On January 17 2013 02:41 Slakkoo wrote: A guy I knew recently died from using synthetic
wut? a friend of mine has smoked this for years and he's fine, ive smoked it myself alot of times and im also fine - in fact i know at least 5 people who has smoked huuuuge amounts of this and they are still alive and not having any side effects from it.
Synthetic cannabis is usually stronger than normal natural cannabis, it tastes a bit differently though - effects are exactly the same from my experience. Only that synthetics pack a bit more punch and you will feel it faster
On January 17 2013 02:41 Slakkoo wrote: A guy I knew recently died from using synthetic
wut? a friend of mine has smoked this for years and he's fine, ive smoked it myself alot of times and im also fine.
Synthetic cannabis is usually stronger than normal natural cannabis, it tastes a bit differently though - effects are exactly the same from my experience. Only that synthetics pack a bit more punch and you will feel it faster
See I disagree about the effects being exactly the same. Synthetic highs really do not feel as pleasurable to me, and I would always opt for plants over the JWH's. I find the the synthetic high to be more dizzying, a bit more dumbing, and a lot less useful.
On January 17 2013 02:41 Slakkoo wrote: A guy I knew recently died from using synthetic
Care to share how? I know it can damage your cardiovascular systems but I never heard of a confirmed case of death by synthetics beyond accidents and suicide.
Im not sure really, but I knew he ordered online synthetic stuff and one day they found him on the floor dead. I can try to dig up more, but I doubt anyone likes to talk about it atm :/
Yeah, the news are (were) full of such events, not really any details, but it seems they're not too safe.
The effects can be a bit stronger, indeed, but the substances also seem to have random effects and feel generally unsafe. Would not recommend to someone without further studies, which I seriously doubt will actually get done.
On January 17 2013 02:41 Slakkoo wrote: A guy I knew recently died from using synthetic
wut? a friend of mine has smoked this for years and he's fine, ive smoked it myself alot of times and im also fine - in fact i know at least 5 people who has smoked huuuuge amounts of this and they are still alive and not having any side effects from it.
Synthetic cannabis is usually stronger than normal natural cannabis, it tastes a bit differently though - effects are exactly the same from my experience. Only that synthetics pack a bit more punch and you will feel it faster
I have a friend who smoked it all the time for quite a while. Eventually he got to the point of vomiting blood and discovering rashes on his skin.
This is, of course, just talking about gas station "spice," I can't be sure of the chemicals used in that particular compound, but the types do vary quite a bit (usually because one of the things in it becomes illegal so they throw some other shit in to maybe make it okay again.) JWH-018 was pretty good, but it's been banned for a while.
On January 17 2013 02:41 Slakkoo wrote: A guy I knew recently died from using synthetic
wut? a friend of mine has smoked this for years and he's fine, ive smoked it myself alot of times and im also fine - in fact i know at least 5 people who has smoked huuuuge amounts of this and they are still alive and not having any side effects from it.
Synthetic cannabis is usually stronger than normal natural cannabis, it tastes a bit differently though - effects are exactly the same from my experience. Only that synthetics pack a bit more punch and you will feel it faster
I have a friend who smoked it all the time for quite a while. Eventually he got to the point of vomiting blood and discovering rashes on his skin.
Can you see why this is very poor evidence? Everyone has "a friend", and those symptoms are very out of the ordinary when compared to main body of evidence.
Edit: Ok, good edit, the actual chemical composition of what one buys as "spice" is a big part of the problem. Move along
On January 17 2013 02:41 Slakkoo wrote: A guy I knew recently died from using synthetic
wut? a friend of mine has smoked this for years and he's fine, ive smoked it myself alot of times and im also fine - in fact i know at least 5 people who has smoked huuuuge amounts of this and they are still alive and not having any side effects from it.
Synthetic cannabis is usually stronger than normal natural cannabis, it tastes a bit differently though - effects are exactly the same from my experience. Only that synthetics pack a bit more punch and you will feel it faster
I have a friend who smoked it all the time for quite a while. Eventually he got to the point of vomiting blood and discovering rashes on his skin.
Can you see why this is very poor evidence? Everyone has "a friend", and those symptoms are very out of the ordinary when compared to main body of evidence.
Okay, sorry I accidentally stumbled upon a huge debate apparently. Next time I'll stick just to pier-reviewed publications to link in order to make a fucking post in the TL general section. Just saying that I knew a guy who got pretty fucked up because he smoked that shit all of the time.
EDIT: Well that was a bit harsh ;p It's been a long day.
On January 17 2013 02:41 Slakkoo wrote: A guy I knew recently died from using synthetic
wut? a friend of mine has smoked this for years and he's fine, ive smoked it myself alot of times and im also fine - in fact i know at least 5 people who has smoked huuuuge amounts of this and they are still alive and not having any side effects from it.
Synthetic cannabis is usually stronger than normal natural cannabis, it tastes a bit differently though - effects are exactly the same from my experience. Only that synthetics pack a bit more punch and you will feel it faster
I have a friend who smoked it all the time for quite a while. Eventually he got to the point of vomiting blood and discovering rashes on his skin.
Can you see why this is very poor evidence? Everyone has "a friend", and those symptoms are very out of the ordinary when compared to main body of evidence.
Okay, sorry I accidentally stumbled upon a huge debate apparently. Next time I'll stick just to pier-reviewed publications to link in order to make a fucking post in the TL general section. Just saying that I knew a guy who got pretty fucked up because he smoked that shit all of the time.
EDIT: Well that was a bit harsh ;p It's been a long day.
If you do drugs with any regularity, as I do, you are probably rather used to hearing bullshit "my friend took this" or "one time, I took this many drugs" sort of stories; that was what I was reacting to. I've only known drug users to vomit blood on two occasions; the first was when a friend OD'ed on ghb, and the second was when the dude actually had tuburculosis lol. Not saying you're lying, I just gotta wonder what else your friend was taking.
On January 17 2013 02:41 Slakkoo wrote: A guy I knew recently died from using synthetic
wut? a friend of mine has smoked this for years and he's fine, ive smoked it myself alot of times and im also fine - in fact i know at least 5 people who has smoked huuuuge amounts of this and they are still alive and not having any side effects from it.
Synthetic cannabis is usually stronger than normal natural cannabis, it tastes a bit differently though - effects are exactly the same from my experience. Only that synthetics pack a bit more punch and you will feel it faster
I have a friend who smoked it all the time for quite a while. Eventually he got to the point of vomiting blood and discovering rashes on his skin.
Can you see why this is very poor evidence? Everyone has "a friend", and those symptoms are very out of the ordinary when compared to main body of evidence.
Okay, sorry I accidentally stumbled upon a huge debate apparently. Next time I'll stick just to pier-reviewed publications to link in order to make a fucking post in the TL general section. Just saying that I knew a guy who got pretty fucked up because he smoked that shit all of the time.
EDIT: Well that was a bit harsh ;p It's been a long day.
If you do drugs with any regularity, as I do, you are probably rather used to hearing bullshit "my friend took this" or "one time, I took this many drugs" sort of stories; that was what I was reacting to. I've only known drug users to vomit blood on two occasions; the first was when a friend OD'ed on ghb, and the second was when the dude actually had tuburculosis lol. Not saying you're lying, I just gotta wonder what else your friend was taking.
I can't really be sure to be honest. He just stayed shy of THC for job purposes, but he was certainly an idiot so I can't rule out anything else that would be undetected (which leaves a few things on the table.)
On January 17 2013 02:41 Slakkoo wrote: A guy I knew recently died from using synthetic
wut? a friend of mine has smoked this for years and he's fine, ive smoked it myself alot of times and im also fine - in fact i know at least 5 people who has smoked huuuuge amounts of this and they are still alive and not having any side effects from it.
Synthetic cannabis is usually stronger than normal natural cannabis, it tastes a bit differently though - effects are exactly the same from my experience. Only that synthetics pack a bit more punch and you will feel it faster
I have a friend who smoked it all the time for quite a while. Eventually he got to the point of vomiting blood and discovering rashes on his skin.
Can you see why this is very poor evidence? Everyone has "a friend", and those symptoms are very out of the ordinary when compared to main body of evidence.
Okay, sorry I accidentally stumbled upon a huge debate apparently. Next time I'll stick just to pier-reviewed publications to link in order to make a fucking post in the TL general section. Just saying that I knew a guy who got pretty fucked up because he smoked that shit all of the time.
EDIT: Well that was a bit harsh ;p It's been a long day.
If you do drugs with any regularity, as I do, you are probably rather used to hearing bullshit "my friend took this" or "one time, I took this many drugs" sort of stories; that was what I was reacting to. I've only known drug users to vomit blood on two occasions; the first was when a friend OD'ed on ghb, and the second was when the dude actually had tuburculosis lol. Not saying you're lying, I just gotta wonder what else your friend was taking.
I can't really be sure to be honest. He just stayed shy of THC for job purposes, but he was certainly an idiot so I can't rule out anything else that would be undetected (which leaves a few things on the table.)
Lol fair enough, it sounds as though we know people cut from the same cloth
i also want to point out that there is a major difference between spice (synthetic cannabis) and bath salts (which has PCP like effects). i smoked a LOT of spice and my bad trips just consisted of me in my chair sweating my brains out unable to move and feeling sick (this is the experience of my friends as well). bath salts are what can cause people to go delirious (the most famous example being the guy who ate someone's face).
the two are often lumped together but they are very different things.
Ok. I'm not going to link you to studies because I haven't seen any. And I don't suspect we'll see any for a while, the government doesn't seem to care too much about doing labratory studies on these drugs. Hopefully cannabis will be legal sooner than that happens and it will be unneccessary. The most I've seen is media reports about scare stories, reports of people going to hospital for racing heart, hot flashes, panic attacks, etc. These can be easily explained away, as when your perception of reality is altered and you become paranoid about your health, it can be easy to work yourself up into a panic and convince yourself you're dying when in fact it might just be mostly your hormones, even if it started by actually increasing/decreasing your rate of breathing or making your skin tingle, etc.
I'm just going to give you personal experience. I was working a job where I absolutely could not consider real marijuana as an option, since I could be drug tested randomly, frequently, and the consequences would have been severe. So I started smoking herbal blends. I tried many different kinds, they all had slightly different effects at different levels, but for the most part they made me feel pretty high, almost as high as dank, but also very very spacey like hash or brownies. I continued using them pretty regularly for a few months. Now I'm not going to tell you that they did permanent damage, because I don't know that they were the complete cause for sure and not the extended period of prolonged lethargy and complete 24 hour a day sedentary lifestyle that may have caused or contributed, but I know for sure that these products absolutely 100% caused some nerve issues. I had involuntary twitches in my arm and leg muscles, even when I first started using them, that got progressively worse as my use became more regular. I haven't smoked these compounds in about 6 months, but I still have nerve spasms/slight bubbling pain sensations in my arms and legs. Again, not sure if being this far removed from use I can say that I still feeling permanent-level effects from that and not from the constant desk ridden job and home life I've been doing, but I do know for sure that I never had these issues in the slightest before I began using them. Also, during and shortly after use, I would feel very lightheaded and short of breath. It was never something I felt dangerous enough to stop using over, but it was not a pleasant sensation. IE the benefit of the high still outweighed this unpleasant feeling. And because it was not lasting, I didn't think anything of it. But now I often feel short of breath and lightheaded when I get really really tired, and this never happened before. Take it with a grain of salt as I'm not the most healthy control specimen, but here is my gist:
TLDR: these compounds have been suspected with nerve issues in user experience and doctor reports, and my personal experience has shown me they have a connection with nerve issues I've had. TAKE MY ADVICE AND AVOID THESE COMPOUNDS. If you must partake in something, stick good old fashioned cannabis,and if you cannot use cannabis, don't smoke at all, or find another alternative that has been vetted, such as alcohol, a reliable pharm, or a different trusted relaxing chemical.
The compounds have no community expectation on quality like marijuana, and there are no avenues for recompense if you have a bad experience, as by misusing their sold intent as incense you are accepting any negative side effects. Because of the random hit and miss harmful effects that people infrequently experience, sometimes getting a 'bad batch', there have been suspicions circulating about growers using other harmful chemicals on the plant materials, like pesticides etc, with zero regulations or community expectations.
Is this thread about spice or synthetic cannabinoids? When you go out and buy spice you have no idea what's in it, how much, and you're taking a huge risk. Sure some people may have died from spice(debatable) but there's a big difference between spice and smoking the pure chemical, so to say "people have died from these chemicals and they're extremely dangerous" is just outrageous. The research has not been done to state a claim either way, as far as how safe it is to use, but most of the studies show that these chemicals have similar benefits that cannabis provides(depends which chemical you're talking about). As far as how carcinogenic or which metabolites they're forming goes, there's TONS of information out there that you can go and look at and decide what you want to do. Personally, I've never had a problem smoking the pure chemicals. Spice on the other hand, can have different long term use effects depending on which herbs they're using, the chemical, although you never REALLY know what you're getting or how they made it. Almost every one of the horror stories you hear about is people who "overdose", freak out, then do something stupid to hurt themselves, or just vomit for a few hours. Point is, do your research before you take random drugs, or you're probably gonna have a bad time.
On January 17 2013 07:24 MethodSC wrote: Is this thread about spice or synthetic cannabinoids? When you go out and buy spice you have no idea what's in it, how much, and you're taking a huge risk. Sure some people may have died from spice(debatable) but there's a big difference between spice and smoking the pure chemical, so to say "people have died from these chemicals and they're extremely dangerous" is just outrageous. The research has not been done to state a claim either way, as far as how safe it is to use, but most of the studies show that these chemicals have similar benefits that cannabis provides(depends which chemical you're talking about). As far as how carcinogenic or which metabolites they're forming goes, there's TONS of information out there that you can go and look at and decide what you want to do. Personally, I've never had a problem smoking the pure chemicals. Spice on the other hand, can have different long term use effects depending on which herbs they're using, the chemical, although you never REALLY know what you're getting or how they made it. Almost every one of the horror stories you hear about is people who "overdose", freak out, then do something stupid to hurt themselves, or just vomit for a few hours. Point is, do your research before you take random drugs, or you're probably gonna have a bad time.
I sincerely doubt those bags of synthetic cannabinoids coming out of "labs" in china and india are anything close to "pure".
Spice honestly sound like shit and i don't understand why anybody would try it. All i've heard from it is just plain bad. These talks of bad drugs just makes me crave for sume good weed...it's a shame i can't smoke any in this country T___T
On January 17 2013 02:41 Slakkoo wrote: A guy I knew recently died from using synthetic
wut? a friend of mine has smoked this for years and he's fine, ive smoked it myself alot of times and im also fine - in fact i know at least 5 people who has smoked huuuuge amounts of this and they are still alive and not having any side effects from it.
Synthetic cannabis is usually stronger than normal natural cannabis, it tastes a bit differently though - effects are exactly the same from my experience. Only that synthetics pack a bit more punch and you will feel it faster
Synthetic cannabis doesn't have any THC in it so it's not cannabis at all. It sounds like you're grouping the two as the same.
EPT
