EPTThere are actually several very good documentaries out there and even youtube has a lot of ex-mormon testimonials. Super interesting if you are into that sort of thing.
President Obama Re-Elected - Page 41
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Velocirapture
United States983 Posts
There are actually several very good documentaries out there and even youtube has a lot of ex-mormon testimonials. Super interesting if you are into that sort of thing. | ||
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viletomato
Canada277 Posts
On April 21 2012 09:34 Velocirapture wrote: For Romney and Obama, pragmatic ranks way higher on their character trait list than religious. Both are religious for community/spiritual purposes, not explicitly supernatural. That said, Mormons as a community are a scary people. They are largely very devout and literal with an extremely strict social hierarchy to enforce obedience. They have no problem forcing financial and political involvement with threats of banishment. There are actually several very good documentaries out there and even youtube has a lot of ex-mormon testimonials. Super interesting if you are into that sort of thing. What are you talking about man, I am a 'Mormon' and that is wrong. The church never involves itself with politics. And it is ridiculous to think we banish people and threaten them. Get your facts straight. If you ever actually visit Utah you will find the people there are the nicest people you will probably ever meet. I live in Toronto and wanted to have a vacation there and a friend of a friend took me in (who was a mormon), fed me and drove me all around the mountains spending his 3 days to make sure I had a good time. | ||
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Black and Proud
49 Posts
On April 21 2012 09:50 viletomato wrote: What are you talking about man, I am a 'Mormon' and that is wrong. The church never involves itself with politics. And it is ridiculous to think we banish people and threaten them. Get your facts straight. If you ever actually visit Utah you will find the people there are the nicest people you will probably ever meet. I live in Toronto and wanted to have a vacation there and a friend of a friend took me in (who was a mormon), fed me and drove me all around the mountains spending his 3 days to make sure I had a good time. Matthew 6 1 “Be careful not to practice your righteousness in front of others to be seen by them. If you do, you will have no reward from your Father in heaven. 2 “So when you give to the needy, do not announce it with trumpets, as the hypocrites do in the synagogues and on the streets, to be honored by others. Truly I tell you, they have received their reward in full. 3 But when you give to the needy, do not let your left hand know what your right hand is doing, 4 so that your giving may be in secret. Then your Father, who sees what is done in secret, will reward you. 5 “And when you pray, do not be like the hypocrites, for they love to pray standing in the synagogues and on the street corners to be seen by others. Truly I tell you, they have received their reward in full. 6 But when you pray, go into your room, close the door and pray to your Father, who is unseen. Then your Father, who sees what is done in secret, will reward you. 7 And when you pray, do not keep on babbling like pagans, for they think they will be heard because of their many words. 8 Do not be like them, for your Father knows what you need before you ask him. User was temp banned for this post. | ||
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Black and Proud
49 Posts
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1Eris1
United States5797 Posts
On April 21 2012 09:53 Black and Proud wrote: You could say the same thing about a friend of a friend of mine who is a Buddhist when I visited Asia. Blah blah blah... Insert stories about generous hospitality thus proving that people who follow the religion are the nicest people on Earth. I've yet to see you provide any reason why Romney's Mormonism or Obama's Christianity has or will have any negative influence on their policies. Instead you've just tried to incite people and derail the thread away from the topic at hand. Seriously this anti-religion stuff is so stupid at times. It's honestly as immature and narrow minded as the hardcore baptists and the like. | ||
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Cele
Germany4016 Posts
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viletomato
Canada277 Posts
On April 21 2012 09:53 Black and Proud wrote: You could say the same thing about a friend of a friend of mine who is a Buddhist when I visited Asia. Blah blah blah... Insert stories about generous hospitality thus proving that people who follow the religion are the nicest people on Earth. I didn't say they were the nicest people on earth did I? I'm sure Buddhists are great people as well. I'm just trying to say they are not some scary people as my previous poster said. | ||
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liberal
1116 Posts
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Papulatus
United States669 Posts
On April 21 2012 08:12 Black and Proud wrote: Anyone who is dumb enough to not form an opinion based on someone's personal beliefs will easily be scammed. It is commonly accepted that Mormonism is ridiculous. If you just do a Google search for their beliefs - tell me if it's possible for any reasonable persn to subscribe to those beliefs if not for the fact that they were raised in the religion? If there was an American Presidential nominee who believed in Scientology, would you not likewise call him dumb? ![[image loading]](http://i.imgur.com/gLVMj.jpg) Just about every religion holds crazy claims. By your thoughts, anyone but an atheist/agnostic should hold office. | ||
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TheToast
United States4808 Posts
On April 21 2012 07:11 Gorsameth wrote: There is no rule saying that they cannot win. People thinking its a throwaway vote prevent them from voting but if everyone who disagreed with both parties voted for a 3e party you would actualy see the effects. Your vote is meaningless to any party. 1 vote is nothing. 3e Part votes are worth as much as a repub/dem vote. so dont be afraid to let your voice heard No there is no rule. But again I go back to the example of the 1992 election, which is probably the only election in the past 100 years (going back to Teddy's second run) where a candidate who wasn't from one of the two main parties had any chance of winning. Ross Perot pulled mainly republican voters from Bush, causing Clinton to win the election. Interesting the EXACT same thing occurred in the 1912 election, when Teddy Roosevelt ran for a second term. The Republicans decided to stick with Taft, so Roosevelt ran as a third party candidate from the Bull Moose party. Roosevelt pulled a significant number of votes from Taft, causing Democrat Woodrow Wilson to win. Voters in this country tend to sit on one side of the political spectrum or the other, and as such third party candidates tend to pull a majority of voters from one side or the other depending on where their views on issues lie. It's sort of like a game of chicken, voters could choose a third party candidate; but if voters on one side decide to stick to their candidate that party is going to win the election. And that's something the major parties understand, probably one of the reasons the democrats began to incorporate more environmental issues to their platform in the mid-1990s, as the green party was taking an increased share of their votes. This also goes back to what I was talking about before, with the Republican candidates trying to play to libertarian Tea Partiers, there has been some concern about people potentially voting for a third party candidate like Ron Paul. I think most of that has subsided now however. On April 21 2012 07:49 Defacer wrote: Here's link to an interesting infographic that shows just how steep a mountain Mitt Romney has to climb to reach the average voter, and re-inforces the stereotype that he's out-of-touch. Also highlights just how much grassroots support Obama was capable of drumming up in 2004. Romney trails in small donations to Obama, Bush 2004 was a long time ago. Now that the Republicans have a candidate, I think you are going to start seeing the money gushing into Romney as we get closer to the election. Having a conservative republican family and a conservative republican state politician in the family I think I'm in a pretty good position to assess the mindset of Republicans. And I can honestly tell you it's pretty intense. Conservative Republicans in this country honestly believe this election is the last chance they have to save this country from economic decline and socialism. They are extremely intent on beating Obama, I cannot really fully express how motivated the right is to win this election, but it's pretty intense. | ||
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aksfjh
United States4853 Posts
On April 21 2012 10:25 TheToast wrote: ANYWAY, back to the topic: No there is no rule. But again I go back to the example of the 1992 election, which is probably the only election in the past 100 years (going back to Teddy's second run) where a candidate who wasn't from one of the two main parties had any chance of winning. Ross Perot pulled mainly republican voters from Bush, causing Clinton to win the election. Interesting the EXACT same thing occurred in the 1912 election, when Teddy Roosevelt ran for a second term. The Republicans decided to stick with Taft, so Roosevelt ran as a third party candidate from the Bull Moose party. Roosevelt pulled a significant number of votes from Taft, causing Democrat Woodrow Wilson to win. Voters in this country tend to sit on one side of the political spectrum or the other, and as such third party candidates tend to pull a majority of voters from one side or the other depending on where their views on issues lie. It's sort of like a game of chicken, voters could choose a third party candidate; but if voters on one side decide to stick to their candidate that party is going to win the election. And that's something the major parties understand, probably one of the reasons the democrats began to incorporate more environmental issues to their platform in the mid-1990s, as the green party was taking an increased share of their votes. This also goes back to what I was talking about before, with the Republican candidates trying to play to libertarian Tea Partiers, there has been some concern about people potentially voting for a third party candidate like Ron Paul. I think most of that has subsided now however. Indeed. Voting for a 3rd party is going to be a waste of time, and possibly hurt your last viable preferred option (lesser of 2 evils). If you're really upset about your choices, then take a stand now with those running in state and congressional elections. Those races often end much closer, with the winner not getting more than 50% of the total vote. | ||
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Deathmanbob
United States2356 Posts
On April 21 2012 09:50 viletomato wrote: What are you talking about man, I am a 'Mormon' and that is wrong. The church never involves itself with politics. And it is ridiculous to think we banish people and threaten them. Get your facts straight. If you ever actually visit Utah you will find the people there are the nicest people you will probably ever meet. I live in Toronto and wanted to have a vacation there and a friend of a friend took me in (who was a mormon), fed me and drove me all around the mountains spending his 3 days to make sure I had a good time. uhhh bullshit? the Mormon church and their involvement in California on Prop 8..... thats all i need to say to debunk this "the church never involves itself with politics" I have nothing against mormons and it would never stop me from voting for someone but dont sit there and tell a guy to get his facts straight when you are wrong | ||
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slappy
United States1271 Posts
EDIT: and whats all this religious discussion about? Sure Romney is Mormon but wtf was any other president and why does it matter? Mormonism is a branch of Christianity, its not as crazy as people make it out to be. I don't think religion will affect the US in the way mormonism affects Utah EDIT2: On April 21 2012 09:50 viletomato wrote: What are you talking about man, I am a 'Mormon' and that is wrong. The church never involves itself with politics. And it is ridiculous to think we banish people and threaten them. Get your facts straight. If you ever actually visit Utah you will find the people there are the nicest people you will probably ever meet. I live in Toronto and wanted to have a vacation there and a friend of a friend took me in (who was a mormon), fed me and drove me all around the mountains spending his 3 days to make sure I had a good time. Velocirapture you are way off track. You been to Utah? As a community they help each other and do tons of service, including feeding homeless people and giving tons of donations to the church charity. My family lives there, it's an awesome place to be. As a community they are literally the closest thing to utopia on earth. You should probably form less opinions about things you read on the internet  viletomato, I have to disagree with you a bit. The church definitely isn't separated from the state of Utah as much as it should be. There is a lot of Mormon influence in Utah politics, and the church owns a huge % of all the land, and buys it at will for whatever they want. Not saying it's all a bad thing, it just creates controversy because they have so much power and money. I'm born and raised LDS too  | ||
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sunprince
United States2258 Posts
On April 21 2012 10:48 Deathmanbob wrote: uhhh bullshit? the Mormon church and their involvement in California on Prop 8..... thats all i need to say to debunk this "the church never involves itself with politics" I have nothing against mormons and it would never stop me from voting for someone but dont sit there and tell a guy to get his facts straight when you are wrong This. Also, it's worth mentioning that though Obama and Romney both seem pay lip service rather than being true believers, they're nevertheless representing religious constituents and their policymaking will be influenced by the desire to maintain those constituents (though this is somewhat more true with Romney than Obama). A Presidential candidate's religion doesn't matter a whole lot if they're not devout believers, but if they portray themselves as believers to win votes then you can bet it will affect policy. | ||
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BioNova
United States598 Posts
(CNN) - The chairman of the Republican National Committee said Friday he was holding off on naming Mitt Romney the presumptive GOP presidential nominee out of respect for the two long shot candidates still running for the spot. Reince Priebus said on CNN’s “John King U.S.A.” the delegate math that overwhelmingly favors Romney isn’t enough to declare an end to the contest. Asked by CNN Chief White House Correspondent Jessica Yellin why he wasn’t yet supporting Romney, Priebus said “I think out of respect and deference to Congressman Paul and Speaker Gingrich." He continued, “We're still talking to all the candidates. We have a little bit of different deal here. We've got to follow some rules. I think also just like I said, out of respect for them it's important for us to continue talking and just making sure that we're moving slowly, we're communicating with all the campaigns obviously.” Everone already knows what the party wishes. Now just waiting for the magic number to commit. Source Romney also had some difficulty getting pledges from Iowa delegates as well, also from CNN. Santorum is nearly 2 million deep in Campaign debt. Gingrich at 4.2 million. Paul's campaign has nearly 2 million on hand and no debt. He'll be the last Republican to fold when statistically pushed out. Without everyone falling in line Romney is going to have to spend even more cash just securing and vetting delegates. Obama is not lacking cash, or breathing room. It would be nice for Mitt if he could rally his party, but they are still a bit non-commital(irony). Source | ||
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Silidons
United States2813 Posts
On April 21 2012 10:58 sunprince wrote: This. Also, it's worth mentioning that though Obama and Romney both seem pay lip service rather than being true believers, they're nevertheless representing religious constituents and their policymaking will be influenced by the desire to maintain those constituents (though this is somewhat more true with Romney than Obama). A Presidential candidate's religion doesn't matter a whole lot if they're not devout believers, but if they portray themselves as believers to win votes then you can bet it will affect policy. For me, the second an Atheist person runs for President they will likely insta-get my vote. Kind of shitty having 0% representation in gov't. | ||
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Spankey McSpank
United States58 Posts
On April 19 2012 18:24 murphs wrote: Dear America, Vote Obama. Sincerely, Rest of the fucking world. Haha, that is classic. Obama, in my opinion, is the better choice because there is a far greater chance of him caring about my world rather than Mitt who is way above my pay grade to give a crap. That is the biggest factor to me. Obama was taxed at around 23% I believe, and Mitt was taxed at way less, but made way more. Obama on top of that 23% donated another 20% of his income to charitys. Mitt isn't even releasing his full tax statement untill a few months from now, wonder why.... | ||
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screamingpalm
United States1527 Posts
I disagree with those claiming voting 3rd party is a waste. As a leftist, the Democrats are not entitled to my vote and they and their centrist platform do not represent me. It is absolute nonsense and empty rhetoric that they blame Nader for Gore losing to Bush. If you're happy with one or both of the mainstream parties, great. I'll continue to support alternative choices that actually represent my views, like a responsible citizen. | ||
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Voltaire
United States1485 Posts
On April 21 2012 11:03 Spankey McSpank wrote: Haha, that is classic. Obama, in my opinion, is the better choice because there is a far greater chance of him caring about my world rather than Mitt who is way above my pay grade to give a crap. That is the biggest factor to me. Obama was taxed at around 23% I believe, and Mitt was taxed at way less, but made way more. Obama on top of that 23% donated another 20% of his income to charitys. Mitt isn't even releasing his full tax statement untill a few months from now, wonder why.... You're just buying into all the left wing rhetoric. Why don't you actually take a look at the issues? Also, it's not Mitt Romney's fault that capital gains taxes are so low. This is coming from someone who will very likely vote for Obama. | ||
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alpinefpOPP
United States134 Posts
On April 20 2012 18:47 Velr wrote: Every 7th american gets food stamps allready... So as it seems theire actually quite socialist .. But don't tell em, else they might stop lieing to themselevs and start to restructure their welfare system.... ... ... .Most americans end up having enough pride to pick themselves up and not even need some b.s. welfare system | ||
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