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On October 07 2010 11:40 BraveGhost wrote:
any material to read over for an extreme nub to HoN, it's just not an easy game to jump right in to
I don't have any excellent resources for brand new players, as I verbally teach my friends, but here are some internet guides. Here are a few good general guides on gamereplays. They'll teach you some of the basics.
After reading through those, I would focus on learning every hero's abilities. There are probably too many to learn all at once, but you should try to load them up in practice mode and read+test all of their abilities briefly. Knowing what you and your opponent can do is key but you can learn just by playing games if you prefer.
I don't recommend following hero guides. Heroes can be built and played in a number of different ways (skills taken in different orders, etc.). However, a hero usually has a pre-defined role based on his abilities. You can read the hero guides on gamereplays if you like but the main thing you should take out of them is the description and usage of the abilities as it may give you some ideas.
If you have any specific questions, post away. I can also help you on vent/in game if you like.
Last piece of advice: Everyone thinks they're amazing at the game. Often, they will give you bad advice and/or blame you. It's usually best to ignore them but try and keep an open mind. Ignore most coordination blame (because there is none at low levels) but take mechanics advice.
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Or challenge everything you learn and find out what works for you and your team. Critical thinking (or the lack thereof) is why nubs develop into scrubs.
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On October 07 2010 12:08 Judicator wrote:
Or challenge everything you learn and find out what works for you and your team. Critical thinking (or the lack thereof) is why nubs develop into scrubs.
Absolutely challenge everything you learn. The best way might be to try both methods and see what works rather than dismissing one in theory. You might not be able to mentally judge it correctly when you're new.
It's kind of hard to judge good advice from bad advice as a new player. If he's brand new, he should focus on learning how the game works in general rather than specific builds, items, coordinating ganks precisely, and whatever.
Edit: The biggest turn off from dota/hon is the community. It's the arguing, nagging, and self-rightous crap that gets thrown everywhere. That's basically the trick to making it into the scene.
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What noob wrote that guide?
Edit: That wasn't even funny. Big bunch of text, but should be a good way to learn. You might want to switch between different resources+playing the game so you don't get bored.
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On October 07 2010 12:23 Durak wrote:What noob wrote that guide? Edit: That wasn't even funny. Big bunch of text, but should be a good way to learn. You might want to switch between different resources+playing the game so you don't get bored.
Not sure if you're being sarcastic, but Rien is a TL member. Notice the Sc2 References and the infamous Crystal Maiden picture
Oh nevermind.. >_>
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Should a tort(lesh) be warding over a hammer(Sven) when tort is the only viable carry on the team? The way I see it hammer only needs boots chalice some bracers maybe and work on a bkb while tort needs to farm towards his nullstone sheep etc for mid-late game
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On October 07 2010 14:29 GhostKorean wrote:
Should a tort(lesh) be warding over a hammer(Sven) when tort is the only viable carry on the team? The way I see it hammer only needs boots chalice some bracers maybe and work on a bkb while tort needs to farm towards his nullstone sheep etc for mid-late game
What is this, a 2v5?
:<
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On October 07 2010 14:29 GhostKorean wrote:
Should a tort(lesh) be warding over a hammer(Sven) when tort is the only viable carry on the team? The way I see it hammer only needs boots chalice some bracers maybe and work on a bkb while tort needs to farm towards his nullstone sheep etc for mid-late game
Is this a serious question?
Yes, Sven can "only" need boots chalice bracers and work towards a bkb, but only when he is being played as a semi-carry. Sven is wayyyyyyyyyyyyyyyyyyyyyyyyyyyyyyyyyyy more viable as a carry than tort
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ehh... you've got bigger problems than that as neither should be warding.
they're both problematic in that they require not a small amount of farm to carry out their role well even if it's not full-on carry. tort needs survivability, hp/mana; hammer needs pk and shrunken head, if they want to make a difference in the midgame. if you're playing them as gankers right from the start though, i guess it's reasonable for them to contribute to warding costs as they're gimped anyways.
anyways, i guess you have to look at the situation. How are each doing in terms of levels? how close is hammer to blink or bkb? what's the make-up of the other team?
in all cases, force the hammer to stop farming after he's got pk + shrunken.
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It was a situation where we were the only ones not instantly dying the second we go into lane I was ahead of the hammer in gold and we lanes together so exp was even (this around around <10 min mark) biggest thing was that hammer was really bad (first item he farmed was elder parasite) but there was no way I could convince him to ward when I really didn't have a legit excuse other than "you suck" I could have easily afforded the wards but so could have he it was a matter of who needed te gold more and he was convinced that tort had no carry potential but all he had around that mark was boots chalice when I had power supply sustainer treads. Should I have just warded in that situation it seems even 200 gold would hurt me substantially in that situation with a super farmed flint on the other team and three underfarmed heroes on ours I was hoping for some midgame dominance and try to win before flint got too big while I was at my strongest point
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On October 07 2010 15:03 GhostKorean wrote:
It was a situation where we were the only ones not instantly dying the second we go into lane I was ahead of the hammer in gold and we lanes together so exp was even (this around around <10 min mark) biggest thing was that hammer was really bad (first item he farmed was elder parasite) but there was no way I could convince him to ward when I really didn't have a legit excuse other than "you suck" I could have easily afforded the wards but so could have he it was a matter of who needed te gold more and he was convinced that tort had no carry potential but all he had around that mark was boots chalice when I had power supply sustainer treads. Should I have just warded in that situation it seems even 200 gold would hurt me substantially in that situation with a super farmed flint on the other team and three underfarmed heroes on ours I was hoping for some midgame dominance and try to win before flint got too big while I was at my strongest point
just buy some wards and farm harder, chobo
bonus points if you just ward your lane so the wards last twice as long. (or you use both and are super safe, either way)
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The other lanes desperately needed them too. Tort isn't exactly a hard lategame carry so I was wary of spending even 200 gold. By the time laning phase wa over the other team was rolling over ours with our incompetent 0-5 everyone. Lack of skill was one of the reasons our team lost but lack of wards was probably a close second
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Scream for wards as you farm. If you get wards, place them so you're safe.
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torturer is normally either a semicarry or a kill waiting to happen - do you have a replay id so i can have a closer look and give proper advice? 
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Search Sunye and look at the most recent game
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first of all, succubus should have done the warding for the most part. as i said, torturer is a semicarry or rather useless unless you know exactly what you are doing, and succubus had the option to do it but chose not to.
if you feel you need wards and noone else agrees to buy them - i usually just get them for key timings (like kongor) and just have one ward placed if possible; for example i wouldnt ward the legion pull spot since its a low public game and they have 3 melee heroes (=> either top is screwed and madman can farm, or you can deny their pull easily)
its just the usual problem - in games like these observing warding behavior doesnt really matter because there are so many fundamental things screwed up you cant really draw any conclusions about plays like warding without guessing if it would have changed or even just improved the outcome at all.
edit: forgot to mention this, but hammerstorm needs a portal key with almost no exceptions. this game isnt one of them. 
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lol at the warding theories here.
look it's not hard, there are only priorities for warding, they're not set in stone, should-bes are pointless in an actual game, use your head to make the right decision, just because convention means one thing doesn't mean you stick to it blindly
in other words, figure it out and talk it out.
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On October 08 2010 00:33 Judicator wrote:
lol at the warding theories here.
look it's not hard, there are only priorities for warding, they're not set in stone, should-bes are pointless in an actual game, use your head to make the right decision, just because convention means one thing doesn't mean you stick to it blindly
in other words, figure it out and talk it out.
Yeah, it really just depends who can afford it (where people are at with items, if they're saving for something expensive, whatever). The benefits from wards way outweigh the costs, even if you're a carry. Just buy them and tell a support hero where to place them.
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Double post!
It's common knowledge that most HoN players are bad. However, I figured they'd be slightly better in all pick where they can choose their preferred heroes. Here's a short description of an AP game I just played because I couldn't find any SD games.
Situation: I join some 1600+ AP game. I am autobalanced onto the team with four locks. I insta-random and get dark lady. The four locks decide to pick us a team of 4 melee. I am stuck bottom lane with pebbles. No one buys a monkey or wards.
Pebbles is bad so we have a rough time in our pebbles+dl lane against accursed+kraken. After a terrible laning phase by my entire team, they just decide to gank for the rest of the game. After trying to work with them for the first little while, I give up and just farm.
Later on after more failed ganks by my team, engineer disconnects. I wreck their team and they concede before engineer rejoins.
![[image loading]](http://imgur.com/84rNT.png)
I tell our french devourer "tempis pour toi" (too bad for you) before we disconnect. He messages me, "you're ugly and I'm banlisting you" and "learn to play" in french. Apparently I'm bad for carrying them four on five. I even saved him with my ult multiple times 
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EPT
