2012 French Presidential Election - Page 72

On May 08 2012 06:59 SiroKO wrote:


Amen+ Show Spoiler +

It's so funny and obscene, almost satanical ;D

On May 08 2012 07:11 Elitios wrote:
I will never understand how in a country so heavily involved with the DEADLIEST WAR EVER (WWII) could have so many advocates of nationalism or any kind of far-right organization. I mean, opinions like that started that war....

So in my eyes the 20% or so that voted for Le Pen are either mad or misguided.

As for Hollande, since the right wing has failed to solve anything despite being in power for so long, maybe it's time to try and see what the left side has to offer.

On May 08 2012 06:59 SiroKO wrote:


Amen
+ Show Spoiler +
It's so funny and obscene, almost satanical ;D

On May 08 2012 07:31 Kahlgar wrote:


ethnic diversity, what a terrifying sight


I'm not sure if you're trolling or actually serious but if you knew anything about France history, you would be aware that immigration is nothing new and more of a strenght of our nation than a threat to it.

But then again, it's probably easier for you to just go : "zomg arabs and blacks people in our country stealin our jobs!!!"

On May 08 2012 07:47 Otolia wrote:

*cough* Why don't you edit and remove the ugly parts.

On May 08 2012 07:42 SiroKO wrote:


I don't have anything against immigrants individually.
In fact, I acknowledge the fact that some immigrants are superior on an individual basis to a lot of French people perhaps including myself.

This is not the issue.

By the way, you see arabs when I see foreign flags.
You see blacks when I myself see no one single white people. It's kind of funny because when it's the other way around, you're allowed to say it and even denounce it on national TV.

On May 08 2012 07:36 SiroKO wrote:



WW2 was forced on us, we didn't declare it.

Furthermore, most of the earliest resistants in WW2 were French patriots belonging or inspired by the "Croix de feu" and "Action française" movements which would nowadays be considerd to be at the extreme extreme right.

Besides, if your think it is moderate to force European treaty upon sovereign nations as well as accepting hundreds of thousands of immigrants each single year, your definition of far-right is equally irrelevant.

On May 08 2012 07:36 SiroKO wrote:



WW2 was forced on us, we didn't declare it.

Furthermore, most of the earliest resistants in WW2 were French patriots belonging or inspired by the "Croix de feu" and "Action française" movements which would nowadays be considerd to be at the extreme extreme right.

Besides, if your think it is moderate to force European treaty upon sovereign nations as well as accepting hundreds of thousands of immigrants each single year, your definition of far-right is equally irrelevant.

On May 08 2012 08:11 Elitios wrote:


Of course. But who cares? Do you deny that nationalism was indeed the cause for the war?

As for you great remark about the resistance, just remember the far more numerous french who stood for Petain and his cohorts. Oh and resistance was not a crusade of saints by any means.
What I asked you to look at was the millions of jews who died because a lot of idiots thought they were the root of all their problems and all the atrocities commited by all the countries involved in the name of "national values" or "ethnic purity" and so on.

Force European treaty? Nobody forced anything onto anybody. If you want to play the victim, fine, but in reality France could not survive without Europe nowadays. But apparently you have a a lot of trouble accepting the fact there is no clear defined border between countries and cultures today. It's called globalisation I've been told back in high school..

On May 08 2012 07:52 Nouar wrote:

The points that's not getting in is : A lot of immigrants ARE FUCKING FRENCH. So don't compare immigrants with french, seriously...
And this time, isn't it told, and denounced on national TV ? Like 2 years ago at that football match Algeria vs Egypt ? It always works both ways, you just don't see it. Or forget it real easily.

On May 08 2012 07:54 Livelovedie wrote:

Not true, France decided to join in when Germany invaded Poland... in no way did France have to declare war on Germany for invading Poland. Also the Treat of Versailles forced Germany to accept responsibility for WW2 (when it wasn't responsible) and forced Germany to give up territory (including alsace lorraine which France got) and to pay heavy war reparations. WW2 was not "forced on" France.

On May 08 2012 09:03 JoelB wrote:
I'd like to throw something into this discussion.
1998 Gerhard Schörder a member of the social democratic party (SPD) our last Chancellor before Merkel won the election. During that time Germany was suffering economically with high(er) unemployment and was called the "sick man of europe". He started to pump money into the economy but soon had to realize that it wasnt working. He then started his infamous "Agenda 2010". The retirement age had been risen to 67 and basically the entire way our social system works was reformed. With heavy consequences because some of the changes were very drastic and too harsh - they should have been corrected in some way but he never got the chance to because before anyone could really judge the outcome of the Agenda 2010 he was replaced by Merkel. The entire socialist party was shattered in the following elections going down to like 20% or less in some minor votes. The fact that a social democrat forged such a "anti-social" act scared away most of their voters. The conservatives agreed on the agenda but i highly doubt they would have done that themselves because the riots would have been INSANE. The fact that he was a social democrat made it easier for many to swallow the bitter pill.

Now almost 12 years later we can see the entire effects of the agenda. The main reason for Germanys (atleast compared to others) good economic state is mostly because of the Agenda 2010 and a rather good administration of Merkel during the crisis itself. I'm not a big fan of the agenda, because some parts of it were far too harsh and still there need to be more corrections. Thought the whole idea was going into the right direction it was poorly executed and the conservatives never had an interest to change it. There really should have been higher taxes for high wages to make the agenda not too one sided. This should show some of the "lefty haters" that their stupid talk about socialists hurting the economy is not always true.

To the french people here: Mr. Hollande is exactly at the same point now like Schörder was 98. He has to face that france needs to be reformed or will suffer heavily. Pure socialist utopia can't exist in a world together with china being there too. But i will bet money that he will be unable to do anything on dept. The markets will crush any of those attempt. He just wont get any money. As i said in a previous post - the times of endless dept ARE OVER and they will not return no matter what some people think. There are only two options: reduce the dept or go bankrupt. Hollande knows this. Though i really really dislike that the markets have such a big influence on politics this time it is for good because it will finally free us from the prison that is dept. It shakles politicians, the people and takes away our freedom. Even far-left dreamers have to finally realize that dept is bad.

Hollande on the other hand is probably the right guy to make his own agenda. I think he will learn from the mistakes Schröder made and reform France in a fairer way. I think as a socialist he has more chances to do so because he on the one hand can more easily raise taxes for higher wages and on the other hand can maybe promote some social reforms better then a conservative could. And you know what? I really believe that this will happen. Why? Because it's the only way left. The markets won't give money for any dept attempts so its the only future France has. And with them the entire European Union.

and to close this some words concerning the state of the EU.
The EU is rich, we have alot of money in fonds for infrastructure and everything. It is already being discussed to let those flow into the directions of those states that try to get back on their foots like spain f.e. (who before the american induced crisis had a very low dept) and will probably be the new program of growth that had been discussed even before the election of Hollande. We can do that without any dept but structural reforms in all countries are necessery. Still the state of the ECB is much, much better then the FED or bank of england. I'm living right next to where the new ECB building is being constructed (New ECB) and i'm saying don't you worry, they are still building - i'm only afraid when they stop . Europe and the euro will go on no matter how hard righties, UK and Americas try to sabotage it. Because it is the only future we have.