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death teleportation - Page 18

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Tachion
Profile Blog Joined May 2010
Canada8573 Posts
Last Edited: 2012-04-14 09:01:58
April 14 2012 08:58 GMT
#341
sorry wrong thread
i was driving down the road this november eve and spotted a hitchhiker walking down the street. i pulled over and saw that it was only a tree. i uprooted it and put it in my trunk. do trees like marshmallow peeps? cause that's all i have and will have.
Herfelt
Profile Joined June 2011
Denmark89 Posts
April 14 2012 08:59 GMT
#342
If you don't believe that "you" is some kind of (immortal) soul attached to your physical body, being rebuild from new atoms shouldn't impose a problem.
A video from a lovely (old) game (imo the best turn based strategy game):
Heouf
Profile Joined March 2012
Netherlands787 Posts
April 14 2012 09:03 GMT
#343
Why would I wanna teleport. I'm fine here in my 14m2 room. I don't need to go anywhere.
Gokba Alhakel
MamiyaOtaru
Profile Blog Joined September 2008
United States1687 Posts
April 14 2012 09:05 GMT
#344
On August 05 2010 19:22 meegrean wrote:
i will never use a teleporter ever. good thing i probably won't see one in this lifetime. maybe future generations that can use this technology will be less religious.
yeah that will definitely help!

On August 05 2010 18:49 BrogMaN wrote:No, absolutely would not even consider it ... Maybe if I was a religious type i would be willing but since i'm pretty atheist and don't really think anything happens after i die there's no way i would willingly kill my current body just to travel somewhere.
oh wait
-Exalt-
Profile Blog Joined November 2010
United States972 Posts
Last Edited: 2012-04-14 09:10:54
April 14 2012 09:07 GMT
#345
people who say "absolutely not".. do you REALLY think you are special/ you have a soul? if so you're probably pretty ignorant and ignore modern science. we're just a bunch of atoms, that includes our brain which truely makes you, you.

quantum teleportation (the process in which the atoms/molecules in your body would get teleported) would teleport all of your atoms exactly to the other place. quantum entanglement is beyond "trustworthy" as it would transmit your atom's information to the destinations location with 100% precision. all of your brain signals, memories, etc exactly the same assuming the machine works properly. if it works? hell yeah i would do it. It would be like blinking, but when you open your eyes you are on the other side of the world.

and yes quantum teleportation/entanglement is a real thing and has been done with a Proton I believe. AFAIK it also destroys the original Atom, so this process is not "cloning". It's teleportation.

So you ask, would you still be.. you? Absolutely and I wish the intelligent bunch of atoms that is myself came into existence.. 2000 years in the future so I could experience this.
Angra
Profile Blog Joined May 2009
United States2652 Posts
Last Edited: 2012-04-14 09:14:50
April 14 2012 09:08 GMT
#346
On April 14 2012 18:07 AegiS_ wrote:
people who say "absolutely not".. do you REALLY think you are special/ you have a soul? if so you're probably pretty ignorant and ignore modern science. we're just a bunch of atoms, that includes our brain which truely makes you, you.

quantum teleportation (the process in which the atoms/molecules in your body would get teleported) would teleport all of your atoms exactly to the other place. quantum entanglement is beyond "trustworthy" as it would transmit your atom's information to the destinations location with 100% precision. all of your brain signals, memories, etc exactly the same assuming the machine works properly. if it works? hell yeah i would do it. It would be like blinking, but when you open your eyes you are on the other side of the world.

and yes quantum teleportation/entanglement is a real thing and has been done with a Proton I believe.

So you ask, would you still be.. you? Absolutely and I wish the intelligent bunch of atoms that is myself came into existence.. 2000 years in the future so I could experience this.


I think what gets confusing is like.. whatever there is after you die, let's just say it's blackness/nothing for all eternity for example. If you were to use the teleport, would you just experience blackness/nothing for all eternity and just an exact copy of you went on to live? Even if it's exactly you, would the original body that is killed still be experiencing nothing for all eternity? If so, then I wouldn't do it because that would just suck because I'd only be experiencing what the original body does, right? I don't think it has to do with souls or anything of the sort. If none of that happened and you just blinked and would start experiencing your next body's life then yes, I'd be fine with doing it.
ImbaTosS
Profile Blog Joined January 2009
United Kingdom1704 Posts
April 14 2012 09:11 GMT
#347
On April 14 2012 18:07 AegiS_ wrote:
people who say "absolutely not".. do you REALLY think you are special/ you have a soul? if so you're probably pretty ignorant and ignore modern science. we're just a bunch of atoms, that includes our brain which truely makes you, you.

quantum teleportation (the process in which the atoms/molecules in your body would get teleported) would teleport all of your atoms exactly to the other place. quantum entanglement is beyond "trustworthy" as it would transmit your atom's information to the destinations location with 100% precision. all of your brain signals, memories, etc exactly the same assuming the machine works properly. if it works? hell yeah i would do it. It would be like blinking, but when you open your eyes you are on the other side of the world.

and yes quantum teleportation/entanglement is a real thing and has been done with a Proton I believe.

So you ask, would you still be.. you? Absolutely and I wish the intelligent bunch of atoms that is myself came into existence.. 2000 years in the future so I could experience this.

The interesting thing is- maybe 2000 years into the future, your atoms will recombine. What if time is actually infinite? Surely then at some other time possibly billions of years into the future, the exact stuff which makes you could come back together as one, whether through chance or through some strange process.
EleGant[AoV]
ImbaTosS
Profile Blog Joined January 2009
United Kingdom1704 Posts
April 14 2012 09:14 GMT
#348
On April 14 2012 18:08 Angra wrote:
Show nested quote +
On April 14 2012 18:07 AegiS_ wrote:
people who say "absolutely not".. do you REALLY think you are special/ you have a soul? if so you're probably pretty ignorant and ignore modern science. we're just a bunch of atoms, that includes our brain which truely makes you, you.

quantum teleportation (the process in which the atoms/molecules in your body would get teleported) would teleport all of your atoms exactly to the other place. quantum entanglement is beyond "trustworthy" as it would transmit your atom's information to the destinations location with 100% precision. all of your brain signals, memories, etc exactly the same assuming the machine works properly. if it works? hell yeah i would do it. It would be like blinking, but when you open your eyes you are on the other side of the world.

and yes quantum teleportation/entanglement is a real thing and has been done with a Proton I believe.

So you ask, would you still be.. you? Absolutely and I wish the intelligent bunch of atoms that is myself came into existence.. 2000 years in the future so I could experience this.


I think what gets confusing is like.. whatever there is after you die, let's just say it's blackness/nothing for all eternity for example. If you were to use the teleport, would you just experience blackness/nothing for all eternity and just an exact copy of you went on to live? If so, then I wouldn't do it because that would just suck, it has nothing to do with souls or anything of the sort. If none of that happened and you just blinked and would start experiencing your next body's life then yes, I'd be fine with doing it.

This whole death thing is a curious and common misconception, which leads to a lot of fear imo. You don't experience some void- you do not experience anything. There is no perception of endless time passing or blackness. These are directly attached to human experience. You do not experience anything!

Of course, if the idea in my post above holds any water, maybe in a universe of infinite time everybody will live again anyway. If time repeats.... then I don't even know what to think any more.
EleGant[AoV]
killa_robot
Profile Joined May 2010
Canada1884 Posts
Last Edited: 2012-04-14 09:20:39
April 14 2012 09:20 GMT
#349
On April 14 2012 18:07 AegiS_ wrote:
people who say "absolutely not".. do you REALLY think you are special/ you have a soul? if so you're probably pretty ignorant and ignore modern science. we're just a bunch of atoms, that includes our brain which truely makes you, you.

quantum teleportation (the process in which the atoms/molecules in your body would get teleported) would teleport all of your atoms exactly to the other place. quantum entanglement is beyond "trustworthy" as it would transmit your atom's information to the destinations location with 100% precision. all of your brain signals, memories, etc exactly the same assuming the machine works properly. if it works? hell yeah i would do it. It would be like blinking, but when you open your eyes you are on the other side of the world.

and yes quantum teleportation/entanglement is a real thing and has been done with a Proton I believe. AFAIK it also destroys the original Atom, so this process is not "cloning". It's teleportation.

So you ask, would you still be.. you? Absolutely and I wish the intelligent bunch of atoms that is myself came into existence.. 2000 years in the future so I could experience this.


On August 05 2010 18:36 UniversalSnip wrote:
This is a common thing in science fiction where you are 'teleported' by a machine that kills you, then reconstructs an exact copy of your body and mind at another point. The question is


You're an idiot. The OP specifically stated that the machine kills you, then reconstructs you elsewhere. You are not truly teleported in his scenario, so what you're saying has nothing to do with the situation presented. The fact that you're trying to talk down to everyone only makes your idiocy worse.
Drium
Profile Blog Joined December 2008
United States888 Posts
April 14 2012 09:23 GMT
#350
I see no logical reason no to, but I still wouldn't do it.
KwanROLLLLLLLED
albis
Profile Joined January 2010
United States652 Posts
April 14 2012 09:29 GMT
#351
you don't actually die though. someone died, someone at the starting destination, but your not that guy. your completely and fully yourself. and your alive
every punch is thrown with bad intentions with the speed of a devil
Licmyobelisk
Profile Blog Joined August 2008
Philippines3682 Posts
April 14 2012 09:30 GMT
#352
On April 14 2012 17:17 killa_robot wrote:
Show nested quote +
On April 14 2012 16:53 Hairy wrote:
It's an interesting conundrum. Eg the teleporters in Star Trek - the body is being annihilated in one location and rebuilt in another. The body is not being 'moved'; one body is destroyed, and an exact copy re-created elsewhere. Does this mean "you" essentially die using the teleporter?

The question boils down to:
Do you believe "you" (i.e. your conscious, thinking mind) are something that inhabits your brain, or are "you" simply the physical brain itself.


You're both; two halves to one whole. The "true" you is your mind, however your body hosts that mind. If your body is destroyed, then that mind is destroyed, and thus you are. It doesn't matter if the machine copies your mind and places it in a new body somewhere else, because your old body, and in extension your old/current mind, has already been destroyed.

Easiest way to realize this is to assume the following: your old body is not destroyed.

Nothing else changes, the machine still copies your mind into a new body and a new "you" is created. As a result, you'll each probably think you're the "real" you. However, the one that was copied is not you, they are a clone. You won't be simultaneously living your life through both bodies, so whoever is in the newly created body, is not "you".

Though only "you" would realize this. As for all intensive purposes, either version of you would be considered the real you by anyone else but you.

There was an interesting movie that played with the concept of cloning, and showed this quite well. In the movie they thought they achieved immortality, by cloning themselves and copying their mind into the new clones. Sadly I forget the name of it.


it was arnold schwazinegger movie bro.. the 6th day. It was pretty bad because the real arnie and the clone just accepted their fates and team up lol
I don't think I've ever wished my opponent good luck prior to a game. When I play, I play to win. I hope every opponent I ever have is cursed with fucking terrible luck. I hope they're stuck playing underneath a stepladder with a black cat in attendance a
Recognizable
Profile Blog Joined December 2011
Netherlands1552 Posts
Last Edited: 2012-04-14 09:33:18
April 14 2012 09:31 GMT
#353
Yes, if they can reconstruct me perfectly down to the atom. I would have zero obligations. I don't believe in a soul, if they can recreate my brains exactly the way they are with my memories still intact then what's there to oppose?
Figgy
Profile Joined February 2011
Canada1788 Posts
Last Edited: 2012-04-14 09:43:16
April 14 2012 09:33 GMT
#354
This cartoon sums up this debate PERFECTLY. It's a cartoon about this problem exactly. Also one of the best clips ever made in general.
Bug Fixes Fixed an issue where, when facing a SlayerS terran, completing a hatchery would cause a medivac and 8 marines to randomly spawn nearby and attack it.
HwangjaeTerran
Profile Blog Joined October 2009
Finland5967 Posts
Last Edited: 2012-04-14 09:43:01
April 14 2012 09:36 GMT
#355
uhh, why would I use such a device? what's in it for me?

A copy of my mind, body and personality is not me. I'm dead.

It reminds me of that Schwarzenegger movie ( I think) where the bad guy was dying and created a clone of himself, then he was somehow shocked that first thing his clone did was kill him.

It's similar to losing your whole memory. A person is no more, while another is born.

e. It would make more sense if your consciousness was transferred to another body, while your body dies. Now that would actually be useful.
https://steamcommunity.com/id/*tlusernamehere*/
Chooser
Profile Joined May 2011
Australia25 Posts
Last Edited: 2012-04-14 12:28:36
April 14 2012 12:24 GMT
#356
On April 14 2012 17:53 heishe wrote:
Show nested quote +
On April 14 2012 16:36 Chooser wrote:
On April 14 2012 16:28 Brutaxilos wrote:
This form of teleportation is utterly retarded. YOU'RE DEAD PEOPLE. You know, if the machine is going to rebuild your body atom by atom in another location, is the whole, killing the original really that important. Might as well just make a clone to do what's needed to be done. Better yet, might as well just do what you want to do electronically and send it. It's not like the information carrying your body plan travels any faster than an email. If your doing this for a fast way to get to something pleasurable, like going on vacation, don't. Your dead. Someone else is enjoying your life.


But why are you necessarily dead? You're still alive, in a sense. Objectively nobody would know the difference. Subjectively, well I'm not sure. But how can you be so sure that you are in effect dead if there is another you in existence?


You would know the difference, since you're dead. Your life is at an end. From a neurological viewpoint, it would certainly be the same as having a normal death, since all your brain function seizes. Whatever is created on the other side isn't you, it's someone else. It could, in the very same way, create a completely different person on the other side of the teleportation device. It would make absolutely no difference for you.

Imo this is one of thousands of useless purely philosophical questions (pure philosophy rarely does something else than raise pointless questions), since they're easily answered using real facts (anybody who would use this device knowingly what it does would be a fool, or suicidal).


Similarly, when I move through time I am displaced from being one person to the next. So that with each 'interval' I'm a different being. That being so, I can understand that I am that thing that has been teleported as it's no different (or I don't see how it is, [explain to me how it is]) from me just passing from one moment to the next.


on another note if you are teleported and in fact 'dead' then there is no 'you' for you to know about some other you.


In fact you should retain the memory of being 'killed' as you're reconstructed as the being with all memories prior to the teleportation, so it is you.

So I ask what this 'you-ness', or 'I-ness' is.
'Ohm nom nom nom nom'
Holy_AT
Profile Joined July 2010
Austria978 Posts
April 14 2012 12:31 GMT
#357
if you are moving a file from one disk to the next its information is being read then writtrn on the other disk and then the old is deleted and its still the same file. If the teleportation copying process was perfect, I would not mind. A human is just a machine there is no soul or something out of the ordinary, a human consists of matter and he stores information in matter and his whole being is matter and nothing else.
opisska
Profile Blog Joined February 2011
Poland8852 Posts
April 14 2012 12:37 GMT
#358
The problem is that you can never know. For all practical purposes the new person is the same as the old one and he can legitimatley say that he feel the same, but you can never know how it actually "felt" until it is too late and you are dead.

This is not a question of soul, religion, whatever. It is a problem based on the fact that we all live this "human experience" and we have no idea at all what it is... wait, I know that I have this experience but I can never know if anybody else does!

All the people that would use such device either know/feel something that I don't, or did not really think this through. I would not even use a teleport if it was based on some quantum technlogogy or whatever. There just can ever be any guarantee that it would not feel like death to me (whatever that means) and a new conscious entity would not be created.

To be very clear: I am not saying it is like that, maybe it is the complete opposite and teleporting is totally fine. I am only saying that there is no reliable way to find that out. You cannot just ask the teleportees, their answers have zero informaiton value on the issue.
"Jeez, that's far from ideal." - Serral, the king of mild trashtalk
TL+ Member
archonOOid
Profile Blog Joined March 2011
1983 Posts
April 14 2012 12:40 GMT
#359
I think it's just called teleportation and not death teleportation. Because you are not dead but your soul is which does not exist. Too add to point whatever teleportation is called it does also not exist.
I'm Quotable (IQ)
Sovern
Profile Joined March 2011
United States312 Posts
April 14 2012 12:48 GMT
#360
I dont know why people are getting the idea that your consciousness isnt made up of atoms either. Of course I'd be fine with being transported, and of course I'd still be conscious because the atom make up would be the same.
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