• Log InLog In
  • Register
Liquid`
Team Liquid Liquipedia
EDT 22:27
CEST 04:27
KST 11:27
  • Home
  • Forum
  • Calendar
  • Streams
  • Liquipedia
  • Features
  • Store
  • EPT
  • TL+
  • StarCraft 2
  • Brood War
  • Smash
  • Heroes
  • Counter-Strike
  • Overwatch
  • Liquibet
  • Fantasy StarCraft
  • TLPD
  • StarCraft 2
  • Brood War
  • Blogs
Forum Sidebar
Events/Features
News
Featured News
Serral wins HomeStory Cup 2914Serral wins Maestros of the Game 243ByuL, and the Limitations of Standard Play3Team Liquid Map Contest #22: Results and Winners7Code S Season 2 (2026): RO4 and Finals Preview12
Community News
IntoTheTV X SOOP SC2 League : Weekly & Monthly4Clem: "I don't have that much hope in Blizzard"3ZeroSpace Early Access is Now Live!29Weekly Cups (July 13-19): Terran & Protoss rise; Zerg falters2Balance hotfix patch 5.0.16b (July 16)95
StarCraft 2
General
How would you feel about frequent/monthly balance patches for SC2? 3kb/s downloading patch..... are we back to 1998? Clem: "I don't have that much hope in Blizzard" Balance hotfix patch 5.0.16b (July 16) Reynor: GSL Loss Wasn't About Preparation Format
Tourneys
RSL Revival: Season 6 - Qualifiers and Main Event PIG STY FESTIVAL 8.0! (13 - 23 August) IntoTheTV X SOOP SC2 League : Weekly & Monthly INu's Battles#18 - Cure, herO, Rogue & ByuN Master Swan Open (Global Bronze-Master 2)
Strategy
[G] Having the right mentality to improve
Custom Maps
[M] (2) Industrial Park New Map Maker - Looking for Advice - Love or Hate
External Content
Cara Menghubungi Call Center Scoot Airlines Mutation # 536 Railroad Switch The PondCast: SC2 News & Results Mutation # 535 Assembly of Vengeance
Brood War
General
BW General Discussion ASL22 General Discussion BGH Auto Balance -> http://bghmmr.eu/ Recent recommended BW games screpdb: new Starcraft reporting tool
Tourneys
Escore Tournament - Season 3 2v2v2v2 Tournament [Megathread] Daily Proleagues Star Con San Diego 2026
Strategy
Simple Questions, Simple Answers PvT advise for noobs Fighting Spirit mining rates Creating a full chart of Zerg builds
Other Games
General Games
ZeroSpace Early Access is Now Live! General RTS Discussion Thread Nintendo Switch Thread Path of Exile Diablo IV
Dota 2
Looking for a Dota Mentor Official 'what is Dota anymore' discussion
League of Legends
TSM pausing esports and CLG Dead
Heroes of the Storm
Heroes of the Storm 2.0
Hearthstone
Deck construction bug
TL Mafia
TL Mafia Power Rank TL Mafia Community Thread NeO.D_StephenKing vs This Guy From 1 Million Dance
Community
General
US Politics Mega-thread Russo-Ukrainian War Thread Artificial Intelligence Thread European Politico-economics QA Mega-thread How to buy a book - shipping from Korea to Europe
Fan Clubs
The IdrA Fan Club The HerO Fan Club!
Media & Entertainment
Movie Discussion! Anime Discussion Thread Series you have seen recently... [Req][Books] Good Fantasy/SciFi books
Sports
2024 - 2026 Football Thread 2026-27 Football Thread placeholder TeamLiquid Health and Fitness Initiative For 2023 Formula 1 Discussion MLB/Baseball 2023
World Cup 2022
Tech Support
Computer Build, Upgrade & Buying Resource Thread Simple Questions Simple Answers FPS when play League Of Legend on laptop
TL Community
Northern Ireland Global Starcraft The Automated Ban List
Blogs
Games, Hormones, and "Dark" …
TrAiDoS
Hello guys!
LIN1s
ASL S22 English Commentary…
namkraft
Poker (part 2)
Nebuchad
An Exploration of th…
waywardstrategy
Customize Sidebar...

Website Feedback

Closed Threads



Active: 7429 users

Diablo IV - Page 74

Forum Index > General Games
Post a Reply
Prev 1 72 73 74 75 76 128 Next
Gorsameth
Profile Joined April 2010
Netherlands22488 Posts
May 18 2023 13:40 GMT
#1461
I fail to see the problem.
So there is an option difficulty for those who want the challenge that doesn't offer increased drop rates.

Why is this a problem?
If you want the challenge you use it, if you don't you don't.
It ignores such insignificant forces as time, entropy, and death
DarkPlasmaBall
Profile Blog Joined March 2010
United States46243 Posts
May 18 2023 13:54 GMT
#1462
On May 18 2023 22:29 {CC}StealthBlue wrote:
So... there is already an issue with the World Tiers even before launch. Tier I and II are exactly the same with no increase drop rates, so essentially a player can start in Tier I beat it and then do the capstone dungeon repeat said dungeon on Tier II and be in Tier III ala skipping Tier II immediately.


I thought the only differences were supposed to be that Tier 2 had harder enemies, gave more experience, and dropped higher amounts of gold than in Tier 1? Additional items don't seem to be mentioned until tiers 3, 4, and 5: https://www.gamesradar.com/diablo-4-world-tiers/
"There is nothing more satisfying than looking at a crowd of people and helping them get what I love." ~Day[9] Daily #100
Manit0u
Profile Blog Joined August 2004
Poland17800 Posts
Last Edited: 2023-05-18 18:22:27
May 18 2023 18:20 GMT
#1463
On May 18 2023 22:54 DarkPlasmaBall wrote:
Show nested quote +
On May 18 2023 22:29 {CC}StealthBlue wrote:
So... there is already an issue with the World Tiers even before launch. Tier I and II are exactly the same with no increase drop rates, so essentially a player can start in Tier I beat it and then do the capstone dungeon repeat said dungeon on Tier II and be in Tier III ala skipping Tier II immediately.


I thought the only differences were supposed to be that Tier 2 had harder enemies, gave more experience, and dropped higher amounts of gold than in Tier 1? Additional items don't seem to be mentioned until tiers 3, 4, and 5: https://www.gamesradar.com/diablo-4-world-tiers/


Yes, it's basically a "challenge mode" with bonus experience making up a bit for the increased time it takes to kill mobs.

Personally I like the approach Grim Dawn took with it, introducing "veteran mode" which was basically "normal +" for more experienced ARPG players. A bit more xp, stronger and tougher enemies but also more spawns with significantly increased chance of getting elite and boss spawns (increasing loot drops by increasing the number of mobs, not tinkering with drop chance or quality).
Time is precious. Waste it wisely.
andrewlt
Profile Joined August 2009
United States7702 Posts
May 18 2023 23:32 GMT
#1464
I think tier 2-5 is the basic normal -> nightmare -> hell -> torment mode of past games. Tier 1 is easy mode for the casual people who just want to finish the campaign. Of course, the players who are only focused on endgame will do tier 1 to rush to tier 3.
Archeon
Profile Joined May 2011
3271 Posts
May 19 2023 16:35 GMT
#1465
On May 18 2023 22:40 Gorsameth wrote:
I fail to see the problem.
So there is an option difficulty for those who want the challenge that doesn't offer increased drop rates.

Why is this a problem?
If you want the challenge you use it, if you don't you don't.

The problem is that for a vocal part of the playerbase ARPGs seem to be grinding simulators where the goal is to get max farming speed per second and while I don't mind that people do this, it's quite annoying that these people cry murder whenever the normal progression isn't the most optimal for that.
low gravity, yes-yes!
DarkPlasmaBall
Profile Blog Joined March 2010
United States46243 Posts
May 19 2023 17:12 GMT
#1466
Super helpful:
"There is nothing more satisfying than looking at a crowd of people and helping them get what I love." ~Day[9] Daily #100
farvacola
Profile Blog Joined January 2011
United States18866 Posts
May 19 2023 17:41 GMT
#1467
On May 20 2023 01:35 Archeon wrote:
Show nested quote +
On May 18 2023 22:40 Gorsameth wrote:
I fail to see the problem.
So there is an option difficulty for those who want the challenge that doesn't offer increased drop rates.

Why is this a problem?
If you want the challenge you use it, if you don't you don't.

The problem is that for a vocal part of the playerbase ARPGs seem to be grinding simulators where the goal is to get max farming speed per second and while I don't mind that people do this, it's quite annoying that these people cry murder whenever the normal progression isn't the most optimal for that.

Cheers to that, many of these complaints make no sense to me, but I'm just a filthy old casual looking to enjoy a game that sparks a bit of that gaming interest I find increasingly hard to come by.
"when the Dead Kennedys found out they had skinhead fans, they literally wrote a song titled 'Nazi Punks Fuck Off'"
andrewlt
Profile Joined August 2009
United States7702 Posts
May 19 2023 19:31 GMT
#1468
On May 20 2023 01:35 Archeon wrote:
Show nested quote +
On May 18 2023 22:40 Gorsameth wrote:
I fail to see the problem.
So there is an option difficulty for those who want the challenge that doesn't offer increased drop rates.

Why is this a problem?
If you want the challenge you use it, if you don't you don't.

The problem is that for a vocal part of the playerbase ARPGs seem to be grinding simulators where the goal is to get max farming speed per second and while I don't mind that people do this, it's quite annoying that these people cry murder whenever the normal progression isn't the most optimal for that.


That's partly why I don't play at many multiplayer games nowadays. I find the most vocal segments of the playerbase of most games to be quite obnoxious. I hope Blizzard listens to more than just the noisiest people.
ProMeTheus112
Profile Joined December 2009
France2027 Posts
May 19 2023 19:34 GMT
#1469
Well I think that's why polling is important.
Manit0u
Profile Blog Joined August 2004
Poland17800 Posts
May 19 2023 22:08 GMT
#1470
On May 20 2023 04:31 andrewlt wrote:
Show nested quote +
On May 20 2023 01:35 Archeon wrote:
On May 18 2023 22:40 Gorsameth wrote:
I fail to see the problem.
So there is an option difficulty for those who want the challenge that doesn't offer increased drop rates.

Why is this a problem?
If you want the challenge you use it, if you don't you don't.

The problem is that for a vocal part of the playerbase ARPGs seem to be grinding simulators where the goal is to get max farming speed per second and while I don't mind that people do this, it's quite annoying that these people cry murder whenever the normal progression isn't the most optimal for that.


That's partly why I don't play at many multiplayer games nowadays. I find the most vocal segments of the playerbase of most games to be quite obnoxious. I hope Blizzard listens to more than just the noisiest people.


I think it's part of the culture now, where everyone is suddenly a "gamer" and they have to "game" their games, preferably in a way that they're familiar with so similar or even the same features are being included in all games regardless of their genre etc.

Kinda sad really. When you look at the amount of time and resources that have to be put into a game for it to be a live service with multiple progression systems, cash shop, competitive whatever, seasonal content and such it's staggering. And all for a game that would be perfectly fine as a single player stand-alone game with potential expansions.

Not only does it take more time and effort to do it, there's much higher chance of doing it wrong, almost certain the original idea behind it is going to be lost and bigger pressure for it to do well to recoup all this extra cost (not to mention much higher maintenance costs).

It's madness in my opinion.
Time is precious. Waste it wisely.
andrewlt
Profile Joined August 2009
United States7702 Posts
May 19 2023 23:44 GMT
#1471
Oh, I don't mind having some live service elements in the games I play. I thought that Civ 6 and Total War: Warhammer, for example, were better served by having constant updates that could only come from having a constant stream of revenue. With that said, the budget and profit expectations are much higher for Diablo 4. Having 4 seasons a year sounds too much though I suppose I'm planning on playing nonseasonal content mostly.

I mean that I don't see why everything has to be turned into a competitive endeavor. Single player games don't need to be balanced. Part of the beauty of something like Total War is that some factions and start positions are harder than others. Multiplayer coop games (and Diablo is firmly in this category) don't need to be as balanced as competitive games. They should fix exploits and nerf clear outliers but some builds having faster optimal farming speeds than others is ok.
KrillinFromwales
Profile Blog Joined March 2022
68 Posts
May 20 2023 14:20 GMT
#1472
On May 20 2023 07:08 Manit0u wrote:
Show nested quote +
On May 20 2023 04:31 andrewlt wrote:
On May 20 2023 01:35 Archeon wrote:
On May 18 2023 22:40 Gorsameth wrote:
I fail to see the problem.
So there is an option difficulty for those who want the challenge that doesn't offer increased drop rates.

Why is this a problem?
If you want the challenge you use it, if you don't you don't.

The problem is that for a vocal part of the playerbase ARPGs seem to be grinding simulators where the goal is to get max farming speed per second and while I don't mind that people do this, it's quite annoying that these people cry murder whenever the normal progression isn't the most optimal for that.


That's partly why I don't play at many multiplayer games nowadays. I find the most vocal segments of the playerbase of most games to be quite obnoxious. I hope Blizzard listens to more than just the noisiest people.


I think it's part of the culture now, where everyone is suddenly a "gamer" and they have to "game" their games, preferably in a way that they're familiar with so similar or even the same features are being included in all games regardless of their genre etc.

Kinda sad really. When you look at the amount of time and resources that have to be put into a game for it to be a live service with multiple progression systems, cash shop, competitive whatever, seasonal content and such it's staggering. And all for a game that would be perfectly fine as a single player stand-alone game with potential expansions.

Not only does it take more time and effort to do it, there's much higher chance of doing it wrong, almost certain the original idea behind it is going to be lost and bigger pressure for it to do well to recoup all this extra cost (not to mention much higher maintenance costs).

It's madness in my opinion.


yeah i agree with this. there's not a lot of fresh blood in games these days and it doesn't seem like there's an emphasis on going outside the game design meta.

tbh i think some simpler features that just extended a long way could be nice. i wouldn't mind chuckling at level 666 characters running around in diablo 4. modern games seem so complex that the equilibria are sort of greyish
Latham
Profile Blog Joined May 2007
9588 Posts
May 20 2023 19:02 GMT
#1473


More discourse about World Tier 1 & 2...
For the curse of life is the curse of want. PC = https://be.pcpartpicker.com/user/LathamTK/builds/#view=CrqmP6
ProMeTheus112
Profile Joined December 2009
France2027 Posts
Last Edited: 2023-05-20 21:41:32
May 20 2023 21:40 GMT
#1474
It's interesting. I think ideal would be if there are real pros and cons to both picks even in terms of efficiency or risk/reward and if even any player would make different choices for T1/T2 depending on how their run is going / per character / situation on different "level brackets" etc.
Manit0u
Profile Blog Joined August 2004
Poland17800 Posts
Last Edited: 2023-05-20 23:53:57
May 20 2023 23:52 GMT
#1475
On May 20 2023 08:44 andrewlt wrote:
Oh, I don't mind having some live service elements in the games I play. I thought that Civ 6 and Total War: Warhammer, for example, were better served by having constant updates that could only come from having a constant stream of revenue. With that said, the budget and profit expectations are much higher for Diablo 4. Having 4 seasons a year sounds too much though I suppose I'm planning on playing nonseasonal content mostly.

I mean that I don't see why everything has to be turned into a competitive endeavor. Single player games don't need to be balanced. Part of the beauty of something like Total War is that some factions and start positions are harder than others. Multiplayer coop games (and Diablo is firmly in this category) don't need to be as balanced as competitive games. They should fix exploits and nerf clear outliers but some builds having faster optimal farming speeds than others is ok.


Civ and TWWH aren't really live service though. You can play them offline, single player, mod them to your heart's content and buy only the DLC you want, you don't have to be running the always online forced multiplayer with everything on top.
Time is precious. Waste it wisely.
{CC}StealthBlue
Profile Blog Joined January 2003
United States41117 Posts
Last Edited: 2023-05-21 18:29:30
May 21 2023 18:22 GMT
#1476
Thus confirmation one can easily skip Tier II basically by leveling past the boss level of the Tier II capstone dungeon Boss which is static according to said interview. All done via leveling up in Tier I.

"Smokey, this is not 'Nam, this is bowling. There are rules."
aseq
Profile Joined January 2003
Netherlands4015 Posts
May 21 2023 19:53 GMT
#1477
Pff I've heard little else than WT1 vs WT2 for the last week. Is it really that important? I hope Blizz just changes 1 number to scale up gear rewards too for WT2 so everyone is wrong.
Gorsameth
Profile Joined April 2010
Netherlands22488 Posts
Last Edited: 2023-05-21 19:58:36
May 21 2023 19:57 GMT
#1478
No its absolutely not important or a problem. The gaming community has just decided to make D4 controversial so now everything has to be fought over like a tribal war.

its arguing for the sake of it because the internet drama machine must be fed and is never satiated.
It ignores such insignificant forces as time, entropy, and death
DarkPlasmaBall
Profile Blog Joined March 2010
United States46243 Posts
May 21 2023 20:26 GMT
#1479
On May 22 2023 04:53 aseq wrote:
Pff I've heard little else than WT1 vs WT2 for the last week. Is it really that important? I hope Blizz just changes 1 number to scale up gear rewards too for WT2 so everyone is wrong.


Nope, not at all. As was noted by many people, there are reasons why someone may choose to play WT1 (e.g., quicker gameplay) and other reasons why someone may choose to play WT2 (e.g., enjoying a challenge), and it's completely subjective and relative. It's a non-issue.
"There is nothing more satisfying than looking at a crowd of people and helping them get what I love." ~Day[9] Daily #100
{CC}StealthBlue
Profile Blog Joined January 2003
United States41117 Posts
Last Edited: 2023-05-22 22:14:29
May 22 2023 22:12 GMT
#1480
I really hope the character voiced by Ralph Ineson, as he is an amazing voice actor, does not die and becomes like Deckard Cain or something. He is appearing more, and more which is great.

"Smokey, this is not 'Nam, this is bowling. There are rules."
Prev 1 72 73 74 75 76 128 Next
Please log in or register to reply.
Live Events Refresh
Next event in 8h 33m
[ Submit Event ]
Live Streams
Refresh
StarCraft 2
Nina 151
Ketroc 58
FoxeR 50
RuFF_SC2 1
StarCraft: Brood War
GuemChi 3905
Free 145
sSak 71
ZergMaN 42
Noble 26
Mind 19
yabsab 6
firebathero 0
Dota 2
NeuroSwarm239
League of Legends
Doublelift6687
Counter-Strike
summit1g11636
Fnx 633
taco 313
minikerr27
Super Smash Bros
hungrybox497
Heroes of the Storm
Khaldor140
Other Games
tarik_tv7652
JimRising 797
WinterStarcraft399
m0e_tv397
C9.Mang0301
Maynarde159
ROOTCatZ117
Livibee90
Organizations
Other Games
gamesdonequick1292
StarCraft 2
Blizzard YouTube
StarCraft: Brood War
BSLTrovo
[ Show 12 non-featured ]
StarCraft 2
• Mapu5
• AfreecaTV YouTube
• intothetv
• Kozan
• IndyKCrew
• LaughNgamezSOOP
• Migwel
• sooper7s
StarCraft: Brood War
• BSLYoutube
• STPLYoutube
• ZZZeroYoutube
League of Legends
• Rush343
Upcoming Events
WardiTV Weekly
8h 33m
Sparkling Tuna Cup
1d 7h
INu's Battles
1d 8h
Cure vs herO
ByuN vs Rogue
PiGosaur Cup
1d 21h
The PondCast
2 days
Kung Fu Cup
2 days
Patches Events
2 days
Replay Cast
3 days
CrankTV Team League
3 days
OSC
3 days
[ Show More ]
Replay Cast
3 days
Escore
4 days
CrankTV Team League
4 days
Replay Cast
4 days
Afreeca Starleague
5 days
RSL Revival
5 days
ByuN vs SHIN
Solar vs Lambo
WardiTV Summer Champion…
5 days
Afreeca Starleague
6 days
RSL Revival
6 days
Clem vs Serral
herO vs Rogue
WardiTV Summer Champion…
6 days
Liquipedia Results

Completed

Acropolis #4
SCTL 2026 Spring
Eternal Conflict S2 Finale

Ongoing

CSL 2026 Summer (S21)
KCM Race Survival 2026 Season 3
RSL Revival: Season 6
CranK Gathers Season 4: BW vs SC2 Team League
BLAST Bounty Summer Qual
Stake Ranked Episode 3
XSE Pro League 2026
IEM Cologne Major 2026
Stake Ranked Episode 2
CS Asia Championships 2026
Asian Champions League 2026
IEM Atlanta 2026
PGL Astana 2026

Upcoming

Escore Tournament S3: W5
ASL Season 22: Qualifier #1
ASL Season 22: Qualifier #2
Acropolis #5
CSLAN 4
ASL Season 22
Acropolis #5 - TRS
HSC XXX
SC4ALL II: StarCraft II
Kung Fu Cup 2026 Grand Finals
PiG Sty Festival 8.0
Light Tournament 2026
ESL Pro League Season 24
Stake Ranked Episode 4
Logitech G Connect 2026
SL StarSeries Fall 2026
FISSURE Playground #5
BLAST Open Fall 2026
Esports World Cup 2026
BLAST Bounty Summer 2026
TLPD

1. ByuN
2. TY
3. Dark
4. Solar
5. Stats
6. Nerchio
7. sOs
8. soO
9. INnoVation
10. Elazer
1. Rain
2. Flash
3. EffOrt
4. Last
5. Bisu
6. Soulkey
7. Mini
8. Sharp
Sidebar Settings...

Advertising | Privacy Policy | Terms Of Use | Contact Us

Original banner artwork: Jim Warren
The contents of this webpage are copyright © 2026 TLnet. All Rights Reserved.