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Now that we have a new thread, in order to ensure that this thread continues to meet TL standards and follows the proper guidelines, we will be enforcing the rules in the OP more strictly. Be sure to give them a complete and thorough read before posting! NOTE: When providing a source, please provide a very brief summary on what it's about and what purpose it adds to the discussion. The supporting statement should clearly explain why the subject is relevant and needs to be discussed. Please follow this rule especially for tweets. Your supporting statement should always come BEFORE you provide the source. If you have any questions, comments, concern, or feedback regarding the USPMT, then please use this thread: http://www.teamliquid.net/forum/website-feedback/510156-us-politics-thread | ||
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Mohdoo
United States15725 Posts
On May 29 2020 13:13 FueledUpAndReadyToGo wrote: Really weird decision to not arrest the officer immediately, giving room for tensions to escalate like this. This may explain that: https://www.reddit.com/r/publicfreakout/comments/gs3cc7 Police unions shouldn't exist. My hope is every police building within 100 miles is rubble by the end of tonight. | ||
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FueledUpAndReadyToGo
Netherlands30548 Posts
On May 29 2020 13:15 Zambrah wrote: In a USA where cops regularly kill black people with no consequences that decision doesn't seem that weird, really Well yes but this was no 'I felt threatened' ' I thought I saw him going for a gun' or 'didn't realize he accidentally suffocated while doing my chokehold'. This is straight up murder by sitting on his neck while the man slowly goes from saying he cant breathe to stop moving, with the bystanders giving the officers a play-by-play of how the man is getting killed. | ||
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ZerOCoolSC2
9010 Posts
Incremental change isn't the problem. It's that there is no change. There is nothing being done to protect people of color from living their lives in peace without being spooked every time they hear a siren wail. It's about leaders condoning actions of recorded murderers who happen to be officers being protected by a law that no person of color gets the same benefit of. The problem isn't incremental change and mass looting/rioting isn't going to solve the issue at hand. The problem is ultimately, they don't care about us or our livelihoods in the same degree that they value theirs. Take over the stations, but leave the communities at large out of it. EDIT: I'll say this: the live stream crew on ground are dedicated and it looks like they got some locals to help provide security as they report. | ||
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Mohdoo
United States15725 Posts
On May 29 2020 13:31 ZerOCoolSC2 wrote: If they kept it to the stations, sure. But it never ends there. I have friends that are like family in that city. If there's just wanton looting and rioting, it won't solve anything. Incremental change isn't the problem. It's that there is no change. There is nothing being done to protect people of color from living their lives in peace without being spooked every time they hear a siren wail. It's about leaders condoning actions of recorded murderers who happen to be officers being protected by a law that no person of color gets the same benefit of. The problem isn't incremental change and mass looting/rioting isn't going to solve the issue at hand. The problem is ultimately, they don't care about us or our livelihoods in the same degree that they value theirs. Take over the stations, but leave the communities at large out of it. EDIT: I'll say this: the live stream crew on ground are dedicated and it looks like they got some locals to help provide security as they report. I think MLK did a good job at capturing why the focus should never be the damage caused by riots but instead the people who caused decent people to riot. When you assume these people are fundamentally good people who are a victims of circumstance, the idea of riots are a tragedy for the participants, not just the city. These people shouldn't have had to do this. They should be sleeping, hanging out with family, enjoying their lives. Instead, they are driven to rage by this unbelievably injustice that happens every day. …I think America must see that riots do not develop out of thin air. Certain conditions continue to exist in our society which must be condemned as vigorously as we condemn riots. But in the final analysis, a riot is the language of the unheard. And what is it that America has failed to hear? It has failed to hear that the plight of the Negro poor has worsened over the last few years. It has failed to hear that the promises of freedom and justice have not been met. And it has failed to hear that large segments of white society are more concerned about tranquility and the status quo than about justice, equality, and humanity. And so in a real sense our nation’s summers of riots are caused by our nation’s winters of delay. And as long as America postpones justice, we stand in the position of having these recurrences of violence and riots over and over again. Social justice and progress are the absolute guarantors of riot prevention. | ||
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Gahlo
United States35165 Posts
Those who make peaceful revolution impossible will make violent revolution inevitable. - JFK | ||
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FueledUpAndReadyToGo
Netherlands30548 Posts
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ZerOCoolSC2
9010 Posts
On May 29 2020 14:01 Mohdoo wrote: I think MLK did a good job at capturing why the focus should never be the damage caused by riots but instead the people who caused decent people to riot. When you assume these people are fundamentally good people who are a victims of circumstance, the idea of riots are a tragedy for the participants, not just the city. These people shouldn't have had to do this. They should be sleeping, hanging out with family, enjoying their lives. Instead, they are driven to rage by this unbelievably injustice that happens every day. Don't mistake my words for not agreeing with you. I feel the protesters. I'm 100% with them. I'm not for destroying local businesses or housing. That's all I'm saying. | ||
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Zambrah
United States7393 Posts
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puppykiller
United States3137 Posts
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Mohdoo
United States15725 Posts
On May 29 2020 14:05 FueledUpAndReadyToGo wrote: Well thankfully Trump is defusing the situation now by saying he's ready to get the military and shoot everyone... https://twitter.com/realDonaldTrump/status/1266231100780744704 Perhaps the worst possible reaction Whyyyyyyyyyyyyyyyyyy did he have to say thugs. god fucking damn it | ||
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Emnjay808
United States10662 Posts
Sad thing is that some protestors will encourage destruction so that their voices will be heard. Sad that that’s their only (if one of the few) ways to expedite change. | ||
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Gahlo
United States35165 Posts
On May 29 2020 14:10 ZerOCoolSC2 wrote: Don't mistake my words for not agreeing with you. I feel the protesters. I'm 100% with them. I'm not for destroying local businesses or housing. That's all I'm saying. Then there's also the cops that go undercover to cause damage to make protestors look bad. https://old.reddit.com/r/PublicFreakout/comments/gsgwpm/video_proof_that_the_protesters_didnt_start_the/ | ||
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ZerOCoolSC2
9010 Posts
On May 29 2020 14:25 Gahlo wrote: Then there's also the cops that go undercover to cause damage to make protestors look bad. https://old.reddit.com/r/PublicFreakout/comments/gsgwpm/video_proof_that_the_protesters_didnt_start_the/ I saw something like that over on IG. You can't screen the protesters and you can't condemn the peaceful ones that are mixed in with bad actors. That's a given. I wish for once that with this evidence, there are charges brought against the cop for perpetrating a crime in order to inflame tensions that were already high. From top to bottom, there needs to be figurative heads rolling for this. If charges/arrests aren't made before the weekend, expect the city to continue burning. | ||
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Yurie
11970 Posts
On May 29 2020 14:35 ZerOCoolSC2 wrote: I saw something like that over on IG. You can't screen the protesters and you can't condemn the peaceful ones that are mixed in with bad actors. That's a given. I wish for once that with this evidence, there are charges brought against the cop for perpetrating a crime in order to inflame tensions that were already high. From top to bottom, there needs to be figurative heads rolling for this. If charges/arrests aren't made before the weekend, expect the city to continue burning. Wouldn't the simplest solution for this be that the FBI arrest the person suspected on manslaughter to calm it down? Then if they release him or not in a week is a different matter. | ||
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Starlightsun
United States1405 Posts
On May 29 2020 14:16 puppykiller wrote: Why has no one brought up voting? You can vote for local officials and an individual can run on police reform. It would be a very popular platform in Minneapolis even before this incident. People are acting like rioting is their last resort and it's a totally BS rationalization. It's simply that right now there's a ton of angry people with a ton of time on their hands and rioting is the fastest way to FEEL like your making a change. I'm so ashamed of the people around me who are supporting this. Too distant and removed perhaps? If my friend or family member had been callously murdered in broad daylight and the perpetrator was protected from arrest, I doubt that "you can eventually cast a vote in an election" would satisfy me at all. This might even extend to a fellow community member, if I felt our community was under threat. | ||
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ZerOCoolSC2
9010 Posts
On May 29 2020 14:38 Yurie wrote: Wouldn't the simplest solution for this be that the FBI arrest the person suspected on manslaughter to calm it down? Then if they release him or not in a week is a different matter. That would be the simplest way. But the issue is that there hasn't been anything 3 days after the fact. | ||
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Zambrah
United States7393 Posts
On May 29 2020 14:16 puppykiller wrote: Why has no one brought up voting? You can vote for local officials and an individual can run on police reform. It would be a very popular platform in Minneapolis even before this incident. People are acting like rioting is their last resort and it's a totally BS rationalization. It's simply that right now there's a ton of angry people with a ton of time on their hands and rioting is the fastest way to FEEL like your making a change. I'm so ashamed of the people around me who are supporting this. How long have police been killing black people for no good reason and getting away with it in the US? Politicians won't solve this issue, its often enough a national tragedy for a blip and then people just hush it away with the news cycle. Politicians wont change SHIT unless it benefits them, and I doubt they see much benefit in breaking up police unions. I'd also argue that rioting is DEFINITELY making more of a change than waiting to vote for some theoretical candidate who cares about police reform. One of those two things is actually doing something, the other is waiting for something to happen. The people in the US who are repeatedly being killed by the police don't have to wait to pray someone eventually maybe hopefully but probably not handles this in the squeaky cleanest way while people die waiting for it to maybe eventually probably not but hopefully happen. | ||
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GreenHorizons
United States23515 Posts
On May 29 2020 14:53 Zambrah wrote: How long have police been killing black people for no good reason and getting away with it in the US? Politicians won't solve this issue, its often enough a national tragedy for a blip and then people just hush it away with the news cycle. Politicians wont change SHIT unless it benefits them, and I doubt they see much benefit in breaking up police unions. I'd also argue that rioting is DEFINITELY making more of a change than waiting to vote for some theoretical candidate who cares about police reform. One of those two things is actually doing something, the other is waiting for something to happen. The people in the US who are repeatedly being killed by the police don't have to wait to pray someone eventually maybe hopefully but probably not handles this in the squeaky cleanest way while people die waiting for it to maybe eventually probably not but hopefully happen. No question this has put more pressure for the abundantly necessary radical changes in policing in 3 days than the Democratic party has in 3 decades imo. | ||
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puppykiller
United States3137 Posts
On May 29 2020 14:53 Zambrah wrote: How long have police been killing black people for no good reason and getting away with it in the US? Politicians won't solve this issue, its often enough a national tragedy for a blip and then people just hush it away with the news cycle. Politicians wont change SHIT unless it benefits them, and I doubt they see much benefit in breaking up police unions. I'd also argue that rioting is DEFINITELY making more of a change than waiting to vote for some theoretical candidate who cares about police reform. One of those two things is actually doing something, the other is waiting for something to happen. The people in the US who are repeatedly being killed by the police don't have to wait to pray someone eventually maybe hopefully but probably not handles this in the squeaky cleanest way while people die waiting for it to maybe eventually probably not but hopefully happen. Police sometimes get away with murder and sometimes do not. These riots aren't a response to a "not guilty" verdict and for this reason I would argue that this makes them premature. I understand the cops responsible haven't been arrested yet. They probably should have been, and they probably will be soon, but that isn't the same as "getting away with a crime" and in no way justifies burning a city. As I said people are angry now and thus unwilling to give due process and election a chance. Thus they are resorting to destruction because it gives them an instant FEELING of relief. I can understand why some people ended up going this route, but I don't think they can rationalize what they are doing as ethical. Running a campaign on police reform could be very popular in this city (especially after this incident) and would benefit a politician as it could make them a very appealing candidate. Electing a politician doesn't have to be the passive process you are characterizing it as. One can play an active role in the campaign process and influence the people in their communities to vote on particular issues. If you don't believe in this you are simply saying you don't believe in democracy. I agree with you that rioting can potentially make a faster change than voting. I think that is the only way in which rioting is a better means to an end considering that it can swiftly lead to more death and destruction. | ||
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Jockmcplop
United Kingdom9755 Posts
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