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NASA: Strange and sudden massive melt in Greenland - Page 11

Forum Index > General Forum
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TheFish7
Profile Blog Joined February 2012
United States2824 Posts
July 26 2012 21:35 GMT
#201
How on earth do people still question the fact of global warming? There is no debate to be had here; people must be seriously trolling this thread.
~ ~ <°)))><~ ~ ~
Xiron
Profile Joined August 2010
Germany1233 Posts
Last Edited: 2012-07-26 21:44:57
July 26 2012 21:44 GMT
#202
On July 27 2012 06:35 TheFish7 wrote:
How on earth do people still question the fact of global warming? There is no debate to be had here; people must be seriously trolling this thread.


There are different ways of interpreting 'global warming'. On the one hand you have those, claiming global warming is purely a consequence of human pollution. On the other hand you've got those who say it's purely nature based and humans have no influence on it.
And then you got people like me who think global warming is happening naturally, but human pollution acts as a catalyst.
"The way of life can be free and beautiful. But we have lost the way. " - Charlie Chaplin
Lockitupv2
Profile Joined March 2012
United States496 Posts
July 26 2012 21:44 GMT
#203
ITS HAPPENING
That's right folks, I definitely heard an ethnic twang in that voice, so everyone put your guesses on the screen. It's everyone's favorite game, it's Guess the Minority!!!
dvorakftw
Profile Blog Joined November 2011
681 Posts
July 26 2012 22:23 GMT
#204
On July 27 2012 05:56 Stoli wrote:
There is really nothing to debate here. There is a large consensus in climate science:
http://www.skepticalscience.com/global-warming-scientific-consensus.htm

even in the US. Politicians already 'control' these industries. Global warming regulation isn't an inherent expansion of government (in some cases it can be obviously) but it is an inherent increase to the allowed

Show nested quote +
On July 26 2012 17:36 Ramanajan wrote:
Hahaha I was banned for having a different opinion. This site is just like any other, I guess.

Enjoy debating amongst yourselves, with people that think exactly like you do. Courtesy of Evilteletubby.

I don't know what you were banned for, but climate "denial" is in my experience, entirely the result of ignorance. It's the inability to research for yourself, and evaluate sources.

For example:
Show nested quote +
On July 26 2012 15:01 dvorakftw wrote:
Fine, you don't like that pic how about this one:

[image loading]



This website is my favourite source by far, I'm yet to see a denial argument it doesn't counter:

http://www.skepticalscience.com/medieval-warm-period.htm

Still, you didn't need that website, a VERY simple google search would have answered your question without demanding someone do the research for you simply by referencing some arbitrary website:

https://www.google.ca/webhp?sourceid=chrome-instant&ie=UTF-8&ion=1#hl=en&safe=off&sclient=psy-ab&q=Medieval climate change&oq=&gs_l=&pbx=1&fp=a72b5deb115828db&ion=1&bav=on.2,or.r_gc.r_pw.r_qf.,cf.osb&biw=1280&bih=636 "medieval climate change" could not be a much more intuitive search.

Literally the first three results directly address your "argument:"

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Medieval_Warm_Period

http://www.newscientist.com/article/dn11644-climate-myths-it-was-warmer-during-the-medieval-period-with-vineyards-in-england.html

http://www.sciencemag.org/content/302/5644/404.short



Note, the last result is a reputable journal. Stick to reputable science instead of sourcing internet blogs. There is nothing to debate: this is not debate, this is education.


I read the news today.

Oh boy.


EvilContrarian
Profile Joined March 2012
United States26 Posts
July 26 2012 22:26 GMT
#205
Climate Science can describe what is happening, and it can even describe why it is happening. Climate Science alone is insufficient to evaluate what to do as a response. This becomes a political problem that needs to be solved at a cross discipline level. Take a look at the TSA if you want to see an example of how political solutions to "big scary" problems can have a deleterious effect on the average person. The bigger the fear, the easier it is to trample decency and dignity in the name of "just do something".
Stoli
Profile Joined May 2010
Canada173 Posts
Last Edited: 2012-07-27 00:12:57
July 27 2012 00:09 GMT
#206
On July 27 2012 07:23 dvorakftw wrote:
Show nested quote +
On July 27 2012 05:56 Stoli wrote:
There is really nothing to debate here. There is a large consensus in climate science:
http://www.skepticalscience.com/global-warming-scientific-consensus.htm

even in the US. Politicians already 'control' these industries. Global warming regulation isn't an inherent expansion of government (in some cases it can be obviously) but it is an inherent increase to the allowed

On July 26 2012 17:36 Ramanajan wrote:
Hahaha I was banned for having a different opinion. This site is just like any other, I guess.

Enjoy debating amongst yourselves, with people that think exactly like you do. Courtesy of Evilteletubby.

I don't know what you were banned for, but climate "denial" is in my experience, entirely the result of ignorance. It's the inability to research for yourself, and evaluate sources.

For example:
On July 26 2012 15:01 dvorakftw wrote:
Fine, you don't like that pic how about this one:

[image loading]



This website is my favourite source by far, I'm yet to see a denial argument it doesn't counter:

http://www.skepticalscience.com/medieval-warm-period.htm

Still, you didn't need that website, a VERY simple google search would have answered your question without demanding someone do the research for you simply by referencing some arbitrary website:

https://www.google.ca/webhp?sourceid=chrome-instant&ie=UTF-8&ion=1#hl=en&safe=off&sclient=psy-ab&q=Medieval climate change&oq=&gs_l=&pbx=1&fp=a72b5deb115828db&ion=1&bav=on.2,or.r_gc.r_pw.r_qf.,cf.osb&biw=1280&bih=636 "medieval climate change" could not be a much more intuitive search.

Literally the first three results directly address your "argument:"

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Medieval_Warm_Period

http://www.newscientist.com/article/dn11644-climate-myths-it-was-warmer-during-the-medieval-period-with-vineyards-in-england.html

http://www.sciencemag.org/content/302/5644/404.short



Note, the last result is a reputable journal. Stick to reputable science instead of sourcing internet blogs. There is nothing to debate: this is not debate, this is education.


I read the news today.

Oh boy.




Again, you highlight your inability to evaluate sources. That is an editorial (http://www.co2science.org/index.php) not a peer reviewed article submitted to an academic journal.

Basically, it's a website, and a public charity. It has no scientific credibility beyond the fact that it has references. None of those references, however, make the assertion that climate change is not occurring.











On July 27 2012 07:26 EvilContrarian wrote:
Climate Science can describe what is happening, and it can even describe why it is happening. Climate Science alone is insufficient to evaluate what to do as a response. This becomes a political problem that needs to be solved at a cross discipline level. Take a look at the TSA if you want to see an example of how political solutions to "big scary" problems can have a deleterious effect on the average person. The bigger the fear, the easier it is to trample decency and dignity in the name of "just do something".


Yes, I agree. I don't think those two are remotely comparable, however- Terrorism has minimal objective risk and is largely the result of mass hysteria/fear. Climate change is not feared (quite the opposite) but has scientific validation and objective risk that could be on a far larger scale (flooding or disease for example).

A good example of your concern is in my neighbourhood :D https://www.google.ca/search?sugexp=chrome,mod=14&sourceid=chrome&ie=UTF-8&q=criticisms of pacific carbon trust

Still, that is no reason not to make an effort, and there is little to no real effort being made. It is just a good reason to carefully evaluate the means of those efforts.
Twisting joints like a contortionist
dvorakftw
Profile Blog Joined November 2011
681 Posts
July 27 2012 00:59 GMT
#207
On July 27 2012 09:09 Stoli wrote:
Again, you highlight your inability to evaluate sources. That is an editorial (http://www.co2science.org/index.php) not a peer reviewed article submitted to an academic journal.

Basically, it's a website, and a public charity. It has no scientific credibility beyond the fact that it has references. None of those references, however, make the assertion that climate change is not occurring.

Again I show my refusal to take your fingers-in-your-ears-nah-nah-nah-I-can't-hear-you attitude seriously. What do you think about CERN? http://hockeyschtick.blogspot.com/2011/08/svensmarks-theory-of-cosmoclimatology.html
dbald27
Profile Joined March 2011
United States49 Posts
July 27 2012 01:25 GMT
#208
I think this thread proves the biggest flaw in democracy. Ignorant people (all of us) thinking they know something about subjects so complicated that they could only understand if they had dedicated their life to studying it. I don't think a single person who posted in this thread saying either it shows global warming is definite, or unrelated has anywhere near the credentials to speak with such confidence. Decisions on such issues should be left to those who actually know about them, especially when its such a complicated and difficult issue.

tldr: idiots telling idiots that they're idiots
also known as kintaro. UCD FIGHTING!!
Barbiero
Profile Blog Joined September 2010
Brazil5259 Posts
July 27 2012 01:31 GMT
#209
On July 27 2012 10:25 dbald27 wrote:
I think this thread proves the biggest flaw in democracy. Ignorant people (all of us) thinking they know something about subjects so complicated that they could only understand if they had dedicated their life to studying it. I don't think a single person who posted in this thread saying either it shows global warming is definite, or unrelated has anywhere near the credentials to speak with such confidence. Decisions on such issues should be left to those who actually know about them, especially when its such a complicated and difficult issue.

tldr: idiots telling idiots that they're idiots


Sir, you just posted one of the most intelligent posts I've ever seen.
♥ The world needs more hearts! ♥
ymir233
Profile Blog Joined June 2010
United States8275 Posts
July 27 2012 01:36 GMT
#210
I vote that we keep continue deforestation, pollution, and general destabilization of the environment.

Because fuck everything else.

Furthermore, you guys realize that even if there's no general obvious net correlation of data to make for a good headline, there are plenty of peer-reviewed articles that explain that what's going on isn't a part of a cycle but a general increase - ________ -;;; not every piece of evidence has to be a braindead "CO2 RISE 5 YRS HERPDERP"...

lols
Come motivate me to be cynical about animus at http://infinityandone.blogspot.com/ // Stork proxy gates are beautiful.
MannerBro
Profile Joined June 2012
United States17 Posts
July 27 2012 01:36 GMT
#211
Global warming is technically "real" but not in the way we picture it as something humans brought upon the earth. The sun goes through solar phases in which at some times the larger solar waves map the earth warmer and at other times the smaller waves make the average temperature cooler. This is scientifically proven through the current fossil record we have at our disposal. Scientists discovered the fossil of a snake in South America that was estimated to be over 80 feet long. For a cold blooded reptile of this size to survive scientists conclude the average temperature would have had to been around 110F much higher than our current average temperature. And back then there were no factories or green house gases to cause this.

In short, there is no reason for people to stress over the melting of the ice caps. It is natural that global temperature will increase and then decrease with the sun's solar cycles. I can be sure that in a few centuries people will be scared due to cold
ROOT FIGHTING~
ymir233
Profile Blog Joined June 2010
United States8275 Posts
July 27 2012 01:41 GMT
#212
On July 27 2012 09:59 dvorakftw wrote:
Show nested quote +
On July 27 2012 09:09 Stoli wrote:
Again, you highlight your inability to evaluate sources. That is an editorial (http://www.co2science.org/index.php) not a peer reviewed article submitted to an academic journal.

Basically, it's a website, and a public charity. It has no scientific credibility beyond the fact that it has references. None of those references, however, make the assertion that climate change is not occurring.

Again I show my refusal to take your fingers-in-your-ears-nah-nah-nah-I-can't-hear-you attitude seriously. What do you think about CERN? http://hockeyschtick.blogspot.com/2011/08/svensmarks-theory-of-cosmoclimatology.html


Yay CERN. Good job not reading an article that doesn't even attempt to build an argument for the crucial bit - that cosmic rays had to significantly affect "the global warming" (in whatever solid terms you want to put it in, not just a handwave kthx) during the 20th century. Not to mention a lot of that data is fucken sensitive as hell.
Come motivate me to be cynical about animus at http://infinityandone.blogspot.com/ // Stork proxy gates are beautiful.
evanthebouncy!
Profile Blog Joined June 2006
United States12816 Posts
July 27 2012 01:53 GMT
#213
It might actually turn green soon ;p
Life is run, it is dance, it is fast, passionate and BAM!, you dance and sing and booze while you can for now is the time and time is mine. Smile and laugh when still can for now is the time and soon you die!
hifriend
Profile Blog Joined June 2009
China7935 Posts
Last Edited: 2012-07-27 01:55:10
July 27 2012 01:53 GMT
#214
I love how many of you guys just assume that an entire domain of hard science is curiously unaware of sun cycles, natural variations in climate etc and failed to account for them in their peer reviewed research.

Those damned climatologists with their multi-billion dollar grants, sitting on their expensive yachts while stroking siamese cats and screwing poor old petroleum industry out of their profits. :'(
ymir233
Profile Blog Joined June 2010
United States8275 Posts
July 27 2012 01:57 GMT
#215
On July 27 2012 10:36 MannerBro wrote:
Global warming is technically "real" but not in the way we picture it as something humans brought upon the earth. The sun goes through solar phases in which at some times the larger solar waves map the earth warmer and at other times the smaller waves make the average temperature cooler. This is scientifically proven through the current fossil record we have at our disposal. Scientists discovered the fossil of a snake in South America that was estimated to be over 80 feet long. For a cold blooded reptile of this size to survive scientists conclude the average temperature would have had to been around 110F much higher than our current average temperature. And back then there were no factories or green house gases to cause this.

In short, there is no reason for people to stress over the melting of the ice caps. It is natural that global temperature will increase and then decrease with the sun's solar cycles. I can be sure that in a few centuries people will be scared due to cold


Finding out temperatures is actually relatively hard to do with fossils. 110 F is above the temp where proteins break down, so that makes no sense. Secondly, we have a rough idea of the temps in the dinosaur ages, and I don't get how they survived. Obv then the solution is physiological, not geosystems-related.
Come motivate me to be cynical about animus at http://infinityandone.blogspot.com/ // Stork proxy gates are beautiful.
dvorakftw
Profile Blog Joined November 2011
681 Posts
Last Edited: 2012-07-27 02:13:30
July 27 2012 02:03 GMT
#216
On July 27 2012 10:25 dbald27 wrote:
I think this thread proves the biggest flaw in democracy. Ignorant people (all of us) thinking they know something about subjects so complicated that they could only understand if they had dedicated their life to studying it. I don't think a single person who posted in this thread saying either it shows global warming is definite, or unrelated has anywhere near the credentials to speak with such confidence. Decisions on such issues should be left to those who actually know about them, especially when its such a complicated and difficult issue.

tldr: idiots telling idiots that they're idiots

People like you are why millions get murdered in places like Russia and China.

edit: why, not while
dbald27
Profile Joined March 2011
United States49 Posts
July 27 2012 02:15 GMT
#217
On July 27 2012 11:03 dvorakftw wrote:
Show nested quote +
On July 27 2012 10:25 dbald27 wrote:
I think this thread proves the biggest flaw in democracy. Ignorant people (all of us) thinking they know something about subjects so complicated that they could only understand if they had dedicated their life to studying it. I don't think a single person who posted in this thread saying either it shows global warming is definite, or unrelated has anywhere near the credentials to speak with such confidence. Decisions on such issues should be left to those who actually know about them, especially when its such a complicated and difficult issue.

tldr: idiots telling idiots that they're idiots

People like you are why millions get murdered in places like Russia and China.

edit: why, not while


I'm definitely not advocating dictatorship. I'm just pointing out something which people have known about democracy for a long time, that it gives people a voice on issues which they are not qualified to make decisions on.
also known as kintaro. UCD FIGHTING!!
Phenny
Profile Joined October 2010
Australia1435 Posts
July 27 2012 02:30 GMT
#218
Global and regional temperature change has never ever occurred throughout the lifetime of the earth until now. Until recent times the earth's temperature has always been completely static. The science that "proves" otherwise is concocted by right-wing extremists in attempt to justify their ever expanding ~corporations~ and let nobody dare propose otherwise!
Khul Sadukar
Profile Joined August 2009
Australia1735 Posts
July 27 2012 02:30 GMT
#219
On July 27 2012 11:15 dbald27 wrote:
Show nested quote +
On July 27 2012 11:03 dvorakftw wrote:
On July 27 2012 10:25 dbald27 wrote:
I think this thread proves the biggest flaw in democracy. Ignorant people (all of us) thinking they know something about subjects so complicated that they could only understand if they had dedicated their life to studying it. I don't think a single person who posted in this thread saying either it shows global warming is definite, or unrelated has anywhere near the credentials to speak with such confidence. Decisions on such issues should be left to those who actually know about them, especially when its such a complicated and difficult issue.

tldr: idiots telling idiots that they're idiots

People like you are why millions get murdered in places like Russia and China.

edit: why, not while


I'm definitely not advocating dictatorship. I'm just pointing out something which people have known about democracy for a long time, that it gives people a voice on issues which they are not qualified to make decisions on.


Your stuck in the mentality that science explains everything. Everyone can have their opinion if they want.

I for one think this could be a natural occurrence. The planets weather system is changing on a whole.
I don't want to be part everything. I want to be something. - Weapon X
minilance
Profile Joined June 2011
Canada500 Posts
July 27 2012 02:32 GMT
#220
On July 25 2012 09:32 Queequag101 wrote:
Global warming doesn't exist the sun has times when it creates large solar waves and the earth gets warmer and times when it gets colder.


ignorant people like this will get us kill ( i guess you voted for Harper...)
Bisu, Jangbang <3
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