EPTwhat is this where is my dota2 beta jnfikfghndfjgudfgdfg
[HoN/DotA] Let's Play~!! - Page 1601
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greggy
United Kingdom1483 Posts
what is this where is my dota2 beta jnfikfghndfjgudfgdfg | ||
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Alur
Denmark3900 Posts
On November 12 2011 00:11 Boblion wrote: Sometimes i'm having more fun griefing and trashtalking than playing the game. I'm completly bipolar when i play this game. I'm like mannered 4 games out of 5 but then there is always that one game where i try my best to be a complete jerk and i'm enjoying it. Maybe that's the real game in HoN ( and in pub team games in general ), like hacking is the real game in D2. lol =( On that note, I remember a game where a teammate would run mid and die purposefully 10+ times, he then went on to chill in base, while calling out where my team was ("Lycan (me) killing kong" etc.). I ended up carrying my team to victory. Needless to say, our opponents were horrible. Regardless, please don't grief, unless you're only playing with people you know and it's not done in poor taste - it's probably the only type of behavior i'd consider unanimously unacceptable. | ||
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nyxnyxnyx
Indonesia2978 Posts
On November 12 2011 20:12 wonderwall wrote: http://honwiki.net/wiki/DotA_vs_HoN It's a few patches behind but the big stuff like item and hero correlations are still there. thanks, this was very helpful! my general feeling so far is that the 'new' heroes that weren't ported are mostly imba | ||
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wonderwall
New Zealand695 Posts
my general feeling so far is that the 'new' heroes that weren't ported are mostly imba S2 seems to be going for the "Everything" hero recently. They think of all these cool ideas and mechanics and try and cram them together in to one hero. The result is heroes who are great with farm, are still okay without farm, and can even play hard support sometimes (MOA is the next andro?). It'd be nice if S2 went back to their heroes having a clearly defined role. Guys like Chipper and Maliken where they were a good ganker or a good hard carry but that's it. | ||
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Manit0u
Poland17257 Posts
Personally I find the biggest issues with Ra, Zephyr and Silhouette. Ra and Zeph have pretty easy time farming and all they really need to do is just be there in the teamfights with their AoE damage and tankiness. They can easily take off mid-game. The problem with Sil is that she's probably the hardest carry right now, yet she doesn't really need as much in terms of items as other carrys. Usually when you get just one item on her, be it nullstone, shrunken or shieldbreaker it's all downhill. She puts out a lot of damage and at the same time has some great utility tools and escape mechanisms. | ||
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woody60707
United States1863 Posts
I don't enjoy watching HoN as I do Starcraft also. Do you really need to have a good understanding of the game to enjoy watching it? | ||
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Manit0u
Poland17257 Posts
On November 13 2011 14:25 woody60707 wrote: So my friend/roommate is a big HON player(but no where at all a pro). When he watched NASL HoN, he wasn't impressed at all. Beside players' play being tighter, there wasn't that extra that only pros could do that only pros could do like in SC2. Like while the players were better, the play was more or less the same. ... Does this make sense to most people? I don't enjoy watching HoN as I do Starcraft also. Do you really need to have a good understanding of the game to enjoy watching it? Yes, you need a good understanding. That's also why competetive games might seem like 'nothing special' for some. The thing is that a game of HoN and a road to victory usually consist of gazillions of tiny factors that aren't always clearly visible. What separates pros from the rest of people is what you called playing it "tight". Split second decisions that can mean the difference between a wipe and a steamroll, awareness, coordination etc. It's not a game where you can really judge players purely on mechanical skills. As a matter of fact, mechanical requirements are probably the least important of all at the top level of the game. And you shouldn't judge players on their individual performance, what matters is the team and how their actions correspond with that of their teammates. It's a completely different thing than your regular RTS, it puts emphasis on totally different things. You should watch it more like a Guild Wars match really, that would be the closest thing I believe. | ||
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Judicator
United States7270 Posts
Teamwork, adjusting to and analyzing situations are not always apparent in the outcomes. There's a lot going on at any given active moment for a new player or viewer to grasp, so yes you need to understand subtle differences. The SC2 analogy would be like understanding what made an attack good/necessary/bad/unnecessary. | ||
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wonderwall
New Zealand695 Posts
Just need for them to finish releasing heroes so they can start the actual balance. And remember the old saying: "If everything is overpowered, nothing is". I was more talking about the very general trend of power drain in most games. Developers need to come up with new and interesting stuff to keep players interested. As they exhaust the basics they need to turn to more complex abilities and hero concepts. Simply due to their abilities having to be new and exciting they are often stronger than the heroes released several years ago. | ||
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Manit0u
Poland17257 Posts
On November 13 2011 15:07 wonderwall wrote: I was more talking about the very general trend of power drain in most games. Developers need to come up with new and interesting stuff to keep players interested. As they exhaust the basics they need to turn to more complex abilities and hero concepts. Simply due to their abilities having to be new and exciting they are often stronger than the heroes released several years ago. I wouldn't be so sure on "often stronger". If you'd look up the most picked/banned list for competetive games it consists mostly of old DotA heroes: Plague Rider, Hellbringer, Pharaoh, Tundra, Pollywog Priest, Bubbles, Tempest, Ophelia. These are all ports. And then you get heroes who usually don't get banned but are being picked quite often: Valkyrie, Corrupted Disciple, Flint Beastwood, Magmus, Pebbles.... Really, the only S2 heroes that we're seeing recently on the competetive scene would be: Amun Ra, Zephyr, Silhouette, Parasite, Rhapsody, Master of Arms. And apart from the obvious Rhapsody/Zephyr combination you rarely see two of them together on the same team. I don't remember if Nymphora is a port or not so I won't comment on her  Edit: Kraken could also be considered S2 hero as he's gone a very long way from being a Leviathan port. | ||
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Nevuk
United States16280 Posts
Hellbringer is not Warlock. Not even close. (they have 1 skill in similar). Hellbringer is a more versatile hero with lower stat gain, his ult is also a little better than WL because it's instant cast and longer range. Tundra is missing BM's 3rd ability.Kraken was considered imba for a while and was fotm for forever (btw, old kraken was so much cooler and less like tide). Electrician was remade after Brized (emperor from dota) proved him to be unbeatable mid. The same thing happened to empath's life link, due to inhouse feedback that she was just unbeatable mid (she was autobanned by teams before the nerf, then used in the occasional flint behe trilane). KotF was played a few times and nerfed mildly. DS is wildly different from dazzle, despite only having 1 talent different (unbreakable lets him be more aggressive in lane and is better early game than grave but far weaker in the late game). Fujiapples proved balphagore imbalanced by taking down a trilane with him solo (he was nerfed the next day into uselessness, recently slightly buffed). Deadwood has been used competitively enough to prove he's very viable, but most teams prefer the magic burst of pebbles to DW. Scout was famously used by chu, Arachna used to see much play, the list goes on and on of s2 heroes that see play. FA was very fotm around when defiler was. Silhouette was incredibly broken (still is in my opinion, 2 escapes on a hard carry and a free mock), MoA can serve multiple roles incredibly well, etc. Many of the newer heroes wind up being banned until s2 nerfs them (either auto or ban used on them, as was the case with MK multiple times). Teams will try out newer heroes but in many cases they prefer what they're more comfortable with (MSI being the main exception, varying from glad trilane dominance to tempest jungle). If there were more than 6-7 actual competitive teams then hon would have much more rapidly changing hero tiers (a la dota) but when there's really only about 50-100 people playing the game competitively then their favorites are going to be what they'll stick with until forced to change | ||
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Ganfei2
473 Posts
Balph is so much better than KOTF for everything unless you want a jungler with minions, in which case tempest is better. Balph minions do like 2x as much as KOTF, have a slow, can be summoned way more often, and move way way faster. He also has a really nice nuke on his Q that provides him with corpses and a silence that can spread to opponents (most balphs forget that the silence spreads). He can lane against practically anyone with his regen from corpses and once he gets 5 minions and plated greaves he can take out a tower in about 15 seconds. The problem with balance for S2 is two-fold in my opinion. Number one, their style of "overpower and then nerf" is fine, but they balance so infrequently that it becomes difficult to deal with. If there were small balance tweaks every week or even two weeks it might be ok, but if your strategy is to overpower new heros and then let them settle and then nerf them or buff others, you can't leave it that way for 9 months. Their patches are worthless and serve to do little other than provide more massively overpriced alt avatars and rotate the f2p heros available. Second, the HON competitive scene is tiny. There are only like 50 "competitive" players and they are the people S2 is listening to the most in the "competitors forum." There is next to no innovation in the game; MSI is one of the only teams that EVER changes ANYTHING, and the HON competitive AND public sphere have both shown that without a winning game from a competitive team doing something different, new strategies are never ever tried. Without enough people playing, there is no motive or incentive to try new things until the old ones no longer win, which takes months to occur. The trilane meta lasted for almost a year in HON, which came a year after it was "over" in DOTA; now everyone does 2/1/1 + jungle or 1/2/1 with two in middle. We'll have to see if anything changes anytime soon. Lastly, ego makes it difficult to innovate. People HATE losing, competitive players most of all. Nobody can stand trying new things out. I watched someone's stream, can't remember who, when EZ had its old roster. Chu had drafted some new setup and they lost. Literally everyone on their vent just cried and bitched for about 20 minutes while Chu said "it was my fault, it was my fault, but how can we try new things if we're afraid to lose, it was my fault, it was my fault, it's a scrim, it doesn't matter," etc. If players are so afraid to lose a scrim that they can't even try new things, then strategies will never evolve. | ||
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Manit0u
Poland17257 Posts
Right now I also like what TDM seems to be playing: aggressive line-ups usually without any carry. Awesome for spectators and I guess that for players too as you get a lot of action right off the bat. | ||
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Ganfei2
473 Posts
Personally I found it rather boring. The games were incredibly predictable, and playing them was boring as hell, as 90% of the time it was just farming and having the trilane supports be level 4 15 minutes into the game. The current strategies are both more entertaining and more skillful, in my opinion. | ||
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Ethenielle
Norway1006 Posts
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semantics
10040 Posts
On November 13 2011 18:41 Ethenielle wrote: In reply to the guy above who wants heroes with clearly defined roles, I disagree and kind of like the approach S2 is taking. I absolutely despise the hard support role and I don't think it brings anything to the game. It's boring as shit to play and you have very little impact on the game past 10 minutes. I do like supports where you can actually bring something to the team, behe/mag/rhaps comes to mind. If S2 could eliminate that role by making heroes with diverse enough skillsets to be able to both support and then be useful later on, I think that's fantastic. Name the heroes that are like that, frankly none of the s2 heroes are like that most of the s2 heroes have 1 or 2 skills that will carry that hero into late game usefulness no matter how underfarmed and leveled you are due to being ward layer hero supporter extraordre, although some may play them are super support get nothing sacrifice everything doesn't mean that's how you're only allowed to play them. You just confuse the small competitive scene's tri lane era of having one guy just bite the bullet for the carry has nothing to do with s2 had everything to do with trilanes. | ||
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semantics
10040 Posts
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ZaplinG
United States3818 Posts
and even if I did decide to buy it, cpu wouldnt be able to run it  It barely runs morrowind | ||
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Durak
Canada3684 Posts
On November 15 2011 03:46 semantics wrote: no one is discussing hon cuz too busy playing skyrim ammrite? I played some games today after two months of limited activity. I was surprised by how few people there were on. According to some people, the clan isn't nearly as active, so that's a rapid change. A couple dozen names of people that I don't recognize isn't appealing. If anyone wants to play some TMM, I'll come on in the following days to mess around. Warning: my lowest account is ~1880 so you might lose and I don't want any people who cry after a loss. I play for fun  | ||
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FinestHour
United States18466 Posts
On November 15 2011 15:39 Durak wrote: I played some games today after two months of limited activity. I was surprised by how few people there were on. According to some people, the clan isn't nearly as active, so that's a rapid change. A couple dozen names of people that I don't recognize isn't appealing. If anyone wants to play some TMM, I'll come on in the following days to mess around. Warning: my lowest account is ~1880 so you might lose and I don't want any people who cry after a loss. I play for fun Your lowest is 1880 jesus Why does s2 like putting in so many heroes with free radi built in, lord sarasomething just looks silly | ||
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