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On April 15 2013 16:44 Sephy90 wrote:Show nested quote +On April 15 2013 16:37 -Archangel- wrote:On April 15 2013 07:53 Tialuram wrote:Great ending in my opinion, felt a bit like "In Utter Darkness" mission from WoL campaign...with all the heroes dieing. Only thing I wish would have been different is Gannicus's end, but oh well. Guess someone had to die in a non heroic way to prove the point of defeat. ...I just really don't like to watch crucifixions  Well since you mentioned crucifixion, did anyone else notice they fracked it up with Agron, but then done it right afterwards? By that I mean, Agron was pierced through palms, while in real Rome it was done through wrists which is what they did to Gannicus. Yeah I was so confused when they did it wrong the first time but then corrected it the next time? Also crucifying Crassus' slave was cool. You could really see how well they depicted the horror on her face on that one. Also Caesar's actor.. had a weird looking expression on his face the entire series lol.
It was done deliberately the first time. They didn't mess up.
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On April 15 2013 16:37 -Archangel- wrote:Show nested quote +On April 15 2013 07:53 Tialuram wrote:Great ending in my opinion, felt a bit like "In Utter Darkness" mission from WoL campaign...with all the heroes dieing. Only thing I wish would have been different is Gannicus's end, but oh well. Guess someone had to die in a non heroic way to prove the point of defeat. ...I just really don't like to watch crucifixions  Well since you mentioned crucifixion, did anyone else notice they fracked it up with Agron, but then done it right afterwards? By that I mean, Agron was pierced through palms, while in real Rome it was done through wrists which is what they did to Gannicus. That makes me wonder, if Agron was pierced through his palms, would he have been able to hold a sword? Cause if it they nailed his wrists, then he wouldn't have.
Unless it was their intention to nail his wrists but they messed it up.
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On April 15 2013 16:46 Uncultured wrote:Show nested quote +On April 15 2013 16:44 Sephy90 wrote:On April 15 2013 16:37 -Archangel- wrote:On April 15 2013 07:53 Tialuram wrote:Great ending in my opinion, felt a bit like "In Utter Darkness" mission from WoL campaign...with all the heroes dieing. Only thing I wish would have been different is Gannicus's end, but oh well. Guess someone had to die in a non heroic way to prove the point of defeat. ...I just really don't like to watch crucifixions  Well since you mentioned crucifixion, did anyone else notice they fracked it up with Agron, but then done it right afterwards? By that I mean, Agron was pierced through palms, while in real Rome it was done through wrists which is what they did to Gannicus. Yeah I was so confused when they did it wrong the first time but then corrected it the next time? Also crucifying Crassus' slave was cool. You could really see how well they depicted the horror on her face on that one. Also Caesar's actor.. had a weird looking expression on his face the entire series lol. It was done deliberately the first time. They didn't mess up. How you know dat? But I wonder why they changed the way they nailed them.. sad the series has ended.. I wanted more!
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On April 15 2013 17:58 Sephy90 wrote:Show nested quote +On April 15 2013 16:46 Uncultured wrote:On April 15 2013 16:44 Sephy90 wrote:On April 15 2013 16:37 -Archangel- wrote:On April 15 2013 07:53 Tialuram wrote:Great ending in my opinion, felt a bit like "In Utter Darkness" mission from WoL campaign...with all the heroes dieing. Only thing I wish would have been different is Gannicus's end, but oh well. Guess someone had to die in a non heroic way to prove the point of defeat. ...I just really don't like to watch crucifixions  Well since you mentioned crucifixion, did anyone else notice they fracked it up with Agron, but then done it right afterwards? By that I mean, Agron was pierced through palms, while in real Rome it was done through wrists which is what they did to Gannicus. Yeah I was so confused when they did it wrong the first time but then corrected it the next time? Also crucifying Crassus' slave was cool. You could really see how well they depicted the horror on her face on that one. Also Caesar's actor.. had a weird looking expression on his face the entire series lol. It was done deliberately the first time. They didn't mess up. How you know dat? But I wonder why they changed the way they nailed them.. sad the series has ended.. I wanted more!
You can rewatch the scene, they voiced the reason for nailing his hands.
On April 15 2013 05:06 Vindicare605 wrote:Show nested quote +On April 15 2013 04:06 hpty603 wrote:On April 14 2013 23:48 Meiya wrote:+ Show Spoiler +IMPORTANT EDIT: This post was made while heavily under the influence of alcohol, but the writer of this post maintains his opinions no matter his level of intoxication.
The endless litany of praise for this show is forcing me to speak up: it's not just the loyal denizens of tl.net, it is sites that I expected to be more critical such as /tv/. I can't understand this, because I was a loyal fan of this show for the first two and a bit seasons and watched every episode since.
Spartacus was a terrible show. Blood and Sand was fanstastic for what it was, as was Gods of the Arena which stuck to a winning formula. Vengeance was the beginning of a moralising and historically insulting soap opera led by an actor that, while decent in the end, was not the man we grew to love. However, through a combination of lazy writing and incompetent research we ended up with the show that ended just recently, entertaining as it was in a sense.
The writers of this show moralised from a very early point, and while there is no evidence of Spartacus giving a single fuck about the plight of slaves in the Republic, it is just anachronistic, lazy and irrelevant work for the overpaid writers of this overrated show to suggest that slavery was this terrible evil when nobody in the day of Spartacus, even Spartacus himself, seemed to really care about the institution of slavery. This is not so much the fault of the show as the fault of terrible modern 'history' that shoves modern moralistic subjectivity down the throats of men and women that lived thousands of years ago, but it as painful as it is disappointing.
However: it is most important for me to point out how grossly irrelevant the events of this overacted series were to reality, and I will list the most frustrating:
-Crassus was not a gladiator-brawling, chivalrous 'leader by example': while courageous, Crassus became the lead man against Spartacus through a combination of cash up the sleeve to pay new legions and willingness to risk defeat against an enemy of such low repute as slaves: Rome certainly never feared they would lose their global influence to Spartacus and his slaves, and even their fear that Rome would be ravaged by Spartacus proved typical Roman paranoiae: to be frank, Spartacus had less chance to conquer Rome than did Alexander the Great. -Tiberius did not exist, Crassus had two real children and neither of them were named Tiberius nor did they bear any historical similarity to this fictional character -Caesar Dictator was too busy serving under Lucullus against Mithridates in the East to give a single fuck about Crassus' little war against slaves, and not only shared not a single character trait with the Caesar in the show but also did not share a single piece of historical similarity -Spartacus was never a crusader for the freedom of all slaves, modern historians with their liberal sensibilities have forced their own beliefs in regards to slavery into the mouth of Spartacus, who was a bad motherfucker but more of a bandit than an idealist, according to the sources. -MOST IMPORTANTLY OF ALL: Roman legions were not useless organisations that could not combat gladiators. Legions were the best fighting forces on earth before, during and after the 3rd Servile War. Legionaries made better soldiers than gladiators (this is not even arguable), they possessed superior discipline and therefore fighting power which is evident in their conduct in situations such as those faced by Caesar Dictator, where Roman legionaries were capable of executing complex manoeuvres in contact under any circumstances and against barbarian soldiers or other Roman soldiers. Nobody but Romans could do this, and examples are provided in Caesar's The Gallic Wars, where for example Caesar has a file of soldiers ambushed by Gauls and orders them to turn to battle, while his other files continue to march out of contact to reform and fight once they reach the flank of the enemy. If that sounds like gibberish it doesn't matter: these were tactical military manoevures that only Roman legionaries were capable of. Basically, Roman soldiers were not bad soldiers, but in fact they were the best soldiers on earth. -Man for man Roman legionaries, if not experienced killers above and beyond that of gladiators such as the soldiers of Pompey and other Roman governors in troublesome provinces, were certainly trained to a very similar standard as gladiators. Oh and gladiators rarely fought to the death in the Republic. -Legionaries did not fight with big spiky retarded spears that look like something straight out of 300: if you look up 'pilum', you'll notice that Roman infantrymen used spears in not only a completely dissimilar manner to that of 'spearmen' or 'hoplites', but also pilum were absolutely dissimilar to the sort of fictional spears depicted in Spartacus. -Watch the first minute or so of the first episode of HBO's Rome for an idea of how Roman soldiers actually fought, and why even excellent individual combatants like Spartacus' gladiators or German tribesman had no chance at all against a decently organised Roman army.
Goddamn I am not going to pretend I was not smashed and angry about my life when I made this post, but for the love of god the historical accuracy of this show in these areas (and a million other ways I probably forgot) is an incredible sore point I may never forget and I cannot ignore when people say this show was the best show ever. I'm a Classicist and historian. I really enjoyed Spartacus because it's impossible to watch a show expecting any shred of historical accuracy. Expect it to be completely incorrect and enjoy the nuggets of truth  (Though I will admit, some points of the show just pissed me off like Tiberius raping Caesar...) I'm as much an enthusiast of classic history as anyone here but I have to agree with this sentiment. Watching any kind of fictionalized cinema or television that depicts the ancient times and expecting it to be historically accurate is like expecting your burger at McDonald's to look like the picture. It's an unrealistic and naive expectation. Instead, take what the show does for what it is and judge it by its own merits. What I think of when I see Spartacus is a show that went from being NOTHING BUT gratuitous gore, violence and nudity to a show with characters and a plot I actually cared about. I came for one thing but I stayed because the writing was good enough to keep me there. I wasn't expecting to come into this show and witness the next great piece of cinema that'd be talked about for generations I came into it just looking for something entertaining that had to do with gladiators. What I got FAR exceeded my expectations and for me that means a whole lot.
Sure it cannot be expected of writers to follow history too closely, but I would have been satisfied with at least ONE thrown pilum. Just one...
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On April 15 2013 05:44 Djzapz wrote:Show nested quote +On April 15 2013 05:38 D10 wrote: Alas, it didnt happen, and I see this series as nothing more than a porn with plot. That's a lot more shallow than the show itself  . If anything they should do a spinoff and show us the whole Crassus/Pompey/Ceasar business. Spartacus, gods of the senate would make a good title.
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Created a new poll, now that the series is done. Sorry I couldnt include gods of the arena, it would make it 24 permutations... For me: wrath of the gods > vengeance > blood and sand > gota
Poll: Rank the seasons!B&S > WOTG > V (14) 48% B&S > V > WOTG (8) 28% WOTG > B&S > V (5) 17% WOTG > V > B&S (1) 3% V > WOTG > B&S (1) 3% V > B&S > WOTG (0) 0% 29 total votes Your vote: Rank the seasons! (Vote): B&S > V > WOTG (Vote): B&S > WOTG > V (Vote): WOTG > V > B&S (Vote): WOTG > B&S > V (Vote): V > B&S > WOTG (Vote): V > WOTG > B&S
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Wrath of the gods? Am i missing something?
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For me it's Blood and sand > War of the damned > Gods of the arena > Vengeance. Something like that.
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B&S and GoA are about the same for me > WotD > V
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Wrath of the Gods eh? : P
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woops sorry, I made that poll at like 6am lol
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B&S > GoA > WotD > V for me. Blood and Sand and Gods of the Arena are very close though.
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What exactly made Spartacus change his mind about going to war with Crassus, just that Crixus died? Because if Crixus took half the warriors and couldn't win what made Spartacus think he was going to win?
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On April 16 2013 04:50 Agron wrote: What exactly made Spartacus change his mind about going to war with Crassus, just that Crixus died? Because if Crixus took half the warriors and couldn't win what made Spartacus think he was going to win?
It's a badly written show that should have ended south of the wall so to speak.
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On April 16 2013 06:29 Flyingdutchman wrote:Show nested quote +On April 16 2013 04:50 Agron wrote: What exactly made Spartacus change his mind about going to war with Crassus, just that Crixus died? Because if Crixus took half the warriors and couldn't win what made Spartacus think he was going to win? It's a badly written show that should have ended south of the wall so to speak.
i'll just copy/paste wiki
"Many popular modern accounts of the war claim that there was a factional split in the escaped slaves between those under Spartacus, who wished to escape over the Alps to freedom, and those under Crixus, who wished to stay in southern Italy to continue raiding and plundering."
just saying, the splitting of the army wasn't in the writer's control, unless they wanted to intentionally leave it out.
wasnt the purpose of sparticus attacking was to allow rest of the people escape? which as far as i know, were all killed by pompey.
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Yes that was the purpose. As I recall in reality, Pompey united with Crassus+Caesar long before and they pincered Spartacus's remaining forces in that location, whereas in the show Pompey is shown as luckily coming across the women+children+others on the mountain. Basically they had Spartacus and the slaves cornered, and he had only one choice which was to fight to the end.
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Looking forward to what they are going to do with the Triumvirate
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Hmm just finished the series. Good! But still Blood and Sand + Gods of the Arena is still better
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