excess goods on Europe, Canada, Mexico, Australia, South America, Africa, and the rest of Asia for small losses or small profits. Not as lucrative as the US market, but they can stay afloat for quite awhile and
they know they just have to wait it out until there are riots in the streets in the US.
Also to be on topic: WTF is happening with the deportation case? The door feels open for Trump to just start throwing anyone he doesn't like in prisons far from any country they are a citizen of.
Also to be on topic: WTF is happening with the deportation case? The door feels open for Trump to just start throwing anyone he doesn't like in prisons far from any country they are a citizen of.
Its another frustrating example of laws only existing as-written without any consideration of intent.
As it currently stands, the US government can legally create a situation where someone is beyond their reach as a form of imprisonment. Somehow, delivering someone to a place where the person can't be tracked, against their will, is not the fault or responsibility of the government.
I think in this case there isn't much a court can or should do. The courts are there to uphold the law, and it's too late to do that. Expecting the courts to intervene in diplomacy with a foreign country is just not going to happen.
The gross miscarriage of justice happened before, when he was deported without due process. Heads should roll because of that. But that is not the court's place. That is congress' role, and they should probably be impeaching Kristi Noem (over this and about a billion other things, but definitely this). And congress is dropping the ball. They have been dropping the ball for ages, and they are definitely not changing that now.
Your next option is to stand up for your rights and protest. But you forgot how to do that too. So... gg.
We had riots when some lowlife got his neck kneeled on. Hell, we riot every time our local sports team wins the championship. The idea that we don't riot is ignorant. The problem is that as a country we don't give a shit about the rights of others, only our own. We're a selfish country. However, when we feel it ourselves, when we are the victim or see ourselves in the victim, that's when we blow.
People haven't really felt the pain of this shit yet. Numbers in a retirement account going down sucks, but doesn't hurt in the immediate and doesn't hurt people living paycheck to paycheck with no savings. When people can't afford basic shit due to mass inflation caused directly by tariffs, they'll feel it. If the tariffs keep up for long, it'll blow.
Poor choice of words and perfect way to skew what actually happened. Kind of pathetic and sickening, if we're being honest.
yes. to keep the picture painted going while adding key details:
the "low life" is now dead and in heaven. another black lives mattered and testament in an unjust system - especially towards minorities. the kneeler however kneels now for other men in prison. where the shield he once had, and which a higher authority took away from him due to his grave misconduct - will not protect him.
On April 09 2025 18:01 Gorsameth wrote: Netanyahu went to Trump and kissed his ass, they agreed to a 0 for 0 tariff deal. A day later Trump changed his mind. Therefor it makes no sense for individual countries, or blocks of countries like the EU, to try and make a deal with Trump.
Trump needs his political 'wins' too. If the trade war escalates, there will definitely be countries trying to get out of the firing line as soon as possible.
Countries tried to get out, Trump said "no I want this"
Netanyahu came to kiss Trumps ass and briefly they got a deal, then Trump went "we send Israel a lot of money, 0 for 0 tariff deal is not good enough". The EU came to Trump with a 0 for 0 deal, Trump is now saying the EU should send a yearly check for 'reparations'.
Trump is still living in a world where the trade deficit means the US sends a check every year to countries that don't buy enough American stuff and he wants to get a check back. No one is going to pay America for the privilege of being allowed to spend further money buying their goods.
As for the likely hood of Congress putting an end to this, the Senate already broke with Trump on this with Canada's tariffs. Ofc the House is a different matter but I think the odds of it happening are higher then Trump relenting on his own or the world deciding that America deserves reparations for decades of trade imbalance...
And yes my empathy has hit rock bottom, if America wants to burn then let it burn. The rest of the world can trade among themselves without the US, it will hurt but it will hurt a lot less then America trading with no one.
On April 09 2025 16:27 iPlaY.NettleS wrote: Regarding the 104% tariff on China, the factories there will really be feeling the heat.Nobody is going to buy an iPhone if you could potentially get it 1000$+ cheaper in a month or two when the tariffs are gone.
What Trump should be doing now is negotiating trade deals with both Thailand and Vietnam.Do that and the stream of factories leaving China for those two countries becomes a flood forcing China to make a move.
Pretty huge gamble but those government jobs eliminated by DOGE aren't coming back so if he can replace those jobs with productive roles it'd be a huge win.
If Trump worked his ass off right now to get manufacturing into the US to replace the job cuts due to DOGE, those factories would open after Trump is out of office. Kind of a problem.
Not only DOGE cuts, he also would need to open up even more factories to replace the jobs currently being cut due to his trade war. Doesn't make sense for companies to retain factory workers to build widgets when the raw materials being imported to make those widgets are now prohibitively expensive. Many companies have already announced layoffs.
That flood of factories leaving China would also take years to get up and running. Do you really think factories are going to pick up and leave China for Thailand and Vietnam when the US will fold the second a non-imbecile takes office? So again, they'll do their best to weather the storm while the US suffers. Long term, they may diversify their manufacturing.
However, they also have an advantage over the USA. America is a huge market, but it's not China's only market. There is no global trade war. It's the USA versus everybody. Everybody else is still trading. In fact, they are making stronger trade deals with each other. China can dump their excess goods on Europe, Canada, Mexico, Australia, South America, Africa, and the rest of Asia for small losses or small profits. Not as lucrative as the US market, but they can stay afloat for quite awhile and
they know they just have to wait it out until there are riots in the streets in the US.
Also to be on topic: WTF is happening with the deportation case? The door feels open for Trump to just start throwing anyone he doesn't like in prisons far from any country they are a citizen of.
Also to be on topic: WTF is happening with the deportation case? The door feels open for Trump to just start throwing anyone he doesn't like in prisons far from any country they are a citizen of.
Its another frustrating example of laws only existing as-written without any consideration of intent.
As it currently stands, the US government can legally create a situation where someone is beyond their reach as a form of imprisonment. Somehow, delivering someone to a place where the person can't be tracked, against their will, is not the fault or responsibility of the government.
I think in this case there isn't much a court can or should do. The courts are there to uphold the law, and it's too late to do that. Expecting the courts to intervene in diplomacy with a foreign country is just not going to happen.
The gross miscarriage of justice happened before, when he was deported without due process. Heads should roll because of that. But that is not the court's place. That is congress' role, and they should probably be impeaching Kristi Noem (over this and about a billion other things, but definitely this). And congress is dropping the ball. They have been dropping the ball for ages, and they are definitely not changing that now.
Your next option is to stand up for your rights and protest. But you forgot how to do that too. So... gg.
We had riots when some lowlife got his neck kneeled on. Hell, we riot every time our local sports team wins the championship. The idea that we don't riot is ignorant. The problem is that as a country we don't give a shit about the rights of others, only our own. We're a selfish country. However, when we feel it ourselves, when we are the victim or see ourselves in the victim, that's when we blow.
People haven't really felt the pain of this shit yet. Numbers in a retirement account going down sucks, but doesn't hurt in the immediate and doesn't hurt people living paycheck to paycheck with no savings. When people can't afford basic shit due to mass inflation caused directly by tariffs, they'll feel it. If the tariffs keep up for long, it'll blow.
Poor choice of words and perfect way to skew what actually happened. Kind of pathetic and sickening, if we're being honest.
Probably intentional choice of words. The problem with evaluating the character of the guy that the police murdered in the open in daylight on camera using state force and a mandate that we, as a society, gave them is that it absolutely doesn't matter. There's no right people for them to murder and wrong people to murder.
On April 09 2025 16:27 iPlaY.NettleS wrote: Regarding the 104% tariff on China, the factories there will really be feeling the heat.Nobody is going to buy an iPhone if you could potentially get it 1000$+ cheaper in a month or two when the tariffs are gone.
What Trump should be doing now is negotiating trade deals with both Thailand and Vietnam.Do that and the stream of factories leaving China for those two countries becomes a flood forcing China to make a move.
Pretty huge gamble but those government jobs eliminated by DOGE aren't coming back so if he can replace those jobs with productive roles it'd be a huge win.
If Trump worked his ass off right now to get manufacturing into the US to replace the job cuts due to DOGE, those factories would open after Trump is out of office. Kind of a problem.
Not only DOGE cuts, he also would need to open up even more factories to replace the jobs currently being cut due to his trade war. Doesn't make sense for companies to retain factory workers to build widgets when the raw materials being imported to make those widgets are now prohibitively expensive. Many companies have already announced layoffs.
That flood of factories leaving China would also take years to get up and running. Do you really think factories are going to pick up and leave China for Thailand and Vietnam when the US will fold the second a non-imbecile takes office? So again, they'll do their best to weather the storm while the US suffers. Long term, they may diversify their manufacturing.
However, they also have an advantage over the USA. America is a huge market, but it's not China's only market. There is no global trade war. It's the USA versus everybody. Everybody else is still trading. In fact, they are making stronger trade deals with each other. China can dump their excess goods on Europe, Canada, Mexico, Australia, South America, Africa, and the rest of Asia for small losses or small profits. Not as lucrative as the US market, but they can stay afloat for quite awhile and
they know they just have to wait it out until there are riots in the streets in the US.
Also to be on topic: WTF is happening with the deportation case? The door feels open for Trump to just start throwing anyone he doesn't like in prisons far from any country they are a citizen of.
Also to be on topic: WTF is happening with the deportation case? The door feels open for Trump to just start throwing anyone he doesn't like in prisons far from any country they are a citizen of.
Its another frustrating example of laws only existing as-written without any consideration of intent.
As it currently stands, the US government can legally create a situation where someone is beyond their reach as a form of imprisonment. Somehow, delivering someone to a place where the person can't be tracked, against their will, is not the fault or responsibility of the government.
I think in this case there isn't much a court can or should do. The courts are there to uphold the law, and it's too late to do that. Expecting the courts to intervene in diplomacy with a foreign country is just not going to happen.
The gross miscarriage of justice happened before, when he was deported without due process. Heads should roll because of that. But that is not the court's place. That is congress' role, and they should probably be impeaching Kristi Noem (over this and about a billion other things, but definitely this). And congress is dropping the ball. They have been dropping the ball for ages, and they are definitely not changing that now.
Your next option is to stand up for your rights and protest. But you forgot how to do that too. So... gg.
We had riots when some lowlife got his neck kneeled on. Hell, we riot every time our local sports team wins the championship. The idea that we don't riot is ignorant. The problem is that as a country we don't give a shit about the rights of others, only our own. We're a selfish country. However, when we feel it ourselves, when we are the victim or see ourselves in the victim, that's when we blow.
People haven't really felt the pain of this shit yet. Numbers in a retirement account going down sucks, but doesn't hurt in the immediate and doesn't hurt people living paycheck to paycheck with no savings. When people can't afford basic shit due to mass inflation caused directly by tariffs, they'll feel it. If the tariffs keep up for long, it'll blow.
Poor choice of words and perfect way to skew what actually happened. Kind of pathetic and sickening, if we're being honest.
Probably intentional choice of words. The problem with evaluating the character of the guy that the police murdered in the open in daylight on camera using state force and a mandate that we, as a society, gave them is that it absolutely doesn't matter. There's no right people for them to murder and wrong people to murder.
Touche. I wanted to give them the benefit of doubt but I am just now reminded of their post history, so you are more than likely correct. They'll probably claim it wouldn't have mattered if the person was white, they would have called a person being murdered on camera a "lowlife." Just disgusting behavior and mindset.
On April 09 2025 21:38 Timebon3s wrote: Yeah that's what I thought, but aren't politicians influenced by cooperations? And if they suffer greatly for this, will this somehow impact their behaviour towards Trump?
What are they gonna do?
Corporations main leverage is in getting someone elected, keeping someone in a job, and some juicy post-office lobbying gig somewhere.
Trump’s already elected. He’s not some long-term member of Congress
When he leaves office he’ll still be set for life financially. Maybe he won’t get a cushy seat on a board somewhere, or get 6 figures for speaking engagement, but he’ll be fine.
He can launch a crypto or something ridiculous like that and his fervent base will lap it up.
Much of corporate America, whether they put money where there mouth was or not was against Trump in both his electoral victories as well as his loss.
On April 09 2025 23:12 Timebon3s wrote: Yeah Trump obviously won't do shit, I was thinking more of the members of Congress. But I guess thats a long shot.
The Republicans made the same mistake as Democrats, though for different reasons. The older Republican establishment loathe Trump for the same reasons that absolutely everyone else does. He is obnoxiously, offensively, unbelievably stupid. Rex Tillerson is the kind of man the Republican establishment picked to overrule and babysit Trump as needed and generally advance the interests of Trump and the Republican agenda. He famously described Trump as a "fucking moron". Wikipedia has this
After leaving the Trump administration, Tillerson spoke to Bob Schieffer about his tenure: "It was challenging for me coming from the disciplined, highly process-oriented Exxon Mobil corporation . . . to go to work for a man who is pretty undisciplined, doesn't like to read, doesn't read briefing reports, doesn't like to get into the details of a lot of things, but rather just kind of says, 'This is what I believe.'"
Speaking to members and staffers of the House Foreign Affairs Committee in May 2019, Tillerson said he and Trump "shared a common goal: to secure and advance America's place in the world and to promote and protect American values," but he noted they do not share the same "value system." Asked to describe Trump's values, he replied, "I cannot."
They hate him but he brings in the votes and so they mistakenly thought they could have it both ways, they could combine his bombastic populism with their agenda. Amusingly the exact same justification that was used to give Hitler power, he's popular, sure, he's bombastic and says some fucked up things in his speeches but we'll surround him with our guys and moderate him.
After Jan 6 they thought he was done, they thought that nobody could come back from a naked violent coup attempt. They decided his voting base was orphaned and that they could pander to it, adopt it, and use it to get their own agenda through. All they needed to do was keep promoting the same bullshit Trump did and refuse to hold him accountable. Turns out he wasn't done.
That older Trump anti establishment has been purged from the Republican Party. Any remaining Republicans who speak out of turn will be immediately accused of wrongthink by a rabid social media driven base and discover that they've always been anti America and that everyone has always known that.
They let him through the door to their house, they refused to kick him out when they had the chance, and now he won't leave. Now he's insisting that it's actually his house, that it's always been his house, and he's filling it with his friends. Their moment is gone, it's not their house anymore. The choice now is between sleeping on the sofa and letting Trump's clown friends fuck them whenever they want or leaving to try to move in to the Democrat's house. For now they're mostly choosing to be Trump's bitch in the hope that he'll just leave one day and they can have their house back.
Just the announcement that he wants to build a golden dome, the wording being a superlative of the iron dome shows that the way he does things is infantilistic in a way.
It works with the older, conservative base that was raised to be highly nationalistic and supremacist.
Maybe the US collective identity under these core traits struggled with not being in the middle of the spotlight while the Russians attacked Ukraine. But they also believe it isn‘t their responsibility to defend European borders.
On April 09 2025 23:12 Timebon3s wrote: Yeah Trump obviously won't do shit, I was thinking more of the members of Congress. But I guess thats a long shot.
Yeah you make a fair point there, oversight in my part.
However, if corporate America pull support from many of these long-serving (in many cases), more traditional ‘establishment’ Republican types, what could plausibly happen is they just get replaced with the next generation of MAGA politicians.
You might just end up instead of a Congress of people too pussy to stand up to Trump, with a smattering of loyalists, to a Congress full of loyalists, with a smattering of non-lunatics.
Corporations have a metric fuck-ton of power, but they can’t control every outcome.
Today’s Brexit mention, but, for example by and large corporate Britain wanted to remain in the EU, and weren’t shy in throwing money around. Indeed, corporate Europe also preferred the prospect of us staying in, but it wasn’t enough to carry that particular day
On April 09 2025 23:12 Timebon3s wrote: Yeah Trump obviously won't do shit, I was thinking more of the members of Congress. But I guess thats a long shot.
Yeah you make a fair point there, oversight in my part.
However, if corporate America pull support from many of these long-serving (in many cases), more traditional ‘establishment’ Republican types, what could plausibly happen is they just get replaced with the next generation of MAGA politicians.
You might just end up instead of a Congress of people too pussy to stand up to Trump, with a smattering of loyalists, to a Congress full of loyalists, with a smattering of non-lunatics.
Corporations have a metric fuck-ton of power, but they can’t control every outcome.
Today’s Brexit mention, but, for example by and large corporate Britain wanted to remain in the EU, and weren’t shy in throwing money around. Indeed, corporate Europe also preferred the prospect of us staying in, but it wasn’t enough to carry that particular day
Russia spent a lot of money on social media manipulation on Brexit. The money wasn't just being spent one way, Prigozhin's Internet Research Agency was as much an arm of the Russian military as Wagner was.
It works with the older, conservative base that was raised to be highly nationalistic and supremacist.
Uhm, you might want to check the young vote. It never went as hard right as it did for Trump. The issue isn't "boomers", it's "everyone". If you want to categorize at all the most fitting category would probably be "white men".
"They engage in intellectual property theft," Navarro told CNBC, regarding Vietnam. "They have the biggest number of cases aside from China at the Department of Commerce on the dumping."
US government officials are yapping about IP theft by Vietnam. sigh. I wonder if they'll play that card with Canada? The Ice Cream shop in my neighbourhood where I grew up is a direct rip off of Dairy Queen..its called Dairy Cream. On the same block as this Ice Cream shop is "Flintstone Glass and Mirror" with a picture of Fred Flintstone on the sides of the maintenance trucks. The font of Flintstone Glass & Mirror is identical the Flintstones cartoon show. Video game arcades are filled with Arcade Cabinets built in Canada from scratch and are 100% pirated.
There is a way around all this though.
Half the fun of visiting the Toronto area is seeing all the blatant IP ripoffs that go unchecked. It seems like half the people use an IPTV ripoff service instead of standard cable.
On April 09 2025 23:12 Timebon3s wrote: Yeah Trump obviously won't do shit, I was thinking more of the members of Congress. But I guess thats a long shot.
Yeah you make a fair point there, oversight in my part.
However, if corporate America pull support from many of these long-serving (in many cases), more traditional ‘establishment’ Republican types, what could plausibly happen is they just get replaced with the next generation of MAGA politicians.
You might just end up instead of a Congress of people too pussy to stand up to Trump, with a smattering of loyalists, to a Congress full of loyalists, with a smattering of non-lunatics.
Corporations have a metric fuck-ton of power, but they can’t control every outcome.
Today’s Brexit mention, but, for example by and large corporate Britain wanted to remain in the EU, and weren’t shy in throwing money around. Indeed, corporate Europe also preferred the prospect of us staying in, but it wasn’t enough to carry that particular day
Russia spent a lot of money on social media manipulation on Brexit. The money wasn't just being spent one way, Prigozhin's Internet Research Agency was as much an arm of the Russian military as Wagner was.
A much more effective arm I’d argue. Insane bang for their buck.
My point was merely that what ‘the establishment’ wants it doesn’t necessarily always snap its fingers and get. But yeah you are correct
On April 09 2025 23:12 Timebon3s wrote: Yeah Trump obviously won't do shit, I was thinking more of the members of Congress. But I guess thats a long shot.
Yeah you make a fair point there, oversight in my part.
However, if corporate America pull support from many of these long-serving (in many cases), more traditional ‘establishment’ Republican types, what could plausibly happen is they just get replaced with the next generation of MAGA politicians.
You might just end up instead of a Congress of people too pussy to stand up to Trump, with a smattering of loyalists, to a Congress full of loyalists, with a smattering of non-lunatics.
Corporations have a metric fuck-ton of power, but they can’t control every outcome.
Today’s Brexit mention, but, for example by and large corporate Britain wanted to remain in the EU, and weren’t shy in throwing money around. Indeed, corporate Europe also preferred the prospect of us staying in, but it wasn’t enough to carry that particular day
Russia spent a lot of money on social media manipulation on Brexit. The money wasn't just being spent one way, Prigozhin's Internet Research Agency was as much an arm of the Russian military as Wagner was.
A much more effective arm I’d argue. Insane bang for their buck.
My point was merely that what ‘the establishment’ wants it doesn’t necessarily always snap its fingers and get. But yeah you are correct
Not posting to disagree, just to expand.
The establishment got exactly what they wanted with Brexit, it just wasn't the British establishment. Same with Trump. Real time dismantling of the American empire while the American establishment stand around and go "are we just going to let this happen, it feels like we're just letting this happen but we shouldn't".
History in the making, America is never going to recover from this and we're lucky enough to watch it happening in real time. We'll be able to dig up our old memes and help our grandkids with their school papers.
On April 09 2025 23:12 Timebon3s wrote: Yeah Trump obviously won't do shit, I was thinking more of the members of Congress. But I guess thats a long shot.
Yeah you make a fair point there, oversight in my part.
However, if corporate America pull support from many of these long-serving (in many cases), more traditional ‘establishment’ Republican types, what could plausibly happen is they just get replaced with the next generation of MAGA politicians.
You might just end up instead of a Congress of people too pussy to stand up to Trump, with a smattering of loyalists, to a Congress full of loyalists, with a smattering of non-lunatics.
Corporations have a metric fuck-ton of power, but they can’t control every outcome.
Today’s Brexit mention, but, for example by and large corporate Britain wanted to remain in the EU, and weren’t shy in throwing money around. Indeed, corporate Europe also preferred the prospect of us staying in, but it wasn’t enough to carry that particular day
Russia spent a lot of money on social media manipulation on Brexit. The money wasn't just being spent one way, Prigozhin's Internet Research Agency was as much an arm of the Russian military as Wagner was.
A much more effective arm I’d argue. Insane bang for their buck.
My point was merely that what ‘the establishment’ wants it doesn’t necessarily always snap its fingers and get. But yeah you are correct
Not posting to disagree, just to expand.
The establishment got exactly what they wanted with Brexit, it just wasn't the British establishment. Same with Trump. Real time dismantling of the American empire while the American establishment stand around and go "are we just going to let this happen, it feels like we're just letting this happen but we shouldn't".
History in the making, America is never going to recover from this and we're lucky enough to watch it happening in real time. We'll be able to dig up our old memes and help our grandkids with their school papers.
I think part of the problem people are having in processing all this is that they presume "American Corporations" have some actual loyalty to the US as a nation/empire. It's like we collectively forgot that these are the same people who constantly threaten to immediately leave the country if we tax them.
IP is a kinda stupid and selfish concept, except when someone successfully copies my text to make money.
But I estimate the risk of that at low, I did at least until someone got caught feeding chatbots with posters‘ personalities.
I like the concept of a robo mini-me existing, as long as I‘m aware of it. Fat chance, with the unregulated automatic harvest of internet material nowadays.
Data travels too quickly so claiming to be the owner of an original design/thought has become hard.
I haven‘t yet asked what Nikola Tesla, a childless man thinks of his name being used by an American pronatalist for example.
IP goes against the idea of a collective responsibility for the planet. A citation is the minimum requirement for monetization or publication of scientific literature. You can get a degree revoked for forgoing that.
As for white men being the issue behind Trumps election, sure.
I‘m unsure on whether the US will ever have a female president. It would help but is also hard to achieve with how addicted its public is to fanfare, show and macho antics. I believe most women would struggle with filling that role.
Social media in private hands with a lot of manipulation tools at their disposal has also become a burning issue.
On April 09 2025 23:12 Timebon3s wrote: Yeah Trump obviously won't do shit, I was thinking more of the members of Congress. But I guess thats a long shot.
Yeah you make a fair point there, oversight in my part.
However, if corporate America pull support from many of these long-serving (in many cases), more traditional ‘establishment’ Republican types, what could plausibly happen is they just get replaced with the next generation of MAGA politicians.
You might just end up instead of a Congress of people too pussy to stand up to Trump, with a smattering of loyalists, to a Congress full of loyalists, with a smattering of non-lunatics.
Corporations have a metric fuck-ton of power, but they can’t control every outcome.
Today’s Brexit mention, but, for example by and large corporate Britain wanted to remain in the EU, and weren’t shy in throwing money around. Indeed, corporate Europe also preferred the prospect of us staying in, but it wasn’t enough to carry that particular day
Russia spent a lot of money on social media manipulation on Brexit. The money wasn't just being spent one way, Prigozhin's Internet Research Agency was as much an arm of the Russian military as Wagner was.
A much more effective arm I’d argue. Insane bang for their buck.
My point was merely that what ‘the establishment’ wants it doesn’t necessarily always snap its fingers and get. But yeah you are correct
Not posting to disagree, just to expand.
The establishment got exactly what they wanted with Brexit, it just wasn't the British establishment. Same with Trump. Real time dismantling of the American empire while the American establishment stand around and go "are we just going to let this happen, it feels like we're just letting this happen but we shouldn't".
History in the making, America is never going to recover from this and we're lucky enough to watch it happening in real time. We'll be able to dig up our old memes and help our grandkids with their school papers.
I think part of the problem people are having in processing all this is that they presume "American Corporations" have some actual loyalty to the US as a nation/empire. It's like we collectively forgot that these are the same people who constantly threaten to immediately leave the country if we tax them.
Considering that many are internet based and outsource their production, data-centers and whatnot, it‘s a rational play from their pov when their entire job is to produce earnings.
The issue is more that money has lost its meaning as a measure of usefulness for society. You can earn money by doing silly things that objectively help no one, for example selling cigarettes.
Drifting off again. Meanwhile Ben N. openly supports Orban and his anti-EU and pro-Russia stance so it makes you wonder which side he is actually on… If only he knew how many Hungarians come to work here, but I think he does, he just doesn‘t give a shit.
On April 10 2025 00:23 KwarK wrote: History in the making, America is never going to recover from this and we're lucky enough to watch it happening in real time. We'll be able to dig up our old memes and help our grandkids with their school papers.
Even if true its not that big of a deal. Since 2014 a substantial % of Americans, both republican and democrat, stated Trump will wreck the country. Most should have an exit plan by now.
For 3 generations my family stayed around the same area because it was a great place to live for many reasons. The place went bad. We left. Again, not that big of a deal.
For people thinking the same place is going to be good forever is more laziness than anything else.
EPT
