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Once again, as this is a sensitive topic and one that can cause a lot of unnecessary things to be said in the heat of the moment, be VERY careful about what you post. Think twice before actually stating something and please be considerate of anyone who may feel involved or affected. |
On July 15 2016 08:40 SK.Testie wrote:Show nested quote +On July 15 2016 08:35 stilt wrote:On July 15 2016 07:25 FiWiFaKi wrote:
I think pictures are fine to get people to understand the situation. More transparency is always good imo.
Curious to see what the reaction to this in France is going to be. No there are not fines, this is immoral, just to increase the spectacular in the back of dead people. I don't have to understand the situation by seeing corpses and every normal human being should not fall in this voyeurism. I agree with Fiwi. I think people actually need to see what violence does to people first hand, brutal violence. It's a shock, it's disgusting, and it has a very visceral reaction. But I think it's important people understand and see the results of violence. I partially believe this because I think liberals would be a little less rose coloured upon seeing a man smash another mans head in or cut his head off. To not look to me is to almost put your head in the sand and pretend it never happened for some people. It seems cowardly and a way to, "this doesn't involve me I just want things to go back to normal."
Yeah, you're right, society should make tv show about torture and stuff like because you must not "act cowardly".
A visceral reaction is not wished, people do not think after this and it has nothing to do with liberals and I will not argue against them by showing this even if I have no respect at all for their ideas.
And your second point is ridiculous, yes they're dead but there are livings too and those have some dignity and it is all about treating the dead with respect, this rapport that we have with death is one of the most important thing on human condition.
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Pardon my ignorance, but is there some political reason as to why it seems like so many of these attacks occur in France and not other European nations? Has France done more to "wrong" these people than other nations? Are they accepting many more immigrants?
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On July 15 2016 09:00 stilt wrote:Show nested quote +On July 15 2016 08:40 SK.Testie wrote:On July 15 2016 08:35 stilt wrote:On July 15 2016 07:25 FiWiFaKi wrote:
I think pictures are fine to get people to understand the situation. More transparency is always good imo.
Curious to see what the reaction to this in France is going to be. No there are not fines, this is immoral, just to increase the spectacular in the back of dead people. I don't have to understand the situation by seeing corpses and every normal human being should not fall in this voyeurism. I agree with Fiwi. I think people actually need to see what violence does to people first hand, brutal violence. It's a shock, it's disgusting, and it has a very visceral reaction. But I think it's important people understand and see the results of violence. I partially believe this because I think liberals would be a little less rose coloured upon seeing a man smash another mans head in or cut his head off. To not look to me is to almost put your head in the sand and pretend it never happened for some people. It seems cowardly and a way to, "this doesn't involve me I just want things to go back to normal." Yeah, you're right, society should make tv show about torture and stuff like because you must not "act cowardly". A visceral reaction is not wished, people do not think after this and it has nothing to do with liberals and I will not argue against them by showing this even if I have no respect at all for their ideas.
What did you think of the movies Saw. Or The Green Room. Or Human Centipede. Or The Serbian Film. Or Hostel? A lot of films get very bloody, graphic, and disturbing.
I'm not saying we should have a "Test your strength by seeing gross shit channel". But this is actually happening. This is real. People should be able to see what happened in their country, even if it's horrific. It is their choice. A choice to film it, a choice to see it.
On July 15 2016 09:02 Chewbacca. wrote:
Pardon my ignorance, but is there some political reason as to why it seems like so many of these attacks occur in France and not other European nations? Has France done more to "wrong" these people than other nations? Are they accepting many more immigrants?
If you listen to terrorists it's largely because of their role in the Libyan airstrikes. However seeing as terrorist attacks happen all across the west, (mostly France though) it's not JUST happening to them. They keep getting the majority of it though.
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On July 15 2016 08:25 Shield wrote:Show nested quote +On July 15 2016 08:21 AbouSV wrote:
As of yet, they are still unsure whether he was a 'lonely lunatic' or a 'motivated perpetrator'. How do you get guns and grenades if you're "lonely lunatic" though? It seems organised, so it can't be one person only.
Actually you can purchase pretty much all the important components to assemble grenades on the internet and the other stuff at ....Walgreens. 
Source
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Just learned the news few minutes ago. I'm disgusted, wanted to play some games but I closed everything and I am just watching the news 
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On July 15 2016 09:04 SK.Testie wrote:Show nested quote +On July 15 2016 09:00 stilt wrote:On July 15 2016 08:40 SK.Testie wrote:On July 15 2016 08:35 stilt wrote:On July 15 2016 07:25 FiWiFaKi wrote:
I think pictures are fine to get people to understand the situation. More transparency is always good imo.
Curious to see what the reaction to this in France is going to be. No there are not fines, this is immoral, just to increase the spectacular in the back of dead people. I don't have to understand the situation by seeing corpses and every normal human being should not fall in this voyeurism. I agree with Fiwi. I think people actually need to see what violence does to people first hand, brutal violence. It's a shock, it's disgusting, and it has a very visceral reaction. But I think it's important people understand and see the results of violence. I partially believe this because I think liberals would be a little less rose coloured upon seeing a man smash another mans head in or cut his head off. To not look to me is to almost put your head in the sand and pretend it never happened for some people. It seems cowardly and a way to, "this doesn't involve me I just want things to go back to normal." Yeah, you're right, society should make tv show about torture and stuff like because you must not "act cowardly". A visceral reaction is not wished, people do not think after this and it has nothing to do with liberals and I will not argue against them by showing this even if I have no respect at all for their ideas. What did you think of the movies Saw. Or The Green Room. Or Human Centipede. Or The Serbian Film. Or Hostel? I'm not saying we should have a "Test your strength by seeing gross shit". But this is actually happening. This is real. People should be able to see what happened in their country, even if it's horrific. It is their choice. A choice to film it, a choice to see it. Show nested quote +On July 15 2016 09:02 Chewbacca. wrote:
Pardon my ignorance, but is there some political reason as to why it seems like so many of these attacks occur in France and not other European nations? Has France done more to "wrong" these people than other nations? Are they accepting many more immigrants? If you listen to terrorists it's largely because of their role in the Libyan airstrikes. However seeing as terrorist attacks happen all across the west, (mostly France though) it's not JUST happening to them. They keep getting the majority of it though.
Not that's not, I will not agree to see the corpse of my mother on this condition, I will disagree seeing ppl making money with it and spreading in all the world some spectacular shits about her corpse, that's not about gust.
And I hated Saw, I don't understand the point at seeing the movies you quote, I like Clockdown Orange or the Korean movies which can be violents but making stuffs with only violence as marketing is pointless.
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On July 15 2016 09:10 stilt wrote:Show nested quote +On July 15 2016 09:04 SK.Testie wrote:On July 15 2016 09:00 stilt wrote:On July 15 2016 08:40 SK.Testie wrote:On July 15 2016 08:35 stilt wrote:On July 15 2016 07:25 FiWiFaKi wrote:
I think pictures are fine to get people to understand the situation. More transparency is always good imo.
Curious to see what the reaction to this in France is going to be. No there are not fines, this is immoral, just to increase the spectacular in the back of dead people. I don't have to understand the situation by seeing corpses and every normal human being should not fall in this voyeurism. I agree with Fiwi. I think people actually need to see what violence does to people first hand, brutal violence. It's a shock, it's disgusting, and it has a very visceral reaction. But I think it's important people understand and see the results of violence. I partially believe this because I think liberals would be a little less rose coloured upon seeing a man smash another mans head in or cut his head off. To not look to me is to almost put your head in the sand and pretend it never happened for some people. It seems cowardly and a way to, "this doesn't involve me I just want things to go back to normal." Yeah, you're right, society should make tv show about torture and stuff like because you must not "act cowardly". A visceral reaction is not wished, people do not think after this and it has nothing to do with liberals and I will not argue against them by showing this even if I have no respect at all for their ideas. What did you think of the movies Saw. Or The Green Room. Or Human Centipede. Or The Serbian Film. Or Hostel? I'm not saying we should have a "Test your strength by seeing gross shit". But this is actually happening. This is real. People should be able to see what happened in their country, even if it's horrific. It is their choice. A choice to film it, a choice to see it. On July 15 2016 09:02 Chewbacca. wrote:
Pardon my ignorance, but is there some political reason as to why it seems like so many of these attacks occur in France and not other European nations? Has France done more to "wrong" these people than other nations? Are they accepting many more immigrants? If you listen to terrorists it's largely because of their role in the Libyan airstrikes. However seeing as terrorist attacks happen all across the west, (mostly France though) it's not JUST happening to them. They keep getting the majority of it though. Not that's not, I will not agree to see the corpse of my mother on this condition, I will disagree seeing ppl making money with it and spreading in all the world some spectacular shits about her corpse, that's not about gust. And I hated Saw, I don't understand the point at seeing the movies you quote, I like Clockdown Orange or the Korean movies which can be violents but making stuffs with only violence as marketing is pointless.
People are allowed to enjoy those movies, and many people do (I am not one of them).
And you may disagree, but as far as I know, it's definitely legal when not showing the faces, and I don't know the inner workings, though I know it massively varies country to country. By all means, have your opinion, but telling people that they are not allowed to do it simply because you don't like it? There's not too many of those laws out there...
Anyway, Testie makes good points, and I agree especially with the fact that it's a system that the government and society in general does to move on with their lives and not get concerned about it. It does often seem that people are trying to get away from the realities, and in the same way how I think you learn a lot of hard lessons if you grow up poor or in crime, you learn other kinds of lessons through this.
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The reason atrocities must be documented is to make denial impossible.
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It never stops... and it never gets easier to hear about it. I'm speechless and unable to think about what should be done.
The worst part is knowing how many of those events are being avoided on top of all the ones that actually happen.
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are there any live news streams covering this
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On July 15 2016 09:26 Dr.Strangelove wrote:
The reason atrocities must be documented is to make denial impossible.
The most important point perhaps. There's a lot of conspiracies on things like Sandy Hook, Orlando, and so on because of there's no up close video of the attacks or the carnage.
On July 15 2016 09:30 CorsairHero wrote:
are there any live news streams covering this
It's UK only if you have a plug-in.
http://news.sky.com/watch-live
http://www.bfmtv.com/mediaplayer/live-video/ French stream
I'll try to find others if no one else brings a link.
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Police should infiltrate agents in salafi mosquees - whoever praises the attack should have a nice 'conversation' out of sight...
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thanks testie, link works
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On July 15 2016 09:27 Noocta wrote:
It never stops... and it never gets easier to hear about it. I'm speechless and unable to think about what should be done.
The worst part is knowing how many of those events are being avoided on top of all the ones that actually happen.
for the most part, what can be done is being done. Bad things happen. Bad people do bad things. A lot of work goes into trying to prevent them, but some happen anyways.
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On July 15 2016 09:34 SoSexy wrote:
Police should infiltrate agents in salafi mosquees - whoever praises the attack should have a nice 'conversation' out of sight...
They do do this and they try to work with and rely on people reporting in the Muslim community. It's not easy. There's at least two or three documentaries of hidden cameras inside UK mosques where they try to get close. I can't recall how much time they were undercover for. I think there's a documentary of a girl called "Aisha" who went undercover for at least a few months to a year. In each time they usually find the usual hate speech. "The Westerners are Kafirs etc." Which has to be a kick in the balls, because a larger % of them are on welfare. So you're paying for people to hate your guts. (Timeframe citation needed though)
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On July 15 2016 09:02 Chewbacca. wrote:
Pardon my ignorance, but is there some political reason as to why it seems like so many of these attacks occur in France and not other European nations? Has France done more to "wrong" these people than other nations? Are they accepting many more immigrants?
Few days ago Stealthblue posted this in the euro politics thread:
http://www.teamliquid.net/forum/viewpost.php?post_id=25831238
I'm ignorant too but to me it seems like security services in other European countries are simply better at prevention.
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On July 15 2016 09:26 FiWiFaKi wrote:Show nested quote +On July 15 2016 09:10 stilt wrote:On July 15 2016 09:04 SK.Testie wrote:On July 15 2016 09:00 stilt wrote:On July 15 2016 08:40 SK.Testie wrote:On July 15 2016 08:35 stilt wrote:On July 15 2016 07:25 FiWiFaKi wrote:
I think pictures are fine to get people to understand the situation. More transparency is always good imo.
Curious to see what the reaction to this in France is going to be. No there are not fines, this is immoral, just to increase the spectacular in the back of dead people. I don't have to understand the situation by seeing corpses and every normal human being should not fall in this voyeurism. I agree with Fiwi. I think people actually need to see what violence does to people first hand, brutal violence. It's a shock, it's disgusting, and it has a very visceral reaction. But I think it's important people understand and see the results of violence. I partially believe this because I think liberals would be a little less rose coloured upon seeing a man smash another mans head in or cut his head off. To not look to me is to almost put your head in the sand and pretend it never happened for some people. It seems cowardly and a way to, "this doesn't involve me I just want things to go back to normal." Yeah, you're right, society should make tv show about torture and stuff like because you must not "act cowardly". A visceral reaction is not wished, people do not think after this and it has nothing to do with liberals and I will not argue against them by showing this even if I have no respect at all for their ideas. What did you think of the movies Saw. Or The Green Room. Or Human Centipede. Or The Serbian Film. Or Hostel? I'm not saying we should have a "Test your strength by seeing gross shit". But this is actually happening. This is real. People should be able to see what happened in their country, even if it's horrific. It is their choice. A choice to film it, a choice to see it. On July 15 2016 09:02 Chewbacca. wrote:
Pardon my ignorance, but is there some political reason as to why it seems like so many of these attacks occur in France and not other European nations? Has France done more to "wrong" these people than other nations? Are they accepting many more immigrants? If you listen to terrorists it's largely because of their role in the Libyan airstrikes. However seeing as terrorist attacks happen all across the west, (mostly France though) it's not JUST happening to them. They keep getting the majority of it though. Not that's not, I will not agree to see the corpse of my mother on this condition, I will disagree seeing ppl making money with it and spreading in all the world some spectacular shits about her corpse, that's not about gust. And I hated Saw, I don't understand the point at seeing the movies you quote, I like Clockdown Orange or the Korean movies which can be violents but making stuffs with only violence as marketing is pointless. People are allowed to those movies, and many people do (I am not one of them). And you may disagree, but as far as I know, it's definitely legal when not showing the faces, and I don't know the inner workings, though I know it massively varies country to country. By all means, have your opinion, but telling people that they are not allowed to do it simply because you don't like it? There's not too many of those laws out there... Anyway, Testie makes good points, and I agree especially with the fact that it's a system that the government and society in general does to move on with their lives and not get concerned about it. It does often seem that people are trying to get away from the realities, and in the same way how I think you learn a lot of hard lessons if you grow up poor or in crime, you learn other kinds of lessons through this.
I say there were pointless, not that they should be prohibited.
Yeah I tell some ppl like you to not own fucking money on fresh corpses, how immoral I am! And I don't talk about laws but voyeurism.
And for fuck sake, you're not in France, people have been extremely shocked about attentats and they still extremely are, we are concerned by it and we feel concerned by it, go away with your assumptions seriously. Moreover, I could argue that you're shits banalize violence.
Well, I will just end any discussion with you, this is getting too absurd, this is not by seeing photos of dead people without the family permission that you will get more concerned, personally, the view of the photos of Bataclan victims given by their families when they were alive was enough for me but I guess I am weird.
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Is anyone else getting a little bit desensitized at this point? This is just another massacre in a long series of massacres. It is depressing but I find it hard to be shocked at this point
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On July 15 2016 09:56 radscorpion9 wrote:
Is anyone else getting a little bit desensitized at this point? This is just another massacre in a long series of massacres. It is depressing but I find it hard to be shocked at this point
I'm not sure if I'm desensitized, or just have a lot of perspective. Could be either really.
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EPT
