• Log InLog In
  • Register
Liquid`
Team Liquid Liquipedia
EDT 10:29
CEST 16:29
KST 23:29
  • Home
  • Forum
  • Calendar
  • Streams
  • Liquipedia
  • Features
  • Store
  • EPT
  • TL+
  • StarCraft 2
  • Brood War
  • Smash
  • Heroes
  • Counter-Strike
  • Overwatch
  • Liquibet
  • Fantasy StarCraft
  • TLPD
  • StarCraft 2
  • Brood War
  • Blogs
Forum Sidebar
Events/Features
News
Featured News
[ASL22] Ro8 Preview: In A Tizzy9[ASL22] Ro16 Preview: Holy Diver5[ASL22] Ro16 Preview: Rough Waters10[ASL22] Ro24 Preview: Siren's Call8[ASL22] Ro24 Preview: Summer's End9
Community News
Weekly Cups (Sep 13-20): herO scores triple2BSL Season 236Weekly Cups (Sep 7-12): SHIN, ByuN, MaxPax double down1StarCraft open world shooter announced at BlizzCon101Weekly Cups (Aug 30-Sep 7): herO thrives amid growing schism10
StarCraft 2
General
Weekly Cups (Sep 13-20): herO scores triple Balance hotfix patch 5.0.16b (July 16) Blizzard Classic Cup @ BlizzCon 2026 - $100k prize pool How do you feel about the StarCraft shooter announcement at BlizzCon 2026? The Death of Cheese: From a Professional Cheeser
Tourneys
Stellar Fest TWO the Moon (Dec 16-20) Sparkling Tuna Cup - Weekly Open Tournament 2026 GSTL Announcement RSL Revival: Season 6 - Qualifiers and Main Event RSL goes to London! 2026 Offline Finals Nov 21-22
Strategy
[H] ZvP Mid-Late Game: Stalkers Collossi HT
Custom Maps
[M] (2) Frigid Storage
External Content
Mutation # 544 Double Trouble The PondCast: SC2 News & Results Mutation # 543 Enhanced Defenses Mutation # 542 The Ascended
Brood War
General
BW General Discussion NaDa's Body BSL Season 23 screpdb: new Starcraft reporting tool an AI researcher's take on the ladder bot
Tourneys
[ASL22] Ro8 Day 2 [ASL22] Ro16 Group D [ASL22] Ro8 Day 1 [IPSL] IPSL is Back With Winter 26-27!
Strategy
Cliff Jump Revisited (1 in a 1000 strategy) Replay Review Process - What do you do? Simple Questions, Simple Answers Odyssey Mineral Stack Saturation
Other Games
General Games
Nintendo Switch Thread Diablo IV Warcraft III: The Frozen Throne Stormgate/Frost Giant Megathread EVE Corporation
Dota 2
Dota 2 Champions League Season 3 Begins April 25! Official 'what is Dota anymore' discussion
League of Legends
[TL LoL EUW IHs] Teemo shall perish
Heroes of the Storm
Heroes of the Storm 2.0
Hearthstone
Deck construction bug
TL Mafia
TL Mafia Community Thread
Community
General
US Politics Mega-thread Russo-Ukrainian War Thread Artificial Intelligence Thread Things Aren’t Peaceful in Palestine All you football fans (soccer)!
Fan Clubs
MarineLorD Fan Club The Creator Fan Club The ShoWTimE Fan Club
Media & Entertainment
Movie Discussion! [Manga] One Piece Diablo Animated Series on Netflix
Sports
Football (Soccer) Thread TeamLiquid Health and Fitness Initiative For 2023 MLB/Baseball 2023
World Cup 2022
Tech Support
Computer Build, Upgrade & Buying Resource Thread
TL Community
Recent Gifted Posts
Blogs
Gaming Intensity, Problemati…
TrAiDoS
38 yo Retired SWE loo…
PurE)Rabbit-SF
Can Bots Beat Pros?? Starcr…
namkraft
[meme] I finally understa…
LUCKY_NOOB
Regacy Esports:Our Goa…
regacyesports
Dreaming of BW patches (mod…
c3rberUs
Customize Sidebar...

Website Feedback

Closed Threads



Active: 8695 users

Diablo IV - Page 74

Forum Index > General Games
Post a Reply
Prev 1 72 73 74 75 76 129 Next
Gorsameth
Profile Joined April 2010
Netherlands22608 Posts
May 18 2023 13:40 GMT
#1461
I fail to see the problem.
So there is an option difficulty for those who want the challenge that doesn't offer increased drop rates.

Why is this a problem?
If you want the challenge you use it, if you don't you don't.
It ignores such insignificant forces as time, entropy, and death
DarkPlasmaBall
Profile Blog Joined March 2010
United States46457 Posts
May 18 2023 13:54 GMT
#1462
On May 18 2023 22:29 {CC}StealthBlue wrote:
So... there is already an issue with the World Tiers even before launch. Tier I and II are exactly the same with no increase drop rates, so essentially a player can start in Tier I beat it and then do the capstone dungeon repeat said dungeon on Tier II and be in Tier III ala skipping Tier II immediately.


I thought the only differences were supposed to be that Tier 2 had harder enemies, gave more experience, and dropped higher amounts of gold than in Tier 1? Additional items don't seem to be mentioned until tiers 3, 4, and 5: https://www.gamesradar.com/diablo-4-world-tiers/
"There is nothing more satisfying than looking at a crowd of people and helping them get what I love." ~Day[9] Daily #100
Manit0u
Profile Blog Joined August 2004
Poland17843 Posts
Last Edited: 2023-05-18 18:22:27
May 18 2023 18:20 GMT
#1463
On May 18 2023 22:54 DarkPlasmaBall wrote:
Show nested quote +
On May 18 2023 22:29 {CC}StealthBlue wrote:
So... there is already an issue with the World Tiers even before launch. Tier I and II are exactly the same with no increase drop rates, so essentially a player can start in Tier I beat it and then do the capstone dungeon repeat said dungeon on Tier II and be in Tier III ala skipping Tier II immediately.


I thought the only differences were supposed to be that Tier 2 had harder enemies, gave more experience, and dropped higher amounts of gold than in Tier 1? Additional items don't seem to be mentioned until tiers 3, 4, and 5: https://www.gamesradar.com/diablo-4-world-tiers/


Yes, it's basically a "challenge mode" with bonus experience making up a bit for the increased time it takes to kill mobs.

Personally I like the approach Grim Dawn took with it, introducing "veteran mode" which was basically "normal +" for more experienced ARPG players. A bit more xp, stronger and tougher enemies but also more spawns with significantly increased chance of getting elite and boss spawns (increasing loot drops by increasing the number of mobs, not tinkering with drop chance or quality).
Time is precious. Waste it wisely.
andrewlt
Profile Joined August 2009
United States7702 Posts
May 18 2023 23:32 GMT
#1464
I think tier 2-5 is the basic normal -> nightmare -> hell -> torment mode of past games. Tier 1 is easy mode for the casual people who just want to finish the campaign. Of course, the players who are only focused on endgame will do tier 1 to rush to tier 3.
Archeon
Profile Joined May 2011
3272 Posts
May 19 2023 16:35 GMT
#1465
On May 18 2023 22:40 Gorsameth wrote:
I fail to see the problem.
So there is an option difficulty for those who want the challenge that doesn't offer increased drop rates.

Why is this a problem?
If you want the challenge you use it, if you don't you don't.

The problem is that for a vocal part of the playerbase ARPGs seem to be grinding simulators where the goal is to get max farming speed per second and while I don't mind that people do this, it's quite annoying that these people cry murder whenever the normal progression isn't the most optimal for that.
low gravity, yes-yes!
DarkPlasmaBall
Profile Blog Joined March 2010
United States46457 Posts
May 19 2023 17:12 GMT
#1466
Super helpful:
"There is nothing more satisfying than looking at a crowd of people and helping them get what I love." ~Day[9] Daily #100
farvacola
Profile Blog Joined January 2011
United States18869 Posts
May 19 2023 17:41 GMT
#1467
On May 20 2023 01:35 Archeon wrote:
Show nested quote +
On May 18 2023 22:40 Gorsameth wrote:
I fail to see the problem.
So there is an option difficulty for those who want the challenge that doesn't offer increased drop rates.

Why is this a problem?
If you want the challenge you use it, if you don't you don't.

The problem is that for a vocal part of the playerbase ARPGs seem to be grinding simulators where the goal is to get max farming speed per second and while I don't mind that people do this, it's quite annoying that these people cry murder whenever the normal progression isn't the most optimal for that.

Cheers to that, many of these complaints make no sense to me, but I'm just a filthy old casual looking to enjoy a game that sparks a bit of that gaming interest I find increasingly hard to come by.
"when the Dead Kennedys found out they had skinhead fans, they literally wrote a song titled 'Nazi Punks Fuck Off'"
andrewlt
Profile Joined August 2009
United States7702 Posts
May 19 2023 19:31 GMT
#1468
On May 20 2023 01:35 Archeon wrote:
Show nested quote +
On May 18 2023 22:40 Gorsameth wrote:
I fail to see the problem.
So there is an option difficulty for those who want the challenge that doesn't offer increased drop rates.

Why is this a problem?
If you want the challenge you use it, if you don't you don't.

The problem is that for a vocal part of the playerbase ARPGs seem to be grinding simulators where the goal is to get max farming speed per second and while I don't mind that people do this, it's quite annoying that these people cry murder whenever the normal progression isn't the most optimal for that.


That's partly why I don't play at many multiplayer games nowadays. I find the most vocal segments of the playerbase of most games to be quite obnoxious. I hope Blizzard listens to more than just the noisiest people.
ProMeTheus112
Profile Joined December 2009
France2027 Posts
May 19 2023 19:34 GMT
#1469
Well I think that's why polling is important.
Manit0u
Profile Blog Joined August 2004
Poland17843 Posts
May 19 2023 22:08 GMT
#1470
On May 20 2023 04:31 andrewlt wrote:
Show nested quote +
On May 20 2023 01:35 Archeon wrote:
On May 18 2023 22:40 Gorsameth wrote:
I fail to see the problem.
So there is an option difficulty for those who want the challenge that doesn't offer increased drop rates.

Why is this a problem?
If you want the challenge you use it, if you don't you don't.

The problem is that for a vocal part of the playerbase ARPGs seem to be grinding simulators where the goal is to get max farming speed per second and while I don't mind that people do this, it's quite annoying that these people cry murder whenever the normal progression isn't the most optimal for that.


That's partly why I don't play at many multiplayer games nowadays. I find the most vocal segments of the playerbase of most games to be quite obnoxious. I hope Blizzard listens to more than just the noisiest people.


I think it's part of the culture now, where everyone is suddenly a "gamer" and they have to "game" their games, preferably in a way that they're familiar with so similar or even the same features are being included in all games regardless of their genre etc.

Kinda sad really. When you look at the amount of time and resources that have to be put into a game for it to be a live service with multiple progression systems, cash shop, competitive whatever, seasonal content and such it's staggering. And all for a game that would be perfectly fine as a single player stand-alone game with potential expansions.

Not only does it take more time and effort to do it, there's much higher chance of doing it wrong, almost certain the original idea behind it is going to be lost and bigger pressure for it to do well to recoup all this extra cost (not to mention much higher maintenance costs).

It's madness in my opinion.
Time is precious. Waste it wisely.
andrewlt
Profile Joined August 2009
United States7702 Posts
May 19 2023 23:44 GMT
#1471
Oh, I don't mind having some live service elements in the games I play. I thought that Civ 6 and Total War: Warhammer, for example, were better served by having constant updates that could only come from having a constant stream of revenue. With that said, the budget and profit expectations are much higher for Diablo 4. Having 4 seasons a year sounds too much though I suppose I'm planning on playing nonseasonal content mostly.

I mean that I don't see why everything has to be turned into a competitive endeavor. Single player games don't need to be balanced. Part of the beauty of something like Total War is that some factions and start positions are harder than others. Multiplayer coop games (and Diablo is firmly in this category) don't need to be as balanced as competitive games. They should fix exploits and nerf clear outliers but some builds having faster optimal farming speeds than others is ok.
KrillinFromwales
Profile Blog Joined March 2022
68 Posts
May 20 2023 14:20 GMT
#1472
On May 20 2023 07:08 Manit0u wrote:
Show nested quote +
On May 20 2023 04:31 andrewlt wrote:
On May 20 2023 01:35 Archeon wrote:
On May 18 2023 22:40 Gorsameth wrote:
I fail to see the problem.
So there is an option difficulty for those who want the challenge that doesn't offer increased drop rates.

Why is this a problem?
If you want the challenge you use it, if you don't you don't.

The problem is that for a vocal part of the playerbase ARPGs seem to be grinding simulators where the goal is to get max farming speed per second and while I don't mind that people do this, it's quite annoying that these people cry murder whenever the normal progression isn't the most optimal for that.


That's partly why I don't play at many multiplayer games nowadays. I find the most vocal segments of the playerbase of most games to be quite obnoxious. I hope Blizzard listens to more than just the noisiest people.


I think it's part of the culture now, where everyone is suddenly a "gamer" and they have to "game" their games, preferably in a way that they're familiar with so similar or even the same features are being included in all games regardless of their genre etc.

Kinda sad really. When you look at the amount of time and resources that have to be put into a game for it to be a live service with multiple progression systems, cash shop, competitive whatever, seasonal content and such it's staggering. And all for a game that would be perfectly fine as a single player stand-alone game with potential expansions.

Not only does it take more time and effort to do it, there's much higher chance of doing it wrong, almost certain the original idea behind it is going to be lost and bigger pressure for it to do well to recoup all this extra cost (not to mention much higher maintenance costs).

It's madness in my opinion.


yeah i agree with this. there's not a lot of fresh blood in games these days and it doesn't seem like there's an emphasis on going outside the game design meta.

tbh i think some simpler features that just extended a long way could be nice. i wouldn't mind chuckling at level 666 characters running around in diablo 4. modern games seem so complex that the equilibria are sort of greyish
Latham
Profile Blog Joined May 2007
9592 Posts
May 20 2023 19:02 GMT
#1473


More discourse about World Tier 1 & 2...
For the curse of life is the curse of want. PC = https://be.pcpartpicker.com/user/LathamTK/builds/#view=CrqmP6
ProMeTheus112
Profile Joined December 2009
France2027 Posts
Last Edited: 2023-05-20 21:41:32
May 20 2023 21:40 GMT
#1474
It's interesting. I think ideal would be if there are real pros and cons to both picks even in terms of efficiency or risk/reward and if even any player would make different choices for T1/T2 depending on how their run is going / per character / situation on different "level brackets" etc.
Manit0u
Profile Blog Joined August 2004
Poland17843 Posts
Last Edited: 2023-05-20 23:53:57
May 20 2023 23:52 GMT
#1475
On May 20 2023 08:44 andrewlt wrote:
Oh, I don't mind having some live service elements in the games I play. I thought that Civ 6 and Total War: Warhammer, for example, were better served by having constant updates that could only come from having a constant stream of revenue. With that said, the budget and profit expectations are much higher for Diablo 4. Having 4 seasons a year sounds too much though I suppose I'm planning on playing nonseasonal content mostly.

I mean that I don't see why everything has to be turned into a competitive endeavor. Single player games don't need to be balanced. Part of the beauty of something like Total War is that some factions and start positions are harder than others. Multiplayer coop games (and Diablo is firmly in this category) don't need to be as balanced as competitive games. They should fix exploits and nerf clear outliers but some builds having faster optimal farming speeds than others is ok.


Civ and TWWH aren't really live service though. You can play them offline, single player, mod them to your heart's content and buy only the DLC you want, you don't have to be running the always online forced multiplayer with everything on top.
Time is precious. Waste it wisely.
{CC}StealthBlue
Profile Blog Joined January 2003
United States41117 Posts
Last Edited: 2023-05-21 18:29:30
May 21 2023 18:22 GMT
#1476
Thus confirmation one can easily skip Tier II basically by leveling past the boss level of the Tier II capstone dungeon Boss which is static according to said interview. All done via leveling up in Tier I.

"Smokey, this is not 'Nam, this is bowling. There are rules."
aseq
Profile Joined January 2003
Netherlands4019 Posts
May 21 2023 19:53 GMT
#1477
Pff I've heard little else than WT1 vs WT2 for the last week. Is it really that important? I hope Blizz just changes 1 number to scale up gear rewards too for WT2 so everyone is wrong.
Gorsameth
Profile Joined April 2010
Netherlands22608 Posts
Last Edited: 2023-05-21 19:58:36
May 21 2023 19:57 GMT
#1478
No its absolutely not important or a problem. The gaming community has just decided to make D4 controversial so now everything has to be fought over like a tribal war.

its arguing for the sake of it because the internet drama machine must be fed and is never satiated.
It ignores such insignificant forces as time, entropy, and death
DarkPlasmaBall
Profile Blog Joined March 2010
United States46457 Posts
May 21 2023 20:26 GMT
#1479
On May 22 2023 04:53 aseq wrote:
Pff I've heard little else than WT1 vs WT2 for the last week. Is it really that important? I hope Blizz just changes 1 number to scale up gear rewards too for WT2 so everyone is wrong.


Nope, not at all. As was noted by many people, there are reasons why someone may choose to play WT1 (e.g., quicker gameplay) and other reasons why someone may choose to play WT2 (e.g., enjoying a challenge), and it's completely subjective and relative. It's a non-issue.
"There is nothing more satisfying than looking at a crowd of people and helping them get what I love." ~Day[9] Daily #100
{CC}StealthBlue
Profile Blog Joined January 2003
United States41117 Posts
Last Edited: 2023-05-22 22:14:29
May 22 2023 22:12 GMT
#1480
I really hope the character voiced by Ralph Ineson, as he is an amazing voice actor, does not die and becomes like Deckard Cain or something. He is appearing more, and more which is great.

"Smokey, this is not 'Nam, this is bowling. There are rules."
Prev 1 72 73 74 75 76 129 Next
Please log in or register to reply.
Live Events Refresh
Kung Fu Cup
11:00
2026 Week 24
IntoTheiNu 1095
RotterdaM621
SteadfastSC150
Rex143
CosmosSc2 55
LiquipediaDiscussion
[ Submit Event ]
Live Streams
Refresh
StarCraft 2
RotterdaM 621
uThermal 242
SteadfastSC 150
Rex 143
CosmosSc2 55
StarCraft: Brood War
Britney 41994
Shuttle 3316
Bisu 1931
BeSt 691
Light 635
Mini 529
Rush 323
Stork 272
Snow 226
hero 140
[ Show more ]
Shine 57
Shinee 53
Hyun 43
sorry 40
PianO 34
Mong 32
Sexy 32
Hm[arnc] 31
ToSsGirL 24
Sharp 23
NotJumperer 20
HiyA 18
Aegong 15
Terrorterran 15
Rock 10
Icarus 6
Dota 2
Gorgc6904
qojqva1767
Dendi994
Counter-Strike
kRYSTAL_289
x6flipin13
Heroes of the Storm
crisheroes423
Other Games
B2W.Neo880
hiko756
Lowko347
Liquid`VortiX188
Mew2King109
ArmadaUGS100
QueenE57
Organizations
Dota 2
PGL Dota 2 - Main Stream14075
StarCraft: Brood War
Afreeca ASL 350
Kim Chul Min (afreeca) 7
[ Show 13 non-featured ]
StarCraft 2
• mYiSmile131
• intothetv
• AfreecaTV YouTube
• Kozan
• IndyKCrew
• Migwel
StarCraft: Brood War
• BSLYoutube
• STPLYoutube
• ZZZeroYoutube
Dota 2
• C_a_k_e 5017
League of Legends
• Nemesis2949
• TFBlade842
Other Games
• WagamamaTV211
Upcoming Events
The PondCast
19h 31m
Replay Cast
1d 9h
Korean StarCraft League
2 days
CranKy Ducklings
2 days
GSL
3 days
Yamato Cup
4 days
Replay Cast
4 days
Afreeca Starleague
4 days
Soma vs Jaedong
WardiTV Weekly
4 days
Sparkling Tuna Cup
5 days
[ Show More ]
Afreeca Starleague
5 days
Leta vs Soulkey
PiGosaur Cup
6 days
Kung Fu Cup
6 days
Liquipedia Results

Completed

Super Anchor Qualifying S3
Blizzard Classic Cup 2026
Big Dog Cup 2026 Div 1

Ongoing

ASL Season 22
CSL 2026 AUTUMN (S22)
Acropolis #5
Acropolis #5 - GSA
Calamity Invitational
Logitech G Play Connect 2026
SL StarSeries Fall 2026
FISSURE Playground #3
BLAST Open Fall 2026
Esports World Cup 2026
BLAST Bounty Summer 2026
BLAST Bounty Summer Qual
Stake Ranked Episode 3
XSE Pro League 2026

Upcoming

Acropolis #5 - GSB
Acropolis #5 - GSC
BSL Season 23
SC4ALL II: Brood War
BSL 23: Non-Korean Championship
HSC XXX
Stellar Fest 2: Lunar Cup
SC4ALL II: StarCraft II
Kung Fu Cup 2026 Grand Finals
RSL Offline Finals
Custodian Cup
Copium Cup
PGL Major Singapore 2026
Stake Ranked Episode 6
BLAST Rivals Fall 2026
IEM Beijing 2026
Stake Ranked Episode 5
PGL Masters Bucharest 2026
1win Private Club #2
Thunderpick World Champ. '26
ESL Pro League Season 24
Stake Ranked Episode 4
1win Private Club #1
TLPD

1. ByuN
2. TY
3. Dark
4. Solar
5. Stats
6. Nerchio
7. sOs
8. soO
9. INnoVation
10. Elazer
1. Rain
2. Flash
3. EffOrt
4. Last
5. Bisu
6. Soulkey
7. Mini
8. Sharp
Sidebar Settings...

Advertising | Privacy Policy | Terms Of Use | Contact Us

Original banner artwork: Jim Warren
The contents of this webpage are copyright © 2026 TLnet. All Rights Reserved.