After hearing all the hype that these movies have gotten I tried to go back and watch Batman Begins. As a huge fan of the animated series from the 90's, the movie from 89, and the occasional story arc of a comic series I have to say I was incredibly disappointed. So many character inaccuracies if they didn't have the same name you'd never know it was related to Batman at all. Ra's al ghoul training batman...what? Ra's without Talia at his side...what again? Even the pronunciation of Ra's name is wrong. Bruce wane being a whiny kid with a love interest that isn't as insane as his enemies...? Not even getting into all the ways they destroyed Scarecrow the movie as a whole was incredibly painful to watch. But I suffered through to get to The Dark Knight and what people are calling the best joker performance ever.
While The Dark Knight wasn't as painful as Batman Begins it was still a let down. More character inaccuracies which I guess shouldn't have surprised me. Joker getting his smile from razors and using makeup to portray his white face made me cringe. Joker is such a hard character to write for and it was painfully obvious Nolan missed the que by quite a bit. We didn't get the completely insane, psychotic, and murderous clown, but instead just some eccentric sociopath. Heath Ledger did alright as the joker but it still cant compare to Jack Nicholson or Mark Hamill's Joker at all. Their talent backed up by better writing made the Jokers of the past truly something special. Not to mention the iconic laugh that Mark Hamill hit oh so amazingly.
Now you may be wondering what the point of this ranting-ish post is. When it comes to The Dark Knight Rises I can only look onto it with skepticism. The characters in the past movies have only been a far cry of their better renditions. It makes me sad that writers from Rocksteady can deliver such an amazing Batman experience, and yet something as off-beat and underwhelming as the past Nolan "works" are praised.
On December 24 2011 03:26 jupiter6 wrote: lol are you seriously banning people who have different opinion than yours? this site is a joke
If you look at his nickname for a second, you already see that he's a troll or a PBU. Then look at his other post that bumps a two year old thread, just to mock moto. And finally this low quality post. I think this one post would have been only warning worthy, but together with the other two factors it's an obvious perm bad.
Zynastor is a well known maphack creator. He's banned on TL due to TL's anti hacker stance. While personally I don't support this policy, it's very understandable to be strict against hackers and hack creators on a website that is based on competitive gaming.
iCafe.Moto was making anti-hack maps, he claimed were unbeatable, and which usually were broken within the week(In some cases by Zynastor). He was also banned on multiple accounts for low quality posting. He is known for his strange smilies and his attitude. iCafe.Zynastor's post fits this pattern.
Thus anybody using the nick "iCafe.Zynastor" is either a troll(the likely case) or one of these two. In either case he's not welcome here.
On December 24 2011 04:27 Luxuria wrote: After hearing all the hype that these movies have gotten I tried to go back and watch Batman Begins. As a huge fan of the animated series from the 90's, the movie from 89, and the occasional story arc of a comic series I have to say I was incredibly disappointed. So many character inaccuracies if they didn't have the same name you'd never know it was related to Batman at all. Ra's al ghoul training batman...what? Ra's without Talia at his side...what again? Even the pronunciation of Ra's name is wrong. Bruce wane being a whiny kid with a love interest that isn't as insane as his enemies...? Not even getting into all the ways they destroyed Scarecrow the movie as a whole was incredibly painful to watch. But I suffered through to get to The Dark Knight and what people are calling the best joker performance ever.
While The Dark Knight wasn't as painful as Batman Begins it was still a let down. More character inaccuracies which I guess shouldn't have surprised me. Joker getting his smile from razors and using makeup to portray his white face made me cringe. Joker is such a hard character to write for and it was painfully obvious Nolan missed the que by quite a bit. We didn't get the completely insane, psychotic, and murderous clown, but instead just some eccentric sociopath. Heath Ledger did alright as the joker but it still cant compare to Jack Nicholson or Mark Hamill's Joker at all. Their talent backed up by better writing made the Jokers of the past truly something special. Not to mention the iconic laugh that Mark Hamill hit oh so amazingly.
Now you may be wondering what the point of this ranting-ish post is. When it comes to The Dark Knight Rises I can only look onto it with skepticism. The characters in the past movies have only been a far cry of their better renditions. It makes me sad that writers from Rocksteady can deliver such an amazing Batman experience, and yet something as off-beat and underwhelming as the past Nolan "works" are praised.
So, you hate on Nolan's Batman for not following the comics closely, but you enjoy Burton's where the Joker killed Batman's parents?
So, you hate on Nolan's Batman for not following the comics closely, but you enjoy Burton's where the Joker killed Batman's parents?
wat?
I completely forgot about that. I've been re-watching the Animated series so I guess the 89 movie fell into nostalgia.
So now disregard your original rant on the terms that you were just being nostalgic.
As a huge comic book fan, I don't want to hate on anyone for not liking something for not being true to the original. To me, that is a completely legitimate gripe. But as a comic fan, I've seen MANY interpretations of the same characters by different artists and writers. Movies are just another interpretation. Their accuracy to the original material should be taken into account when you consider whether you liked the movie or not, but it's only one part of the many things that go into a film.
Look at the Green Lantern film that just came out. While I was never a big Green Lantern fan, my understanding is that the movie followed the comics quite closely. There were of course things that the die hard fans weren't happy about, but they clearly put the effort in to recreating what they could of the comic. And guess what? It was still fucking terrible.
So yeah, I can agree with you that Nolan's Batman isn't the one true Batman that all others should be compared to. It's still very enjoyable though, and you shouldn't let some inaccuracies ruin your entire experience of the films.
On December 24 2011 04:27 Luxuria wrote: After hearing all the hype that these movies have gotten I tried to go back and watch Batman Begins. As a huge fan of the animated series from the 90's, the movie from 89, and the occasional story arc of a comic series I have to say I was incredibly disappointed. So many character inaccuracies if they didn't have the same name you'd never know it was related to Batman at all. Ra's al ghoul training batman...what? Ra's without Talia at his side...what again? Even the pronunciation of Ra's name is wrong. Bruce wane being a whiny kid with a love interest that isn't as insane as his enemies...? Not even getting into all the ways they destroyed Scarecrow the movie as a whole was incredibly painful to watch. But I suffered through to get to The Dark Knight and what people are calling the best joker performance ever.
While The Dark Knight wasn't as painful as Batman Begins it was still a let down. More character inaccuracies which I guess shouldn't have surprised me. Joker getting his smile from razors and using makeup to portray his white face made me cringe. Joker is such a hard character to write for and it was painfully obvious Nolan missed the que by quite a bit. We didn't get the completely insane, psychotic, and murderous clown, but instead just some eccentric sociopath. Heath Ledger did alright as the joker but it still cant compare to Jack Nicholson or Mark Hamill's Joker at all. Their talent backed up by better writing made the Jokers of the past truly something special. Not to mention the iconic laugh that Mark Hamill hit oh so amazingly.
Now you may be wondering what the point of this ranting-ish post is. When it comes to The Dark Knight Rises I can only look onto it with skepticism. The characters in the past movies have only been a far cry of their better renditions. It makes me sad that writers from Rocksteady can deliver such an amazing Batman experience, and yet something as off-beat and underwhelming as the past Nolan "works" are praised.
Remaking a piece of fiction and giving your own spin to it is one of the best parts of comic books, movies, and other media. Just because it's different doesn't mean it's bad.
Where does it say every portrayal of the joker needs to be the same? Why can't he be more of a terrorist sociopath?
Now, I'm fine with you saying the other renditions are better, that's logical. But the argument you're using is "the new ones are bad because they're different", is silly.
To address the other points you made:
I think the make-up was a brilliant touch, and also, you seem to have missed the one of the most intriguing points of The Dark Knight, the joker consistently changes the story of how he gets his scars. He mentions razor blades, but also a kitchen knife from his father. Maybe both of those stories are false? It leaves the audience to paint a sinister picture in their head, and makes the joker an even more mysterious and frightening character. Nolan did good job creating a depth there, and it appears you completely missed it.
On December 24 2011 04:27 Luxuria wrote: After hearing all the hype that these movies have gotten I tried to go back and watch Batman Begins. As a huge fan of the animated series from the 90's, the movie from 89, and the occasional story arc of a comic series I have to say I was incredibly disappointed. So many character inaccuracies if they didn't have the same name you'd never know it was related to Batman at all. Ra's al ghoul training batman...what? Ra's without Talia at his side...what again? Even the pronunciation of Ra's name is wrong. Bruce wane being a whiny kid with a love interest that isn't as insane as his enemies...? Not even getting into all the ways they destroyed Scarecrow the movie as a whole was incredibly painful to watch. But I suffered through to get to The Dark Knight and what people are calling the best joker performance ever.
While The Dark Knight wasn't as painful as Batman Begins it was still a let down. More character inaccuracies which I guess shouldn't have surprised me. Joker getting his smile from razors and using makeup to portray his white face made me cringe. Joker is such a hard character to write for and it was painfully obvious Nolan missed the que by quite a bit. We didn't get the completely insane, psychotic, and murderous clown, but instead just some eccentric sociopath. Heath Ledger did alright as the joker but it still cant compare to Jack Nicholson or Mark Hamill's Joker at all. Their talent backed up by better writing made the Jokers of the past truly something special. Not to mention the iconic laugh that Mark Hamill hit oh so amazingly.
Now you may be wondering what the point of this ranting-ish post is. When it comes to The Dark Knight Rises I can only look onto it with skepticism. The characters in the past movies have only been a far cry of their better renditions. It makes me sad that writers from Rocksteady can deliver such an amazing Batman experience, and yet something as off-beat and underwhelming as the past Nolan "works" are praised.
I respect your opinion, but I have to disagree. I also must admit that the animated series of batman was pretty boss, but then again I was like 6 or 7 at the time when I was watching it so I may be looking through the nostalgia lens. (Much like the X-men cartoon in my books is still one of the most awesome things ever written)
As for Batman Begins - I didn't find that movie particularly great. The first time I watched it in the theater I was pretty entertained, but when I bought it for Christmas and brought it home for my girlfriend and I to watch at the time, after about 30 minutes we lost interest and found something better to do... You know, I'd honestly put that movie under the category of movies you put on when you don't actually *want* to watch the movie. I realize this come down to taste too. I will say it was an improvement in terms of bringing the batman movies back towards a more adult viewership.
The Dark Knight was exceptional I thought. The first time I watched that movie in the theater I walked out and thought that was the best movie I'd seen in years. I thoroughly enjoyed the take on the Joker, and found the character absolutely captivating. The ending of the movie sent chills down my spine. I've watched multiple times since, and I maintain the opinion that it's a great movie. The overall context of the movie was well done, much like Spiderman 2, in that it gave a sense of realism to the story. I also thought the subtext of what the Joker's character was trying to portray was quite clever. I love that you're never sure if he's completely insane, or absolutely brilliant. The way he plans things and keeps you guessing is pretty great, and I thoroughly enjoyed that aspect of the movie.
Because of the hit and miss nature for me with these movies, I am merely hoping the next movie will live up to the 2nd. If I've learned anything from the spiderman movie franchise it's to not get my hopes up with regards to super hero movies. Either way, I am excited to see what kind of direction they go with this movie and hope it can provide some entertainment beyond the initial watch.
On December 24 2011 04:27 Luxuria wrote: After hearing all the hype that these movies have gotten I tried to go back and watch Batman Begins. As a huge fan of the animated series from the 90's, the movie from 89, and the occasional story arc of a comic series I have to say I was incredibly disappointed. So many character inaccuracies if they didn't have the same name you'd never know it was related to Batman at all. Ra's al ghoul training batman...what? Ra's without Talia at his side...what again? Even the pronunciation of Ra's name is wrong. Bruce wane being a whiny kid with a love interest that isn't as insane as his enemies...? Not even getting into all the ways they destroyed Scarecrow the movie as a whole was incredibly painful to watch. But I suffered through to get to The Dark Knight and what people are calling the best joker performance ever.
While The Dark Knight wasn't as painful as Batman Begins it was still a let down. More character inaccuracies which I guess shouldn't have surprised me. Joker getting his smile from razors and using makeup to portray his white face made me cringe. Joker is such a hard character to write for and it was painfully obvious Nolan missed the que by quite a bit. We didn't get the completely insane, psychotic, and murderous clown, but instead just some eccentric sociopath. Heath Ledger did alright as the joker but it still cant compare to Jack Nicholson or Mark Hamill's Joker at all. Their talent backed up by better writing made the Jokers of the past truly something special. Not to mention the iconic laugh that Mark Hamill hit oh so amazingly.
Now you may be wondering what the point of this ranting-ish post is. When it comes to The Dark Knight Rises I can only look onto it with skepticism. The characters in the past movies have only been a far cry of their better renditions. It makes me sad that writers from Rocksteady can deliver such an amazing Batman experience, and yet something as off-beat and underwhelming as the past Nolan "works" are praised.
I respect your opinion, but I have to disagree. I also must admit that the animated series of batman was pretty boss, but then again I was like 6 or 7 at the time when I was watching it so I may be looking through the nostalgia lens. (Much like the X-men cartoon in my books is still one of the most awesome things ever written)
As for Batman Begins - I didn't find that movie particularly great. The first time I watched it in the theater I was pretty entertained, but when I bought it for Christmas and brought it home for my girlfriend and I to watch at the time, after about 30 minutes we lost interest and found something better to do... You know, I'd honestly put that movie under the category of movies you put on when you don't actually *want* to watch the movie. I realize this come down to taste too. I will say it was an improvement in terms of bringing the batman movies back towards a more adult viewership.
The Dark Knight was exceptional I thought. The first time I watched that movie in the theater I walked out and thought that was the best movie I'd seen in years. I thoroughly enjoyed the take on the Joker, and found the character absolutely captivating. The ending of the movie sent chills down my spine. I've watched multiple times since, and I maintain the opinion that it's a great movie. The overall context of the movie was well done, much like Spiderman 2, in that it gave a sense of realism to the story. I also thought the subtext of what the Joker's character was trying to portray was quite clever. I love that you're never sure if he's completely insane, or absolutely brilliant. The way he plans things and keeps you guessing is pretty great, and I thoroughly enjoyed that aspect of the movie.
Because of the hit and miss nature for me with these movies, I am merely hoping the next movie will live up to the 2nd. If I've learned anything from the spiderman movie franchise it's to not get my hopes up with regards to super hero movies. Either way, I am excited to see what kind of direction they go with this movie and hope it can provide some entertainment beyond the initial watch.
I agree with you 100%. The Dark Knight will probably be a classic, because the acting and the story (particular Heath as the Joker) were phenomenal, and I can watch it again and again. As far as Batman Begins goes, I feel it was good for what it was: an origin story that laid the groundwork for the sequel. I can only hope that DKR will be as good as DK and serve as an adequate conclusion.
As far as comic book continuity goes, I appreciate Nolans take on the Batman universe. I like the gritty, dark, realistic feel it has to it, and I'm one of the biggest Batman comic fans there is. I have a collection of just under 1000 Batman comics at home.
I'm not going to lie, every time I hear someone dislike one of the first two movies, I believe that it's some kind of hipster uniqueness thing where they dislike a good movie just to stand out. TDKR is going to be awesome, I can guarentee, although I am a little suprised at Bane's size. He's...not that big. Yeah, the whole 500lb muscle mass, venom-infused bane doesn't work in the Nolan Batman, but he should be just about as big as they get, like Brock Lesnar big at least.
On December 24 2011 10:58 Lobotomist wrote: I'm not going to lie, every time I hear someone dislike one of the first two movies, I believe that it's some kind of hipster uniqueness thing where they dislike a good movie just to stand out. TDKR is going to be awesome, I can guarentee, although I am a little suprised at Bane's size. He's...not that big. Yeah, the whole 500lb muscle mass, venom-infused bane doesn't work in the Nolan Batman, but he should be just about as big as they get, like Brock Lesnar big at least.
Thing is, there aren't that many quality actors that are that large. In fact, I can't think of any.
On December 24 2011 10:58 Lobotomist wrote: I'm not going to lie, every time I hear someone dislike one of the first two movies, I believe that it's some kind of hipster uniqueness thing where they dislike a good movie just to stand out. TDKR is going to be awesome, I can guarentee, although I am a little suprised at Bane's size. He's...not that big. Yeah, the whole 500lb muscle mass, venom-infused bane doesn't work in the Nolan Batman, but he should be just about as big as they get, like Brock Lesnar big at least.
I think a lot of the 'hipster' criticisms are just a natural backlash to the praise some people give the films. Many people call the Dark Knight one of the best films of all time, or their personal favourite film. Now there's nothing wrong with loving a film, but the Dark Knight isn't a masterpiece - it's fun but has flaws.
Personally I got more out of Batman Returns than either of Nolan's films, though I still enjoyed them too, and am looking forward to the new one.
On December 24 2011 10:58 Lobotomist wrote: I'm not going to lie, every time I hear someone dislike one of the first two movies, I believe that it's some kind of hipster uniqueness thing where they dislike a good movie just to stand out. TDKR is going to be awesome, I can guarentee, although I am a little suprised at Bane's size. He's...not that big. Yeah, the whole 500lb muscle mass, venom-infused bane doesn't work in the Nolan Batman, but he should be just about as big as they get, like Brock Lesnar big at least.
"Begins" just wasn't that special. Both in terms of works Nolan made himself and in the greater spectrum of film. It was above average but many levels below "The Dark Knight."
On December 24 2011 10:58 Lobotomist wrote: I'm not going to lie, every time I hear someone dislike one of the first two movies, I believe that it's some kind of hipster uniqueness thing where they dislike a good movie just to stand out. TDKR is going to be awesome, I can guarentee, although I am a little suprised at Bane's size. He's...not that big. Yeah, the whole 500lb muscle mass, venom-infused bane doesn't work in the Nolan Batman, but he should be just about as big as they get, like Brock Lesnar big at least.
Thing is, there aren't that many quality actors that are that large. In fact, I can't think of any.
I was watching quality actors before they were mainstream.
I'm rewatching the Dark Knight now, and I'm just blown away by how emotionally stressful it is. Especially with how good Aaron Eckhart played Harvey Dent. It's torture knowing that such an awesome character will meet his demise. That's how you know it is a good movie.
On December 24 2011 10:58 Lobotomist wrote: I'm not going to lie, every time I hear someone dislike one of the first two movies, I believe that it's some kind of hipster uniqueness thing where they dislike a good movie just to stand out. TDKR is going to be awesome, I can guarentee, although I am a little suprised at Bane's size. He's...not that big. Yeah, the whole 500lb muscle mass, venom-infused bane doesn't work in the Nolan Batman, but he should be just about as big as they get, like Brock Lesnar big at least.
Thing is, there aren't that many quality actors that are that large. In fact, I can't think of any.
I was watching quality actors before they were mainstream.
On December 24 2011 12:02 ryanAnger wrote: I'm rewatching the Dark Knight now, and I'm just blown away by how emotionally stressful it is. Especially with how good Aaron Eckhart played Harvey Dent. It's torture knowing that such an awesome character will meet his demise. That's how you know it is a good movie.
It really just does not let off, it's climax after climax and it's incredibly stressful the whole way through. It actually kind of drags the third act down because by then you're exhausted by the brutality of the movie and it can make things feel kind of tired.
EPT
