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BanZu
United States3329 Posts
On September 10 2009 16:55 Pholon wrote: I completely agree with cz - by all means read it, it's fun enough and has historic value, but dont expect it to revolutionize your SC play in any way I'm pretty sure everyone is on the same page here. No one thinks it'll do wonders. | ||
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Lokomis
United States72 Posts
If you disagree I challenge you to quote something from the wiki that is both useful and not obvious. ---- Apologies for the recycled ridicule. At the risk of being silly in doing so the point to be made was that one could just as easily have memorized build orders, units sizes, building/ability/upgrade costs and still be a complete simpleton in regards to basic strategy. "Not likely," you might say, but not all that far-fetched either. I'm sure plenty of players can proxy dark temps in five minutes but if they still lose every time regardless of a flawlessly executed build order then the issue falls back on the very basics that have been assumed to be common knowledge. I hold no doubt that plenty of players have played through the campaign modes managing to either turtle, out-mass or fluke their way to wins without ever developing upon their knowledge of strategy, only to turn around get stomped game after game online. tl;dr: On September 10 2009 16:12 viewer wrote: whats obvious to you isnt always obvious to everyone else. | ||
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wbirdy
Singapore335 Posts
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jtype
England2167 Posts
Yes, a lot of it is common sense and logic, but that's just what philosophy is. As Kwark said earlier, most mistakes that players make (this applies even at pro level too) are obvious ones. So what's the merit of reading this book? Well, reading it and studying it can help you to keep it's philosophies in mind, leading to more effective decision-making, in and out of the game. We all need constant reminders. Why are military commanders and business strategists around the world still encouraged to know that book off-by-heart? Because it's information is effective and useful. I've written extensively in my blog (on another Starcraft site), applying Sun Tzu's quotes directly to SC and received positive feedback. You never know, reading the book might help you think of a new (or at least, new to you) strategy or tactic that can help you to be more successful in future SC matches. | ||
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foeffa
Belgium2115 Posts
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gnuvince
Canada73 Posts
On September 10 2009 21:17 jtype wrote: I've written extensively in my blog (on another Starcraft site), applying Sun Tzu's quotes directly to SC and received positive feedback. Do you have a link to those articles? | ||
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LeperKahn
Romania1839 Posts
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jtype
England2167 Posts
http://starfeeder.gameriot.com/blogs/Mastering-The-Art - I must warn you though, they are very basic and aimed at newbies. | ||
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Afasia
Finland70 Posts
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St3MoR
Spain3256 Posts
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wok
United States504 Posts
For example, if in PvP, your opponent goes proxy pylon into 2-gate proxy rush, knowing those general principles will be insufficient to achieve victory. In fact: there are 2 contradicting goals: 1.) to destroy the production facilities 2.) to make sure your economy is stronger than your opponent's. Both of these points have proverbs describing how to accomplish these goals, but lacking knowledge of the very small space that sufficiently optimizes the two parameters... You are not going to win. | ||
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gnuvince
Canada73 Posts
On September 11 2009 00:11 jtype wrote: http://starfeeder.gameriot.com/blogs/Mastering-The-Art - I must warn you though, they are very basic and aimed at newbies. Thanks! | ||
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Iaaan
Canada578 Posts
Still nice to have a hardcopy tho ^^ | ||
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ShadowDrgn
United States2497 Posts
+ Show Spoiler + The translation used was done in 1910, but still. | ||
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bdams19
United States1316 Posts
TEACHER YOU FORGOT TO GIVE US HOMEWORK | ||
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Pufftrees
2449 Posts
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Teejing
Germany1360 Posts
On September 10 2009 16:10 Licmyobelisk wrote: he who is aussie, is always awesome  <3 lazz!Anyway, here is something we can use in theorycrafting: 5. Thus, though we have heard of stupid haste in war, cleverness has never been seen associated with long delays. So meaning, it's not about cheesing and waiting for too long to go 200/200 push, but to provide excellent timing when opponents has his pants down is the way to victory haha, and i thought you was referring to blizzards delay xD | ||
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538
Hungary3932 Posts
On September 10 2009 11:46 BalliSLife wrote: He who has 1-1 upgrades should move out ROFL | ||
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EsX_Raptor
United States2801 Posts
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DefMatrixUltra
Canada1992 Posts
On September 10 2009 13:48 heyoka wrote: Its worth reading but yeah its really overrated. Its really more a "philosophy of how to set your mind when you go into battle" than anything but people seem to treat it like it actually has advice on how tactics work or something. Thanks for the file It's hardly overrated because of the reason you stated. A young strategist reading this book can learn lessons that might otherwise take years. When I was a little kid, I played video games all the time. When I got into competitive gaming (fighting games), I almost always considered very powerful moves 'cheap' or exploiting existing bugs 'cheating'. But if I had just read this book, I could see that when in a competitive situation, it's not about following the rule book, it's about winning despite the rule book. This kind of philosophical outlook is capable of turning a bad strategist into a master strategist practically overnight. I've never seen anyone recommend this book based on their learning of battle tactics or some nonsense like that. This book is recommended across many industries because of the mindset that it inspires. Reading this book will not make you a better manager or first base or Starcraft player directly, but it will open your mind up to what 'strategy' really means and how to optimize your path to your goals intelligently and consistently. I mean sure, if you've played chess for 35 years, you could probably write this book yourself, but the point is I can give this to someone that's never had any real inkling of what 'strategy' actually is, and it will blow their mind and give them incredible insight into problem-solving. Everything in the book is, as others have said, completely obvious in hindsight, but the organization of thoughts will teach you how to think instead of what to think. That is really the key to this book. | ||
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