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On October 15 2010 16:59 SnK-Arcbound wrote:
Republicans have always believed that government should play the proper role in society to maintain the most freedoms possible for its citizens. Only the government could make the louisiana purchase to help with colonization of the Americas. With Teddy the government stopped monopolies from charging exhorbant amounts for anything and everything. Democrats have always believed in a government that will overrun any rights of the people in order to put into place their vision. That's why they wanted and empowered State and weak Federal government, so they could continue to brutalize black men and women, and keep slaves. Now they want a weak state and empowered Federal government to force people to buy anything they deem a "right". The means has changed, but the logic hasn't.
Democrats believe that the government should play a role in order to help out the poor and less wealthy in order to raise the median of standard of living in America. Only the government can bare the cost of such things as health care without the risk of moral hazard and adverse selection. With FDR the government introduced minimum wage preventing large businesses from exploiting the workers. Republicans always believed in government that support big businesses with minimal regulation in order to place their vision. That's why they want to empower corporations and no regulations, so they could continue to brutalize workers and the middle class, and keep making profits from these businesses by owning shares in said businesses. Now they want to fulfill corporation demands by drilling everywhere with no regards for the consequences and spreading misinformation about the health care bill.
see I can do it too.
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In the 1990s, O'Donnell took a public stance against masturbation, calling it "sinful".[113] Some commentators have noted her comments are consistent with official Roman Catholic doctrine, which condemns masturbation and other forms of non-procreative sex.
from the wiki found on the link on the front page. wow~!
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That damned woman wants to take away my only joy in life... If she comes between me and my little friend she will pay the price.
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I believe I have a similar example. In Georgia the Republican candidate Nathan Deal not only did not disclose MILLIONs of dollars of debt, he tries to claim hes just a victim of the economic times when he made a bad investment. And that man is still leading in the polls....
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This is so hilarious ... stuff like this always reminds me why i wouldn't move to america even if fuckin blizzard themselves would offer me a job. It's so funny that the same people who try to be very very christian ignore the fact that if the chruch did one thing right in the past it is that they ALWAYS cared for the poor, the ill and the weak (atleast on the lower hierachy levels ... not the pope himself ofc). Atleast here in europe since i don't know how this neo protestantism works over there ... flaggs besides jesus? i mean ... really?
I really really don't get why having a system where the unlucky people get help from the community by law is something communistic? I mean ... i guess it's that way in every single EU country (i think) ... are we communists or what? It's also common knowledge that the US health care system is probaly the weakest of all industrial nations.
It's just that american way of life ... the velociraptor capitalism where all you care about is your money and your personal wellfare - which is SO alienating for many europeans like me. This whole "christian" thing is just a disguise for their egocentric mindset. Go on ... kill people, plunder the weak and destroy the environment. Your beloved jesus would turn in his grave if he would be witnessing this.
Don't get me wrong ... i know that there are atleast 50% democratic voters in the US so not all hope is lost. I just cannot understand how someone can vote such a person like Palin etc. and onto those people my hate is directed. I literally had tears in my eyes when i heard obamas first speech cause i for the first time had the feeling that there is a spark of hope for the world - and btw i haven't changed my oppinion just yet ... changes need time. He has probably achieved more than american's notice atm. It's always feels different if you see something from a neutral distance.
sry if i offended someone but when i read something like in the OP i always feel like "gosh, there is no hope for this world."
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People just aren't informed. Most of the people who oppose the health care bill are just people who watch Fox and believe that shit. I bet that all these people like Palin and Glenn Beck know that what they say is huge BS, but the viewers are just scared. It's sad that people like Beck can make all this money by capitalizing on people's fear.
Also, I've met many people who say "ALL HOMELESS PEOPLE ARE HOMELESS BECAUSE THEY'RE LAZY AND THUS DON'T DESERVE GOVERNMENT HELP" Which we all know is BS. I mean, sure, there are people who are homeless because they're lazy. But saying that all homeless people are homeless for that reason is so ignorant. If we could get rid of thinking like that, we could actually make progress with social welfare.
And lol at the transcript.
O'Reilly: The doctor is saying that if we use animal embryos for stem cells, we don't need to use human embryos.
Christine: THIS IS JUST ABOUT CLONING HUMANS
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On October 15 2010 16:59 SnK-Arcbound wrote:That's nice, too bad I never mentioned Democrats voting during the civil war. Reading what I wrote: after Lincoln won the Civil War. Now why after? Because democrats were either expelled or withdrew with the secession.
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...or they retained their position(s) and continued to vote just as they had before and during the war.
While I didn't say that they were passed, I did believe that they weren't (which is entirely my misunderstanding). However I'm still correct as it was declared unconstitutional and was also unenforcable in the southern states.
No, you were wrong. Feel free to declare victory and move on though.
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On October 15 2010 15:17 SnK-Arcbound wrote:
So to shorten up what you're saying, you believe that Democrats, after over 100 years of hatred of black men and women, trying to uphold slavery, creating the KKK, lynching black men and women at Democratic rallys, and constantly having the means to prosecute black men and women taken away from them by Republicans, decided to become Republicans.
That makes sense.
...I have no idea where you got this from especially as I deliberately went out of my way to avoid mentioning either party and the KKK's obviously racist slant. But I will say that this kind of thinking (constantly equating politicians of the present with past offenses and indiscriminate mudslinging regardless of the debate) is exactly what keeps obviously partisan people like you from being taken seriously.
On October 15 2010 16:25 bbq ftw wrote:
In all honesty, its not easy to respond to a post that boils down to: "anyone who believes in limited government/fiscal conservatism is retarded, doesn't believe in science, is fueled by paranoia and hate, is anti-nonwhite. Did I mention they're also stupid?
Oh, and they're just like the KKK."
Really, though, how would you respond? To do so seriously would concede the point: "oh, they're not as idiotic as you think..."
It's amusing that you would conflate my entire post into such a hateful diatribe, as if you yourself were being attacked personally, when I was making a clearly bipartisan point. You completely misinterpret my post, which is unfortunate because if you weren't so busy being childishly offended you'd understand I was making the point that this is a good thing for both Tea Party members and conservatives.
To simplify for future reference, I made the comparison of the Tea Party to the KKK as I believe they're both populist organizations that, post their collapse, will lead to an almost cathartic moment of revelation for many Americans, which itself will lead to a new era of progress in the US.
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On October 15 2010 23:58 Ferrose wrote:
People just aren't informed. Most of the people who oppose the health care bill are just people who watch Fox and believe that shit. I bet that all these people like Palin and Glenn Beck know that what they say is huge BS, but the viewers are just scared. It's sad that people like Beck can make all this money by capitalizing on people's fear.
Hrm. I seem to recall opponents of the health care bill saying that premiums would increase greatly if the bill was passed. I also seem to recall opponents saying that the health care bill would further reduce services covered by insurance. I don't know whether you pay for your health insurance or see your bills, but I do and I'll tell you this: the opponents were right.
There's a reason why an overwhelming percentage of the population wants the health care bill repealed. It's a piece of garbage that wrecks far more than it fixes.
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On October 15 2010 21:51 JoelB wrote:
I literally had tears in my eyes when i heard obamas first speech cause i for the first time had the feeling that there is a spark of hope for the world - and btw i haven't changed my oppinion just yet ... changes need time. He has probably achieved more than american's notice atm. It's always feels different if you see something from a neutral distance.
So you were fooled just as badly as everyone who voted for Obama here in America? Compare Obama's pre-election rhetoric to his post-election behavior. There's a serious mismatch. The guy hasn't transcended politics in America at all. He's been hyper-partisan. Americans who voted for Obama are figuring out that they were sold a false bill of goods. There's a reason why his approval rating is plummeting.
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Ok, no logical or rational human being would vote for her after her performance in the Delaware debate yesterday. I mean really, she has absolutely 0 knowledge it seems of the issues she claims to discuss, she dodges questions like a pro (she simply would not answer the question "Do you believe evolution is a myth?"), and everything she says revolves around ad hominem attacks on her opponent.
Was hilarious how she couldn't name any recent supreme court decisions yet she is sure that she disagrees with most of them. I mean the woman has zero critical thinking skills, I truly don't think she is capable of making rational, circumspect, decisions. What scares me the most is that she has a clear animosity towards science, yet claims to know what the best way to educate the U.S. about science and math is.
The standards for being a politician in this country are appallingly low. God help us if she gets elected, that will be a terrible day for the U.S.
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And the "hyper-partisan" nature of things has nothing to do with republicans. It's not like they make shit up about him and then repeat it despite simple and abundant proof to the contrary. It's not like congress is unable to pass even universally appealing bills like health care for 9/11 rescue workers suffering due to the risks they took in helping people on 9/11. No, it's really all Obama's fault that the roads aren't yet paved with gold, because the president has complete and total power over the government.
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On October 16 2010 03:51 phyren wrote:
And the "hyper-partisan" nature of things has nothing to do with republicans. It's not like they make shit up about him and then repeat it despite simple and abundant proof to the contrary. It's not like congress is unable to pass even universally appealing bills like health care for 9/11 rescue workers suffering due to the risks they took in helping people on 9/11. No, it's really all Obama's fault that the roads aren't yet paved with gold, because the president has complete and total power over the government.
Correct, the hyper-partisanship has almost nothing to do with the republicans. Obama had a large majority in the House and a super-majority in the senate. He could have passed anything he wanted if he simply threw republicans a bone here and there in the bills. He refused to do that. Is it any surprise that he received no support from republicans? You don't get people to vote for things unless you offer some incentive. It's pretty simple.
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On October 16 2010 03:58 xDaunt wrote:Show nested quote +On October 16 2010 03:51 phyren wrote:
And the "hyper-partisan" nature of things has nothing to do with republicans. It's not like they make shit up about him and then repeat it despite simple and abundant proof to the contrary. It's not like congress is unable to pass even universally appealing bills like health care for 9/11 rescue workers suffering due to the risks they took in helping people on 9/11. No, it's really all Obama's fault that the roads aren't yet paved with gold, because the president has complete and total power over the government. Correct, the hyper-partisanship has almost nothing to do with the republicans. Obama had a large majority in the House and a super-majority in the senate. He could have passed anything he wanted if he simply threw republicans a bone here and there in the bills. He refused to do that. Is it any surprise that he received no support from republicans? You don't get people to vote for things unless you offer some incentive. It's pretty simple.
Not throwing the Republicans a bone is pure bullshit. Republicans said NO to a whole bunch of crap that they were FOR.
Quite frankly, a lot of the legislation is terrible because of the compromises made to get 1 or 2 Republicans to sign on.
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On October 16 2010 04:01 Adila wrote:Show nested quote +On October 16 2010 03:58 xDaunt wrote:On October 16 2010 03:51 phyren wrote:
And the "hyper-partisan" nature of things has nothing to do with republicans. It's not like they make shit up about him and then repeat it despite simple and abundant proof to the contrary. It's not like congress is unable to pass even universally appealing bills like health care for 9/11 rescue workers suffering due to the risks they took in helping people on 9/11. No, it's really all Obama's fault that the roads aren't yet paved with gold, because the president has complete and total power over the government. Correct, the hyper-partisanship has almost nothing to do with the republicans. Obama had a large majority in the House and a super-majority in the senate. He could have passed anything he wanted if he simply threw republicans a bone here and there in the bills. He refused to do that. Is it any surprise that he received no support from republicans? You don't get people to vote for things unless you offer some incentive. It's pretty simple. Not throwing the Republicans a bone is pure bullshit. Republicans said NO to a whole bunch of crap that they were FOR. Quite frankly, a lot of the legislation is terrible because of the compromises made to get 1 or 2 Republicans to sign on.
That's also a myth. You generally don't vote for a 1000 page bill just because you like 10 pages of it. Obama needed to offer more, period. It's called "compromise," and every presidential administration has had to do it at one time or another.
In fact, Obama is the luckiest of all recent presidents becasue he had to compromise less due to the huge democratic majorities. However, he stupidly pissed away this once in a century opportunity through a combination of bad policy and partisanship.
Take the stimulus bill, for example. Obama and the democrats are getting politically murdered for passing it right now because they didn't offer republicans any meaningful incentive to support it. Thus, when it predictably failed, democrats bear 100% of the responsibility. That's bad politics. I don't know who advised him on that one, but it was the stupidest thing that he did so far in his presidency.
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Take the stimulus bill, for example. Obama and the democrats are getting politically murdered for passing it right now because they didn't offer republicans any meaningful incentive to support it.
No, they are getting politically murdered because its a bad bill, and at some point, blaming the Republicans for running the economy into the ground becomes trite.
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On October 16 2010 04:21 bbq ftw wrote:Show nested quote +Take the stimulus bill, for example. Obama and the democrats are getting politically murdered for passing it right now because they didn't offer republicans any meaningful incentive to support it. No, they are getting politically murdered because its a bad bill, and at some point, blaming the Republicans for running the economy into the ground becomes trite.
I'm not arguiing that it's a good bill. I can't think of a worse bill that was passed in the past twenty years.
The only point that I was making is that democrats would at least have some political cover if they had been able to coopt some of the dumber republicans into voting for it. Instead, republicans get to hammer democrats ruthlessly for passing that garbage.
EDIT: How could I forget about the healthcare bill? That one takes the cake as the worst bill passed in recent memory.
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I hope this ends the same way as the Hartford Convention.
Seriously, I'm getting pretty annoyed by this.
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On October 16 2010 03:58 xDaunt wrote:Show nested quote +On October 16 2010 03:51 phyren wrote:
And the "hyper-partisan" nature of things has nothing to do with republicans. It's not like they make shit up about him and then repeat it despite simple and abundant proof to the contrary. It's not like congress is unable to pass even universally appealing bills like health care for 9/11 rescue workers suffering due to the risks they took in helping people on 9/11. No, it's really all Obama's fault that the roads aren't yet paved with gold, because the president has complete and total power over the government. Correct, the hyper-partisanship has almost nothing to do with the republicans. Obama had a large majority in the House and a super-majority in the senate. He could have passed anything he wanted if he simply threw republicans a bone here and there in the bills. He refused to do that. Is it any surprise that he received no support from republicans? You don't get people to vote for things unless you offer some incentive. It's pretty simple.
Obama said he was open to tort reform if republicans would be willing to be flexible on some issues and republicans laughed in his face.
xDaunt with his, 'oh my gosh my health insurance went up' as if it wasn't sky rocketing before the bill as well. Many of these rate hikes are being denied by state judges because they are unjustified. Health insurers are still making record profits and hiking their rates at the same time. Why? so they can fool morons like xDaunt into believing that its the fault of th ehealth care bill. The Chamber of Commerce, Fox News, and the Koch brothers will be the downfall of America.
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EPT
