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Now that we have a new thread, in order to ensure that this thread continues to meet TL standards and follows the proper guidelines, we will be enforcing the rules in the OP more strictly. Be sure to give them a complete and thorough read before posting! NOTE: When providing a source, please provide a very brief summary on what it's about and what purpose it adds to the discussion. The supporting statement should clearly explain why the subject is relevant and needs to be discussed. Please follow this rule especially for tweets. Your supporting statement should always come BEFORE you provide the source. If you have any questions, comments, concern, or feedback regarding the USPMT, then please use this thread: http://www.teamliquid.net/forum/website-feedback/510156-us-politics-thread | ||
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Gorsameth
Netherlands21536 Posts
On December 15 2019 01:38 redlightdistrict wrote:To all of you thinking nothing would come of this because it "just a grope" and not rape. sexual assult = rape Terribly convenient of you to argue against a non existent position because no one said it was 'just a grope'.And people have already explained several times to you that not all sexual assault is rape. | ||
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Dangermousecatdog
United Kingdom7084 Posts
The amount in which any of your links writes that sexual assault is rape = 0 | ||
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WombaT
Northern Ireland24485 Posts
On December 15 2019 01:38 redlightdistrict wrote: The man who violated a female reporter on live live tv has finally been charged with sexual assault. https://www.yahoo.com/news/man-accused-slapping-reporters-bottom-095508603.html To all of you thinking nothing would come of this because it "just a grope" and not rape. sexual assult = rape Harvey Weinstien has reached a settlement on one of his charged without having to pay out any of his own money. It will be paid out by Miramax in bankruptcy proceedings https://www.nytimes.com/2019/12/11/us/harvey-weinstein-settlement.html Weinstien isnt out of the woods yet, but this settlement gives him a more favorabile chance of the other charges being settled and/or dismissed I said when you previously posted this that I’m not sure what debate you’re looking to stir here, but if you wished to expand on whatever I can’t figure out you’re saying by all means do so. I legitimately have no idea what wider point you’re trying to make in reposting these (vaguely) related stories without additional commentary. As per ‘just a grope’ nobody here actually said that. Myself I think it is important to tackle more ‘benign’ forms of sexual impropriety as well. Canvassing female friends, without probing particularly deeply few have reported rape but many (all) have reported sexual harassment of the unwanted touching/arse grabbing variety in the workplace or out in the town. A commonly reported frustration was being put in the position that made them extremely uncomfortable (one left her job), but the social pressure that to report someone when it was ‘just a laugh’ and fearing they’d be ostracised for doing so. It’s a problem basically all women have to varying degrees, unlike rape, but unlike rape it’s to a degree socially tolerated as ‘just having a laugh’ or whatever. There are also societal problems around rape absolutely, but an actual proven rapist is a social pariah. Is that the point you’re trying to make or, what? Well if not I at least made some kind of point relating to this. | ||
micronesia
United States24633 Posts
On December 15 2019 01:38 redlightdistrict wrote: The man who violated a female reporter on live live tv has finally been charged with sexual assault. https://www.yahoo.com/news/man-accused-slapping-reporters-bottom-095508603.html To all of you thinking nothing would come of this because it "just a grope" and not rape. sexual assult = rape It was not rape. Rape is different. Please do not post in this thread again until you correct yourself here. | ||
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JimmiC
Canada22817 Posts
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Sent.
Poland9139 Posts
I legitimately have no idea what wider point you’re trying to make in reposting these (vaguely) related stories without additional commentary. The wider point is to ridicule groups who tend to demand inadequate responses to mild offences and actions that aren't even offences. Or weren't until their "victim" realized they can make profit from them. I legitimately have no idea what he's trying to achieve by posting those stories in this thread. | ||
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Gahlo
United States35118 Posts
On December 15 2019 02:33 JimmiC wrote: Rape is a sexual assault Groping is a sexual assault Groping is not rape. Same as Apple is a Fruit Orange is a Fruit An Apple is not an Orange. I like to use squares and rectangles. All squares are rectangles, the same way all rapes are sexual assault, but not all rectangles are squares, the same way not all sexual assaults are rape. | ||
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Simberto
Germany11409 Posts
At least in the german language, a lot of my students refuse to ever learn the difference/additional requirements. | ||
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Gahlo
United States35118 Posts
On December 15 2019 03:27 Simberto wrote: You would be surprised to how many people "squares" and "rectangle" and "four sided figure" are the exact same thing. (is there really no more common word in english for an object consisting of 4 lines and 4 corners, but without any additional requirements to angles and so on). In fact, even google translate wants to translate the german "Viereck" meaning "four-sided figure" to "square", which is clearly a subtype of that. At least in the german language, a lot of my students refuse to ever learn the difference/additional requirements. You're looking for quadrilateral. | ||
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redlightdistrict
382 Posts
On December 12 2019 07:14 Nebuchad wrote: Since redlight wants to make no difference between groping and rape he probably feels in the same way that ostracization is the same as "two people said some stuff" This implys that the user is saying groping is different that rape, discounting the severity of the offense when they are the same. Smacking someone is violent act, Grabbing a girls ass is sexual act, a sexual act combined with violence is Rape. Even a board certified physician is on record saying Rape is a violent crime is combined with an sexual act. + Show Spoiler + Saying grope and rape are different is the justification rapists use to defend there actions and lessen their prison sentence, such as the 2015 Brock Turner case. https://www.leagle.com/decision/incaco20180808037 | ||
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WombaT
Northern Ireland24485 Posts
On December 15 2019 03:42 redlightdistrict wrote: This implys that the user is saying groping is different that rape, discounting the severity of the offense when they are the same. Smacking someone is violent act, Grabbing a girls ass is sexual act, a sexual act combined with violence is Rape. Even a board certified physician is on record saying Rape is a violent crime is combined with an sexual act. + Show Spoiler + https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=gBjIXCKtIxk Saying grope and rape are different is the justification rapists use to defend there actions and lessen their prison sentence, such as the 2015 Brock Turner case. https://www.leagle.com/decision/incaco20180808037 No this is preposterous. In your own post it says the ass grabber was charged with a misdemeanour. I’d make a ‘demean her’ pun but I’m above such things. He got charged for that because wow it’s almost like grabbing someone’s ass is treated differently from penetrative rape by both societal attitudes and the legal system. If I push my partner in the case of an argument, I’ll be treated rather differently than if I beat the living shit out of her. Hence why grievous bodily harm exists as an extension of assault. | ||
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micronesia
United States24633 Posts
On December 15 2019 03:42 redlightdistrict wrote: This implys that the user is saying groping is different that rape, discounting the severity of the offense when they are the same. Smacking someone is violent act, Grabbing a girls ass is sexual act, a sexual act combined with violence is Rape. Even a board certified physician is on record saying Rape is a violent crime is combined with an sexual act. + Show Spoiler + Saying grope and rape are different is the justification rapists use to defend there actions and lessen their prison sentence, such as the 2015 Brock Turner case. https://www.leagle.com/decision/incaco20180808037 You are temporarily banned from posting in this particular thread until you can speak more intelligently about serious topics like "rape" and stop derailing the thread. | ||
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Simberto
Germany11409 Posts
You can not just make up an incredibly stupid position, and then point at that position and say "Look at how stupid people who hold that position are!". That just doesn't work. | ||
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Nebuchad
Switzerland12061 Posts
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Dangermousecatdog
United Kingdom7084 Posts
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Falling
Canada11328 Posts
All murder would involve battery to some extent, but most battery is not murder. Collapsing those two categories into one would be a great disservice to the justice system. | ||
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JimmiC
Canada22817 Posts
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WombaT
Northern Ireland24485 Posts
On December 15 2019 06:24 JimmiC wrote: I think in this particular case its just far wrong politics. It almost feels backwards to explain what isn't rape. More often it is explaining that date rape, is rape. I mean is it always though? It’s an immensely complex issue tied into certain cultural norms around gender. A sober person taking advantage of a really drunk person then yes, but if you’re both hammered? I once arrived in Finland to visit my then girlfriend, had a house party to welcome me and was plied with traditional Finnish booze by her and her friends. Can’t remember the tipple but imagine liquorice in booze form. Next day had a lot of joking ‘oh you had fun last night’ comments, which i had zero idea what they were referring to initially as I’d zero memory of the previous evening. But I’m a guy, so my response is ‘oh cool I got laid’ and not a negative response, whereas the opposite may have been more problematic. There’s an underlying cultural bedrock on the issue that is pretty problematic. This absolutely isn’t saying women make false rape claims, more that women being chaste and loyal is still culturally embedded in society, so if women fall off that standard they will feel violated in a way that men are not. | ||
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iPlaY.NettleS
Australia4329 Posts
https://www.politico.com/news/2019/12/14/jeff-van-drew-change-parties-085036 “It was supposed to be bipartisan, it was supposed to be incontrovertible. It was supposed to be something that was always on the rarest of circumstances,” Van Drew told reporters about impeachment earlier this week. “Well it’s not bipartisan.” Republicans were excitedly touting the news on Saturday, describing it as a huge blow to Democrats' effort to impeach the president, which Trump and other GOP leaders have repeatedly decried as a "partisan witch hunt." The move is also certain to score major points with Trump, whose support could be crucial in a crowded GOP primary. Trump and Van Drew are expected to hold an event together next week, according to sources on Capitol Hill. | ||
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micronesia
United States24633 Posts
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