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On October 19 2019 08:50 iPlaY.NettleS wrote:Show nested quote +On October 18 2019 13:10 Artisreal wrote:On October 18 2019 08:26 iPlaY.NettleS wrote:On October 17 2019 22:33 ahswtini wrote: Juncker has ruled out granting an extension, reason being that there is now a deal that both sides have agreed to. Source? Also pointing out that financial Times has Johnson losing this by three votes and election map UK predicting a tied vote. Gonna be close. Election maps 311 for 311 against 11 non voters 13 unknown https://mobile.twitter.com/electionmapsuk/status/1184894286728499201 He said so in an interview. Adding that albeit it is not for him to decide but that he's of that opinion. I heard that part on the radio yesterday. Macron is now also saying the same thing. https://www.theguardian.com/politics/2019/oct/18/brexit-extension-unavoidable-if-mps-reject-deal-says-merkelShow nested quote +Macron told reporters: “I am not trying to read into the future but I do not think we shall grant any further delay. I think it is time to put an end to these negotiations and move on to the future relationship. And put to an end to what is currently ongoing. Pretty sure Macron was also against an extension the last time, and the time before that.
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On October 19 2019 08:53 Gorsameth wrote:Show nested quote +On October 19 2019 08:50 iPlaY.NettleS wrote:On October 18 2019 13:10 Artisreal wrote:On October 18 2019 08:26 iPlaY.NettleS wrote:On October 17 2019 22:33 ahswtini wrote: Juncker has ruled out granting an extension, reason being that there is now a deal that both sides have agreed to. Source? Also pointing out that financial Times has Johnson losing this by three votes and election map UK predicting a tied vote. Gonna be close. Election maps 311 for 311 against 11 non voters 13 unknown https://mobile.twitter.com/electionmapsuk/status/1184894286728499201 He said so in an interview. Adding that albeit it is not for him to decide but that he's of that opinion. I heard that part on the radio yesterday. Macron is now also saying the same thing. https://www.theguardian.com/politics/2019/oct/18/brexit-extension-unavoidable-if-mps-reject-deal-says-merkelMacron told reporters: “I am not trying to read into the future but I do not think we shall grant any further delay. I think it is time to put an end to these negotiations and move on to the future relationship. And put to an end to what is currently ongoing. Pretty sure Macron was also against an extension the last time, and the time before that. To be fair last time he agreed to the extension he said "I think this is the final, final deadline". Anyway, see what happens today and it will become clearer.
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I'd be rather suprised if the EU would have the UK crash out, it's all drumming support for the deal that BJ desperately needs
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On October 19 2019 16:36 Artisreal wrote: I'd be rather suprised if the EU would have the UK crash out, it's all drumming support for the deal that BJ desperately needs The EU doesn't want a crash, and would very much prefer this deal over no-deal. However, it would be even happier if the deal fails, elections happen followed by a referendum between the deal and remain and have remain win. Causing the UK to remain in the EU.
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Anyone listening to debate before vote on BoJo deal? I am. I kinda wish our parliment was this orderly.
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On October 19 2019 19:20 Silvanel wrote: Anyone listening to debate before vote on BoJo deal? Yeah, the amount of false information coming out of Johnson is... impressive.
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D day today. My money is on the deal getting passed. Letwin:nay Kyle:not relevant Deal:yay
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5930 Posts
You'd think fishing made up of 50% of the UK population and economy with how they're talking about it.
Also nice of Boris to admit that they haven't bothered to look at the impact of any Brexit deal. Its basically looking like that they want to exit the European Union first then figure everything out later, including the whole deal with Scotland, Northern Ireland and the Union in general. Which is definitely the best way of going about your day to day life...how the Brexit process is occurring is the same as some guy quitting their job, telling their family to not worry about mortgage and how everything will be OK because they're British and British are hard working winners.
You do have to wonder about the merits of the "democratic process" if this is the end result of it.
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Letwin amendment passes 322 vs 306, Boris is now required to ask for an extension. Vote on Boris's deal is now basically pointless. The dance will continue.
Boris saying he will not ask for a delay and claiming he is not required to do so.
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Why not just ask for an extension and let the EU refuse as promised?
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On October 19 2019 23:25 Sent. wrote: Why not just ask for an extension and let the EU refuse as promised? Because the EU likely isn't going to refuse and be responsible for a hard brexit that they have been working to avoid for the last 3 years.
I suspect the EU will wait to see what happens next week when parliament is supposed to vote on laws to implement Boris's deal. If those all pass then the UK leaves with Boris's deal, no extension needed.
If they fail I expect the opposition to address the EU to give an extension so they can hold elections, EU doesn't want a deal deal exit so they grant the extension, Vote of no confidence throws out Boris and the UK will have elections.
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I mean getting a refusal to force the parliament to choose between hard brexit and Boris deal.
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On October 19 2019 23:36 Sent. wrote: I mean getting a refusal to force the parliament to choose between hard brexit and Boris deal. The alternative is to grant an extension for an election which could lead to the UK remaining. 4-6 months of further uncertainty could be seen as preferable to the UK leaving with hard brexiteers at the helm.
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On October 19 2019 23:36 Sent. wrote: I mean getting a refusal to force the parliament to choose between hard brexit and Boris deal. They can simply wait with giving their answer to do that and I that is why I expect them not to give an answer until parliament has voted on the implementing laws. The EU can in theory wait until 22:30 on 31st October to give their answer on an extension.
Forcing parliament to chose between this deal and a hard brexit isn't in the EU's interest when they would ideally want remain. And they could have, but refused to, do this for May's deal which was technically better from the EU's perspective.
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I've gone through how various MP:s voted today and(from my limited knowledge of their leanings) the vote on the actual deal looks to be really really close. The great unknown, for me at least, is how the people who abstained today is going to vote. I think it will be key.
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United States40729 Posts
The EU shouldn't play chicken with idiots. If the other guy doesn't know that the train is dangerous it just can't end well.
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What appears to be happening to BJ at the moment, according to my humble interpretation of how things are going down in parliament ath the moment, is what could have happened to Trump if any of the republicans had any moral or spine or decency whatsoever. He's not pulling through on his lies, threats and tantrums. What a relief.
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actually the tories are doing pretty well in the polls
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