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Perry Announces Flat Tax Plan - Page 4

Forum Index > General Forum
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Trezeguet
Profile Blog Joined January 2009
United States2656 Posts
October 25 2011 04:29 GMT
#61
He did poorly at an relatively unimpressive school, but I think we are all smart enough to realize that he didn't really come up with any part of this tax plan. Can we please leave his terrible and pathetic grades out of this. He could have flunked out of college for all I care if he is smart enough to listen to people who didn't.

The real questions that need to be answered are 1. what is the effect on the lowest 50%? 2. what is the effect on the next 49%? 3. what is the effect on the top earners? 4. What is the overall effect on the total tax collection?
benjammin
Profile Blog Joined August 2008
United States2728 Posts
October 25 2011 04:33 GMT
#62
On October 25 2011 13:18 Mindcrime wrote:
Show nested quote +
On October 25 2011 12:47 aethereality wrote:
Wikipedia:
Perry graduated in 1972 with a Bachelor of Science degree in animal science with a 2.5 GPA.


Hahahaha. A public state university, and he couldn't even try hard enough to get a GPA over 3.0? People actually want to elect a slacker? I mean, you'd have to be sitting around all day with your thumb up your ass to get a GPA that low. I truly do not trust people like this to run an entire nation.

J.R. Bob Dobbs help us TT


Edit: Also, animal science? Hmm....


his transcript is quite impressive:

+ Show Spoiler +
[image loading]



D in econ? shocking
wash uffitizi, drive me to firenze
Froadac
Profile Blog Joined July 2009
United States6733 Posts
October 25 2011 04:40 GMT
#63
Good god. This makes me sad to even identify with the Republican Party.

Ron Paul may want to cut a toooonnnn of stuff, but at least if you look at the numbers, and that stuff gets cut, money is saved.

Especially the stuff abroad.

Basically this is like "massive random taxcut with ambiguous spending cuts"
natrus
Profile Joined March 2011
United States102 Posts
October 25 2011 04:43 GMT
#64
am i seeing that right? a D in principles of economics?!?!
SC2 greatest RTS ever.
whiteguycash
Profile Joined April 2010
United States476 Posts
October 25 2011 04:45 GMT
#65
I don't understand how people who know jack shit about principles of economics, and the idea behind accounting are allowed to be in charge of the nation's financial plan. Please, can we just contract the budgeting to a major accounting firm, and be done with it?
theBOOCH
Profile Joined November 2010
United States832 Posts
October 25 2011 04:45 GMT
#66
Does this remind anyone of the income tax in Monopoly? Obviously most people, especially the ones that have people to do their taxes for them, are just going to choose the cheaper option. This isn't really tax reform, just a new way to make it seem like everyone's interests are at heart.
If all you're offering is Dos Equis, I will stay thirsty thank you very much.
TheBatman
Profile Joined January 2011
United States209 Posts
October 25 2011 04:47 GMT
#67
On October 25 2011 12:10 WTFZerg wrote:
Show nested quote +
On October 25 2011 12:03 jeremysaint wrote:
i swear americans live on another planet sometimes. the usa is going broke because of its ridiculously low taxes. 3rd lowest in western world. you dont need a tax cut, and unless you really hate people with low income you dont need a federal sales tax or any kind of flat tax.

sometimes complex problems and systems don't have a simple answer, and a tax code you pulled out of your ass on a whim will not help your finacial woes. if there are problems with the current system fix the problems, close the loopholes, force republicans to cooperate with the us govt and president for the good of the country, at least once.


[image loading]

Lose the federal spending limit and drop the choice between the two tax options and it could be sound.

Not bad Perry, buy whoever thought of it a beer and a promotion.

User was warned for this post



why was this guy warned?
Froadac
Profile Blog Joined July 2009
United States6733 Posts
October 25 2011 04:49 GMT
#68
On October 25 2011 13:47 TheBatman wrote:
Show nested quote +
On October 25 2011 12:10 WTFZerg wrote:
On October 25 2011 12:03 jeremysaint wrote:
i swear americans live on another planet sometimes. the usa is going broke because of its ridiculously low taxes. 3rd lowest in western world. you dont need a tax cut, and unless you really hate people with low income you dont need a federal sales tax or any kind of flat tax.

sometimes complex problems and systems don't have a simple answer, and a tax code you pulled out of your ass on a whim will not help your finacial woes. if there are problems with the current system fix the problems, close the loopholes, force republicans to cooperate with the us govt and president for the good of the country, at least once.


[image loading]

Lose the federal spending limit and drop the choice between the two tax options and it could be sound.

Not bad Perry, buy whoever thought of it a beer and a promotion.

User was warned for this post



why was this guy warned?

The facepalm.
GGTeMpLaR
Profile Blog Joined June 2009
United States7226 Posts
October 25 2011 04:50 GMT
#69
Is it me or are they all starting to come out with plans ever since Ron Paul did it lol
Froadac
Profile Blog Joined July 2009
United States6733 Posts
October 25 2011 04:51 GMT
#70
On October 25 2011 13:50 GGTeMpLaR wrote:
Is it me or are they all starting to come out with plans ever since Ron Paul did it lol

Well, 9-9-9 came first, I think.
fatfail
Profile Blog Joined December 2010
United States386 Posts
October 25 2011 04:54 GMT
#71
50% flat tax rate seems better in my opinion. I believe it is roughly what they have in China. With the slightly more transparent American government, things might actually work out.
Kong fan... <3 Stork <3 Jangbi <3 Yellow <3 Fantasy
TheBomb
Profile Joined October 2011
237 Posts
October 25 2011 04:59 GMT
#72
Actually it seems rather nice on the outside, but the fact that you can choose over the current tax and a new one still makes it overall a bad thing.

For example the guys who are exempt with the current tax code will just opt to be on the current tax and your average families are going to opt out of the current tax system believing its bad and end up actually paying more taxes.

Also he is a bilderberg member, he was in Bilderberg in Turkey, so I wouldn't tryst this guy.
Starcraft 2 needs LAN support
lithiumdeuteride
Profile Joined June 2011
96 Posts
Last Edited: 2011-10-25 05:01:26
October 25 2011 05:00 GMT
#73
I threw together an income tax bracket calculator in Excel, and I can inform you that the critical threshold is $94,500 for an individual, and $189,000 for a joint (married) filing. If you make more than this threshold, you get a net benefit from switching to the flat 20%. If you make less, switching to the flat 20% would be disadvantageous.

Who benefits from this plan? According to Wikipedia, a household income of $150,000 puts one in the top 6.04% of all households, and an income of $200,000 puts one in the top 2.87%. Linearly interpolating, we can estimate that an income of $189,000 would be in the top 3.57%, approximately.

In summary, those in the top 3.57% of incomes benefit from this plan, and everyone else sees no change. Rick Perry can kiss my ass.
Sweet bacteria of Liberia!
aethereality
Profile Joined February 2011
Canada62 Posts
October 25 2011 05:02 GMT
#74
On October 25 2011 13:29 Trezeguet wrote:
He did poorly at an relatively unimpressive school, but I think we are all smart enough to realize that he didn't really come up with any part of this tax plan. Can we please leave his terrible and pathetic grades out of this. He could have flunked out of college for all I care if he is smart enough to listen to people who didn't.

The real questions that need to be answered are 1. what is the effect on the lowest 50%? 2. what is the effect on the next 49%? 3. what is the effect on the top earners? 4. What is the overall effect on the total tax collection?



How can I trust that someone either lazy or stupid enough to fail hard at school is smart enough to listen to good advice, or differentiate between good and bad advice? I honestly don't care about any of his policies if it is shown that he is so lazy that he BARELY made it out of a low-end public college. I know people who study like 30 minutes per day and keep their gpa higher than that. Lazy people don't deserve my pocket money, nor yours.
Myrmidon
Profile Blog Joined December 2004
United States9452 Posts
Last Edited: 2011-10-25 05:06:51
October 25 2011 05:05 GMT
#75
On October 25 2011 14:00 lithiumdeuteride wrote:
I threw together an income tax bracket calculator in Excel, and I can inform you that the critical threshold is $94,500 for an individual, and $189,000 for a joint (married) filing. If you make more than this threshold, you get a net benefit from switching to the flat 20%. If you make less, you see no change at all.

Who benefits from this plan? According to Wikipedia, a household income of $150,000 puts one in the top 6.04% of all households, and an income of $200,000 puts one in the top 2.87%. Linearly interpolating, we can estimate that an income of $189,000 would be in the top 3.57%, approximately.

In summary, those in the top 3.57% of incomes benefit from this plan, and everyone else sees no change. Rick Perry can kiss my ass.


I don't think an Excel spreadsheet is large enough to hold all of the potential deductions and credits (that a lot of people are using), lol. edit: or did you account for the main ones already and average those in somehow? The numbers look off, but my intuition could be way off since I don't currently make that kind of money (while in school...) to care about that bracket.

In practice, this means that most or many people at those income levels you calculated actually pay less than 20%, so the real figure is a bit higher. Thus it's a smaller percentage who would benefit, than you think.

And by "benefit" I mean pay less taxes, which is worse overall.
samuraibael
Profile Joined February 2008
Australia294 Posts
October 25 2011 05:10 GMT
#76
On October 25 2011 12:13 Yergidy wrote:
Show nested quote +
On October 25 2011 12:03 jeremysaint wrote:
i swear americans live on another planet sometimes. the usa is going broke because of its ridiculously low taxes. 3rd lowest in western world. you dont need a tax cut, and unless you really hate people with low income you dont need a federal sales tax or any kind of flat tax.

sometimes complex problems and systems don't have a simple answer, and a tax code you pulled out of your ass on a whim will not help your finacial woes. if there are problems with the current system fix the problems, close the loopholes, force republicans to cooperate with the us govt and president for the good of the country, at least once.

That is your opinion. My opinion is that taking more money from businesses, big or small, reduces business expansion and hiring which in turn reduces overall tax revenue because when taxes are raised on businesses the customer suffers does because businesses HAVE to meet overhead or they can't function so they raise prices to keep their profit. Raising taxes does nothing but raise costs for everyone. While lower taxes gives businesses more money for expansion and hiring people and thus yields a higher return to the government in taxes.


What does this have to do with business tax? Its personal income tax.
Froadac
Profile Blog Joined July 2009
United States6733 Posts
October 25 2011 05:10 GMT
#77
He didn't even broaden the tax base. I don't see anywhere besides the laffer curve where he can even claim to make up the difference.
lithiumdeuteride
Profile Joined June 2011
96 Posts
October 25 2011 05:16 GMT
#78
On October 25 2011 14:05 Myrmidon wrote:
Show nested quote +
On October 25 2011 14:00 lithiumdeuteride wrote:
I threw together an income tax bracket calculator in Excel, and I can inform you that the critical threshold is $94,500 for an individual, and $189,000 for a joint (married) filing. If you make more than this threshold, you get a net benefit from switching to the flat 20%. If you make less, you see no change at all.

Who benefits from this plan? According to Wikipedia, a household income of $150,000 puts one in the top 6.04% of all households, and an income of $200,000 puts one in the top 2.87%. Linearly interpolating, we can estimate that an income of $189,000 would be in the top 3.57%, approximately.

In summary, those in the top 3.57% of incomes benefit from this plan, and everyone else sees no change. Rick Perry can kiss my ass.


I don't think an Excel spreadsheet is large enough to hold all of the potential deductions and credits (that a lot of people are using), lol. edit: or did you account for the main ones already and average those in somehow? The numbers look off, but my intuition could be way off since I don't currently make that kind of money (while in school...) to care about that bracket.

In practice, this means that most or many people at those income levels you calculated actually pay less than 20%, so the real figure is a bit higher. Thus it's a smaller percentage who would benefit, than you think.

And by "benefit" I mean pay less taxes, which is worse overall.

Yeah, I realize the deductions complicate everything. I did not account for any deductions. I simply looked at the US income tax brackets, and household income percentiles. The result is, as you said, that even fewer people will see a reduction in taxes than my calculation predicts. I stand by the sentiment that Rick Perry can kiss my ass.
Sweet bacteria of Liberia!
0neder
Profile Joined July 2009
United States3733 Posts
October 25 2011 05:22 GMT
#79
On October 25 2011 12:03 jeremysaint wrote:
i swear americans live on another planet sometimes. the usa is going broke because of its ridiculously low taxes. 3rd lowest in western world. you dont need a tax cut, and unless you really hate people with low income you dont need a federal sales tax or any kind of flat tax.

sometimes complex problems and systems don't have a simple answer, and a tax code you pulled out of your ass on a whim will not help your finacial woes. if there are problems with the current system fix the problems, close the loopholes, force republicans to cooperate with the us govt and president for the good of the country, at least once.

Jeremy, your complaints ironically display an even more simplistic viewpoint than you claim us Americans have. There is a reason that Republicans won back the House, and nearly the Senate. We looked at Europe, which is in some measure gradually learning that unbridled socialism is not sustainable, and at dozens of other examples from the last hundred years, and decided that maybe we passed the threshold at which government size is appropriate relative to our private sector's size.

Jeremy, are you aware that when Bush lowered taxes, revenues went up? How is that possible? I thought that tax rates had completely linear relationships with revenues?

People will mock this tax plan as imperfect and simplistic, but it's been 25 year since we cleaned house with our tax policy and there's no time like the present to review everything. The principle behid this plan is what's important.

Our current tax code is an extraordinary catalyst for creating the very collusion between business and government which you so deride.

And you say that politicians should be 'forced' to cooperate with 'the us govt' - is a politician only part of the us govt if they are democrat? How would you 'force' them to comply?

Do you realize the simplistic and dangerous potential when you start using words like 'force' and 'occupy' ? Those have led to many sad and tragic events throughout the years.
InRaged
Profile Joined February 2007
1047 Posts
October 25 2011 06:08 GMT
#80
On October 25 2011 14:22 0neder wrote:
Show nested quote +
On October 25 2011 12:03 jeremysaint wrote:
i swear americans live on another planet sometimes. the usa is going broke because of its ridiculously low taxes. 3rd lowest in western world. you dont need a tax cut, and unless you really hate people with low income you dont need a federal sales tax or any kind of flat tax.

sometimes complex problems and systems don't have a simple answer, and a tax code you pulled out of your ass on a whim will not help your finacial woes. if there are problems with the current system fix the problems, close the loopholes, force republicans to cooperate with the us govt and president for the good of the country, at least once.

Jeremy, are you aware that when Bush lowered taxes, revenues went up? How is that possible? I thought that tax rates had completely linear relationships with revenues?.

How is that possible? Very simple explanation: you're bullshiting, that's how ;P

http://www.cbo.gov/ftpdocs/108xx/doc10871/historicaltables.pdf
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