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On August 02 2011 20:50 endy wrote:Show nested quote +On August 02 2011 20:35 Evilmystic wrote:
I could never understand, how can be people against legal prostitution. The only problem I see with this particular case is that the girls don't pay taxes from their earnings and probably don't undergo medical tests for STD often enough. I hope you will read this post again if your daughter has to prostitute herself to finance her studies. Oh wait, you won't even know that she gets fucked by an 80 year old pervert. In my opinion the real discussion is not whether prostitution should be legal or not, it's about how shocking it is that college girls have to sell their bodies to finance their studies. And I am extremely shocked.
If my daughter (I have two) turns to prostitution then it must be either because she really likes the idea (there are people...) or because she sees no other way out of a bad situation. In that case, I'd like her to be as safe as possible doing that. Which can only be achieved with legalized prostitution. Try to look from the point of view of the prostitute before you judge them.
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In her profile on the site, Taylor describes herself as "a full-time college student studying psychology and looking to meet someone to help pay the bills."
Well there's the problem. I have no idea what job she thought she could have gotten with that type of degree. Should have taken some Engineering or practical science course.
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Russian Federation266 Posts
On August 02 2011 20:41 Wrongspeedy wrote:Show nested quote +On August 02 2011 20:35 Evilmystic wrote:
I could never understand, how can be people against legal prostitution. The only problem I see with this particular case is that the girls don't pay taxes from their earnings and probably don't undergo medical tests for STD often enough. Because thats your opinion, just because it cannot be changed doesn't make it right or wrong or unbiased. But there are plenty of people on this planet that don't think its right to take money for sex (for porn or prostitution, cause really whats the difference). You say "I could never understand?" Why? Is sex really like going to the grocery store for you? Or is it actually important who, where, when, and why it is happening?
It's not because it's not important for me with who, where, when and why I have sex, but because it's not somebody else's business what you do with your body and your time.
Prostitution should be regulated though to prevent mass STD transmission just like you have sanitary norms for public catering so you may expect to not get some disease from food you eat there.
On August 02 2011 20:50 endy wrote:Show nested quote +On August 02 2011 20:35 Evilmystic wrote:
I could never understand, how can be people against legal prostitution. The only problem I see with this particular case is that the girls don't pay taxes from their earnings and probably don't undergo medical tests for STD often enough. I hope you will read this post again if your daughter has to prostitute herself to finance her studies. Oh wait, you won't even know that she gets fucked by an 80 year old pervert. In my opinion the real discussion is not whether prostitution should be legal or not, it's about how shocking it is that college girls have to sell their bodies to finance their studies. And I am extremely shocked.
No one forces you to be prostitute, if you are only able to work as a one you still have option to live on street and die from starvation. But better to sell sex for money than die, right? And better to do it in legit brothels with regular medical examination and employment contract than in some underground shithole with junkie pimp and no protection.
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United States17920 Posts
To put this in the starcraft 2 vernacular: Minerals being mined. Read the article, nothing new.
Also On August 02 2011 12:25 Rickilicious wrote:
I'd do an old lady to pay off a student loan.
They don't have to be old. I found out 1 year into my first relationship my girlfriend was rich. God those were good times.
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great system you have, where people have to prostitute themselves so they can learn something advanced.
This world and their people make me so sick at times.
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Frankly the "paying for the studies" part is kind of a lie. There are probably some that do that just to pay for studies, especially in US. But here we have basically free university education that you can easily afford with even average part time job without taking any loans and quite a lot of female students still have sex for money.
As for legalization, it should be legal so taxes can be collected. Prostitution is present even if it is illegal, so there is not much point anyway.
EDIT:typo
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This makes me sick. No matter how much I whine about the German education system, I guess we're still better off than the country of freedom.
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On August 02 2011 21:01 BlackFlag wrote:
great system you have, where people have to prostitute themselves so they can learn something advanced.
This world and their people make me so sick at times.
I agree, this is disgusting...
I'm scared that in 10 years, mentality "evolved" and this stuff become more accepted among student and old perverts.
10 - 20k in debt is quite big when you're studying and have to pay bills. Thoses girls were screwed right from the start. The fact that some "arrangement" of the kind remain their best option make me want to vomit. I really don't like how things are evolving.
So now you're slaved by debt right from college. I wonder what'll happen when debt will arrive even earlier. I hope this subject will receive lots of attention as this is something that have to be fought against in my opinion. I mean how can we legally let this happen ? How can this be perfectly legal ?
Maybe it's better than nothing, as they'll be force to go into some underground system that might mean more risks if some "legal" "secured" websites didn't exist.
This article is about what happen in USA but I remember hearing some similar stories in France, where student girls have to prostitute themselves in order to pay their bills and studies. I hope that phenomen won't spread but the debt has a bright future as it will gradually increase over the years. Seriously, that make me sick...
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On August 02 2011 20:53 Badjas wrote:Show nested quote +On August 02 2011 20:50 endy wrote:On August 02 2011 20:35 Evilmystic wrote:
I could never understand, how can be people against legal prostitution. The only problem I see with this particular case is that the girls don't pay taxes from their earnings and probably don't undergo medical tests for STD often enough. I hope you will read this post again if your daughter has to prostitute herself to finance her studies. Oh wait, you won't even know that she gets fucked by an 80 year old pervert. In my opinion the real discussion is not whether prostitution should be legal or not, it's about how shocking it is that college girls have to sell their bodies to finance their studies. And I am extremely shocked. If my daughter (I have two) turns to prostitution then it must be either because she really likes the idea (there are people...) or because she sees no other way out of a bad situation. In that case, I'd like her to be as safe as possible doing that. Which can only be achieved with legalized prostitution. Try to look from the point of view of the prostitute before you judge them.
That's exactly the point I was trying to prove. That people should be shocked by the facts girls have to resort to prostitution to finance studies, instead of taking it lightly saying "oh it's better if it's legal so they get STD tested etc".
Obviously, if you ask anyone "if you daughter had to prostitute herself, would you prefer that she does it in a legal as safe as possible way, or that she does it in a filthy brothel ?" the answer will be the legal way. There isn't even a discussion about this.
The question we should ask ourselves is why our modern societies reached such a desperate situation that college girls have to sell their bodies only to be able to pay their college fees.
edit : glad to see the two posters above being sickened by this "find an arrangement" thing. It's really disgusting.
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I think its absurd the author of this article had so many words to say on the subject honestly. The scenario of young woman having sex with older men because they have money has been a fact of life virtually since currency has existed. The only thing of note is that as we find ourselves in the age of information, Its easier for people to pursue that relationship via the internet.
It's a sad fact of life that college is expensive. Given that, I dont see debt as a reason to sell your body. The article stated most woman have an average of 8,000 dollars in credit card debt. Here's a tip, stop trying to live beyond your means. Most people in the world spend money on luxuries, and excess. When you're throwing money away on clothes, alcohol at bars, and other things you dont really need, then the debt you've accumulated from school becomes another brick in the wall.
Granted I think the article puffs this up as a bigger deal than it really is. As I mentioned at the start of my post, powerful old men attract younger woman who has little of value outside their looks. Obviously this trend occurs for a reason. And if thats what that old man, and that young girl decide to do with their time, it's on their shoulders and no one else.
Sure there are extremes for both arguments. Some woman have no problem in effect selling themselves, and others feel they dont have a choice. But at the end of the day if you don't take responsibility for your actions then you bring nothing but pain into your life through unconscious choice.
The overwhelming majority of students handle the debt they've accumulated themselves. Ya, it sucks. But eventually you can pay it off on your own. The core of this article just highlights the problems we face as a society. I'm a believer in merit rising above all else. People are inherently good, at heart. I know this because I see evidence of it every single day, often times from unlikely individuals. And I think all people see that good in all other people too, they just bury it in ignorance because of fear.
In summary
Money, some people have a lot of it and others very little. To think that because you are not wealthy you must sacrifice who you are to acquire some is essentially denial of the power you possess as a person. And the only way to remedy that affliction completely is to embody yourself. Be who you are. Not the things you own, or the troubles you face.
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Prostitution should be 100% legal. Two consenting adults should be able to do whatever the hell they want.
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+ Show Spoiler +On August 02 2011 20:56 Evilmystic wrote:Show nested quote +On August 02 2011 20:41 Wrongspeedy wrote:On August 02 2011 20:35 Evilmystic wrote:
I could never understand, how can be people against legal prostitution. The only problem I see with this particular case is that the girls don't pay taxes from their earnings and probably don't undergo medical tests for STD often enough. Because thats your opinion, just because it cannot be changed doesn't make it right or wrong or unbiased. But there are plenty of people on this planet that don't think its right to take money for sex (for porn or prostitution, cause really whats the difference). You say "I could never understand?" Why? Is sex really like going to the grocery store for you? Or is it actually important who, where, when, and why it is happening? It's not because it's not important for me with who, where, when and why I have sex, but because it's not somebody else's business what you do with your body and your time. Prostitution should be regulated though to prevent mass STD transmission just like you have sanitary norms for public catering so you may expect to not get some disease from food you eat there. Show nested quote +On August 02 2011 20:50 endy wrote:On August 02 2011 20:35 Evilmystic wrote:
I could never understand, how can be people against legal prostitution. The only problem I see with this particular case is that the girls don't pay taxes from their earnings and probably don't undergo medical tests for STD often enough. I hope you will read this post again if your daughter has to prostitute herself to finance her studies. Oh wait, you won't even know that she gets fucked by an 80 year old pervert. In my opinion the real discussion is not whether prostitution should be legal or not, it's about how shocking it is that college girls have to sell their bodies to finance their studies. And I am extremely shocked. No one forces you to be prostitute, if you are only able to work as a one you still have option to live on street and die from starvation. But better to sell sex for money than die, right? And better to do it in legit brothels with regular medical examination and employment contract than in some underground shithole with junkie pimp and no protection.
I understand personal relationships are no ones business. But this is Business. Literally. I agree that prostitutes in general get a bad rap, and there is nothing wrong with having sex. But look at it from my point of view (even if you don't like it or agree with it). The guy paying for sex is weak, and should be spending his time (which he obviously has a lot of because he is rich) finding a partner (I dunno someone he doesn't have to pay to live with LOL). The girl taking money for sex is weak because she doesn't want to actually have to work and find a job to pay the bills (THAT she has accumulated on her own, knowing 100% that she would have to pay them, and there are ways to go to school without selling your body. Just because its not easy, doesn't mean it doesn't exist). Not to mention she may even regret doing it when she actually realizes that people she chooses to associate with later in life actually care about this sort of thing (because sex is important). They way I'm looking at it, its a lose-lose situation for both parties thats perpetuated by a system that allows it (IE the hook-up website). In the end the rich guy is still lonely (yet sexually satisfied for the moment) and the girl pays some bills (which she could have done some other way but made up excuses to have sex instead).
I hope you don't take this as me bashing you or anything, I just actually want to discuss this and see how people feel.
Edit:
On August 02 2011 21:25 Klaus1986 wrote:
Prostitution should be 100% legal. Two consenting adults should be able to do whatever the hell they want.
But its not : ).
Oh and I really like Sporadics post above me. The last paragraph summed up how I feel I think.
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This is standard in Romania. I'd be shocked if i DIDN'T find a good looking lower-middle class girl without a sugar daddy here. Oh, and it goes both ways too. Guys work out at the gym non stop, do modelling and whore themselves out to rich cougars so they can get expense paid trips to exotic countries and monthly allowance.
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On August 02 2011 21:25 Klaus1986 wrote:
Prostitution should be 100% legal. Two consenting adults should be able to do whatever the hell they want.
If by consenting you mean forced to do it by need, then no...
Have you read the article ? About that girl feeling dirty after doing that shit ?
You have some weird definition of consentment my friend...
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On August 02 2011 12:41 wongfeihung wrote:Show nested quote +Jennifer doesn't label what she's doing as prostitution. "I'm not a whore. Whores are paid by the hour, can have a high volume of clients in a given day, and it's based on money, not on who the individual actually is. There's no feeling involved and the entire interaction revolves around a sexual act," says Jennifer, who wears a $300 strapless dress purchased with money from her most recent conquest. The rest of the money, she says, went towards paying down her student loans.
"My situation is different in a number of different ways. First of all, I don't engage with a high volume of people, instead choosing one or two men I actually like spending time with and have decided to develop a friendship with them. And while sex is involved, the focus is on providing friendship. It's not only about getting paid." This idiot is just splitting hairs with her "definition" of what a whore is. In the end, she's lying to herself to make herself feel better about what she's doing. And while she might believe what she says, others most likely will not.
You speak the truth. If her relationships with the men were really based around providing a friendship then they ought to stop charging the men after a certain point. It is entirely about getting paid despite what she says.
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This has been going on for a while now, and most women will freely admit if they got married for the money or the man. Sucks, but that's why we have prenups.
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On August 02 2011 21:30 Diks wrote:Show nested quote +On August 02 2011 21:25 Klaus1986 wrote:
Prostitution should be 100% legal. Two consenting adults should be able to do whatever the hell they want. If by consenting you mean forced to do it by need, then no... Have you read the article ? About that girl feeling dirty after doing that shit ? You have some weird definition of consentment my friend...
That's one instance, have you seen Las Vegas call girls? Trust me, they don't need to be out there doing what they do.
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On August 02 2011 21:23 endy wrote:
The question we should ask ourselves is why our modern societies reached such a desperate situation that college girls have to sell their bodies only to be able to pay their college fees.
They really don't. They're largely choosing to do so on their own. These are girls at good universities (in line with the type of girls you find at high-end escort agencies), not girls who are impoverished. For the most part, students at such universities are from middle class or better socioeconomic backgrounds, and typically have their educations funded by their parents. Additionally, government and institutional financial aid is available to virtually all students.
In general, these are not girls who are being forced into prostitution. They are of above-average intellect and socioeconomic standing and even if not capable of accessing family funds can typically acquire reasonable paying part or full time jobs (something made even easier given that they're also generally physically attractive). Even if for some reason they do need more income than that can provide, less questionable forms of sex work such as stripping exist too. They are choosing to be sugar babies because it is easier than the alternatives, of having to do work-study or pick up a real job.
I actually have a friend who does something like this, and by her estimation, the majority of her peers are not girls who are desperate to pay for college. Rather, they're well-off girls who grew up spending on daddy's credit cards and now need a more 'independent' source of income. They tend to enjoy the high-class dates and romantic getaways as much or more than the actual spending money that they get out of it. And contrary to the picture presented by the article, not all of the clientele are dirty old men. Some of them are powerful, highly desirable and high status men who simply choose an escort/sugar baby arrangement out of a combination of laziness/need for discretion/unusual kinks.
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On August 02 2011 21:23 endy wrote:
The question we should ask ourselves is why our modern societies reached such a desperate situation that college girls have to sell their bodies only to be able to pay their college fees.
This is far and a way a rare situation where this is actually the case. There are systems like financial aid, grants from organizations, and scholarships. Individuals whom go to the most expensive schools often times come from a family with money themselves. When a less fortunate student attends a university they get help. And if they're going to an expensive school chances are good they will make at least decent money upon graduating. Community college is very cheap. Going to a state school in which you have residency, is very cheap. The depiction of these girls on these sites the article gives is a stretch to say the least.
If the girl does in fact need to make money from sex, she is either looking for a quick buck, or simply living beyond her means.
So if I could answer your question with another question. Do we blame society for putting an emphasis on status (money, car, where you live, what you wear); or do we blame the individual for buying into bullshit?
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On August 02 2011 21:34 GreEny K wrote:Show nested quote +On August 02 2011 21:30 Diks wrote:On August 02 2011 21:25 Klaus1986 wrote:
Prostitution should be 100% legal. Two consenting adults should be able to do whatever the hell they want. If by consenting you mean forced to do it by need, then no... Have you read the article ? About that girl feeling dirty after doing that shit ? You have some weird definition of consentment my friend... That's one instance, have you seen Las Vegas call girls? Trust me, they don't need to be out there doing what they do.
Are you merging 2 very different cases into one ?
Be cause it seems you do.
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EPT
