EPTLikewise with harassing by using a spell to last hit creeps + get a hero + not hit more creeps than you need to (so you don't push the lane), but that depends on your hero.
[HoN/DotA] Let's Play~!! - Page 1642
| Forum Index > General Games |
|
Logo
United States7542 Posts
Likewise with harassing by using a spell to last hit creeps + get a hero + not hit more creeps than you need to (so you don't push the lane), but that depends on your hero. | ||
|
Ganfei2
473 Posts
On March 29 2012 03:23 Ethenielle wrote: Hes apparently just moved beyond basic mechanical skills and hero knowledge and your advice is boot switching. This thread never ceases to amaze l m f a o. edit: I'm sorry I didn't really mean to be hostile but your advice is just so absurd... boot switching gives a very marginal advantage and may save you in some situations but in any event it's a pretty technical detail/advanced concept. There's a lot more important things to work on if you're still working on last hitting. I disagree that the advantage from boot switching is marginal. Paying attention to it now will also help in the long run because eventually it will become second nature. It's like asking someone who has never used hotkeys to add +50 APM in SC; it's hard at the beginning because you are unused to the mechanics, and it takes some practice, and it makes you worse for a short period, but eventually you get used to it. Swapping boots isn't anywhere near as difficult as that. | ||
|
Alur
Denmark3900 Posts
On March 29 2012 04:33 Ganfei2 wrote: I disagree that the advantage from boot switching is marginal. Paying attention to it now will also help in the long run because eventually it will become second nature. It's like asking someone who has never used hotkeys to add +50 APM in SC; it's hard at the beginning because you are unused to the mechanics, and it takes some practice, and it makes you worse for a short period, but eventually you get used to it. Swapping boots isn't anywhere near as difficult as that. Agreed, the amount of times boot switching has saved my life/gotten me kills is quite staggering. I actually consider the point where I really started using that trick to be a major point in the improvement of my individual skill. | ||
|
DCLXVI
United States729 Posts
| ||
|
wonderwall
New Zealand695 Posts
Whenever your are going to cast several spells in a row burning mana swap your boots to INT. If you're going to experience hp removal for any reason (chalice) swap your boots to STR. How is that hard? | ||
Antimage
Canada1293 Posts
You wonder why all the pros use attribute boots where in 1600s people are getting phase boots - and that is why. and about the second thing: even at my level i feel that i could be last hitting better with certain heroes (bubbles/pyro might seem easy to last hit with, but it does take a few gmaes to get used to the attack animation). I'm assuming - by intermediate, he means 1600s... | ||
|
Dubzex
United States6994 Posts
| ||
|
xZiGGY
United Kingdom801 Posts
On March 29 2012 03:23 Ethenielle wrote: Hes apparently just moved beyond basic mechanical skills and hero knowledge and your advice is boot switching. This thread never ceases to amaze l m f a o. edit: I'm sorry I didn't really mean to be hostile but your advice is just so absurd... boot switching gives a very marginal advantage and may save you in some situations but in any event it's a pretty technical detail/advanced concept. There's a lot more important things to work on if you're still working on last hitting. I'm afraid I must also disagree with this, in the right situation boot switching is everything. :/ | ||
|
Miyoshino
314 Posts
Really in this game you are better off getting your mmr low and getting your kd high rather than the other way around. Considering starting a new account to do exactly this because playing this way is pointless and retardation increases a little each game I play. Basically now when I am in lane, there is always an auto attacker. Basically no one wards. If you are mid and you get your 3 minute bottle, you often can't get it because someone else is using the courier for a nonsense item. And if you can get farm and win the game, you will be having your savage mace on a walking courier if you don't upgrade it yourself. Really, in this game the team with the least stupid idiot wins. All other 4 players are irrelevant and have no effect on the outcome of the game. | ||
|
JeeJee
Canada5652 Posts
Sure at a high level, every little bit counts.. but that doesn't apply to 99% of the people in this thread. I personally noticed a much better flow in my games when I started to focus on the stuff that, in my opinion, actually matters. Instead of min/maxing the tiny consequences of individual decisions.. but actually focus on making better decisions to begin with. | ||
|
xZiGGY
United Kingdom801 Posts
| ||
|
Porkz
Denmark1027 Posts
http://forums.heroesofnewerth.com/showthread.php?t=406197 Im pretty sure its still march 30th...but ok :D | ||
|
Ethenielle
Norway1006 Posts
On March 30 2012 09:21 xZiGGY wrote: I'm afraid I must also disagree with this, in the right situation boot switching is everything. :/ That's what I am saying. ? It's situationally important but an advanced concept. This guy can barely last hit and you guys want him to swap steamboots to save his life now and again? Seriously? THAT is the next step? How about game sense, learning spell damage and hero hit point steps, when to push, when to team fight, when to defend and when to trade towers, when you can drag the game later, how to drag the game later and turn a disadvantage, how about _anything_ other than steamboot switch for a healthpot or spell? He's a newb. You're suggesting going from calculating the derivative of x to nuclear physics and brain surgery. It's terrible advice. I hope I made my case. Kthxbai. edit: apparently all the pros use steam boots. I was not aware of this fact. If anyone wants to pull up some statistics, now would be the time... | ||
|
M2
Bulgaria4171 Posts
So, I am trying to learn the game(Dota, not Hon) I already played fair amount of games with many different heroes (pub games I mean in ICCUP) and to some extend I can understand the different roles the heroes have such as Suport, Tank, Roamer, Carry, Semi-Carry etc. to some extend I can even play them accordingly, however, what I cannot understand is the different strategies that can be undertaken so we can win the game. I cannot see the whole picture. For example when playing broodwar from the very beginning of each game on each map I have a clear view/idea on what I want to achieve and how can I achieve it, it may or may not work but at any point of the game I am able to adapt accordingly and to understand how much the game is going im my direction and why. In Dota I know probably 2 ways of winning: one is through pushing and the other is through strong carry. However, I have no idea for example in pushing strategy how exactly it has to be executed: How many pushers, when do we start to push? how much do we avoid battles? or when do we avoid them, if for example the strategy contains two pushers, what kind of heroes should be other 3 and why. are 2 pushers enough actually for pushing strategy or not? Those are just random questions though. And if we talk about the strong carry strat than besides the obvious that carry should not die and he has to earn a lot of money, but how do you achieve that? meaning what should be the other heroes? how many tanks? how many supports?etc? what exactly do they do? do they need to be good team fighters do you need to defend until the carry is strong what? Additionally whats the difference between ranged and melee carry? I mean the difference is obvious but how do you build the team around them? does the ranged carry need more tanks in the team? how many ranged heroes actually you have to pick in a team and how many melee according to given strat? Except through carry and pushing what other global means of winnig a game there are? is it viable with two carries? just a random thought that is and again how do you build around this what are the little goals during the game? I understand that my questions are too many and its too hard to be answered fully, but I will appreciate if you can provide me with some more general input such as: you can win the game through strong carry and in this strat the carry should be melee you should have 2 ranges supports because of this and that , one tank that aims at this and that something like that, Another is through 2 ranged carries one up one down ...etc just examples that are probably not relevant but to point what exactly I am looking for Thanks in advance  | ||
|
ahswtini
Northern Ireland22213 Posts
On March 30 2012 23:01 Ethenielle wrote: He's a newb. You're suggesting going from calculating the derivative of x to nuclear physics and brain surgery. It's terrible advice. I hope I made my case. Kthxbai. . Just no. | ||
|
xZiGGY
United Kingdom801 Posts
On March 30 2012 23:01 Ethenielle wrote: That's what I am saying. ? It's situationally important but an advanced concept. This guy can barely last hit and you guys want him to swap steamboots to save his life now and again? Seriously? THAT is the next step? How about game sense, learning spell damage and hero hit point steps, when to push, when to team fight, when to defend and when to trade towers, when you can drag the game later, how to drag the game later and turn a disadvantage, how about _anything_ other than steamboot switch for a healthpot or spell? He's a newb. You're suggesting going from calculating the derivative of x to nuclear physics and brain surgery. It's terrible advice. I hope I made my case. Kthxbai. edit: apparently all the pros use steam boots. I was not aware of this fact. If anyone wants to pull up some statistics, now would be the time... You're the only one suggesting it is an advanced concept, it's a very simple and effective pubstomping technique, you contradict yourself on several occasions and frankly your attitude sucks. It's more like going from deriving x to integrating 1, now please stop assuming that just because to you it seems like an advanced concept that it actually is an advanced concept. In lowbie pubs you win by exploiting and crushing the weak, not many of the strategic concepts you suggest are either ineffectual in pubs or require too much insight and explanation to warrant teaching to a new player, strategic concepts are developed over much time and experience whereas tactical tricks and shortcuts can be more readily adapted or learnt. To dismiss them entirely as trivial benefits seems ludicrous since the gain-to-time-spent is much higher (assuming: type of game, level of play) and will allow the player to look at the game from a fresh perspective whilst improving on his/her own. You aren't even suggesting methods with which the novice can improve his game, whereas the suggestion I provided: map/time management is fairly intuitive and yet deep and will quickly lead to much deeper concepts should they choose to take my advice. /feh | ||
|
XeliN
United Kingdom1755 Posts
That said there are so many spots that being adept at boot switching is important that you could easily argue it the other way, I wouldn't but hey this is all opinion. As for things to focus on, I would make sure you are good at warding//counterwarding, making sure you can buy your items extremely quickly as well as learning the hotkeys for the more frequent ones, the obvious being B,R,R for Bottle. Then Learn how to jungle the jungling heroes effectively, and by effectively, firstly how to maximise farm and experience when you are 100% focusing on jungle, and from then try to incorporate ganking and pushing so you can learn the spots and situations you should be doing that, specially given the trend at the moment that is so jungle orientated, learn how to mid effectively by watching replays, pro games, playing yourself. Practice solo laning, both in the short and suicide lane and try to increase your ability to make those lanes successful, positioning usually being the most important factor. and something more specific that ive noticed testie in particular does, if you have a ranged farming hero make sure you keep to your full, or close to it, distance when farming in the lane. Last hits may be slightly harder as the time delay between animation and your attack hitting the creep is greater, but the extra protection this provides from people combo-ing onto you is huge. Once you learn that shit try switching boots around, its actually quite fun, they change to all different pretty colours and things. | ||
|
Durak
Canada3685 Posts
| ||
|
xZiGGY
United Kingdom801 Posts
 | ||
|
rabidch
United States20289 Posts
On March 30 2012 12:58 JeeJee wrote: I disagree with the boot switching being important... I used to think of dota as more of a mechanical game and I was focusing on stuff like boot switching, taking advantage of the extra couple of seconds of fountain regen after TP, etc.. really focusing on these minutiae when they really don't matter. You can squeeze out an extra spell here, an extra last hit or kill there, but if you lose focus of the big picture, if you make a bad prediction and throw a teamfight, go aggressive when you shouldn't, try and push when you should have roshed, etc. none of that shit matters. it's the big decisions that decide games. Sure at a high level, every little bit counts.. but that doesn't apply to 99% of the people in this thread. I personally noticed a much better flow in my games when I started to focus on the stuff that, in my opinion, actually matters. Instead of min/maxing the tiny consequences of individual decisions.. but actually focus on making better decisions to begin with. dota-as-mechanical-game is just a stage in the development of good dota players. basically a learning process. | ||
| ||
