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Keep your off topic discussions out of this thread and show some damn respect! |
On July 25 2011 08:45 DBOWNIZZ wrote:Show nested quote +Oh come on. If there's anything to learn from all this it's that any ideology can be perverted into a justification for killing innocents. Christianity, islam, liberalism, socialism, animal rights, even pacifism, you name it and people have killed for it.
Devout muslims aren't any more or any less violent then devout christians, or whatever other ideological group you want to name. They all have their demons. Yea actually you can because there is no way in hell you can't say that there are just as many violent muslims in this world then there is violent christians. A huge portion of Muslims use violence and terror as a normal practice in there culture esp. against western civilized areas. You almost hardly ever hear about A Christian with bombs strapped to his chest killing people like you hear almost daily in the middle-east and muslims trying to prove a point, You never see pictures or videos of hundreds of christians revolting holding up signs saying "Christians will dominate this world" Like you do Muslims. (Not saying it doesn't happen but the percentage of violence in the muslim culture out weighs the violent attacks christians make. Lets face it the Quran promotes a shit ton of violence while the bible just promotes some. http://bp0.blogger.com/_tznAmKo1y8k/SJBuFnc87YI/AAAAAAAACrk/_qvZLrdN1fQ/s1600-h/Islam dominate.JPG
A vocal and highly visible minority is not the same as a whole group of people.
+ Show Spoiler +
Islam being viewed as a 'violent religion' in the U.S. follows the same road as the jews being viewed as dirty, untrustworthy people in Hitler's Germany.
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On July 25 2011 08:45 DBOWNIZZ wrote:Show nested quote +Oh come on. If there's anything to learn from all this it's that any ideology can be perverted into a justification for killing innocents. Christianity, islam, liberalism, socialism, animal rights, even pacifism, you name it and people have killed for it.
Devout muslims aren't any more or any less violent then devout christians, or whatever other ideological group you want to name. They all have their demons. Yea actually you can because there is no way in hell you can't say that there are just as many violent muslims in this world then there is violent christians. A huge portion of Muslims use violence and terror as a normal practice in there culture esp. against western civilized areas. You almost hardly ever hear about A Christian with bombs strapped to his chest killing people like you hear almost daily in the middle-east and muslims trying to prove a point, You never see pictures or videos of hundreds of christians revolting holding up signs saying "Christians will dominate this world" Like you do Muslims. (Not saying it doesn't happen but the percentage of violence in the muslim culture out weighs the violent attacks christians make. Lets face it the Quran promotes a shit ton of violence while the bible just promotes some. http://bp0.blogger.com/_tznAmKo1y8k/SJBuFnc87YI/AAAAAAAACrk/_qvZLrdN1fQ/s1600-h/Islam dominate.JPG
Inquisitions, Crusades, wars of religion, most antisemitist acts were all done by violent christians, want some more, my poor ignorant chap?"A huge portion" my ass, if you put all the extremist muslims together they won't add to 1% of their total population.
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On July 25 2011 08:51 Yazor wrote:
for me it is too hard to figure out why he did this but I am sure there was selfishness and other evil things involved
my deep condolences to the people in Norway
I wish I had your presence and peace of mind. I guess I shouldn't have been so curious about psychoanalyzing selfish demons. A combination of factors (his good looks, his claimed faith, and the "Knights Templar" thing) really screwed my brain over. I really need to get back to work.
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Sweden16951 Posts
This thread is getting pretty nasty now IMO. I mean: ''A huge portion of Muslims use violence and terror as a normal practice in there culture''. Come on...
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On July 25 2011 08:59 Jormundr wrote:Show nested quote +On July 25 2011 08:45 DBOWNIZZ wrote:Oh come on. If there's anything to learn from all this it's that any ideology can be perverted into a justification for killing innocents. Christianity, islam, liberalism, socialism, animal rights, even pacifism, you name it and people have killed for it.
Devout muslims aren't any more or any less violent then devout christians, or whatever other ideological group you want to name. They all have their demons. Yea actually you can because there is no way in hell you can't say that there are just as many violent muslims in this world then there is violent christians. A huge portion of Muslims use violence and terror as a normal practice in there culture esp. against western civilized areas. You almost hardly ever hear about A Christian with bombs strapped to his chest killing people like you hear almost daily in the middle-east and muslims trying to prove a point, You never see pictures or videos of hundreds of christians revolting holding up signs saying "Christians will dominate this world" Like you do Muslims. (Not saying it doesn't happen but the percentage of violence in the muslim culture out weighs the violent attacks christians make. Lets face it the Quran promotes a shit ton of violence while the bible just promotes some. http://bp0.blogger.com/_tznAmKo1y8k/SJBuFnc87YI/AAAAAAAACrk/_qvZLrdN1fQ/s1600-h/Islam dominate.JPG A vocal and highly visible minority is not the same as a whole group of people. + Show Spoiler +Islam being viewed as a 'violent religion' in the U.S. follows the same road as the jews being viewed as dirty, untrustworthy people in Hitler's Germany.
Very well said, sir
I think, back in the time, they achieved that with the propaganda and controle of the media.
The formula hasn't really changed
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United States43808 Posts
On July 25 2011 08:45 DBOWNIZZ wrote:Show nested quote +Oh come on. If there's anything to learn from all this it's that any ideology can be perverted into a justification for killing innocents. Christianity, islam, liberalism, socialism, animal rights, even pacifism, you name it and people have killed for it.
Devout muslims aren't any more or any less violent then devout christians, or whatever other ideological group you want to name. They all have their demons. Yea actually you can because there is no way in hell you can't say that there are just as many violent muslims in this world then there is violent christians. A huge portion of Muslims use violence and terror as a normal practice in there culture esp. against western civilized areas. You almost hardly ever hear about A Christian with bombs strapped to his chest killing people like you hear almost daily in the middle-east and muslims trying to prove a point, You never see pictures or videos of hundreds of christians revolting holding up signs saying "Christians will dominate this world" Like you do Muslims. (Not saying it doesn't happen but the percentage of violence in the muslim culture out weighs the violent attacks christians make. Lets face it the Quran promotes a shit ton of violence while the bible just promotes some. http://bp0.blogger.com/_tznAmKo1y8k/SJBuFnc87YI/AAAAAAAACrk/_qvZLrdN1fQ/s1600-h/Islam dominate.JPG
I suggest you go to Northern Ireland and explain to them how Christianity never caused any terrorism. I'm sure they'd love to hear you.
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It's pretty clear what his religious views are if you read his "manifest". That he identifies himself so strongly with Christianity probably originally comes from that he sees it as the opposite of what Muslims believe in and that Christianity is European "tradition". It's probably not an uncomplicated issue for him since he for example seem to like Norse Mythology as well.
Personally I got the impression that he really wants to be a strong Christian, that he thinks Christianity is great(he makes the that part crystal clear) etc, basically that he believes in Christianity like other strong believers. But with the exception that I don't think he actually believes that God exists. Which probably isn't very unique either though.
He doesn't seem to be a very complex person at all, he seems to wrestle with his arguably extreme patriotic feelings and his opinions seem to follow all basic patterns you would expect for someone like that.
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So it looks like he'll be trying to escape.
From his manifesto:
This depot is intended to work as a cache in a scenario where the Justiciar Knight survives his operation and where he faces apprehension and subsequent incarceration. When incarcerated, the Justiciar Knight should do everything in in his power to escape from prison. If he succeeds, he may initiate a “bonus operation” which consists of the assassination of 3-5 primary category B traitors/multiculturalists.
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On July 25 2011 09:26 tmtx wrote:So it looks like he'll be trying to escape. From his manifesto: Show nested quote +This depot is intended to work as a cache in a scenario where the Justiciar Knight survives his operation and where he faces apprehension and subsequent incarceration. When incarcerated, the Justiciar Knight should do everything in in his power to escape from prison. If he succeeds, he may initiate a “bonus operation” which consists of the assassination of 3-5 primary category B traitors/multiculturalists.
I hope they know about this...
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On July 25 2011 09:26 tmtx wrote:So it looks like he'll be trying to escape. From his manifesto: Show nested quote +This depot is intended to work as a cache in a scenario where the Justiciar Knight survives his operation and where he faces apprehension and subsequent incarceration. When incarcerated, the Justiciar Knight should do everything in in his power to escape from prison. If he succeeds, he may initiate a “bonus operation” which consists of the assassination of 3-5 primary category B traitors/multiculturalists. Hehe the most interesting part with that is that he most likely prepared a lot of stuff in case he manages to escape at some point. It's pretty clear if you read the following pages.
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On July 25 2011 09:30 mentallyafk wrote:Show nested quote +On July 25 2011 09:26 tmtx wrote:So it looks like he'll be trying to escape. From his manifesto: This depot is intended to work as a cache in a scenario where the Justiciar Knight survives his operation and where he faces apprehension and subsequent incarceration. When incarcerated, the Justiciar Knight should do everything in in his power to escape from prison. If he succeeds, he may initiate a “bonus operation” which consists of the assassination of 3-5 primary category B traitors/multiculturalists. I hope they know about this...
Nobody of that infamy escapes a modern high security prison. No Worries.
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i don't understand why you are discussing whether he is a christian or not. does it really matter? the guy murdered 90+ people and that's what you're worried about. please fill me in on what i seem to not understand.
religion/christianity in norway is a joke anyways
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On July 25 2011 09:33 OneRedBeard wrote:Show nested quote +On July 25 2011 09:30 mentallyafk wrote:On July 25 2011 09:26 tmtx wrote:So it looks like he'll be trying to escape. From his manifesto: This depot is intended to work as a cache in a scenario where the Justiciar Knight survives his operation and where he faces apprehension and subsequent incarceration. When incarcerated, the Justiciar Knight should do everything in in his power to escape from prison. If he succeeds, he may initiate a “bonus operation” which consists of the assassination of 3-5 primary category B traitors/multiculturalists. I hope they know about this... Nobody of that infamy escapes a modern high security prison. No Worries.
In Finland, a murderer sentenced for life in prison escaped by "climbing over the wall" so yeah it does happen o_O Not sure what you mean with "modern high security prison", though.
Suspect is going to speak in court today, seems like the police wants to make it a closed one because they don't want him to talk about his ideology to everyone, but I think that the decision is on the judge
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On July 25 2011 08:05 IzieBoy wrote:
I think it's truly saddening that he targeted basically innocents. I don't see the relation between youth activists and Islam. I send my condolences to the victims.
Let me elaborate; Breivik targeted those youths because they are the next generation of politicians of the Norwegian Labour Party. It seems to me that this whole tragedy is a personal vendetta to cripple the Government (which has been moslty led by The Labour Party post-WWII to present) who, in Breviks eyes, has f***ed up our country. Thats why he also chose to bomb the Government district in Oslo to distract the police, he hit two birds with stone.
In the manifesto it says that he resorted to violence as a last option because everything else he had tried, failed. Everything is his attempt to show us that our government has failed the nation and our national inheritance as norwegians, with a liberal immigration policy etc. Basically anyone from a third world country (Muslims as well as others) can move here and get free welfare, as long as they claim they are refugees.
And above all, he proves that the justice system is flawed because he, who murdered over 90 poeple with cold blood, can only get a sentence of max. 21 years. And while he's in jail, he lives a hotel life and has access to free education and whatnot.
This guy is not insane, but rather driven into madness by his beliefs. This is only what i've made out of watching the news non-stop the past two days and what i think is the reason behind what happened. And by the way, i'm not sympathizing with him, his actions were gruesome and disgusting. All i'm saying is that i somewhat agree with his beliefs.... screw being politically correct, LOL.
When i woke up the day after it happened and discovered that the kill-count had raised from 10 to 90 throughout the night, i almost threw up. All i could do was wander around aimlessly, thinking about the victims and their families. I was lucky enough and didn't have any acquaintanses at Utøya.
TL;DR
Breivik tried to cripple the government because he STRONGLY disagrees with the way they reign, and unfortunatly he chose to use violence and kill people.
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On July 25 2011 09:34 qwaykee wrote:
i don't understand why you are discussing whether he is a christian or not. does it really matter? the guy murdered 90+ people and that's what you're worried about. please fill me in on what i seem to not understand.
religion/christianity in norway is a joke anyways
I think it is important to correct miss information and understandings of such a brutal psychotic killer.
Also, I consider myself a fundamentalist Christian, and It's just wrong to bring him into the same category. It's like someone stating they are in the same family as you, and others accepting it as true. You would of course try to correct those who believe so with "I've never know this man, He doesn't have the same blood as me at all"
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On July 25 2011 09:49 ThePhan2m wrote:Show nested quote +On July 25 2011 09:34 qwaykee wrote:
i don't understand why you are discussing whether he is a christian or not. does it really matter? the guy murdered 90+ people and that's what you're worried about. please fill me in on what i seem to not understand.
religion/christianity in norway is a joke anyways I think it is important to correct miss information and understandings of such a brutal psychotic killer. Also, I consider myself a fundamentalist Christian, and It's just wrong to bring him into the same category. It's like someone stating they are in the same family as you, and others accepting it as true. You would of course try to correct those who believe so with "I've never know this man, He doesn't have the same blood as me at all"
Guess how muslims must feel. I think that was the point why this discussion came up anyway. (not that you're wrong)
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On July 25 2011 09:34 qwaykee wrote:
i don't understand why you are discussing whether he is a christian or not. does it really matter? the guy murdered 90+ people and that's what you're worried about. please fill me in on what i seem to not understand.
religion/christianity in norway is a joke anyways Well, people will discuss why he did what he did for many years, nothing strange with that. That discussion is probably impossible without mention religions since he did what he did(from his perspective) to fight a religion. He even wrote 1500 pages about it.
Anyhow, he did what he did for, from his perspective patriotic/religious reasons but that doesn't mean that we can't have mature discussions about his motives.
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Man, this is just horrible beyond words.
Is there a fund we can donate to or some concrete way to help the Norwegians affected?
Like donating to a scholarship fund for the kids?
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EPT![[image loading]](http://www.mediaite.com/wp-content/uploads/2011/01/westboro_baptist_church_drones_church.jpg)
