Pro-China, Anti-Japan Protests - Page 117

On October 20 2012 02:30 Silvanel wrote:
Yeah i tottaly agree with ZERG_RUSSIAN, i dont get why this hatred towards Japanese poeple should be justified. Theres tons unresolved crimes and tensions all over the world, either all "victims" in the world have the right to hatred and violence or none of them. I prefere the latter. The world will be a better place if we try to forgive.

Ps. I was really dissapointed by that remark by KwarK, glad i am not the only one.

On October 20 2012 02:22 ZERG_RUSSIAN wrote:

Stop being a racist for a second and let's do analysis:


Let's take a look at Kwark's post, shall we?

Sentence 1: "To be honest learning about Japanese conduct... justifies anti-Japanese feelings."

Sentence 2: Imperial Japan was evil but didn't atone correctly and wallowed in self pity and denial, they should have followed the example of the great Nazis. What the fuck.

Sentence 3: It's not the current generation's fault. Okay, that's obviously true.

Sentence 4: However they still need to take responsibility for what people did fucking YEARS BEFORE THEY WERE BORN.

Sentence 5: Some shit politicians did that shows how evil Japanese people are. By that metric, all Americans are idiots. Wait--

Sentence 6: A link to the evil deeds of the politicians.

Sentence 7: Violent protests are always wrong BUT anti-Japanese ones are justifiable.

I mean, I'm being reasonable here, but this is an attack on Japanese people in the middle of China turning all of their guns on them, too. Are you guys blind?

On October 20 2012 03:38 ddrddrddrddr wrote:

You're making it way to simplistic. By this logic, China should just do whatever it wants with Japan because a generation later no one have to be accountable for anything and no one have the right to be angry toward China for it either. That's not how the world works and that's not how human beings work. Hell, death doesn't even absolve you of all material debt as a person, much less moral responsibilities and historical accountability as a nation.

On October 20 2012 03:32 ETisME wrote:

the world would be a stupid one if the country fail to acknowledge its mistake and downplaying it to its citizen.

You obviously know very little about by how much Japan downplay some of their actions in their textbooks as well as visiting the shrine that is set up for rememberance of the soldiers of the imperial japan.

If they need to be forgiven, they would need to show their determination of wanting to be forgiven.
Maybe you are still young but forgiving DOES require one to make an effort, and not trying to downplay it and hope the other party get less upset and "forgive" him.

And OP should also consider this on why China did not really take a strong approach to turn down the protest:
China's economy had been facing a slowdown and any factories are shut down due to China is in the stage of economy restructuring into less dependant on manufacturing.
The amount of corruption in the government as well as income disequality have both caused a lot of social unrest in China.
It's a good chance for China to release their anger etc onto something that can unite it's people together, rather than putting it out on the government.

But they have taken some steps in limiting the size of the protests, just not that much

On October 20 2012 02:22 ZERG_RUSSIAN wrote:

Stop being a racist for a second and let's do analysis:


Let's take a look at Kwark's post, shall we?

Sentence 1: "To be honest learning about Japanese conduct... justifies anti-Japanese feelings."

Sentence 2: Imperial Japan was evil but didn't atone correctly and wallowed in self pity and denial, they should have followed the example of the great Nazis. What the fuck.

Sentence 3: It's not the current generation's fault. Okay, that's obviously true.

Sentence 4: However they still need to take responsibility for what people did fucking YEARS BEFORE THEY WERE BORN.

Sentence 5: Some shit politicians did that shows how evil Japanese people are. By that metric, all Americans are idiots. Wait--

Sentence 6: A link to the evil deeds of the politicians.

Sentence 7: Violent protests are always wrong BUT anti-Japanese ones are justifiable.

I mean, I'm being reasonable here, but this is an attack on Japanese people in the middle of China turning all of their guns on them, too. Are you guys blind?

On October 20 2012 03:42 oneofthem wrote:
kwark underestimates the virulence of the sentiment.


but really, talk about downplaying when you got these clueless chinese kids protesting AGAINST human rights for tibetans. rofl?

On October 20 2012 03:48 Silvanel wrote:


Japan isnt the only nor the biggest "World Criminal" that didnt atone for its sins. But when the other matters like that are being brought up on this very board the general response is "get over with it", so thats my response to Chinese "get over it" . I dont see how its ok for Chinese to show hatred and violence, but (for example) Armenians, Polish or Chechnyans are being ridiculed when they simply complain about similiar matters.

On October 20 2012 03:52 KwarK wrote:

You have completely failed to read my post.
I said they needed to understand and show awareness of their history, at no point did I suggest they needed to be responsible for it, in fact, I said the opposite of that.
Politicians in a democracy speak for the people. That's how it works. It's not comparable to "all Americans are idiots"
I specifically condemned violent protests but said that anti-Japanese sentiment can be understood.

You have read my post through insane "everybody be hatin' on Japan" lenses and either deliberately misconstrued some very unambiguous sentences, maliciously misrepresented my words or lack any kind of reading comprehension. I suggest you re-examine your life and/or education.

On October 20 2012 04:12 ETisME wrote:

One very common view from the Chinese is that China had been too soft on international political positions.
Look back to China's history:
It lost lands, resources from opium war where uk tried to force open up opium trade.
Then invaded by the Eight-Nation Alliance in 1900 (in the name of protecting their people against the rebell group), lost lands and treasures, women raped etc
then faced revolution
Then WW2 loss from Japan

China now has the economic power to stand up in the international stage, people EXPECT China to speak out to these continuous insult to the Chinese history, especially the visiting of shrine and obviously the island purchase is a big FU to China's face.
Riots are one way to damage Japanese' economy and it has been successful.
Wen Jiabao especially warned Japan NOT to do so a few years ago, which is one possible explaination why China is behaving so aggressively in this case.

if "let it go" is the right attitude, then I am sure Taiwan would be first to "let it go" seeing how good relation they have with the Japanese.
Whether they should "let it go" is upto the party affected, not by some other cases happened somewhere else in another time.

On October 20 2012 03:55 ddrddrddrddr wrote:

Nobody protests against human rights. Nobody will ever go out of their way to protest something that is so good and simple. Minorities enjoy more rights than Hans in China. It's independence and what is perceived as Western interference with what is perceived as internal affairs that people are angry about. There's a sentiment that the Tibetans are given free infrastructure, financial support and a moderate amount of respect for culture but remains ungrateful. Because of these kind of views they feel cheated. Culture will nevertheless become diluted and better opportunities nevertheless draws young Tibetans away from their home, but it's not a consorted effort to screw with Tibetans. America dealt with its natives and so is China. Nations will only go so far to do what is "right" because what is practical is more important. It's those that simplify situations down to a single sentence that fail to see complex forces at work in politics.

On October 20 2012 05:29 ZERG_RUSSIAN wrote:

Or, maybe we could both acknowledge that we're on opposite sides of this debate and see that there's something terrible CURRENTLY going on that shouldn't be justified. Japanese have no control over their politicians. We're not all like that. So maybe China shouldn't be inciting their citizens to destroy property and harass individuals based on their political views. Do you remember how WW2 started?

On October 20 2012 08:07 KwarK wrote:

The post you are criticising said that the protests that are currently going on are "always wrong". You are continuing to intentionally misinterpret an unambiguous statement which clearly and simply criticised violent protests against Japanese people. You are not debating with anyone. You have taken a post which described violent protest as always wrong and are attacking it for "justifying something terrible". You are lying. Stop it.

On October 20 2012 08:15 DeepElemBlues wrote:


Kinda weird that many different people somehow managed to misinterpret what you said in exactly the same way, and your response is first to zero in on one of them and insult them, and second to tell him he's lying and to stop it.

You spent two paragraphs talking about how Japan is wrong and the sentiments that have caused violence are justified - and one throwaway line about how violence is never justified. Now, all you want to focus on is the throwaway line. Ignore the rest. And to say that what you said was unambiguous and simple... kind of bad form to tell someone he's a liar and to stop it when what you said wasn't a simple and clear statement condemning violence (a clear and simple sentence, out of two paragraphs that undercut that sentence), and it apparently wasn't unambiguous either judging from the reaction to it.

Maybe, if what people are believing is causing them to be violent, what they're believing is wrong, at least to the intensity that they believe it. Maybe?

And maybe when only one sentence out of two paragraphs rejects violence, maybe it wasn't just a simple and clear statement of rejecting violence. "Violence is never right," full stop, is clear and simple. "Violence is never right, but the feelings that have caused it in this particular instance are justifiable" is not.