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I always wanted to try this place... but it was closed on sundays 
Damn you religion!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
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On July 26 2012 07:01 Energizer wrote:Show nested quote +On July 26 2012 06:54 Praetorial wrote:On July 26 2012 06:45 TheBatman wrote:On July 26 2012 05:53 Praetorial wrote:Baller! I live in Boston, and I for one would love to see that bastion of Southern bigotry get out of my city! Heck, use eminent domain, zoning laws, whatever. Just get them gone! Just look at this: http://www.huffingtonpost.com/2012/07/17/dan-cathy-chick-fil-a-president-anti-gay_n_1680984.html
I think we are inviting God's judgment on our nation when we shake our fist at Him and say, 'We know better than you as to what constitutes a marriage,' and I pray God's mercy on our generation that has such a prideful, arrogant attitude to think that we have the audacity to define what marriage is about
Disgusting. how is it disgusting? Or do you just not like people talking about religion Allow me to clarify, as the only open Bostonian here. The position of Boston is, as you have all correctly pointed out, very liberal. We do indeed believe that gay marriage is justifiable and should be legal, and we've legalized it. We believe that some amount of marijuana can be carried on a person, so it was allowed. We base policy on what the current political feeling of the city is. Does that sound familiar? I bet it does, since all of your cities regardless of where you live in the states do the same. If the people want something, they can elect officials or petition that something be done. We DO NOT LIKE people giving money to anti-gay organizations. Those people are ostracized, confined to the company of people like themselves if they make it publicly known that that is how they feel. When a person at the top of an organization gives money to a political agenda, conservative or otherwise, we don't care at all. WHEN A COMPANY gives money to an organization, even by the direction of the people at the top, you know what happens?People get pissed off and angry about it. And then they start petitions, get all flustered about it. Eventually, the mayor gets that and bans the organization-not because he has a penchant for violating freedom of speech, but because the people of boston don't want it. And let me be very very clear. THE PEOPLE OF BOSTON DON'T WANT A RESTAURANT CHAIN DONATING TO AN ANTI-GAY AGENDA, and that is why it is being banned. So, when a company donates money to an anti-gay organization its heiracy But when a company donates money to a pro-gay organization like google or Nike its acceptable Got it, Thought I was confused in thinking you were a hypocrite, silly me. Should of known double standards are nonexistant.
As I've said, double standards form the basis of policy.
When people don't like something, they vote against or petition against it.
This is fine no matter what it is.
When the MAJORITY(which is true in this case)-find something objectionable, it get's landed with a policy slap.
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On July 26 2012 06:48 farvacola wrote:Show nested quote +On July 26 2012 06:45 TheBatman wrote:On July 26 2012 05:53 Praetorial wrote:Baller! I live in Boston, and I for one would love to see that bastion of Southern bigotry get out of my city! Heck, use eminent domain, zoning laws, whatever. Just get them gone! Just look at this: http://www.huffingtonpost.com/2012/07/17/dan-cathy-chick-fil-a-president-anti-gay_n_1680984.html
I think we are inviting God's judgment on our nation when we shake our fist at Him and say, 'We know better than you as to what constitutes a marriage,' and I pray God's mercy on our generation that has such a prideful, arrogant attitude to think that we have the audacity to define what marriage is about
Disgusting. how is it disgusting? Or do you just not like people talking about religion I know many religious people who would still call that disgusting. That a scriptural originalist, one who uses his narrow-minded interpretation of the Bible to justify his bigotry, is being held accountable for what he says should be expected and embraced. All we need is for one flamboyant homosexual to be thrown out of a Chik-fil-a for civil rights case to ensue, and I'd bet on whose gonna win.
Just because your anti gay-marriage doesn't mean your anti gay, I know some gay people who are against gay marriage. All he is saying really is that he disagrees with the view of marriage being put upon him to accept, I see no issue in someone with different principles than another. It's not like he is supporting lynchings or hate mobs, he just disagrees on the matter of marriage.
He just thinks marriage is a christian institution and he disagrees with the altering of what constitutes a marriage over time, it isnt disgusting, saying 'narrow-minded' interpretation of the bible to justify his thoughts are silly- you'd have to be seriously twisting words trying to justify gay marriage through biblical principle. As for "being accountable for what he says", are you kidding? He is just voicing his opinion, an opinion.
From your rhetoric it sounds like you would be giddy if someone got fired from chik-fil-a then claimed to be a homosexual just to sue them, that's disgusting.
You shouldn't base what should and shouldn't be allowed in society based on your own personal beliefs and agenda.
This thought police crap has to end.
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United States42499 Posts
On July 26 2012 07:01 Energizer wrote:Show nested quote +On July 26 2012 06:54 Praetorial wrote:On July 26 2012 06:45 TheBatman wrote:On July 26 2012 05:53 Praetorial wrote:Baller! I live in Boston, and I for one would love to see that bastion of Southern bigotry get out of my city! Heck, use eminent domain, zoning laws, whatever. Just get them gone! Just look at this: http://www.huffingtonpost.com/2012/07/17/dan-cathy-chick-fil-a-president-anti-gay_n_1680984.html
I think we are inviting God's judgment on our nation when we shake our fist at Him and say, 'We know better than you as to what constitutes a marriage,' and I pray God's mercy on our generation that has such a prideful, arrogant attitude to think that we have the audacity to define what marriage is about
Disgusting. how is it disgusting? Or do you just not like people talking about religion Allow me to clarify, as the only open Bostonian here. The position of Boston is, as you have all correctly pointed out, very liberal. We do indeed believe that gay marriage is justifiable and should be legal, and we've legalized it. We believe that some amount of marijuana can be carried on a person, so it was allowed. We base policy on what the current political feeling of the city is. Does that sound familiar? I bet it does, since all of your cities regardless of where you live in the states do the same. If the people want something, they can elect officials or petition that something be done. We DO NOT LIKE people giving money to anti-gay organizations. Those people are ostracized, confined to the company of people like themselves if they make it publicly known that that is how they feel. When a person at the top of an organization gives money to a political agenda, conservative or otherwise, we don't care at all. WHEN A COMPANY gives money to an organization, even by the direction of the people at the top, you know what happens?People get pissed off and angry about it. And then they start petitions, get all flustered about it. Eventually, the mayor gets that and bans the organization-not because he has a penchant for violating freedom of speech, but because the people of boston don't want it. And let me be very very clear. THE PEOPLE OF BOSTON DON'T WANT A RESTAURANT CHAIN DONATING TO AN ANTI-GAY AGENDA, and that is why it is being banned. So, when a company donates money to an anti-gay organization its heiracy But when a company donates money to a pro-gay organization like google or Nike its acceptable Got it, Thought I was confused in thinking you were a hypocrite, silly me. Should of known double standards are nonexistant.
What you have identified is that someone has a single stance on the same issue. He's not against a company taking a corporate stance. He's in favour of companies which take a corporate stance on issues he agrees with and not in favour of those which take a stance on issues he disagrees with. There is no hypocrisy there.
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On July 26 2012 07:01 Energizer wrote:Show nested quote +On July 26 2012 06:54 Praetorial wrote:On July 26 2012 06:45 TheBatman wrote:On July 26 2012 05:53 Praetorial wrote:Baller! I live in Boston, and I for one would love to see that bastion of Southern bigotry get out of my city! Heck, use eminent domain, zoning laws, whatever. Just get them gone! Just look at this: http://www.huffingtonpost.com/2012/07/17/dan-cathy-chick-fil-a-president-anti-gay_n_1680984.html
I think we are inviting God's judgment on our nation when we shake our fist at Him and say, 'We know better than you as to what constitutes a marriage,' and I pray God's mercy on our generation that has such a prideful, arrogant attitude to think that we have the audacity to define what marriage is about
Disgusting. how is it disgusting? Or do you just not like people talking about religion Allow me to clarify, as the only open Bostonian here. The position of Boston is, as you have all correctly pointed out, very liberal. We do indeed believe that gay marriage is justifiable and should be legal, and we've legalized it. We believe that some amount of marijuana can be carried on a person, so it was allowed. We base policy on what the current political feeling of the city is. Does that sound familiar? I bet it does, since all of your cities regardless of where you live in the states do the same. If the people want something, they can elect officials or petition that something be done. We DO NOT LIKE people giving money to anti-gay organizations. Those people are ostracized, confined to the company of people like themselves if they make it publicly known that that is how they feel. When a person at the top of an organization gives money to a political agenda, conservative or otherwise, we don't care at all. WHEN A COMPANY gives money to an organization, even by the direction of the people at the top, you know what happens?People get pissed off and angry about it. And then they start petitions, get all flustered about it. Eventually, the mayor gets that and bans the organization-not because he has a penchant for violating freedom of speech, but because the people of boston don't want it. And let me be very very clear. THE PEOPLE OF BOSTON DON'T WANT A RESTAURANT CHAIN DONATING TO AN ANTI-GAY AGENDA, and that is why it is being banned. So, when a company donates money to an anti-gay organization its heiracy But when a company donates money to a pro-gay organization like google or Nike its acceptable Got it, Thought I was confused in thinking you were a hypocrite, silly me. Should of known double standards are nonexistant.
If you shun bigotry and support the right for a person to pursue happiness how does that make you a hypocrit? Are you a troll or just that stupid?
User was warned for this post
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There is nothing wrong with discriminating against a company whose views you disagree with. I do have a problem with the government discriminating against a company whose views it disagrees with because the government is supposed to represent all of us and not all of us have the same views.
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United States5162 Posts
This is clearly a violation of the first amendment and unconstitutional. However, it's also clear that a significant amount of people are fine with censoring free speech they don't agree with. The fact that the company has a anti-gay stance means nothing as long as they don't actively discriminate.
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On July 26 2012 06:35 DeepElemBlues wrote:Show nested quote +On July 26 2012 06:33 TheYango wrote:On July 26 2012 06:05 KwarK wrote:
If someone openly politicises their company by taking a corporate stance on issues like this then they invite a broader social referendum on their operation. Whether or not it is the prerogative of the mayor to make that decision is another question but I have no problem with a company going "this is what we stand for" and a city going "we don't want what you stand for". If they stood just for good chicken then they wouldn't be having this problem. This post needs more acknowledgement. It's one thing to pass judgement on a company for something said by the owner. But if the company as an organization has donated money to anti-gay rights organizations, that's a completely different matter. It's no longer just an issue of the owner's personal beliefs. No, it isn't a different matter. It's still political speech. It's not a legal basis to do anything. Again, in a free country. But an awful lot of people in this thread seem to only want to live in a free country when that suits them.
Surely donating money to political organizations is not speech. Why are you upset that, for some people, complete and utter freedom does not take precedence to all other valuable things?
I see several of you are going on about "thought police" this and "freedom of speech" that, but in reality disallowing businesses that donate to certain political agendas is not thought-policing by any means. If you've read 1984, as I assume you have, you'd know that thought-policing involves (and the name is indeed a clue) charging people for their thoughts, not their speech or donations. Nor would disallowing Chic-fil-a curtail anybody's freedom of speech: it is not an utterance by their owner that is the cited reason, but the fact that they donate to political agendas the city disagrees with. Even if Chic-fil-a were to be banned today, every person would still be free to say the same things they were free to say yesterday.
As for whether it is within the mayor's rights to do this, I don't find the matter especially interesting.
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On July 26 2012 06:53 KwarK wrote:Show nested quote +On July 26 2012 06:48 GwSC wrote:On July 26 2012 06:44 KwarK wrote:On July 26 2012 06:40 danl9rm wrote:On July 26 2012 06:05 KwarK wrote:
If someone openly politicises their company by taking a corporate stance on issues like this then they invite a broader social referendum on their operation. Whether or not it is the prerogative of the mayor to make that decision is another question but I have no problem with a company going "this is what we stand for" and a city going "we don't want what you stand for". If they stood just for good chicken then they wouldn't be having this problem. At the head of every company is a person. Every person has beliefs, specifically about, let's just say it, gay marriage. I suppose we should interrogate every company in the U.S. as to what the owner or CEO of that company believes about gay marriage and then decide whether they get business licenses or not because of that belief? You're missing the point where the owner merged his own personal views on it with the company and gave his company a corporate stance on the matter. Saying "individuals have views" doesn't mean anything in this case. You've entirely misunderstood what happened here and then attempted to make an odd straw man where people in favour of it want to force everyone into interrogation chambers. Please try not to do that again. I don't understand, are you saying that this being a corporate stance, it is ok for the business to be banned? What is wrong with having a corporate stance that some people disagree with? Is it normal for government to be able to force out corporations with unpopular beliefs? If that is not what you meant, disregard. I'm saying it's okay for a city to decide what happens within that city as long as it doesn't discriminate against people on the grounds of race, gender, religion, disability etc. It'd be wrong for a city to say "no Mosques" but not wrong to say "no fast food". People deciding what kind of society they want to live in and trying to shape their society to improve it in their eyes is a good thing and they have the democratic right to do so. Chic-Fil-A has a corporate stance on the issue, they have stated what they believe in, the people of the city have a right to reject them based upon it.
I think I can agree with all of this. The problem I think I have is the mayor assuming the power to ban a business on these grounds. Of course the mayor, being elected, speaks for the people to an extent. I just think that in cases like this, where it is practical to do so and there is no immediate danger to anyone in doing so, the most democratic course of action is for the mayor to actually allow "the people" to make the decision, and either support the restaurant with their business or not.
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Go solve some crimes. ban chik fala? Id knock my mayor out. bad rnough mayors in this country going after soda.
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On July 26 2012 07:01 KwarK wrote:Show nested quote +On July 26 2012 06:57 jdseemoreglass wrote:On July 26 2012 06:53 KwarK wrote:On July 26 2012 06:48 GwSC wrote:On July 26 2012 06:44 KwarK wrote:On July 26 2012 06:40 danl9rm wrote:On July 26 2012 06:05 KwarK wrote:
If someone openly politicises their company by taking a corporate stance on issues like this then they invite a broader social referendum on their operation. Whether or not it is the prerogative of the mayor to make that decision is another question but I have no problem with a company going "this is what we stand for" and a city going "we don't want what you stand for". If they stood just for good chicken then they wouldn't be having this problem. At the head of every company is a person. Every person has beliefs, specifically about, let's just say it, gay marriage. I suppose we should interrogate every company in the U.S. as to what the owner or CEO of that company believes about gay marriage and then decide whether they get business licenses or not because of that belief? You're missing the point where the owner merged his own personal views on it with the company and gave his company a corporate stance on the matter. Saying "individuals have views" doesn't mean anything in this case. You've entirely misunderstood what happened here and then attempted to make an odd straw man where people in favour of it want to force everyone into interrogation chambers. Please try not to do that again. I don't understand, are you saying that this being a corporate stance, it is ok for the business to be banned? What is wrong with having a corporate stance that some people disagree with? Is it normal for government to be able to force out corporations with unpopular beliefs? If that is not what you meant, disregard. I'm saying it's okay for a city to decide what happens within that city as long as it doesn't discriminate against people on the grounds of race, gender, religion, disability etc. It'd be wrong for a city to say "no Mosques" but not wrong to say "no fast food". People deciding what kind of society they want to live in and trying to shape their society to improve it in their eyes is a good thing and they have the democratic right to do so. Chic-Fil-A has a corporate stance on the issue, they have stated what they believe in, the people of the city have a right to reject them based upon it. But if they state that their stance on gay marriage is dictated by religion, then the city IS effectively discriminating against a religious belief. You could say that the religion is discriminating against gays to begin with, but people are allowed to discriminate, government institutions are not. I'm pretty sure freedom of worship ends the same place all the other freedoms end, when you start impacting upon other people. Christianity doesn't require its members to use their corporations to further anti-gay agendas but even if you came up with a religion that did and then claimed discrimination was exercising your religious freedom it'd get struck down. You have the right to the private exercising of your beliefs, what Chic-Fil-A did was take a public corporate stance.
A private company has the same right a private individual does to take a political stance.
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On July 26 2012 07:03 Praetorial wrote:Show nested quote +On July 26 2012 07:01 Energizer wrote:On July 26 2012 06:54 Praetorial wrote:On July 26 2012 06:45 TheBatman wrote:On July 26 2012 05:53 Praetorial wrote:Baller! I live in Boston, and I for one would love to see that bastion of Southern bigotry get out of my city! Heck, use eminent domain, zoning laws, whatever. Just get them gone! Just look at this: http://www.huffingtonpost.com/2012/07/17/dan-cathy-chick-fil-a-president-anti-gay_n_1680984.html
I think we are inviting God's judgment on our nation when we shake our fist at Him and say, 'We know better than you as to what constitutes a marriage,' and I pray God's mercy on our generation that has such a prideful, arrogant attitude to think that we have the audacity to define what marriage is about
Disgusting. how is it disgusting? Or do you just not like people talking about religion Allow me to clarify, as the only open Bostonian here. The position of Boston is, as you have all correctly pointed out, very liberal. We do indeed believe that gay marriage is justifiable and should be legal, and we've legalized it. We believe that some amount of marijuana can be carried on a person, so it was allowed. We base policy on what the current political feeling of the city is. Does that sound familiar? I bet it does, since all of your cities regardless of where you live in the states do the same. If the people want something, they can elect officials or petition that something be done. We DO NOT LIKE people giving money to anti-gay organizations. Those people are ostracized, confined to the company of people like themselves if they make it publicly known that that is how they feel. When a person at the top of an organization gives money to a political agenda, conservative or otherwise, we don't care at all. WHEN A COMPANY gives money to an organization, even by the direction of the people at the top, you know what happens?People get pissed off and angry about it. And then they start petitions, get all flustered about it. Eventually, the mayor gets that and bans the organization-not because he has a penchant for violating freedom of speech, but because the people of boston don't want it. And let me be very very clear. THE PEOPLE OF BOSTON DON'T WANT A RESTAURANT CHAIN DONATING TO AN ANTI-GAY AGENDA, and that is why it is being banned. So, when a company donates money to an anti-gay organization its heiracy But when a company donates money to a pro-gay organization like google or Nike its acceptable Got it, Thought I was confused in thinking you were a hypocrite, silly me. Should of known double standards are nonexistant. As I've said, double standards form the basis of policy. When people don't like something, they vote against or petition against it. This is fine no matter what it is. When the MAJORITY(which is true in this case)-find something objectionable, it get's landed with a policy slap.
The funny thing is, nearly every single time the issue of gay marriage has been put to a vote, the majority have voted it down. Has there been a single vote anywhere where the people have passed it? I am not aware of any.
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On July 26 2012 07:07 jdseemoreglass wrote:Show nested quote +On July 26 2012 07:03 Praetorial wrote:On July 26 2012 07:01 Energizer wrote:On July 26 2012 06:54 Praetorial wrote:On July 26 2012 06:45 TheBatman wrote:On July 26 2012 05:53 Praetorial wrote:Baller! I live in Boston, and I for one would love to see that bastion of Southern bigotry get out of my city! Heck, use eminent domain, zoning laws, whatever. Just get them gone! Just look at this: http://www.huffingtonpost.com/2012/07/17/dan-cathy-chick-fil-a-president-anti-gay_n_1680984.html
I think we are inviting God's judgment on our nation when we shake our fist at Him and say, 'We know better than you as to what constitutes a marriage,' and I pray God's mercy on our generation that has such a prideful, arrogant attitude to think that we have the audacity to define what marriage is about
Disgusting. how is it disgusting? Or do you just not like people talking about religion Allow me to clarify, as the only open Bostonian here. The position of Boston is, as you have all correctly pointed out, very liberal. We do indeed believe that gay marriage is justifiable and should be legal, and we've legalized it. We believe that some amount of marijuana can be carried on a person, so it was allowed. We base policy on what the current political feeling of the city is. Does that sound familiar? I bet it does, since all of your cities regardless of where you live in the states do the same. If the people want something, they can elect officials or petition that something be done. We DO NOT LIKE people giving money to anti-gay organizations. Those people are ostracized, confined to the company of people like themselves if they make it publicly known that that is how they feel. When a person at the top of an organization gives money to a political agenda, conservative or otherwise, we don't care at all. WHEN A COMPANY gives money to an organization, even by the direction of the people at the top, you know what happens?People get pissed off and angry about it. And then they start petitions, get all flustered about it. Eventually, the mayor gets that and bans the organization-not because he has a penchant for violating freedom of speech, but because the people of boston don't want it. And let me be very very clear. THE PEOPLE OF BOSTON DON'T WANT A RESTAURANT CHAIN DONATING TO AN ANTI-GAY AGENDA, and that is why it is being banned. So, when a company donates money to an anti-gay organization its heiracy But when a company donates money to a pro-gay organization like google or Nike its acceptable Got it, Thought I was confused in thinking you were a hypocrite, silly me. Should of known double standards are nonexistant. As I've said, double standards form the basis of policy. When people don't like something, they vote against or petition against it. This is fine no matter what it is. When the MAJORITY(which is true in this case)-find something objectionable, it get's landed with a policy slap. The funny thing is, nearly every single time the issue of gay marriage has been put to a vote, the majority have voted it down. Has there been a single vote anywhere where the people have passed it? I am not aware of any.
WELCOME TO MASSACHUSETTS!
Gay marriage is legal here!
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United States42499 Posts
On July 26 2012 07:05 Myles wrote:
This is clearly a violation of the first amendment and unconstitutional. However, it's also clear that a significant amount of people are fine with censoring free speech they don't agree with. The fact that the company has a anti-gay stance means nothing as long as they don't actively discriminate.
Firstly, it's a business and businesses don't get the same rights citizens do because they're not people. Secondly, nobody is saying Chic-Fil-A can't say what they like. They're not saying they're not allowed to donate money to anti-gay organisations or suing them or anything. They're saying that if the society democratically decides that a corporation with that stance conflicts with the society that they are trying to build and the values it embodies then they can deny them the right to do business within their society. This isn't a new thing. It's the same thing people use in towns where all the buildings have the same old style and someone wants to knock one down and build new concrete monstrosity.
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Surely donating money to political organizations is not speech. Why are you upset that, for some people, complete and utter freedom does not take precedence to all other valuable things?]
It is speech. Disseminating views takes money. That is just an opinion and a controversial one, but it is the opinion of the US Supreme Court as far as American law goes and I think it is a correct opinion.
Why are you so upset that people are free to speak and behave in ways you don't like?
I see several of you are going on about "thought police" this and "freedom of speech" that, but in reality disallowing businesses that donate to certain political agendas is not thought-policing by any means. If you've read 1984, as I assume you have, you'd know that thought-policing involves (and the name is indeed a clue) charging people for their thoughts, not their speech or donations. Nor would disallowing Chick-fil-a curtail anybody's freedom of speech: it is not an utterance by their owner that is the cited reason, but the fact that they donate to political agendas the city disagrees with. Even if Chick-fil-a were to be banned today, every person would still be free to say the same things they were free to say yesterday.
You're splitting hairs to defend fascism.
If you support denying a business a permit based on opinions held and distributed by its executives personally or through the company, you're supporting fascism. Simple as that.
As I've said, double standards form the basis of policy.
When people don't like something, they vote against or petition against it.
This is fine no matter what it is.
When the MAJORITY(which is true in this case)-find something objectionable, it get's landed with a policy slap.
Dunno if you're trolling or really a crypto-fascist, it's pretty disturbing that you think it's acceptable for the government to hand a "policy slap" out based on such a flimsy justification.
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On July 26 2012 06:37 Gunther wrote:Show nested quote +On July 26 2012 06:33 TheYango wrote:On July 26 2012 06:05 KwarK wrote:
If someone openly politicises their company by taking a corporate stance on issues like this then they invite a broader social referendum on their operation. Whether or not it is the prerogative of the mayor to make that decision is another question but I have no problem with a company going "this is what we stand for" and a city going "we don't want what you stand for". If they stood just for good chicken then they wouldn't be having this problem. This post needs more acknowledgement. It's one thing to pass judgement on a company for something said by the owner. But if the company as an organization has donated money to anti-gay rights organizations, that's a completely different matter. It's no longer just an issue of the owner's personal beliefs. No, it's really a pretty moot point because you can make that against any organization/company/business that donates to poltical campaigns as well ( particuarly those condidates who will implement anti-gay marriage legislation)
Very good. Thus leading to getting companies out of politics. Where they shouldn't be and should never have been allowed in the first place.
I'm trying to see the downside here, but it's not coming to me.
On July 26 2012 06:46 logikly wrote:
"If you disagree with the Left, you are one or all of the following -- Sexist, intolerant, xenophobic, homophobic, Islamophobic, racist, bigoted.)" -Dennis Prager
Way to miss the point. There's no question that there's raging bigotry at play here. It's not because of "disagreeing with the left". It's because of a guy using his company and his beliefs to be a raging bigot.
The question is whether the actions being proposed are appropriate.
On July 26 2012 06:57 jdseemoreglass wrote:Show nested quote +On July 26 2012 06:53 KwarK wrote:On July 26 2012 06:48 GwSC wrote:On July 26 2012 06:44 KwarK wrote:On July 26 2012 06:40 danl9rm wrote:On July 26 2012 06:05 KwarK wrote:
If someone openly politicises their company by taking a corporate stance on issues like this then they invite a broader social referendum on their operation. Whether or not it is the prerogative of the mayor to make that decision is another question but I have no problem with a company going "this is what we stand for" and a city going "we don't want what you stand for". If they stood just for good chicken then they wouldn't be having this problem. At the head of every company is a person. Every person has beliefs, specifically about, let's just say it, gay marriage. I suppose we should interrogate every company in the U.S. as to what the owner or CEO of that company believes about gay marriage and then decide whether they get business licenses or not because of that belief? You're missing the point where the owner merged his own personal views on it with the company and gave his company a corporate stance on the matter. Saying "individuals have views" doesn't mean anything in this case. You've entirely misunderstood what happened here and then attempted to make an odd straw man where people in favour of it want to force everyone into interrogation chambers. Please try not to do that again. I don't understand, are you saying that this being a corporate stance, it is ok for the business to be banned? What is wrong with having a corporate stance that some people disagree with? Is it normal for government to be able to force out corporations with unpopular beliefs? If that is not what you meant, disregard. I'm saying it's okay for a city to decide what happens within that city as long as it doesn't discriminate against people on the grounds of race, gender, religion, disability etc. It'd be wrong for a city to say "no Mosques" but not wrong to say "no fast food". People deciding what kind of society they want to live in and trying to shape their society to improve it in their eyes is a good thing and they have the democratic right to do so. Chic-Fil-A has a corporate stance on the issue, they have stated what they believe in, the people of the city have a right to reject them based upon it. But if they state that their stance on gay marriage is dictated by religion, then the city IS effectively discriminating against a religious belief. You could say that the religion is discriminating against gays to begin with, but people are allowed to discriminate, government institutions are not.
So you're saying that a position that is backed up by an old book that we define as "religion" must be allowed?
That's puts too much power on the idea of religion. You could justify all kinds of bullshit, just by digging out Bible quotes and claiming that it's a tenant of your religion.
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On July 26 2012 06:58 Crushinator wrote:Show nested quote +On July 26 2012 06:50 overt wrote:On July 26 2012 06:48 farvacola wrote:On July 26 2012 06:45 TheBatman wrote:On July 26 2012 05:53 Praetorial wrote:Baller! I live in Boston, and I for one would love to see that bastion of Southern bigotry get out of my city! Heck, use eminent domain, zoning laws, whatever. Just get them gone! Just look at this: http://www.huffingtonpost.com/2012/07/17/dan-cathy-chick-fil-a-president-anti-gay_n_1680984.html
I think we are inviting God's judgment on our nation when we shake our fist at Him and say, 'We know better than you as to what constitutes a marriage,' and I pray God's mercy on our generation that has such a prideful, arrogant attitude to think that we have the audacity to define what marriage is about
Disgusting. how is it disgusting? Or do you just not like people talking about religion I know many religious people who would still call that disgusting. That a scriptural originalist, one who uses his narrow-minded interpretation of the Bible to justify his bigotry, is being held accountable for what he says should be expected and embraced. I'm fine with Chick-Fil-A being open about their religion. I'm also fine with them closing on Sunday. Hell, if they wanted to put Bible verses all over their restaurant I'd be cool with that too. I'm not cool with their company trying to stop gay marriage though. I don't care if it's religiously motivated or not, it's disgusting. I am not cool with them being religious, or closing on sunday, and their stance on gay marriage disgusts me. I do not wish to eat in an establishment that propagates religion. But I also strongly believe a government should not ban organizations with disgusting beliefs, aslong as they do not support criminal activities.
Thanks, this post had the idea I was looking for. It is one thing to consider the organizations to which Chick-Fil-A donates to be harmful and bigoted. However, neither the actions of the organizations or Chick-Fil-A are illegal to my knowledge. As such, it is dangerous for a government official to cater to the masses (which tend to be ok with 'ends justifies the means' type of thinking) if indeed he would attempt to by law/fiat ban the organization from setting up in the city.
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On July 26 2012 06:05 Zaqwert wrote:
The intellectually honest question is:
You either believe a mayor should have the power to ban a business because he disagrees with the owners religion or you don't.
You can't pick and choose which religions are "ok" to legally discriminate against and which ones aren't.
It would also be the same thing if a religious mayor wanted to ban atheist businesses.
It's not the government's job to punish businesses for their beliefs, individuals should have the power to support/not support them.
This presupposes it's about religion, rather than a civil rights issue. Take religion completely out of the equation and leave just the discrimination vs no discrimination and it becomes a pretty black and white issue.
For people who are in favor of this just because they agree with the position, what happens when another town does the same thing to say Starbucks for giving money to pro-gay marriage organizations?
This isn't an issue. It's not a case of arbitrarily deciding based on a personal whim but rather being against discriminatory practices and those who openly support them. If someone tried to ban Starbucks for being pro-gay then it would be unacceptable because they'd be furthering a discriminatory agenda. Your issue is a non-starter.
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Fascism is supreme governmental power.
I'm advocating for democratic process.
Where are you getting crypto-fascist?
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On July 26 2012 07:07 jdseemoreglass wrote:Show nested quote +On July 26 2012 07:03 Praetorial wrote:On July 26 2012 07:01 Energizer wrote:On July 26 2012 06:54 Praetorial wrote:On July 26 2012 06:45 TheBatman wrote:On July 26 2012 05:53 Praetorial wrote:Baller! I live in Boston, and I for one would love to see that bastion of Southern bigotry get out of my city! Heck, use eminent domain, zoning laws, whatever. Just get them gone! Just look at this: http://www.huffingtonpost.com/2012/07/17/dan-cathy-chick-fil-a-president-anti-gay_n_1680984.html
I think we are inviting God's judgment on our nation when we shake our fist at Him and say, 'We know better than you as to what constitutes a marriage,' and I pray God's mercy on our generation that has such a prideful, arrogant attitude to think that we have the audacity to define what marriage is about
Disgusting. how is it disgusting? Or do you just not like people talking about religion Allow me to clarify, as the only open Bostonian here. The position of Boston is, as you have all correctly pointed out, very liberal. We do indeed believe that gay marriage is justifiable and should be legal, and we've legalized it. We believe that some amount of marijuana can be carried on a person, so it was allowed. We base policy on what the current political feeling of the city is. Does that sound familiar? I bet it does, since all of your cities regardless of where you live in the states do the same. If the people want something, they can elect officials or petition that something be done. We DO NOT LIKE people giving money to anti-gay organizations. Those people are ostracized, confined to the company of people like themselves if they make it publicly known that that is how they feel. When a person at the top of an organization gives money to a political agenda, conservative or otherwise, we don't care at all. WHEN A COMPANY gives money to an organization, even by the direction of the people at the top, you know what happens?People get pissed off and angry about it. And then they start petitions, get all flustered about it. Eventually, the mayor gets that and bans the organization-not because he has a penchant for violating freedom of speech, but because the people of boston don't want it. And let me be very very clear. THE PEOPLE OF BOSTON DON'T WANT A RESTAURANT CHAIN DONATING TO AN ANTI-GAY AGENDA, and that is why it is being banned. So, when a company donates money to an anti-gay organization its heiracy But when a company donates money to a pro-gay organization like google or Nike its acceptable Got it, Thought I was confused in thinking you were a hypocrite, silly me. Should of known double standards are nonexistant. As I've said, double standards form the basis of policy. When people don't like something, they vote against or petition against it. This is fine no matter what it is. When the MAJORITY(which is true in this case)-find something objectionable, it get's landed with a policy slap. The funny thing is, nearly every single time the issue of gay marriage has been put to a vote, the majority have voted it down. Has there been a single vote anywhere where the people have passed it? I am not aware of any.
Are you claiming that nowhere in the world a democratic majority supports gay-marriage? Because you would be very wrong, an overwhelming majority of Dutch citizens and politcians support gay marriage, and this hold true of several other European countries, I'm sure.
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