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Thread is about the various issues surrounding Japan in the aftermath of the recent earthquake. Don't bring the shit side of the internet to the thread, and post with the realization that this thread is very important, and very real, to your fellow members.
Do not post speculative and unconfirmed news you saw on TV or anywhere else. Generally the more dramatic it sounds the less likely it's true. |
On March 17 2011 01:28 mTw|NarutO wrote:
The japanese reactors were insanely safe and they were not damaged (at least not mentioned) by the earthquake NOR by the tsunami. The reason it all went downhill was that the tsunami damaged the cooling system or actually not even that, but due to power outage and flooded diesel generators the cooling could not continue..
from that point on, we all know the story. But thats offtopic. Hopefully they can prevent further damage.
Not so safe after all: wikileak on japanese nuclear safety published by daily telegraph
Naturally, governments and nuclear power companies have the control over infromation regarding risks and safety and it is in their interest to provide an overly optimistic view.
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On March 17 2011 01:28 r.Evo wrote:
I'm finding the individual countries press really interesting from what I'm getting from this thread:
Fearmongering:
Germany (because of upcoming elections and the hope that an anti-nuclear power point of view might swing things in favor of the current ruling party)
France (because the japanese plants are from the US and not from France - any other reason for this?)
Russia (Because their experts aren't let into Japan and to point the finger at someone to make Chernobyl look better?)
Non-Fearmongering:
Finland
Japan
United Kingdom
Anything important I missed?
I was just watching US news on CNN with my mom, and they are definitely fear mongering too.
"omg people are fleeing the country of Japan!"
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On March 17 2011 01:28 r.Evo wrote:
Russia (Because their experts aren't let into Japan and to point the finger at someone to make Chernobyl look better?)
Anything important I missed?
Nah, dude, nobody wants to make Tchernobyl look better, we all know how bad it was and for Russian government it is even more important to make it look worse, because it is one of those awful mistakes that Soviet Union made in its time. Since the whole idea now for the goverment is to turn the page and prove the fresh start it is obvious that Tchernobyl should be treated as a major failure of USSR.
But the other thing is that Russia and Japan are in serious political battle over the Kuryl islands. Since Japan sees Russia as an invader there it is very important for the goverment to act as a good guy to prove, that they still want to be friends with Japanese even tho Russians do not want to discuss the posession of the islands.
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while i was reading some stuff regarding nuclear power, i stumbled across some interesting information. According to this site http://de.wikipedia.org/wiki/Transportbehälterlager_Gorleben nuclear waste (which i understand are used fuel rods) inside these containers http://de.wikipedia.org/wiki/Castor_(Kerntechnik) has a temperature of 400°C. It takes 20-30 years to lower that to 200°C. Since the boiling point of water is 100°C that means you have to constanly cool down the waste or replace the water.
Are those numbers in any way comparable to the Fukushima situation, i.e. will they have to douse the rods for as long as it takes for them to construct a cooling solution and thus leaking radioactive water into the sea for all that time? I was somehow under the impression that cooling down the rods to a level where it wouldn't boil away the water was a matter of days (was never stated, but all the news about the radiation levels make it sound like they can't keep up with the way they are cooling down the rods at the moments for much longer).
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Finnish news:
Japanese officials worried about the used fuel tank of 3. and 4. reactors, says IAEA. The reason is super technical and I can't translate it, something to do with parts of the uranium having transformed into radioactive something and transuranium something something.
America's having their soldiers stay more than 80km away from the Fukushima plant without special permission, USA giving iodine pills to their air force in Japan
IAEA boss Yukiya Amano says he's traveling to Japan asap, has earlier said that he'd want the japanese government to keep him better informed about the nuclear incident
EU asks european countries to check stuff coming from japan for radioactivity
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On March 17 2011 01:48 AntiLegend wrote:while i was reading some stuff regarding nuclear power, i stumbled across some interesting information. According to this site http://de.wikipedia.org/wiki/Transportbehälterlager_Gorleben nuclear waste (which i understand are used fuel rods) inside these containers http://de.wikipedia.org/wiki/Castor_(Kerntechnik) has a temperature of 400°C. It takes 20-30 years to lower that to 200°C. Since the boiling point of water is 100°C that means you have to constanly cool down the waste or replace the water. Are those numbers in any way comparable to the Fukushima situation, i.e. will they have to douse the rods for as long as it takes for them to construct a cooling solution and thus leaking radioactive water into the sea for all that time? I was somehow under the impression that cooling down the rods to a level where it wouldn't boil away the water was a matter of days (was never stated, but all the news about the radiation levels make it sound like they can't keep up with the way they are cooling down the rods at the moments for much longer).
Well I don't know much but just thinking about it the answer should be both yes and no, the big importance is that the temperature does not exceed the limits of it's hull, which is 3k degrees or something, I think or maybe it was something different. Or whatever things are close and in danger, so I don't see a big risk of there actually not being water in the used rods facility in the same way, depending on what stage they are in ofc. This is where those 10 days everyone talks about comes in handy I would guess.
Just guesswork and sorry if so but it feels reasonable to me.
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On March 17 2011 01:28 r.Evo wrote:
Fearmongering:
Germany (because of upcoming elections and the hope that an anti-nuclear power point of view might swing things in favor of the current ruling party)
That's not correct. The current ruling party (the CDU/CSU, in coalition with the FDP) has been on the side of more nuclear power in the near future, it's the opposition (especially the Green Party) that has argued more strongly in favor of a quicker move away from nuclear power.
If anything, the news coverage I'm seeing here is using an anti-nuclear stance to attack the ruling party, not to support it.
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On March 17 2011 01:03 IntoTheWow wrote:
From what I've been reading, the French are making a big deal about this cause the Japanese bought reactors from the US, instead of the Framatome/Areva models.
At first when I read that, I thought you were a bad guy attacking my country, was starting to get all blue white red. But seriously, I think you are right, when we know the link between our politician, especially our midget president, and the big french company such as Areva (society mainly known for nuclear power). Sarkozy already tried to sell various stuff to other country, like that Rafale that nobody want.
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Zurich15366 Posts
On March 17 2011 01:50 AmericanUmlaut wrote:Show nested quote +On March 17 2011 01:28 r.Evo wrote:
Fearmongering:
Germany (because of upcoming elections and the hope that an anti-nuclear power point of view might swing things in favor of the current ruling party) That's not correct. The current ruling party (the CDU/CSU, in coalition with the FDP) has been on the side of more nuclear power in the near future, it's the opposition (especially the Green Party) that has argued more strongly in favor of a quicker move away from nuclear power. If anything, the news coverage I'm seeing here is using an anti-nuclear stance to attack the ruling party, not to support it.
I think what he is trying to say is that in light of the upcoming election the current conservative coalition is trying to save some votes with their 180 turn into instashutdown.
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Russia (Because their experts aren't let into Japan and to point the finger at someone to make Chernobyl look better?) .
This is just dumb. Chernobyl was an incident in Ukraine.
The other regions you listed, like the UK, also perpetrate "fearmongering". The fact of the matter is, at one point or another, some nut with an agenda is going to get the floor on a major media outlet and spread his filth - distracting us away from the issue at hand.
I'm very glad for this thread, but please, let's not focus on these "fearmongerers" and maintain our attention to the crisis at hand.
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On March 17 2011 02:03 oceanblack wrote:Show nested quote +Russia (Because their experts aren't let into Japan and to point the finger at someone to make Chernobyl look better?) . This is just dumb. Chernobyl was an incident in Ukraine.
You do know that pre 1991 there was a huge country called the USSR which happened to include today's Ukraine, do you?
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![[image loading]](http://i.imgur.com/MKadO.jpg)
Inspiring :O
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On March 17 2011 02:23 Southlight wrote:Inspiring :O
Wow. Thats actually really really cool.
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My condolences to those in Japan right now.
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On March 17 2011 01:50 Yttrasil wrote:Show nested quote +On March 17 2011 01:48 AntiLegend wrote:while i was reading some stuff regarding nuclear power, i stumbled across some interesting information. According to this site http://de.wikipedia.org/wiki/Transportbehälterlager_Gorleben nuclear waste (which i understand are used fuel rods) inside these containers http://de.wikipedia.org/wiki/Castor_(Kerntechnik) has a temperature of 400°C. It takes 20-30 years to lower that to 200°C. Since the boiling point of water is 100°C that means you have to constanly cool down the waste or replace the water. Are those numbers in any way comparable to the Fukushima situation, i.e. will they have to douse the rods for as long as it takes for them to construct a cooling solution and thus leaking radioactive water into the sea for all that time? I was somehow under the impression that cooling down the rods to a level where it wouldn't boil away the water was a matter of days (was never stated, but all the news about the radiation levels make it sound like they can't keep up with the way they are cooling down the rods at the moments for much longer). Well I don't know much but just thinking about it the answer should be both yes and no, the big importance is that the temperature does not exceed the limits of it's hull, which is 3k degrees or something, I think or maybe it was something different. Or whatever things are close and in danger, so I don't see a big risk of there actually not being water in the used rods facility in the same way, depending on what stage they are in ofc. This is where those 10 days everyone talks about comes in handy I would guess. Just guesswork and sorry if so but it feels reasonable to me.
what 10 days? haven't heard that before
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Just took a peek at most Chinese news agencies and they're trying everything to avoid people from panicking. Every single report is like, "the radioactive clouds are far away and will be diluted to acceptable levels".
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Wow!
I wish they had road workers like that in Delaware- "The state of never-ending roadwork."
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A crisis of this magnitude unites the people, and they achieve amazing things.
But why does this have to happen? Why do people have to suffer, so many people plunged into pain, so many of them not deserving it....
gah, what does life mean?
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Even found time to plant a row of shrubs in just the 4 days. I wonder how many crews they have doing work at this rate around the country.
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At Swedish TV they were interviewing some reindeer owners who apparently are seriously worried about nuclear waste reaching us from Japan. First I was laughing but then it made me rage when I realized she wasn't even kidding. Really, WTF?
http://playrapport.se/#/video/2362105
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EPT
