| Forum Index > General Games |
|
Silvanel
Poland4742 Posts
Not much info yet: https://baldursgate3.game/ Trailer below: So any thoughts about Larian doing it? Personally i hope the graphic style more resembles original BG games than Original Sins (i liked both OS games but in my opinion something closer to orignal style would be much more fitting). Anyway i am hopeful and pumped. Edit: Illithids as a main theme - i dont know how to feel about that yet... | ||
|
PoulsenB
Poland7730 Posts
| ||
|
OsaX Nymloth
Poland3244 Posts
| ||
|
InFiNitY[pG]
Germany3474 Posts
| ||
|
karazax
United States3737 Posts
| ||
|
Silvanel
Poland4742 Posts
| ||
|
Bacillus
Finland2019 Posts
It seems like they're using the city of Baldur's Gate, but I don't think Baldur's Gate ever was about the city. The city was probably the least polished part of the original and rarely mentioned in the 2nd one. | ||
|
deacon.frost
Czech Republic12129 Posts
On June 07 2019 03:17 InFiNitY[pG] wrote: While I am not a fan of the ilithid theme (yet), there is no developer that I would trust to make a better BG3 than Larian, and that includes today's Bioware. DoS2 is a fucking brilliant RPG, I am 100% sure they are gonna do a great job making a worthy successor, plus they got the time and the money to make the perfect version of their game inXile? (Torment - Tide of Numenera, Wasteland) Obsidian? (Pillars of Eternity 1 & 2, KOTOR2, Tyranny) Thinking about it, I would like Obsidian to do that more, just because how dark the PoE was, but I don't mind these guys doing it either. Anyway, Cthulhu in a BG game?  I'm sold.On June 07 2019 04:48 Bacillus wrote: I'm having a bit trouble figuring out how they're going to connect it to the original series. The original story arc is as complete as it gets. I guess you can drop in some familiar characters and items, but that's probably it. It seems like they're using the city of Baldur's Gate, but I don't think Baldur's Gate ever was about the city. The city was probably the least polished part of the original and rarely mentioned in the 2nd one. It should be 100 years later after BG2. So IMO no connection unless they allow necromancy  | ||
|
Godwrath
Spain10138 Posts
If there is a company that can do something like this is Larian imo. | ||
|
Manit0u
Poland17665 Posts
| ||
|
Starlightsun
United States1405 Posts
On June 07 2019 06:46 Manit0u wrote: I wish this trend with games and movies would end. I could really use some new titles instead of constantly rehashing old franchises and milking the nostalgia. I wouldn't mind it if they really did justice to the franchises by creating a new classic. But time after time it ends up as a mediocre game/movie that is completely forgettable if not for name stealing. So yeah I agree, wish it would end too. Cynical money grabbing at its worst. | ||
|
blunderfulguy
United States1415 Posts
*Actually, I think the cancelled BG3 was going to be more connected to IWD2 or even the Dark Alliance series? It's been so long since I've been into any of those, I can't quite remember... The first time I saw the city overview was from the 5e adventure Descent into Avernus reveal stuff and couldn't help but think "gosh, that sure looks CG and like it belongs in a video game..." and it's cool that I was right! When the trailer hit and I saw the soldier starting to transform, I was hoping it would go in the devil or demon direction. A mind flayer was not expected and confusing, I don't get why they went that route. But I'm happy to see a BG3 coming out. Crossing my fingers it's interesting, most CRPGs in the last few (eh, several) years haven't held my attention for very long, I'd really like this one to. Torment: Tides of Numenera let me down kinda hard and nothing else has grabbed me except the Kingmaker game which (after many months of bug fixing and DLC adding) finally moved the bar that was set by Icewind Dale, Fallout 2, and Planescape: Torment when I played them ages ago. I really want to find time to finish Kingmaker and go back and play and finish BG 1-2, IWD 1-2, and P:T... | ||
|
Silvanel
Poland4742 Posts
| ||
|
deacon.frost
Czech Republic12129 Posts
On June 07 2019 15:36 Silvanel wrote: Havent played Kingamaker yet but there have been some very good RPGs in the last few years. OS2, Pillars, Tyrrany (too short), Witcher 3. Its not BG2/MoB/Torment 1 but they are still very good in my opinion. New Torment kinda put my out in the begining still have to come back to it. Well Tyranny was short because the premise was you will play it at least 3 times, preferably 4 times with different choices. Not sure if the western world is prepared for such games but it was an interesting concept. (I believe there are 4 endings, not sure though) | ||
|
Silvanel
Poland4742 Posts
| ||
|
-Archangel-
Croatia7457 Posts
On June 07 2019 06:46 Manit0u wrote: I wish this trend with games and movies would end. I could really use some new titles instead of constantly rehashing old franchises and milking the nostalgia. Then I hope you are already playing Pathfinder: Kingmaker as it is not based on old franchise but it is equally awesome. | ||
|
-Archangel-
Croatia7457 Posts
On June 07 2019 15:36 Silvanel wrote: Havent played Kingamaker yet but there have been some very good RPGs in the last few years. OS2, Pillars, Tyrrany (too short), Witcher 3. Its not BG2/MoB/Torment 1 but they are still very good in my opinion. New Torment kinda put my out in the begining still have to come back to it. Then playing Kingmaker now would be perfect time as they just released Enhanced Edition and last DLC. | ||
|
blunderfulguy
United States1415 Posts
Thinking about it again just now, one game I loved at the time but always forget exists is Shadowrun Returns. Never played Dragonfall or Hong Kong, or at least I don't remember playing them... I was even on a tabletop Shadowrun kick at the time, too. Is my memory just that bad and everyone else really likes them? | ||
|
Silvanel
Poland4742 Posts
Edit: I am absolutly going to play Kingmaker, i just prefere to wait for the time when game has all dlc realesed. I dont have time for two walktroughs. Edit 2: Is Kingmaker based on any books, campaigns, theme in Pathfinder universe or is it something tottaly new? | ||
|
bluzi
4703 Posts
Hoping for some more information , i would suspect a E3 2020 game play and release end of 2020 or early 2021. | ||
|
Manit0u
Poland17665 Posts
On June 07 2019 19:24 -Archangel- wrote: Then I hope you are already playing Pathfinder: Kingmaker as it is not based on old franchise but it is equally awesome. I am indeed. Pre-ordered it and got all DLC for it. On June 07 2019 20:05 blunderfulguy wrote: The Witcher 3 is one of the best games ever made, but that whole series is pretty far from CRPG territory. Although, perhaps it's time for CRPGs to have more cutscenes and up-close, face-to-face interactions with NPCs like a lot of the other styles of RPGs so they can change up the storytelling and dialogue formulae within the sub-genre a little. Thinking about it again just now, one game I loved at the time but always forget exists is Shadowrun Returns. Never played Dragonfall or Hong Kong, or at least I don't remember playing them... I was even on a tabletop Shadowrun kick at the time, too. Is my memory just that bad and everyone else really likes them? Witcher series are not my cup of tea. They're just trying to do too much: plenty of action and also plenty of gathering resources, crafting, wandering around etc. I think it would be better if they went in one direction and maintain the pace instead of "some story, action, action, action, gathering, gathering, crafting, action, action, wait... Where was I with the story again?" It's also a bit too arcade'y for me. I think that in this format the best RPG to date is Vampire: The Masquerade: Bloodlines. Shadowrun: Dragonfall is amazing, much better than Returns actually. Hong Kong is really good too. Numenera is also fun, but feels a bit weird. | ||
|
Sbrubbles
Brazil5776 Posts
On June 07 2019 15:36 Silvanel wrote: Havent played Kingamaker yet but there have been some very good RPGs in the last few years. OS2, Pillars, Tyrrany (too short), Witcher 3. Its not BG2/MoB/Torment 1 but they are still very good in my opinion. New Torment kinda put my out in the begining still have to come back to it. Kingmaker is fun to a point, but I had a lot of frustration playing it. The battle difficulty is all over the place, it can go from "this guy has such high AC that I can only hit him with critical hits" to "this one character (goblin rogue dude) is killing everything by himself with his insane sneak attacks". Luckily, there's a "fuck this bullshit" button (difficulty slider) which you can mess around with at will. I found the world building to be uninspired and dull (with exception of a few choice places like the cyclop lich's tomb). Part of this is a consequence of the story: you're not really exploring some wondurous land on some exciting quest. You're running around in your backwater barony's lands (which is just empty forrests/mountains with the ocassional ruin) killing dangerous things and solving whatever's plaguing the populace that year. Chapter 4 (or whatever the Pitax one is) has you doing some nonsense diplomacy that made me cringe. Finally, the UI could use a lot of work. For example, when I was leveling up, there's no indication of which future feats will become available if I take a currently available feat (like cleave requiring power attack), so this requires me to look at all unavailable feats one by one to figure out what I would do, when a simple feat skill tree would have made it much clearer. Quests are much more confusing than they need to be, meaning I had to wiki way more than I did for something like PoE 2. | ||
|
M3t4PhYzX
Poland4235 Posts
GL HF dev team! Can't wait to sink my teeth in the final product. Take Your time, though. There is absolutely no rush at all with things as important as this is | ||
Nakajin
Canada8989 Posts
With that said, it's one of the best game I ever played. | ||
|
blunderfulguy
United States1415 Posts
On June 07 2019 20:55 Silvanel wrote: Edit: I am absolutly going to play Kingmaker, i just prefere to wait for the time when game has all dlc realesed. I dont have time for two walktroughs. Edit 2: Is Kingmaker based on any books, campaigns, theme in Pathfinder universe or is it something tottaly new? The original Kingmaker adventure series was an Adventure Path for the tabletop game. The Kingmaker CRPG by Owlcat follows the basic premise of the original series of adventure books but has a lot of new or slightly different things going on, and obviously plays completely different than the 4-6 player tabletop campaign. I believe Ed Greenwood was a big part of making the original adventures, and Chris Avellone worked on the CRPG with Owlcat staff. The Adventure Path is also coming up on its 10th anniversary and is getting a crowdfunded rerelease of sorts. It'll include all or most of the new things in the CRPG, and will have rules for Pathfinder 2e and D&D 5e iirc. *I suppose I'll add here that, in the CRPG, the Hard and whatever difficulty above that are extremely difficult because enemy AC and critical hit damage multiplier are very high. It isn't recommended that you play on Hard unless you like the gameplay of save-scumming and doing fights over and over, which I do to some degree. They have a lot of options and sliders in the difficulty menu to tweak the difficulty. When I played I kept almost everything at "Hard" except for critical hit damage and something else, I can't remember what, and I'd suggest looking over that screen for a minute, and normal vs hard or what-have-you, no matter which difficulty you're going to play on. **I'd also recommend playing the tabletop game, but getting that and a group of players together every week for a long campaign was next to impossible for me as a kid in my small-ish Midwestern town, and as an adult everyone is so much busier. Rise of the Runelords was another Pathfinder Adventure Path that a lot of friends started with and still love introducing new players to Pathfinder and D&D 5e with, it'd be cool of Owlcat takes on that if they make another Pathfinder CRPG... Anywho, there are tons of great tabletop adventurers out there. | ||
|
Silvanel
Poland4742 Posts
| ||
|
Nalmissra
4 Posts
It's goofy, it's stupid, as soon as i started and i was collecting 2000 seashells and stealing whole cabinets from people's houses i could tell this game was not for me. I was hoping it was Obsidian but now i wish it had been Owlcat instead. Kingmaker comes closest to the true RPG experience of IWD, BG etc. Hopefully the game takes nothing from DOS2 and more from other, better RPGs, and emulates at least the combat and item progression style of the Infinity engine games. It could have been worse, it could have been EA's Bioware i guess. | ||
|
{CC}StealthBlue
United States41117 Posts
| ||
|
OsaX Nymloth
Poland3244 Posts
aaaand..... it looks like Divinity: Original Sin - D&D Edition. Not impressed tbh | ||
|
Erasme
Bahamas15899 Posts
On June 08 2019 08:53 Nalmissra wrote: I was dreading it was Larian. To this day DOS2 is the only uninstalled RPG in my library because i absolutely hate it.I don't even know why anyone is even praising the game . I don't know whose brilliant idea it was that every spell in this stupid game creates some aoe puddle that stacks to form some retarded aoe soup but yeah...horrendous game design. Oh you cast "fire arrow" aka single target spell well it is now lake of fire oh and the next guy that casts some other spell is gonna topdeck on top of your aoe, jesus christ, which you all have to walk through now .And i cant look past something like that, its not like i hate some guy's voice acting or some NPC' s hat , i absolutely hate the game when it comes to core combat mechanics. It's goofy, it's stupid, as soon as i started and i was collecting 2000 seashells and stealing whole cabinets from people's houses i could tell this game was not for me. I was hoping it was Obsidian but now i wish it had been Owlcat instead. Kingmaker comes closest to the true RPG experience of IWD, BG etc. Hopefully the game takes nothing from DOS2 and more from other, better RPGs, and emulates at least the combat and item progression style of the Infinity engine games. It could have been worse, it could have been EA's Bioware i guess. This was a very well thought post with remarkable insights. Thank you. | ||
|
HolydaKing
21254 Posts
| ||
|
blunderfulguy
United States1415 Posts
The dialogue and options feel off in a way. The voice acting is very off-putting, it feels so unnatural in the writing and overacted/overexaggerated, hyper-theatrical all around. ("*I* am a D&D CHARACTER with this fantastical ACCENT!" The vampire spawn is basically Edgy Paul Bettany the Dragon Age Character, and everyone else is a caricature too. I thought we were past this.) The combat looks like it's in the middle of being polished. It doesn't exactly remind me of Baldur's Gate, but this long after those old CRPGs, I would never expect it to either. What it doesn't remind me of is Divinity Original Sin in any way except the pacing, it just looks like a modern CRPG. All the systems are very much in-line with D&D 5e with the character creation, abilities, different actions, bonus actions, advantage and disadvantage; which is nice but doesn't make a big difference to me with a first impression of an awkward gameplay demo. Looks like D&D, albeit a very literal, cut-and-dry adaptation of the rules. It doesn't look like they're including "gimmicky" mechanics (like the elemental effects of DOS2). The biggest gameplay things that stand out are the kinds of things that are (hopefully) going to be changed throughout testing and before release (AI, pathing, UI stuff, targeting awkwardness, to-hit and damage numbers, that kinda thing), and animations that are still being finished. I'd much prefer if the numbers behind the scenes were fudged for the monsters to make the game less swingy and random and instead more designed, but, eh, hopefully you can tweak a bunch of difficulty settings and other options at launch. I basically just see a lot of potential, and nothing telling me that it's going to be a bad game by any means, just maybe lacking in a few areas (mostly dialogue, but I've only seen a few minutes of that so far), but also potentially excelling in some too (like the cutscenes). I guess it looks kinda like Dragon Age in the Forgotten Realms more than anything, and kinda like Larian is treating Baldur's Gate similarly to how Owlcat is treating Pathfinder but using an already-built engine and an experienced team. We'll see how it goes. I actually want to play it, so there's that. | ||
|
Sbrubbles
Brazil5776 Posts
I know it's minor, but the dialog as narration is very strange. | ||
|
Bacillus
Finland2019 Posts
Not that I really feel like going back to the bhaalspawn storyline though, not at least to the excisting characters and all that. The original saga is one of the most complete arcs in the whole gaming in my books. It doesn't really need expansion there. Lots of things to explore outside that too though, so I hope Larian finds their Baldur's Gate connections in some different way. | ||
|
-Archangel-
Croatia7457 Posts
On February 28 2020 21:22 Sbrubbles wrote: I dunno, not that impressed. I wasn't a fan of Divinity OS 1 (and never played 2), and it looks very similar, so I don't have the greatest expectations. I know it's minor, but the dialog as narration is very strange. I agree with this. I also quit DOS1 about 2/3 into the game and never even bothered to try DOS2. I am especially not impressed when Larian was saying recently they got 350 people working on this game (when they counted all the outsourcing too). For a AAA production, this looks worse than DAO. I was hoping at least it would be at DAO level and hoped for better.. | ||
|
InFiNitY[pG]
Germany3474 Posts
| ||
|
virpi
Germany3599 Posts
| ||
|
andrewlt
United States7702 Posts
My biggest annoyance is the item system. It’s really tedious to have to search so many things and go through so much junk to get the few important quest items and crafting materials. Game does a terrible job of letting the player know if it’s safe to get rid of certain flavor items. | ||
|
M3t4PhYzX
Poland4235 Posts
Kinda worried it won't live up to the hype, but we will see.. Not feeling it at the moment. | ||
|
nanaoei
3358 Posts
thing i don't like: - DoS2 with small UI and graphical changes. from what was shown, the large circle (indicating the hitbox or space occupied by the moving character) that shows where you are moving is very very out of place for a game like this. they would have done better with RTS cursor movement. i'm not a fan of the same old font used in other larian games. there is no system in the huge skill bar (34 per row i believe) to help with organizing. meaning that this will all be a nightmare when this game eventually gets released on console. - once again with the magic inventory system where you can send items from anywhere regardless of distance. i see this as a negative unless you are playing purely solo. this is a problem because it allows for a lot of weird exploits. - dialogue options as mentioned are narrated first person and roleplaying centric. this is this exact stuff people do online, asterisks included. it's out of place and uneasy as it is. - the DnD systems are hidden under a shell that most people will never touch. so 90% hitrate is just 90% hitrate. this is an example of convenience and ease of use not really accomplishing much more than simplifying systems that a lot of people are familiar with. things i do like: - the freedom which seems to be even more than in DoS2. now the problem with this are the exploits and the many walls the level and encounter designers must set up to make it so the creativity can't get out of hand. you can do shit in the other larian games, but with DnD spells and more support. - cinematics are on point. - looks good, and will be far-reaching. - will have a great co-op experience with 2 or 3 other people. | ||
|
Latham
9568 Posts
I agree with this guy in the video: | ||
|
necrosexy
451 Posts
Oh frabjous day, callooh callay! | ||
|
Sbrubbles
Brazil5776 Posts
We can speculate all we want, and chances are things will still change, but I wonder if they would have been better off giving a different title altogether. Neverwinter nights wasn't named BG 3 for a reason, I guess. Edit: not to say it won't be a success anyway. Fallout 3 worked through the initial wtf, and the difference there between games was order of magnitudes bigger than the difference here. Maybe the difference being bigger actually helped ... somehow | ||
|
DrunkenSCV
76 Posts
On March 01 2020 08:48 Sbrubbles wrote: We can speculate all we want, and chances are things will still change, but I wonder if they would have been better off giving a different title altogether. Neverwinter nights wasn't named BG 3 for a reason, I guess. Edit: not to say it won't be a success anyway. Fallout 3 worked through the initial wtf, and the difference there between games was order of magnitudes bigger than the difference here. Maybe the difference being bigger actually helped ... somehow It reminds me of Fallout 3 too. A foreign company makes the 3rd part of the series without even trying to make it somewhat relevant to the first two. If Larian wanted their next Divinity happen in DnD: Forgotten Realms setting, they could do that without using BG title. What they've shown us reminds of Baldur's Gate in no way at all. Even smaller details like sounds and interface elements remind of Divinity, not BG. I liked Divinity: OS 2. But it's nothing like BG, it's a quite different experience. It's like reading books vs watching cartoons. Imagine there is an old art house movie that you love very much. Then you get to know there is gonna be a sequel... you have mixed feelings: surprise, confusion, but also a bit of hope. Then they reveal the details: starring Dwayne Johnson and Vine Diesel, made by Disney. This is just sad. | ||
|
True_Spike
Poland3426 Posts
What I saw looks like D:OS meets D&D, but *feels* nothing like a Baldur's Gate game. Turn-based combat I'm fine with (even though I prefer rtwp), but the extremely gimmicky gameplay systems from D:OS clash very hard with my expectations. The music, the dialogues, itemization, the overall aesthetic and tone of the game is, to me, completely wrong. I'm sure Larian will make a decent RPG, as always, but that's beside the point; The game is called Baldur's Gate 3, after all, and certain expectations come with that title. | ||
|
iPlaY.NettleS
Australia4384 Posts
I'm following black geyser and that's all right now. | ||
|
blunderfulguy
United States1415 Posts
Something else I realized was that there probably aren't very many people who have been following everything going on with Baldur's Gate after the second game, and I mean everything, so I'll give some big-picture context. The story of Baldur's Gate 1 and 2 is a contained thing, to me and I think a lot of people. It's separate from the Dark Alliance series and the tabletop games (for the most part). That story was finished in the second game and its expansion; it'll always be there, and is always going to be as great as it is for all time for the people who care about it. So whatever the story of any other games and how much it has to do with BG1/2 doesn't matter too much in my mind and, I think, to WotC and the team making BG3. I also think if they were to try and chase after some weird concept of "BG3 takes place after BG2 and everything is tied together" that the game would just be a mess and the writing would never be good because it would be trying to extend something that's been finished for a long time. That route doesn't make sense to me, even ignoring everything else that's happened since BG2. Now let's talk about D&D 5e and what that means for BG3 specifically. WotC started calling the new series of tabletop and computer RPGs "The Baldur's Gate Saga" with the creation of Baldur's Gate: Descent into Avernus (maybe earlier, idk). "The Baldur's Gate Saga" extends all the way back to 2013 with D&D Next (the testing phase for 5th Edition in which every adventure had rules for 3.5, 4e, and Next/5e). In order, this is the new saga they refer to: 2013 Ghosts of Dragonspear Castle, 2014 Dreams of the Red Wizards: Scourge of the Sword Coast, 2014 Dreams of the Red Wizards: Dead in Thay, 2015 Murder in Baldur's Gate, 2017 Baldur's Gate: Descent into Avernus, 2020/21 Baldur's Gate 3. The important ones, and the focus of the current story, are Descent into Avernus and Baldur's Gate 3, with Murder in Baldur's Gate being barely relevant (I think). From what I can tell, that's the current story they're continuing with for this new "saga." If you don't play tabletop RPGs, I think you should try them, and even if none of the TRPG adventures are closely tied to anything in BG3, they are pretty fun. Descent into Avernus involves going from Baldur's Gate to the first layer of Hell (Avernus) and playing a weird Mad Max meets Diablo kind of adventure with devil contracts and fallen angels and currency based on peoples' souls, and all that kind of craziness. Side note about Dark Alliance: + Show Spoiler + Since the "Dark Alliance" "reboot" was announced, it seems that Dark Alliance 3 and the follow-up to the teaser ending of Dark Alliance 2 is forever lost (read: killed off by whoever decided that giving this new ARPG-thing the same name was a good idea). R.i.p. Dark Alliance. On a personal note, whatever happens to BG3, it's guaranteed to be magnitudes better than what is happening to DA (so far). Side note about Icewind Dale: + Show Spoiler + After Icewind Dale 2, like with Baldur's Gate 2, there was nothing major for a long time until the 2015 release of Legacy of the Crystal Shard for D&D Next. Sadly, there's hasn't been anything else tied to Icewind Dale since then. Where the story of BG3 goes in the long run isn't out there yet, but there's some stuff you can get from the cinematic. An evil mind flayer from the Far Realm (eldritch horror dimension) aboard a Spelljammer vessel (fantasy spaceship) is attacking cities including Baldur's Gate and being fought by githyanki (arch-enemies of mind flayers) and red dragons from the Astral Plane (weird dream sea that is connected to all other planes/dimensions in the world, including Realmspace/space-space which you fly through to reach other worlds using fantasy spaceships), and the characters have been infested with mind flayer tadpoles which are going to eat their brains, kill them, and morph them into new mind flayers. What does this have to do with BG1/2? I don't think much besides the fact that Baldur's Gate is a core location, and I think that's fine. It's new territory for a D&D game, and even in TRPGs hasn't been touched on in a while, and the lore they're pulling from is awesome and promising imo. So, yeah. BG3 is a new game, with a new story, and a different direction. The tabletop RPG Descent into Avernus happens before Baldur's Gate 3, but might only be connected in the grand history of Baldur's Gate in terms of what WotC considers canon. The old CRPGs, the old ARPGs, the newer TRPGs, and Baldur's Gate 3 are probably all meant to be four, separate, contained stories, tied together by the setting and its long history, and possibly a few key characters and villains sprinkled throughout. + Show Spoiler + Maybe the next TRPG adventure will be about Spelljammer and fighting mind flayers in the Astral Plane and travelling between settings. There have been a few other nods to Spelljammer in 5e books, so if it isn't a TRPG adventure in the next year it could very well be a place for BG3 or even 4 to dive into, using the IP to explore new things instead of trying to retread old, established ground. Maybe that context will change where peoples' heads are at with this, idk. /shrug Rambling continues, might delete later: + Show Spoiler + The idea that BG3 would ever be a "true continuation of the story and gameplay" by hardcore fans seems a little ridiculous to me. Vocal people either want it to have no impact on their precious BG1/2 story, or they want it to be 1,000% faithful to the original in every conceivable way from graphics to gameplay to writing but also be new and modern (somehow). The former is actually possible, even if it requires ignoring BG3 to maintain your own head-canon (which requires no effort on your part), but the latter is impossible and completely ridiculous. It's like hating the new Star Wars trilogy to me. Who cares. Why waste your breath on this. It isn't for you, move on. It's probably going to be a good game, and if you don't like it then go back to playing BG1/2 over and over or find something else to do. The negativity for this, especially after that awesome cinematic of an illithid spelljammer fighting red dragon-riding githyanki, seems silly, and more so when looking at the big picture. /rant | ||
|
DrunkenSCV
76 Posts
On March 02 2020 14:41 blunderfulguy wrote: Rambling continues, might delete later: + Show Spoiler + The idea that BG3 would ever be a "true continuation of the story and gameplay" by hardcore fans seems a little ridiculous to me. Vocal people either want it to have no impact on their precious BG1/2 story, or they want it to be 1,000% faithful to the original in every conceivable way from graphics to gameplay to writing but also be new and modern (somehow). The former is actually possible, even if it requires ignoring BG3 to maintain your own head-canon (which requires no effort on your part), but the latter is impossible and completely ridiculous. It's like hating the new Star Wars trilogy to me. Who cares. Why waste your breath on this. It isn't for you, move on. It's probably going to be a good game, and if you don't like it then go back to playing BG1/2 over and over or find something else to do. The negativity for this, especially after that awesome cinematic of an illithid spelljammer fighting red dragon-riding githyanki, seems silly, and more so when looking at the big picture. /rant Yeah, the awesome cinematic makes all negativity about the actual game silly, a fair point that is. Very few people want (I've seen none, actually) BG3 to be a "true continuation of the story", what you claim there is not true. The story is concluded, pretty much everyone agrees with that. There are modern games like PoE and PK: KM that are true spiritual heirs of the classical CRPGs. So saying that people wanting the gameplay and graphics be modern yet faithful to BG1/2 is ridiculous and impossible is ridiculous and impossible. There are reasons why isometric camera view is so important. It gives you context as beautifully pictured locations while leaving details to your imagination. I still remember the Elven city with its airy architecture and that city with the fancy mosaic in the town square. I still remember meeting Khalid and Jaheira, Aerie, Viconia. As if those are my personal memories. I played DOS2 something like 1.5 years ago and I've already almost forgotten everything. For me when camera is behind character, it's like witnessing the story, while isometric camera make me feel more like I am part of it. Besides that, the game can be dark and even brutal at times without looking grotesque. Like, remember Dragon Age? All your characters are soaking with blood all time. The final dungeon is visually repulsive. As it's supposed to be, but I think text and visual hints work better in such cases. On the combat system now. I've seen many times this point: "What is the idea of RTwP when you pause all time anyway?". Can't say for others, but I don't pause all time. This is the point of thinking over character generation and progression, figuring mechanics out and learning how things work. If I feel tired of some dungeon I can spend some extra resources like potions and scrolls to speed up the dynamics. RTwP allows bigger party. So I find it overall more strategic and less tactical than turn based. I don't hate turn based combats, I just want to point out that there are some cons and pros. There are many more things I'd like to say, but I've already said much. Just don't think of those who didn't like how the demo looks as some weird fools with duck syndrome. I suggest reading baldur's gate subreddit if you want to know why some people are upset about BG3. I think there are many good and fair points. | ||
|
insitelol
845 Posts
| ||
|
Bacillus
Finland2019 Posts
I guess the starting motivations for the story are mostly the parasites and abduction/crash aftermath. | ||
|
blunderfulguy
United States1415 Posts
On March 02 2020 18:05 DrunkenSCV wrote: Yeah, the awesome cinematic makes all negativity about the actual game silly, a fair point that is. Very few people want (I've seen none, actually) BG3 to be a "true continuation of the story", what you claim there is not true. The story is concluded, pretty much everyone agrees with that. There are modern games like PoE and PK: KM that are true spiritual heirs of the classical CRPGs. So saying that people wanting the gameplay and graphics be modern yet faithful to BG1/2 is ridiculous and impossible is ridiculous and impossible. There are reasons why isometric camera view is so important. It gives you context as beautifully pictured locations while leaving details to your imagination. I still remember the Elven city with its airy architecture and that city with the fancy mosaic in the town square. I still remember meeting Khalid and Jaheira, Aerie, Viconia. As if those are my personal memories. I played DOS2 something like 1.5 years ago and I've already almost forgotten everything. For me when camera is behind character, it's like witnessing the story, while isometric camera make me feel more like I am part of it. Besides that, the game can be dark and even brutal at times without looking grotesque. Like, remember Dragon Age? All your characters are soaking with blood all time. The final dungeon is visually repulsive. As it's supposed to be, but I think text and visual hints work better in such cases. On the combat system now. I've seen many times this point: "What is the idea of RTwP when you pause all time anyway?". Can't say for others, but I don't pause all time. This is the point of thinking over character generation and progression, figuring mechanics out and learning how things work. If I feel tired of some dungeon I can spend some extra resources like potions and scrolls to speed up the dynamics. RTwP allows bigger party. So I find it overall more strategic and less tactical than turn based. I don't hate turn based combats, I just want to point out that there are some cons and pros. There are many more things I'd like to say, but I've already said much. Just don't think of those who didn't like how the demo looks as some weird fools with duck syndrome. I suggest reading baldur's gate subreddit if you want to know why some people are upset about BG3. I think there are many good and fair points. Why do people keep saying the camera angle is locked to third-person? Did I miss something? I wouldn't be surprised, I just honestly didn't think that was true the couple of times I saw it pop up. In the PAX demo Swen uses a near-isometric view half the time (at least I thought so), moving the camera around and zooming in and out. Maybe the camera zoom depends on the particular area, but the way it looks now it definitely isn't locked to third-person. That aside, if you feel that a distant isometric view helps you feel like a part of the story, most players will actually disagree with you; a third-person view, especially when combined with light cutscenes, tends to give a feeling of being closer to characters and story more than an isometric view does, so I think you're in the minority there. An adjustable view that goes from a locked third-person to a zoomed-out isometric view is the best when it's appropriate. We didn't see any brief cutscenes showing off the larger area (yet), but overall it seemed like an adjustable view with light cutscenes was the case in the gameplay showcase demo thing. If you remembered a game from twenty years ago better than some other newer game, that doesn't mean an isometric view is better or even that the game was better, it just means you liked it more. What is more likely with fans of original BG or [insert very old game here] is that it was one of the early games they played in that genre that they loved and have thick nostalgia goggles about when it comes to minor things, and/or they formed some bias against anything like a newer game that they happened to not enjoy or remember for any myriad of reasons that probably have nothing to do with stuff like a game's camera angle (unless you just absolutely hate certain established camera angles)... As for turn-based vs real-time combat, the vast majority of players play CRPGs in turned-based modes or with heavy pause usage (a lot of RTS players actually pause a lot or play on slower settings). And since this game uses 5th Edition D&D, that's another reason for it to be turn-based (D&D is turn-based). One gameplay complaint I've seen that I agree with is that group initiative (enemies take all their turns then your party takes all its turns) is not what a lot of people want, and I can see that changing later on after the team gets more of that feedback from players if they aren't already working on it (I didn't hear that question during the Q&A bit and was a little surprised it didn't come up). Again, the best thing for everyone is to have a ton of options and settings to change, but that's different for every game, engine, and studio, and sometimes making a decision about things like camera angles can make for a better game (designing for X instead of X, Y, and Z tends to make development smoother and games better as a result). On March 02 2020 20:04 Bacillus wrote: I have to say the opening cinematic didn't really help out the things for me. At the start I'm looking for something to anchor me down, give me ideas about the spirit and mentality of the game and so on. And here I am, presented a high stakes conflict between two supernatural races that I vaguely know. It's a cool cinematic, but I couldn't help to feel pretty indifferent considering how epic the proportions are and hoped it had established something more relatable in the runtime of whopping 5 minutes. There are some clues with the dead mind flayers and abducted gihtyanki of course, but even those are pretty far removed from the business of mere mortals. I guess the starting motivations for the story are mostly the parasites and abduction/crash aftermath. The point about being grounded is totally valid. I guess I assume that dragons and weird bits of D&D lore I've loved for almost twenty years counterbalances that, along with the actual gameplay after the opening. We haven't seen the tutorial (afaik), and that might be the kicker for some. A good tutorial purely from a mechanics standpoint can make a game, and a bad one break it, but the story during tutorials for any story-driven game can as well. But I also think that when it comes to long RPGs (including TRPGs and CRPGs), the beginning is not quite so important aside from setting up a quick hook/pull. What's really important is the full story, the actual adventure. In my experience running and playing D&D, players will put a lot of stock in the opening adventure hook while myself and a few DMs and writers I know or follow put a lot less emphasis on that and a lot more on the later aspects. So I am biased for games that give a great hook and dump you into the world like this does. That kind of... "You have dreams of being sealed away in a sarcophagus and visions of scientists trying to open it, then you wake up and demons attack while you're still chained inside your coffin!" Or, "You're a prisoner in a mind flayer ship and the alien pilot infests you with a parasite, then other aliens riding dragons attack and the ship crashes!" It's a certain style of hook, for sure. But how is that compared to the style of hooks in other CRPGs? Eh, question for another time. The idea that people don't get excited about seeing dragons fighting mind flayers, or at least get excited for other people who do, doesn't exactly compute for my ten year old self, or my current self for that matter. But, ah well. Some people just don't like chocolate and peanut butter. And again, I wonder how the tutorial section and first little section right after will be for the different characters or the custom player character, and if that has something to ease/pull people in who aren't already raring to go after the cinematic. Now that I think about it, having a dedicated tutorial section in a CRPG doesn't make a ton of sense to me. Rather, it seems like a better decision for players to teach them without a tutorial but more like a puzzle game (introducing new mechanics over time while also engaging in story moments). But from a development side, a dedicated tutorial is probably easiest to do. We'll have to wait and see how that looks and how/if it changes, I'm really curious now. | ||
|
-Archangel-
Croatia7457 Posts
| ||
|
Yurie
12037 Posts
On March 02 2020 23:15 blunderfulguy wrote: Now that I think about it, having a dedicated tutorial section in a CRPG doesn't make a ton of sense to me. Rather, it seems like a better decision for players to teach them without a tutorial but more like a puzzle game (introducing new mechanics over time while also engaging in story moments). But from a development side, a dedicated tutorial is probably easiest to do. We'll have to wait and see how that looks and how/if it changes, I'm really curious now. It makes tons of sense. The biggest advantage is that you can make it skippable. A large part of the charm (for some people) of games like this is trying it with different groups and on different difficulties, even with mods. So having a tutorial that is played once and then not touched again makes it much easier to play multiple times. Even BG2 had a mod to skip the entire starting dungeon since it was an on rails experience to slowly introduce you to a lot of stuff. Not a tutorial per say but close to one. | ||
|
Bacillus
Finland2019 Posts
On March 02 2020 23:46 -Archangel- wrote: This game is not being made for 30+ year old Baldur's Gate fans. It is being made for 15+ year old Divinity Original Sin fans and those that loved Dragon Age series. Any BG fans that also play it and love it are welcome but not a target That's probably the case here, but they're weirdly not hitting the easy nostalgia buttons either. Right now they probably could market it as Divinity Something and get a better response. I guess it gives them access to DnD stuff if that's purely what they want. | ||
|
WombaT
Northern Ireland26265 Posts
Do I play them in order ideally or are they both relatively self-contained? Slightly off topic so apologies for that, just figured I’d ask here. Hopefully it goes better than my attempts to play Pillars of Eternity purely in real time anyway :p | ||
|
Bacillus
Finland2019 Posts
That being said, I don't think BG1 is that deep on the story. So, if you get totally burned by BG1's lvl 1 weakling main character or 1998 mechanics, BG2 can probably work as a standalone too. BG1 has Tales of the Sword coast expansion that doesn't really add to the main story and BG1 Enchanced Edition has the Siege of Dragonspear storyline that brigdes BG1 and BG2. I wouldn't consider either necessary for the full experience. --- For me personally, I think the whole BG1 into BG2 into ToB is the only way to go. One of my favourite things about the long saga is how naturally you shift from this green rookie saving for some basic armor into a past-epic level adventurer with insane gear and abilities. There's less level scaling and such involved than in modern games, so the game really lets you grow in strength rather than just scaling the world difficulty as you go. | ||
|
True_Spike
Poland3426 Posts
| ||
|
Sbrubbles
Brazil5776 Posts
On March 03 2020 02:10 Wombat_NI wrote: I shamefully haven’t played either BG 1 or 2 yet, although I do own them. Going through a lot of CRPGs lately and will start soon. Do I play them in order ideally or are they both relatively self-contained? Slightly off topic so apologies for that, just figured I’d ask here. Hopefully it goes better than my attempts to play Pillars of Eternity purely in real time anyway :p TBH, I don't think BG1 has aged nearly as well as BG2, so if you think your patience is gonna be thin, just play BG2. Both are self-contained for the most part. | ||
|
plated.rawr
Norway1676 Posts
| ||
|
Theoren
Canada810 Posts
On March 02 2020 18:05 DrunkenSCV wrote: Yeah, the awesome cinematic makes all negativity about the actual game silly, a fair point that is. Very few people want (I've seen none, actually) BG3 to be a "true continuation of the story", what you claim there is not true. The story is concluded, pretty much everyone agrees with that. There are modern games like PoE and PK: KM that are true spiritual heirs of the classical CRPGs. So saying that people wanting the gameplay and graphics be modern yet faithful to BG1/2 is ridiculous and impossible is ridiculous and impossible. There are reasons why isometric camera view is so important. It gives you context as beautifully pictured locations while leaving details to your imagination. I still remember the Elven city with its airy architecture and that city with the fancy mosaic in the town square. I still remember meeting Khalid and Jaheira, Aerie, Viconia. As if those are my personal memories. I played DOS2 something like 1.5 years ago and I've already almost forgotten everything. For me when camera is behind character, it's like witnessing the story, while isometric camera make me feel more like I am part of it. Besides that, the game can be dark and even brutal at times without looking grotesque. Like, remember Dragon Age? All your characters are soaking with blood all time. The final dungeon is visually repulsive. As it's supposed to be, but I think text and visual hints work better in such cases. On the combat system now. I've seen many times this point: "What is the idea of RTwP when you pause all time anyway?". Can't say for others, but I don't pause all time. This is the point of thinking over character generation and progression, figuring mechanics out and learning how things work. If I feel tired of some dungeon I can spend some extra resources like potions and scrolls to speed up the dynamics. RTwP allows bigger party. So I find it overall more strategic and less tactical than turn based. I don't hate turn based combats, I just want to point out that there are some cons and pros. There are many more things I'd like to say, but I've already said much. Just don't think of those who didn't like how the demo looks as some weird fools with duck syndrome. I suggest reading baldur's gate subreddit if you want to know why some people are upset about BG3. I think there are many good and fair points. Baldur's gate fans can be upset all they want, but this is about selling video games and RTWP and Old School Graphics don't sell. DOS:2 sold more than twice the amount of POE, POE2, and Pathfinder sales combined. Oh and POE2 and Pathfinder both implemented turn based modes cause of popular demand. So while you and some other hardcore BG fans might have wanted something different, the general public has spoken with their wallets in the past. No company that isn't kickstarted is going to deliberately make a game that isn't going to sell and that's exactly what would happen if they went the way you wanted them to. | ||
|
CuddlyCuteKitten
Sweden2715 Posts
On March 03 2020 03:49 Sbrubbles wrote: TBH, I don't think BG1 has aged nearly as well as BG2, so if you think your patience is gonna be thin, just play BG2. Both are self-contained for the most part. There is an extended edition for both BG1 and BG2 now isn't there? I don't really think BG2 needs it but 1 does for sure. Lots of the first game were empty maps and the characters had way fewer interactions. Still a great game (especially for it's time, I bought it on release). I've played D:OS 1 for like 2-3 hours and then quit because the story sucked and the combat was equally tedious as it was rewarding so I have low hopes for this one. | ||
|
Sbrubbles
Brazil5776 Posts
On March 03 2020 04:14 CuddlyCuteKitten wrote: There is an extended edition for both BG1 and BG2 now isn't there? I don't really think BG2 needs it but 1 does for sure. Lots of the first game were empty maps and the characters had way fewer interactions. Still a great game (especially for it's time, I bought it on release). I think so. I know for sure that there were mods that made BG 1 and 2 a seamless experience (put BG1 in BG2 engine, added spells, etc), but they were a pain in the ass to install. In my case I played BG1 near release (though didn't beat it), played and beat BG2 a few years later, then many years later bought a big bundle that included icewind date, installed a few mods and finally beat BG1. On March 03 2020 04:14 CuddlyCuteKitten wrote: I've played D:OS 1 for like 2-3 hours and then quit because the story sucked and the combat was equally tedious as it was rewarding so I have low hopes for this one. Yeah, this was my case as well. | ||
|
DrunkenSCV
76 Posts
On March 03 2020 04:12 Theoren wrote: Baldur's gate fans can be upset all they want, but this is about selling video games and RTWP and Old School Graphics don't sell. DOS:2 sold more than twice the amount of POE, POE2, and Pathfinder sales combined. Oh and POE2 and Pathfinder both implemented turn based modes cause of popular demand. So while you and some other hardcore BG fans might have wanted something different, the general public has spoken with their wallets in the past. No company that isn't kickstarted is going to deliberately make a game that isn't going to sell and that's exactly what would happen if they went the way you wanted them to. Nah, I was answering to another post there, not expressing what I wanted or expected BG3 to be. I had a little hope that Larian would be somewhat bolder and try to surprise us with BG3 (the idea itself to make this game was surprising to me). But they went the lamest path and chose to make another DOS game. So the title is just for marketing, meh. Btw this is like the last argument one would want to use. Yeah, the best RPG game of all time didn't sell well too. Now it's even worse, people play Frontnite and some mobile games. But thankfully not everyone strives for the biggest profit. Even PK:KM sold in up to 1M copies. If it was a bit more friendly and bug-free, who knows... | ||
|
iPlaY.NettleS
Australia4384 Posts
On March 03 2020 04:12 Theoren wrote: Baldur's gate fans can be upset all they want, but this is about selling video games and RTWP and Old School Graphics don't sell. DOS:2 sold more than twice the amount of POE, POE2, and Pathfinder sales combined. Oh and POE2 and Pathfinder both implemented turn based modes cause of popular demand. So while you and some other hardcore BG fans might have wanted something different, the general public has spoken with their wallets in the past. No company that isn't kickstarted is going to deliberately make a game that isn't going to sell and that's exactly what would happen if they went the way you wanted them to. Maybe it's about them wanting to do console ports down the line.RTWP wouldn't work as well on console I don't think. | ||
|
Velr
Switzerland10852 Posts
I like DoS but i somehow never finnish them and just do the first 2-3 chapters. But i'm kinda hyped for the D&D ruleset/options when it Comes to race/classes and so on. Btw: Dear god i hope not every partymember has a brainworm and is "also a main character" like in DoS2... | ||
|
-Archangel-
Croatia7457 Posts
On March 03 2020 20:24 Velr wrote: It also looks a Little too DoS for me. I like DoS but i somehow never finnish them and just do the first 2-3 chapters. But i'm kinda hyped for the D&D ruleset/options when it Comes to race/classes and so on. Btw: Dear god i hope not every partymember has a brainworm and is "also a main character" like in DoS2... How else would they do the 4 man coop like in DOS2?  Also in BG games, you were not the only bhaalspawn and you even traveled with others in your party | ||
|
Simberto
Germany11752 Posts
BG3 will almost certainly not have any connection to BG1/2. The only reason it is called BG3 is because that immediately produces free hype, no matter what you attach that name to. But it also means that you can never fulfill those expectations, no matter what game you produce. BG2 is basically a legend at this point. No real game can possibly compare to the nostalgia-fueled image of BG2 as the perfect game which a lot of people have. This will sell, because people will buy it, hoping that it will feel to them now as people remember BG2 feeling to them when it released. But it will also disappoint these people, because these expectations are impossible to fulfill. And then it will disappear, never to be heard of again. It is almost irrelevant what the actual game attached to the BG hype will be. It feels really cynical to me. And it seems to be effective, because a lot of those revivals are happening. | ||
|
Trozz
Canada3456 Posts
"Hey player, remember this?" Drizzt companion inc. | ||
|
Sbrubbles
Brazil5776 Posts
On March 04 2020 11:37 Trozz wrote: Weird IP to use. "Hey player, remember this?" Drizzt companion inc. Hear me out. Drizzt companion DLC. | ||
|
blunderfulguy
United States1415 Posts
On March 04 2020 08:15 Simberto wrote: Honestly, i dislike this type of digging up popular old IPs and releasing a new game. BG3 will almost certainly not have any connection to BG1/2. The only reason it is called BG3 is because that immediately produces free hype, no matter what you attach that name to. But it also means that you can never fulfill those expectations, no matter what game you produce. BG2 is basically a legend at this point. No real game can possibly compare to the nostalgia-fueled image of BG2 as the perfect game which a lot of people have. This will sell, because people will buy it, hoping that it will feel to them now as people remember BG2 feeling to them when it released. But it will also disappoint these people, because these expectations are impossible to fulfill. And then it will disappear, never to be heard of again. It is almost irrelevant what the actual game attached to the BG hype will be. It feels really cynical to me. And it seems to be effective, because a lot of those revivals are happening. I agree with this to some degree for a lot of reboots/revivals, but I don't see Baldur's Gate as being a revival. To me, and I think a lot of long-time D&D players might agree, it never really died (okay, maybe for a little while around 3e-4e it did). It's a major location in the tabletop game and its history has grown with every edition of D&D (to a lesser or greater extent depending on the edition). The D&D Next tabletop adventures set in Baldur's Gate were awesome, I don't think they would have written so many if the first couple weren't at least a little popular and fun, and the newest tabletop adventure in Baldur's Gate (Descent into Avernus from last September) was great too. To me, they're just keeping an already moving train moving. It also, to me, looks like they aren't just trying to retread old ground. They're doing something different in a lot of the TRPGs and with BG3, which I appreciate. Of course I would still love to see a new IP or CRPG set in Ravenloft or Dark Sun, but that's higher risk and probably couldn't exist unless they made a BG3 or a "Planescape 2" that sold well. And I guess that's another reason I get excited about Larian doing a D&D CRPG and Owlcat doing Pathfinder APs. | ||
|
deacon.frost
Czech Republic12129 Posts
On March 04 2020 08:15 Simberto wrote: Honestly, i dislike this type of digging up popular old IPs and releasing a new game. BG3 will almost certainly not have any connection to BG1/2. The only reason it is called BG3 is because that immediately produces free hype, no matter what you attach that name to. But it also means that you can never fulfill those expectations, no matter what game you produce. BG2 is basically a legend at this point. No real game can possibly compare to the nostalgia-fueled image of BG2 as the perfect game which a lot of people have. This will sell, because people will buy it, hoping that it will feel to them now as people remember BG2 feeling to them when it released. But it will also disappoint these people, because these expectations are impossible to fulfill. And then it will disappear, never to be heard of again. It is almost irrelevant what the actual game attached to the BG hype will be. It feels really cynical to me. And it seems to be effective, because a lot of those revivals are happening. Well it's supposed to be set in the BG territory so it's not totally disconnected but shouldn't be too much connected either. Similarily Half Life 3 can be about a hero not named Gordon Freeman and it will still be a game from HL because it shares the world, time and age | ||
|
Broetchenholer
Germany1951 Posts
| ||
|
CuddlyCuteKitten
Sweden2715 Posts
On March 12 2020 20:50 Broetchenholer wrote: I would have played any larian game set in the sword coast no matter how it was called. If you are disappointed by this not being bg2 with new story, why are you a 30+ year old gamer that is not able to like a game for what it is and not for how it is called and is not? This is not Master of Orion 3, that was not at all like moo2 and trash on top or master of Orion that simply cloned the game without adding any value. It is a larian game in the sword coast with a name that might be misleading to people with less life experience than bg2 fans. That comment fits me pretty well (30+ "old" gamer with low expectations of this). Let's be clear here. I don't care at all how the game works from a technical standpoint. It could be a first person shooter with card based combat for all I care. The reason people still love the BG games is because a) the story was amazing b) the writing of the dialogue was fantastic c) the game developers both avoided all the common pitfalls and managed to come up with completely new shit when it came to story that got you hooked initially and then just dragged you deeper. The game series was a 3 part epic and it felt so damn satisfying beating the last expansion. I don't care if this games story has anything to do with the previous games TBH. But it needs to be amazing all the way through. And given the developers track record of this chances are very, very low. Even in BG1 when they started out they managed the really hard feat of getting you attached to a completely self made character, giving him meaningful and complete backstory, fleshing out a bit of his character, imparting a sense of dread and the need to leave hastily and setting up a major story driving evet while dumping you into the wilderness at level 1. In the prologue. Compare this to games like pillars of eternity and DO:S where you make your own character that is supposed to have lived a life somewhere previous (you even get stats from the choices). But you know *nothing* about that life and it's no where near a complete backstory. *You* never made the choice to enter the story. And for some reason your character, despite being *someone*, is for all intents a nobody. It generates very little initial attachment to your character. Can someone remind me why I am supposed to save the world again? I could probably write down like 80 % of all the quests and a good chunk of quotes just from memory, and I didn't even play the game *that* much. | ||
|
Godwrath
Spain10138 Posts
| ||
|
Fanatic-Templar
Canada5819 Posts
On March 13 2020 02:12 CuddlyCuteKitten wrote: The reason people still love the BG games is because a) the story was amazing b) the writing of the dialogue was fantastic c) the game developers both avoided all the common pitfalls and managed to come up with completely new shit when it came to story that got you hooked initially and then just dragged you deeper. The game series was a 3 part epic and it felt so damn satisfying beating the last expansion. Honestly, I thought Throne of Bhaal was always a huge letdown. | ||
|
Bacillus
Finland2019 Posts
| ||
|
CuddlyCuteKitten
Sweden2715 Posts
On March 14 2020 19:53 Bacillus wrote: I felt like ToB could've done more in terms of story and villain and all that, but at the same time it still manages to wrap up the crazy past epic lvl stuff quite nicely. So, basically as a standalone it wouldn't have been that good, but I think it complements the overall arc well enough. This is exactly my feeling. The story was kind of "meh", especially at the beginning. But it did a good job of really letting your character and party go past 11 on the power gauge into "dragon slaying before lunch, daemon prince at 2 PM sharp" territory. It closes the experience and if you took your character from BG1 when a wolf could literally kill both you and Imoen to fighting demi-gods it's quite a journey. It also tied up the whole Bhaalspawn thing nicely into a logical and fitting conclusion, including why and what happened when Gorion saved you. I just read that there will actually be major tie-ins to the older games which made me a bit more interested. It would be really cool to run into some of the old NPC's as older epic level power players. Imoen for example is an arch mage and supposedly started a thief guild. Would also be extremely cool if they let you input the name of your "main" character and their ToB ending and have that affect the game in a meaningful way. + Show Spoiler + Like having an actual religion/cult perhaps? Edit: What were your party in BG:II? My good party was: Main PC (paladin) Minsc (fighter) Anomen (cleric/figther) Aerie (cleric/mage) Nalia (mage) Imoen (mage/thief) - (usually Yoshimo until I got her) My evil party was Main PC (sorcerer) Korgan (fighter) Edwin (mage) Imoen (mage) Jan (mage thief) Viconia (cleric) Can't remember if I ditched Jan for Sarevok in ToB. Probably not, I liked going overboard on mages. | ||
|
Fanatic-Templar
Canada5819 Posts
On March 15 2020 03:33 CuddlyCuteKitten wrote: Edit: What were your party in BG:II? My good party was: Main PC (paladin) Minsc (fighter) Anomen (cleric/figther) Aerie (cleric/mage) Nalia (mage) Imoen (mage/thief) - (usually Yoshimo until I got her) My evil party was Main PC (sorcerer) Korgan (fighter) Edwin (mage) Imoen (mage) Jan (mage thief) Viconia (cleric) Can't remember if I ditched Jan for Sarevok in ToB. Probably not, I liked going overboard on mages. I don't always get the same party, but I usually keep Jaheira, Minsc and Imoen. After all we've been through together, it feels weird to ditch them  .Every time I've tried to play evil I've gotten bored before completing the Nashkel Mines. It's funny getting wrecked by the Flaming Fist ambushes in Beregost, but overall playing evil exposes a major flaw in most RPGs of this type to me: the game revolves around achieving three things - killing something, acquiring something, or making a roleplaying choice. And the evil roleplaying choices invariably end up being 'kill more things' and 'acquire more things' so you've just got 2/3 of the satisfaction I'd get from playing a good. | ||
|
Simberto
Germany11752 Posts
In ToB, i mostly remember...nothing? I have vague recollection of a final battle in some outer dimension room, and something about water spirits at some point? Or Yuan-Ti in a fire temple? And was i in the military of some city at some point? | ||
|
Sbrubbles
Brazil5776 Posts
On March 15 2020 07:14 Simberto wrote: That is actually true. I am pretty sure i could still write down most of the major story beats of Shadows of Amn. (I was a bit too young when i played BG1 to really remember what was going on there) In ToB, i mostly remember...nothing? I have vague recollection of a final battle in some outer dimension room, and something about water spirits at some point? Or Yuan-Ti in a fire temple? And was i in the military of some city at some point? I distinctly remember dying to fire giants | ||
|
Fanatic-Templar
Canada5819 Posts
On March 15 2020 07:14 Simberto wrote: That is actually true. I am pretty sure i could still write down most of the major story beats of Shadows of Amn. (I was a bit too young when i played BG1 to really remember what was going on there) In ToB, i mostly remember...nothing? I have vague recollection of a final battle in some outer dimension room, and something about water spirits at some point? Or Yuan-Ti in a fire temple? And was i in the military of some city at some point? I remember the events, I could even name a lot of the characters and places, I just can't remember why any of it is happening. I remember just before the final fight Amelyssan gets summoned to your demiplane to explain her character at you because you'd otherwise have no idea why the final fight is happening. | ||
|
suxN
Finland1167 Posts
The places i dislike in bg saga are the labyrinths (bg1 ending, bg2 spellhold, both expansions). Its just not fun when you cant adventure around and are forced to annoying fight after annoying fight, i really hope there will be more adventuring and less fighting in bg3. I played most of the both D:OS games and think they are the best team to make BG3, sure the slow fights were tedious for first 5 hours or so and there are slightly too many fights, but on the upside the fights get really interesting once you have teleports and whatnot and i fully believe d&d has enough base spells to make BG3 fights cheesy, strategic and fun with the Larian engine. And they have been asking guidance from the Disco Elysium makers to make the failed skill checks more rewarding, i haven't found time to play the game yet but considering it was RPG game of the year i'm having big hopes for it and their guidance. Absolutely preordering bg3 | ||
|
iPlaY.NettleS
Australia4384 Posts
Developers Larian Studios made the announcement during a special broadcast exploring the story, characters, multiplayer and system requirements of its upcoming game set in the Dungeons and Dragons universe. During the Panel From Hell broadcast, Larian has now designated September 30 as the fixed release date for Early Access. | ||
|
Yurie
12037 Posts
On August 22 2020 16:23 iPlaY.NettleS wrote: Early access build should be out by end of September : https://www.standard.co.uk/tech/gaming/baldurs-gate-3-early-access-release-date-a4528321.html Sounds like the EA will be bigger than some games that get released. Though still far from finished with the level 4 limit. Though if engaging that limit shouldn't be a big problem. | ||
|
Kevin_Sorbo
Canada3217 Posts
| ||
|
deacon.frost
Czech Republic12129 Posts
On August 22 2020 19:41 Yurie wrote: Sounds like the EA will be bigger than some games that get released. Though still far from finished with the level 4 limit. Though if engaging that limit shouldn't be a big problem. They did similar thing with D:OS, it's their way of polishing the game. | ||
|
whiterabbit
2675 Posts
| ||
|
OsaX Nymloth
Poland3244 Posts
On August 23 2020 03:37 whiterabbit wrote: Big Larian fan but never played BG games. Giving this is 3rd game in series is it made in a way someone who never played Baldur's Gate can enjoy it and not feel lost/out of place? To be honest, this doesn't even look like BG game. If you're fan of their previous works, it seems you'll feel right at home - just with D&D universe and ruleset. Knowledge of previous game's story doesn't seem like a requirement so far and I kinda doubt it will be necessary. This said I would totally recommend trying out Baldur's Gate 1 and 2, they're classic and loved to this day for a good reason. | ||
|
Simberto
Germany11752 Posts
| ||
|
mierin
United States4943 Posts
On August 23 2020 04:47 Simberto wrote: And they profit very much from being produced with in a way which doesn't make your eyes bleed on modern machines. Seriously. I got the BG1 revamp edition on Steam and it looks amazing. Vanilla BG1 I'm not sure I could bring myself to enjoy playing anymore. | ||
|
whiterabbit
2675 Posts
On August 23 2020 03:58 OsaX Nymloth wrote: To be honest, this doesn't even look like BG game. If you're fan of their previous works, it seems you'll feel right at home - just with D&D universe and ruleset. Knowledge of previous game's story doesn't seem like a requirement so far and I kinda doubt it will be necessary. This said I would totally recommend trying out Baldur's Gate 1 and 2, they're classic and loved to this day for a good reason. Nice to hear, thanks for info! | ||
|
thePunGun
598 Posts
I'm curios did anyone bother getting it and if so... is it a true successor to Baldur's Gate 1&2 or just a DoS in BG's 'clothing'? | ||
|
OsaX Nymloth
Poland3244 Posts
On October 08 2020 02:26 thePunGun wrote: Just noticed it's been in early access on Steam since yesterday and has already 81% positive reviews. I'm curios did anyone bother getting it and if so... is it a true successor to Baldur's Gate 1&2 or just a DoS in BG's 'clothing'? Watched like 2-3h of stream aaand for me it totally looks like Divinity: Original Sin. Nothing - except few BG inspired icons for spells - says it's Baldur's Gate, at least to me. Obviously game may be good, doubt Larian will mess it up, but nothing imho merits use of BG brand here. | ||
|
Salazarz
Korea (South)2591 Posts
| ||
|
thePunGun
598 Posts
But I'll might still check it out one day, once it's on sale for 10 bucks or less... | ||
|
Erasme
Bahamas15899 Posts
| ||
|
Biff The Understudy
France7982 Posts
| ||
|
Ryzel
United States545 Posts
| ||
|
Biff The Understudy
France7982 Posts
| ||
|
Simberto
Germany11752 Posts
On October 09 2020 20:54 Biff The Understudy wrote: Never played D:OS though. Only one way to find out if I like those games I guess... A cheaper way to start is getting one of the D:OS games. | ||
|
Velr
Switzerland10852 Posts
On October 09 2020 19:05 Biff The Understudy wrote: Pity I'm a huuuuge fan of BG1 and 2 and was hoping this one would revive good memories. Does it really feel like a completely different game? And is it really badly written? The writing in the original game was amazing. It could be called Divinity Original Sin 3 and people wouldn't shrug (aside from the world). That said DOS 1+2 are good games but further away from BG1+2 than Pillars of Eternity and the like. | ||
|
thePunGun
598 Posts
| ||
|
Biff The Understudy
France7982 Posts
| ||
|
DrunkenSCV
76 Posts
On October 10 2020 00:38 thePunGun wrote: I think the only game developer, who could've pulled off another great Baldur's Gate is Obsidian. Even though I thought the writting of their latest game (the Outer Worlds) was a little weak, they rarely disappoint storytelling wise. The games Obsidian released after Chris Avellone departure aren't inspiring hope, unfortunately. But there is Owlcat games, their Pathfinder: Kingmaker is my top 3 cRPG of all time right after PS:T and BG2. | ||
|
iPlaY.NettleS
Australia4384 Posts
On October 11 2020 04:35 DrunkenSCV wrote: The games Obsidian released after Chris Avellone departure aren't inspiring hope, unfortunately. But there is Owlcat games, their Pathfinder: Kingmaker is my top 3 cRPG of all time right after PS:T and BG2. I'm still following Black Geyser, which is basically a Pillars clone set to release this month according to the developers. There may be more frequent updates on the kickstarter page for it, the discord is pretty quiet. Also should note it's real time with pause, not turn based. | ||
|
Dangermousecatdog
United Kingdom7084 Posts
| ||
|
Bacillus
Finland2019 Posts
Is that just how Larian tells their stories or have they refined it in more recent games? | ||
|
andrewlt
United States7702 Posts
I like the combat of D:OS. Pure turn-based works better for CRPGs than BG's hybrid. It has a much better tactical feel to it. I really dislike the item system though. I spent too much time micromanaging junk. The game does a piss poor job of letting the player know which items are useful, which can be sold, which are used in crafting, which quest items are no longer needed, which items are just for flavor, etc. By the end game, I had hundreds of items in my inventory across numerous containers. | ||
|
Biff The Understudy
France7982 Posts
| ||
|
Bacillus
Finland2019 Posts
I don't think playing D:OS as a multiplayer really helped my experience though, everything becomes double the unwieldy when you've got multiple players controlling stuff. | ||
|
True_Spike
Poland3426 Posts
On October 12 2020 16:24 Biff The Understudy wrote: To be totally honest, the inventory was a huge problem in Baldur's Gate too. The amount of useless junk you were carrying was absolutely insane. In the second they at least introduced containers but they would fill really quickly. I couldn't disagree more. This "junk" economy in modern RPGs is atrocious and D:OS and D:OS2 were, in my opinion, the worst in terms of itemization of them all. In BG2 you had weapons that enemies dropped (which they were in fact using, you didn't have squirells dropping two-handed swords) - that's useful in early game and becomes trash later on. But that's at least easy to ignore, since only the magical items you care about and they could be easily filtered from non-magical items upon pickup. All magical items (other than the generic +1, +2 etc.) had wonderful art, descriptions, had unique names and were one-of-a-kind. The only other "trash" items in the game were the gems - the containers in BG2 mostly solved that, but I didn't like them either. However, there were nowhere near as many as you make it seem. With few minor tweaks the item economy in BG2 (including the fantastic crafting system the game had) could easily become the best accross all RPGs. D:OS keeps literally throwing hundreds of generic items your way, most of them trash or barely useful in some obscure scenarios. It almost felt like a bad copy of Diablo 2 in this regard. Unfortunately they seem to be continuing this route in BG3, but we'll see. I pretty much only started the early access now and I'll have tons of feedback once I get through everything. | ||
|
Biff The Understudy
France7982 Posts
I mean hear me, BG is my favourite game of all time. But the inventory IS a bit of a chore. Haven't played those other games and it might be much worse. | ||
|
necrosexy
451 Posts
why not just put stuff in an inn? i like the bottomless bag of holding mod in bg2 | ||
|
iFU.pauline
France1670 Posts
| ||
|
Bacillus
Finland2019 Posts
On October 12 2020 22:36 Biff The Understudy wrote: I mean hear me, BG is my favourite game of all time. But the inventory IS a bit of a chore. Haven't played those other games and it might be much worse. I think it's mostly that things got far worse since the BG series. Now we are dealing with crafting components everywhere, consolified UI and randomly generated generic loot and so on. There's more clutter everywhere and most of the actual equipment is a huge sea of muddle you have fish for that one item that gives you an extra stat point or 3% more resistance to random element. | ||
|
Biff The Understudy
France7982 Posts
On October 13 2020 12:00 necrosexy wrote: inventory problems in BG? why not just put stuff in an inn? i like the bottomless bag of holding mod in bg2 Of course, you can do that. Although, I am a VERY casual gamer, and I know that there is a game I would like to finish in a heavily modded version I have, that I haven't touched for over a year. One of the reason I delay playing again is that I don't remember in what chest I put all my items and it's gonna take ages to find out 😁 | ||
|
Broetchenholer
Germany1951 Posts
Also, larian is not necessary great with overarching story lines, the main story of both divinities was meh. They are great at bringing their world to life though. Side quests are fun and interesting and the settings of the campaigns are as well. Compared to that the pillars of eternities felt empty. The world was simply not that interesting to interact with. And dos is also no never winter nights. The main story is not that bad. | ||
|
andrewlt
United States7702 Posts
On October 12 2020 16:24 Biff The Understudy wrote: To be totally honest, the inventory was a huge problem in Baldur's Gate too. The amount of useless junk you were carrying was absolutely insane. In the second they at least introduced containers but they would fill really quickly. It was a huge problem in BG1 and 2. D:OS makes makes it look like not a problem in comparison. D:OS has randomized loot with randomized stats. It has a crafting system with way too many items. It has gems you can socket into gear and a crafting system for said gems. It has way too much useless junk. And too many of the flavor items look like quest items you should keep. And unless I'm remembering incorrectly, it has no button to highlight stuff you can interact with, something that I think BG has. I can't remember which game had it first. | ||
|
Fanatic-Templar
Canada5819 Posts
On October 14 2020 01:14 Broetchenholer wrote: The game has nothing in common with BG2 except for the name and the setting. Which is a good thing, Then why have the name in common? | ||
|
Manit0u
Poland17665 Posts
With this title I guess I'll wait about a year before getting it. So that bugs and issues can be ironed out. From what I've seen so far from people playing early access it's a bug-ridden mess at the moment. I'm not really a fan of moving too much into the 3D. I like my RPGs to have simpler artwork and aesthetic, it's easier to focus on the important stuff then (and I don't think such games should be the ones straining your PC). | ||
|
Simberto
Germany11752 Posts
| ||
|
clusen
Germany8702 Posts
On October 19 2020 23:33 Manit0u wrote: No love for Icewind Dale? I think I liked it even more than BG. With this title I guess I'll wait about a year before getting it. So that bugs and issues can be ironed out. From what I've seen so far from people playing early access it's a bug-ridden mess at the moment. Bugs and stuff is the reason for Early Access, Divinity 1 and 2 were very playable at launch. Is the story/setting still a mess? The only complaint I have about Divinity 1 and 2 is that the games couldn't decide what they want to be, a silly/fun play ground or a serious story. | ||
|
Manit0u
Poland17665 Posts
On October 19 2020 23:36 Simberto wrote: Icewind Dale was mostly a tactics game imo. I don't recall there being a lot of non-combat stuff going on there, especially in comparison to BG (and obviously Planescape at the far other end) I mean, the problem with BG was that the story was pretty much forced upon you (there was only an illusion of choice) and the NPCs that you interacted with (your party) were absolutely obnoxious for the most part. IWD definitely didn't have that much story behind it (although I'm not sure if I like shoehorned story that much) but it had way better atmosphere, graphics, music and combat. I think way too many people tend to view BG through nostalgia lens. BG2 was much better than BG1 and I still think it might've been worse than IWD (maybe except for the Underdark part). BG was just too confused about what it was (which was heavily combat-oriented game with pretense for story and bad combat encounters) to be really great. IWD while simpler and more linear was totally honest about what it was: bare-bones story with awesome combat encounters (and where villains had more than 1 dimension and were actually interesting, as opposed to BG where bad guys were bad because they like being bad). I mean, in IWD you had villainous enemies that made you feel bad after you defeated them because you could totally understand their motivations and actually even get behind them. They were sad and tragic characters, not just derpy run-of-the mill bad guys. | ||
|
True_Spike
Poland3426 Posts
There's a 6 person party, everyone has 3 additional slots for quick use items, 3 slots for ammo and there are specialized containers for storing useful items (i.e. one container for scrolls, one container for potions, one for ammo, a bag of holding for gear - which wasn't from a mod, it was in the game by default, the mod just introduced more of them and early on) + a container for mostly useless gems (which, again, there weren't that many to begin with). Not to mention that the vast majority of items in BG2 were *interesting* and unique. items in modern RPGs are randomly generated and, to me, extremely boring, partially also because there's *so much loot everywhere*. D:OS1 and 2 were just utter garbage in this aspect - all containers looked very similiar, could be used to store anything and generally were a pain to use, it felt like 80% of the items you found in the game were complete useless trash or used for crafting - which was mostly a useless gimmick to begin with. There were items *everywhere* and there were *so many* of them. I literally stopped playing both games multiple times for long periods of time because of my frustration caused by this - after a few hours of playing nothing felt rewarding, I didn't care about anything i found or bought and everything item-related felt more like a chore rather than fun. I think even games like The Witcher 3 are worse than the classics in this regard, despite advancements in the UI department compared to older games (although 'consolifcation' and not having seperate UIs for mouse/keyboard and gamepads is a major issue in PC RPG UIs, rendering them less robust than they could have been). It feels like every RPG game is trying to use a mix of diablo-like and classic-like approach to items, unfortunately mixing the worst elements of the two most of the time. | ||
|
andrewlt
United States7702 Posts
| ||
|
Sermokala
United States14104 Posts
| ||
|
Biff The Understudy
France7982 Posts
On October 20 2020 08:09 Manit0u wrote: I mean, the problem with BG was that the story was pretty much forced upon you (there was only an illusion of choice) and the NPCs that you interacted with (your party) were absolutely obnoxious for the most part. IWD definitely didn't have that much story behind it (although I'm not sure if I like shoehorned story that much) but it had way better atmosphere, graphics, music and combat. I think way too many people tend to view BG through nostalgia lens. BG2 was much better than BG1 and I still think it might've been worse than IWD (maybe except for the Underdark part). BG was just too confused about what it was (which was heavily combat-oriented game with pretense for story and bad combat encounters) to be really great. IWD while simpler and more linear was totally honest about what it was: bare-bones story with awesome combat encounters (and where villains had more than 1 dimension and were actually interesting, as opposed to BG where bad guys were bad because they like being bad). I mean, in IWD you had villainous enemies that made you feel bad after you defeated them because you could totally understand their motivations and actually even get behind them. They were sad and tragic characters, not just derpy run-of-the mill bad guys. Really? I loved the NPCs in BG. They were sooo well written. Minsc and Boo? Edwin? Jan Jansen? Those were proper RP NPCs. Also the story was forced upon you but you had choice over what order you wanted to do your quests, you could spend time chilling between dungeons, they were a ton to explore, etc. It felt very free. Oh and you absolutely could decide to be a total dick, even though that was rarely optimal play. Icewind Dale was just one linear succession of dungeons where you wouldn't talk to anyone, your party had no personality whatsoever... I never managed to finish them. I still play BG (have a game going right now). There are still (really good) mods to discover and new parties to make, even after 20 years. I mostly play with custom parties because I know the game so well, and powergame with the hardest mods, and it's still fun. | ||
|
Velr
Switzerland10852 Posts
Imho (A)D&D low level combat is just horrible, once your level 5/6+ things get better (to get worse in the truely epic levels again). I finnished IWD2 and had fun with it, after the first few level ups, it had a few memorable dungeons but I actually don't clearly remember any of the fights in any detail. It was fun/decent for what it was but it is nowhere near BG2 when it comes to the full package. | ||
|
Manit0u
Poland17665 Posts
On October 22 2020 23:27 Biff The Understudy wrote: Really? I loved the NPCs in BG. They were sooo well written. Minsc and Boo? Edwin? Jan Jansen? Those were proper RP NPCs. Also the story was forced upon you but you had choice over what order you wanted to do your quests, you could spend time chilling between dungeons, they were a ton to explore, etc. It felt very free. Oh and you absolutely could decide to be a total dick, even though that was rarely optimal play. Icewind Dale was just one linear succession of dungeons where you wouldn't talk to anyone, your party had no personality whatsoever... I never managed to finish them. I still play BG (have a game going right now). There are still (really good) mods to discover and new parties to make, even after 20 years. I mostly play with custom parties because I know the game so well, and powergame with the hardest mods, and it's still fun. Minsc was atrocious. I couldn't stand him - he was fun for a few brief moments but then it got stale really fast. The forced romance and constant bickering was just annoying too. IWD had the advantage that it didn't hide what it was, a dungeon crawler first and foremost (and that's what 99% D&D games are all about). If you want to do a nuanced RPG with emphasis on role playing you shouldn't do it using the D&D system. | ||
|
Velr
Switzerland10852 Posts
You give 1 wrong answer and all of the 3 romances irreversibly break and it's often not clear which answer that (you'll know when you fucked up in the next interraction ). How can you call that "forced"? Let alone that one of the three tended to bug out or not progress because you were likely to never do what was necessary to progress it. | ||
|
Lysteria
France2280 Posts
Took me like 10 years to know it was even a thing. I enjoyed the IWD games but I have absolutely no memory of any of them. The fights were a bit more on the fair side and you didn't have to know too much to do decently. | ||
|
Biff The Understudy
France7982 Posts
On October 23 2020 00:22 Manit0u wrote: Minsc was atrocious. I couldn't stand him - he was fun for a few brief moments but then it got stale really fast. The forced romance and constant bickering was just annoying too. IWD had the advantage that it didn't hide what it was, a dungeon crawler first and foremost (and that's what 99% D&D games are all about). If you want to do a nuanced RPG with emphasis on role playing you shouldn't do it using the D&D system. T-t-t Minsc was AWESOME. | ||
|
Sorusaba
294 Posts
Boo says fight hard, so I fight hard. Absolutely agreed!! | ||
|
Fanatic-Templar
Canada5819 Posts
On October 19 2020 23:33 Manit0u wrote: No love for Icewind Dale? I think I liked it even more than BG. Icewind Dale is what happens when someone tries to make a Diablo game by using the byzantine mechanical structure of Second Edition AD&D - though that description's unfair to the character and ambience of Diablo. Why anyone would use AD&D for that purpose is beyond me. It's not as noticeable in Baldur's Gate, but it's a dead weight on Planescape: Torment. I grew up playing it and had a lot of fun when I didn't know of any better system, but it's a horror looking back. I've tried completing Icewind Dale a couple of times and always reach that point where I encounter the Fire Giants and realise I have no idea why I'm doing anything and I get the same feeling I've gotten when I realise I've been tricked into playing a boring mind-killer of a game by logging in for daily quests. Icewind Dale is my second most hated RPG after Tecmo's Secret of the Stars. | ||
|
Manit0u
Poland17665 Posts
| ||
|
Simberto
Germany11752 Posts
On October 23 2020 09:23 Manit0u wrote: Well, D&D is actually pretty cool once you get what it's about - and that's just a series of encounters, each being a logic puzzle you need to solve (party positioning, what spells to cast in which order etc.). It is great for that, but it's atrocious for anything non-combat related (for non-combat stuff you want systems like WoD). I am going to have to stop me from totally nerding out with regards to indie TTRPGs. Suffice it to be said that there is a lot of really cool narrative stuff out there to be played at a gaming table. (Or sadly only at an online table currently due to stupid covid). Not only D&D and other major systems like WoD. That being said, i also remember enjoying Icewind Dale quite a lot for what it was. D&D (in all its iterations) is actually a pretty reasonable tactics game system, that is what it is known for in the TTRPG-scene too. | ||
|
Fanatic-Templar
Canada5819 Posts
But playing actual AD&D is one thing. Transposing it into a mindless hack & slash video game is taking rules that are created in the context of being usable by a group of people around a table with nothing but pen, paper and dice, and applying it to a medium with a built-in calculator. I'm certainly glad I didn't have to deal with the mechanical systems while playing these games, but it raises the question of why they were included at all. And even if you, for some reason that is beyond my conception, really wanted to play Diablo but with dice rolls and a ridiculous levelling curve, then Icewind Dale is still bad. Durlag's Tower from Tales of the Sword Coast is just a better dungeon crawler. | ||
|
Yurie
12037 Posts
| ||
|
Simberto
Germany11752 Posts
Diablo is about fast action, reflexes and blowing up screens full of enemies in seconds. IWD combat is a lot more tactical and less action focused, to the point where it felt like a turn-based tactics game (Despite being real-time-ish) I think a much better comparison would be something like X-Com, and to me it filled the same niche of games. | ||
|
Sbrubbles
Brazil5776 Posts
On October 22 2020 23:27 Biff The Understudy wrote: Really? I loved the NPCs in BG. They were sooo well written. Minsc and Boo? Edwin? Jan Jansen? Those were proper RP NPCs. Also the story was forced upon you but you had choice over what order you wanted to do your quests, you could spend time chilling between dungeons, they were a ton to explore, etc. It felt very free. Oh and you absolutely could decide to be a total dick, even though that was rarely optimal play. Icewind Dale was just one linear succession of dungeons where you wouldn't talk to anyone, your party had no personality whatsoever... I never managed to finish them. I still play BG (have a game going right now). There are still (really good) mods to discover and new parties to make, even after 20 years. I mostly play with custom parties because I know the game so well, and powergame with the hardest mods, and it's still fun. I agree, and I might even go further: there hasn't been a single RPG that has done party NPC interactions as well as BG2 despite it being a 20 year old game. Well, Dragon Age Origins did, but I'm hard pressed to think of another As for "the story being forced upon you", that's just having a linear story progression (in BG's case, with ample stops for sidequests). There's nothing inherently wrong with that, so long as the story is well told and engaging. RPGs don't necessarily require meaningful choices in the main quest, especially in a black-and-white story like BG2 (not much nuance in "evil mage stole your sister then your soul" and again, that's fine) | ||
|
Manit0u
Poland17665 Posts
I like a bit of grey in my characters and I really love it when you have the option of playing a more selfish and not-so-nice character without feeling like a total asshat because of the bullshit choices they give you. What I'm talking about is a hypothetical situation when a bum approaches you and asks for 5 coins in alms and these are the only choices you're given: 1. Give him 10 coins and your best weapon. 2. Kill him and take his 3 coins. | ||
|
Biff The Understudy
France7982 Posts
On October 26 2020 02:04 Manit0u wrote: I don't mind linear stories. What I mind in case of BG was the illusion of freedom. Sure, you could play/act as an evil character but usually that was super non-optimal and the game was penalizing you for it. And I don't have to mention it being too black and white with the choices where you're either an altruistic doo-gooder or extreme asshole without anything in between really (it's not just BG that's suffering from it, KOTOR also had such problems). I like a bit of grey in my characters and I really love it when you have the option of playing a more selfish and not-so-nice character without feeling like a total asshat because of the bullshit choices they give you. What I'm talking about is a hypothetical situation when a bum approaches you and asks for 5 coins in alms and these are the only choices you're given: 1. Give him 10 coins and your best weapon. 2. Kill him and take his 3 coins. I don't think BG really was like that. Take Avalon quest, you could: Be the knight in the shiny armour and exchange the eggs with the fake Solaufein had given you IF you had been a nice guy and saved Solaufein. No fight. Give the demons the right eggs because you had killed Solaufein, and kill both the demons and the drows. That was the road to most xp. Just go berserk and kill the drows before the demon showed up. Betray Avalon and give the eggs to the demon. Then you could actually kill Avalon and get an ingredient for arguably the best armour in the game, the human skin armour. Just be selfish, double cross everyone and use the drow disguise to escape underdark, leaving those good folks to solve their problems. The optimal way for xp and everything was actually: Save Solaufein Not use his eggs and let them give tge goodceggs to the demon Kill both demons and drows Get your reward from Avalon Kill Avalon But you would need to have pretty good knowledge of the game to know that. Big "evil" decision such as helping Bodhi against the Shadow Thieves were not really worse than the alternative. Rp wise, in that case, it were anyway different shadows of grey. On top of that, I would add that the best NPCs were all evil: Korgan was clearly the best tank, by far Edwin was wayyyyy ahead of any mage in the game Viconia was the best cleric AND had irreplacable magic resistance. If you played the good guy and got your reputation to 18 they would leave your party. You will tell me, ok, then have evil characters, be a good guy and commit minor offenses to keep your reputation low enough, but every RPG will have exploitative solutions like that when you know it inside out. | ||
|
Manit0u
Poland17665 Posts
| ||
|
Sbrubbles
Brazil5776 Posts
Anyone here having fun with it so far? | ||
|
mierin
United States4943 Posts
On November 05 2020 03:36 Sbrubbles wrote: A friend of mine has been saying a lot of good things about the early access, despite (like me) not having liked divinity at all. It's really getting my hopes up. Anyone here having fun with it so far? I'm right there with you. I want to hear it from someone who really doesn't like Divinity before i shell out like $50 for it. | ||
|
Neneu
Norway492 Posts
| ||
|
andrewlt
United States7702 Posts
| ||
|
HolydaKing
21254 Posts
The fantastic things first: Everything is voiced and it's just great. The game has a lot of nice quests and characters and it's definitely fun to explore. The graphics are beautiful as well. Also, there are so many choices. Almost guaranteed that every playthrough is different. I don't like a lot of things but they aren't able to make it a bad game, as the points before make the game feel great. Still gonna list some here: The combat feels bland coming from Pathfinder (which also had non turn based combat as an option), the class system there was so much more interesting imo. The inventory is a garbage masterpiece, just like how I remember it from Divinity. I just ended up selling prettty much everything recently but even that takes a while since there is no sell junk buttton as far as I'm aware of. Also no shared inventory weight sucks. | ||
|
ProMeTheus112
France2027 Posts
| ||
|
Salazarz
Korea (South)2591 Posts
Not only that, but it's just absolutely idiotic that only the character that initiated the dialogue / interaction is available to, well, talk or interact with whatever is going on. Like if my mean githyanki companion was the first to be spotted by some guy that wanted to talk, I have no option to tell her 'hey hold on, let me handle this', nope either the whole conversation is done by a gal with 8 charisma and no persuasion or I have to reload the game. Likewise early on in the game there's a wizard trapped inside some portal who needs a strong arm to pull him out -- you'd think after my little elven bard failed the strength check to do so I could ask the abovementioned githyanki to lend me her 17 str hand? Nope, she's just standing back watching without a care in the world. You're talking to some shifty guy who might be hiding something from you, but your most insightful character isn't the one having the conversation? Too bad, the other dude will never let you know that there's something off about the dude you're talking to. It's just mind-boggingly bad design. Also, the constant dice rolls and skill checks that are shoved in your face are massively immersion breaking. You're walking through a forest, suddenly a 'perception check: failed!' pops up. Obviously there is a hidden treasure or a pathway nearby. Why are you being told that you failed the said perception check if you didn't spot it? Who knows. Or you're talking to a person who tells you something along the lines of, "I've got nothing to hide, I'm just a dude", suddenly an 'insight check: failed!' pops up. Obviously not just a dude, then. At this point you're either reloading until you pass the check, or move on with your life wondering what the guy is hiding -- but either way whatever surprise there might have been is already subverted. And these aren't one off things, it happens literally all the time. And then there's the writing... I mean, it's serviceable, for the most part, I guess? People going 'FUCK YEAH!' in a fantasy RPG isn't exactly my cup of tea but whatever, that's mostly limited to one character so far, at least. But overall there isn't anything particularly outstanding, the main quest quickly went from 'this is maybe interesting' to 'jesus christ what a load of crap' imo meanwhile literally every single companion have tried to hit on me within what amounts to... 2 days of time spent travelling together, which is just ???... Like my cleric started telling me I'm the best person she's ever met and I've changed her life by the time we stopped to sleep for a night because like, I didn't let a mean druid feed a child to her snake and uhh, that's actually pretty much it? The tiefling gal is apparently madly in love with me even though I've literally never had her as part of my party and she is just sitting in the camp all day and I'm just confused at this point. I don't know. I still plan on finishing the game eventually since it's not as if there are many CRPGs around, but the strongest feeling this game has evoked in me so far is, 'gosh how I miss Baldur's Gate 2.' oh and yeah, that inventory system. in 2023. 10/10 masterpiece new standard in rpg gaming. HAHAHAHAHA. | ||
|
HolydaKing
21254 Posts
I can honestly see myself prefering Pathfinder WotR in the end though, I much prefer the character skill system there. Not only that, but a lot of little things are missing in BG 3 (which outside of the world to me is Divinity 3). Basically everything about the inventory is a problem, and no statistics feels bad too. Wish you could change how your character looks in camp & outside, feels kinda important with such great item models. | ||
|
Neneu
Norway492 Posts
On August 09 2023 19:57 Salazarz wrote: There's virtually no interaction with your companions outside of the +/- opinions and the brief commentary about whatever quest you're doing now and then; they pretty much never say anything during encounters or dialogue which just feels like such a massive fail for a game with a budget as big as this that supposedly focused on interaction and reactive world. Well you are going to have some pretty major interactions with your companions later on. + Show Spoiler + E.g. my shadowheart is no longer a servant of shaar, she's been converted | ||
|
ProMeTheus112
France2027 Posts
| ||
|
Striker.superfreunde
Germany1120 Posts
| ||
|
HolydaKing
21254 Posts
So I agree, if I ever play a 2nd run (very likely), I will definitely pick up much less items. I picked up pretty much everything expecting a Divinity 2 where you can use everything, but they toned that down a lot - good imo. I stand by my opinion that the item selling could be a ton better. It's a downgrade from Pathfinder and honestly even from Baldurs Gate 1. Yes, the inventory there was very small, but that has some pros too. Also picking up items there is 100 times more comfortable - unless I'm missing something very crucial. You have to click every corpse after each battle, don't you? | ||
|
ProMeTheus112
France2027 Posts
On August 10 2023 03:41 HolydaKing wrote: I'm playing on the medium difficulty and never had any gold problems, then again I barely ever bought something from vendors aside from potions and trap disarment kits. Very rarely something where I had nothing equipped. Yeah even on hard difficulty you can definitely have a lot of excess gold so you could leave a lot behind. Plus if you actually ran into a gold problem technically you could likely just go get the stuff back that you didn't pick up lol but I don't think you'd need to. I also think I'll want to play a 2nd playthrough that would be interesting. On August 10 2023 03:36 Striker.superfreunde wrote: Imo the item management isn't too bad. Yes, it takes some time to get a feeling which items are better to be kept and which can be sold. There is also the option to mark the items as goods (dunno if theres a hotkey for it) to make the selling process faster. If you are not sure about an item you can always send it to your camp. And on top of that you have all the time in the world to take care of your item mgmt. Yea I agree. | ||
|
HolydaKing
21254 Posts
| ||
|
Broetchenholer
Germany1951 Posts
The problem that Salazarz mentioned, where the option in dialogues are limited to the character initiating the dialogue are only relevant in multiplayer or in some niche cases where you had split a person off the party. Because in these cases, only the character you currently control are part of the dialogue. Sometimes it might also be buggy and straight not allow more then the leading char, not sure. Generally, MP feels a bit strange in that regard, we have 4 people play one original char each and we basically never get party interaction. And also the barbarian deals with all the mage puzzles because he is always in front and clicks on stuff...Playing with my wife, 2 chars each, is pretty cool though The item system definately feels off for the swordcoast, the number of minor "magic" items that are just laying around and can be found by merchants is not my cup of tea, also the strange multiclassing rules and amendments to DND are weird. You think you know how this works and then realize. that they switched off just enough to feel a bit wrong. It's probably better for the gameplay if people don't play pnp DnD, but for me it's strange. All in all, i am currently stuck waiting for my friends/wife, i decided to not run ahead with a solo game and it's killing me. Even with everything i mentioned, i just wanna play more! | ||
|
M3t4PhYzX
Poland4235 Posts
On August 09 2023 19:57 Salazarz wrote: I don't want to write an in depth review because I haven't even gotten out of act 1 yet, but at this point I honestly don't get what all the hype is about. People talking about 'new standard for crpgs' and stuff, yet it feels like the devs haven't learned anything at all from previous rpg games and pretty much just stuffed as many lines of voice-acted conversations as they could into the game and called it a day. There's virtually no interaction with your companions outside of the +/- opinions and the brief commentary about whatever quest you're doing now and then; they pretty much never say anything during encounters or dialogue which just feels like such a massive fail for a game with a budget as big as this that supposedly focused on interaction and reactive world. Not only that, but it's just absolutely idiotic that only the character that initiated the dialogue / interaction is available to, well, talk or interact with whatever is going on. Like if my mean githyanki companion was the first to be spotted by some guy that wanted to talk, I have no option to tell her 'hey hold on, let me handle this', nope either the whole conversation is done by a gal with 8 charisma and no persuasion or I have to reload the game. Likewise early on in the game there's a wizard trapped inside some portal who needs a strong arm to pull him out -- you'd think after my little elven bard failed the strength check to do so I could ask the abovementioned githyanki to lend me her 17 str hand? Nope, she's just standing back watching without a care in the world. You're talking to some shifty guy who might be hiding something from you, but your most insightful character isn't the one having the conversation? Too bad, the other dude will never let you know that there's something off about the dude you're talking to. It's just mind-boggingly bad design. Also, the constant dice rolls and skill checks that are shoved in your face are massively immersion breaking. You're walking through a forest, suddenly a 'perception check: failed!' pops up. Obviously there is a hidden treasure or a pathway nearby. Why are you being told that you failed the said perception check if you didn't spot it? Who knows. Or you're talking to a person who tells you something along the lines of, "I've got nothing to hide, I'm just a dude", suddenly an 'insight check: failed!' pops up. Obviously not just a dude, then. At this point you're either reloading until you pass the check, or move on with your life wondering what the guy is hiding -- but either way whatever surprise there might have been is already subverted. And these aren't one off things, it happens literally all the time. And then there's the writing... I mean, it's serviceable, for the most part, I guess? People going 'FUCK YEAH!' in a fantasy RPG isn't exactly my cup of tea but whatever, that's mostly limited to one character so far, at least. But overall there isn't anything particularly outstanding, the main quest quickly went from 'this is maybe interesting' to 'jesus christ what a load of crap' imo meanwhile literally every single companion have tried to hit on me within what amounts to... 2 days of time spent travelling together, which is just ???... Like my cleric started telling me I'm the best person she's ever met and I've changed her life by the time we stopped to sleep for a night because like, I didn't let a mean druid feed a child to her snake and uhh, that's actually pretty much it? The tiefling gal is apparently madly in love with me even though I've literally never had her as part of my party and she is just sitting in the camp all day and I'm just confused at this point. I don't know. I still plan on finishing the game eventually since it's not as if there are many CRPGs around, but the strongest feeling this game has evoked in me so far is, 'gosh how I miss Baldur's Gate 2.' oh and yeah, that inventory system. in 2023. 10/10 masterpiece new standard in rpg gaming. HAHAHAHAHA. +1 to this, dude Also - I hate the combat system.. | ||
|
farvacola
United States18854 Posts
| ||
|
CuddlyCuteKitten
Sweden2715 Posts
On August 10 2023 09:34 M3t4PhYzX wrote: +1 to this, dude Also - I hate the combat system.. I like the game but +1. Other annoying things: Shield always gives +2 AC even when not equipped. Straight buff to ranged weapons which were already powerful in DnD. Could have just made it so you can only switch weapon + shield ONCE per turn for free. Also can't have more than one weapon equipped in hotbar which was a staple since BG1. Makes things either tedious or makes the situational weapons (mace of disruption, sunbringer says hi) much worse. Can't move characters through each other (why, it's in the core rules?). In general Larian should have tried to understand "less is more". The good thing about BG and NWN was about choices, both in and outside combat. And keeping other things simple so you could make more choices. BG3 just overload you on everything while adding a lot of unnecessary tedium. Like inventory management. In BG at least you couldn't pick up every piece of scrap and even if you could limited space (not weight!) made you choose. Maybe you don't need to pick up that dagger, it's not valuable either way... Also why go to a skill roll for picking a lock. I know what my character has for bonus, I only care if it succeeds. And the combat system is fine for me but it's slow (so you can only have 4 characters) and it's not challenging unless you play on hardest (and the fact that they call that "tactical" is a travesty if it's a play on the mod for BG2). | ||
|
cha0
Canada508 Posts
I'll admit I have not played any tabletop DnD and I see a lot of people online arguing that this single character dialogue is 'the way DnD is meant to be played' but regardless it doesn't sit well with me. Frankly absurd that your party member/companion would just stand next to you awkwardly watching you fail at answering a question that they know the answer to. Maybe it is built this way due to it being DnD but quite a big miss-step imo and I hope some mods come out in the future that allow you to switch characters (Though ideally Larian would have implemented 'group' convos where any member that is nearby would have their options appear and have whoever you are talking with react to having someone interject in the conversation). | ||
|
Salazarz
Korea (South)2591 Posts
On August 10 2023 22:06 cha0 wrote: I am enjoying the game but as mentioned that dialogue system just plain stinks. Honestly feels downright silly that you have a party adventuring together trying to work towards some common goal but then whenever a dialogue is initiated all other members have to sit back and just watch the outcome play out(Besides occasionally throwing in quips at your handling of the situation). I'll admit I have not played any tabletop DnD and I see a lot of people online arguing that this single character dialogue is 'the way DnD is meant to be played' but regardless it doesn't sit well with me. Frankly absurd that your party member/companion would just stand next to you awkwardly watching you fail at answering a question that they know the answer to. Maybe it is built this way due to it being DnD but quite a big miss-step imo and I hope some mods come out in the future that allow you to switch characters (Though ideally Larian would have implemented 'group' convos where any member that is nearby would have their options appear and have whoever you are talking with react to having someone interject in the conversation). I think you must have misread the comments about 'the way DnD is meant to be played.' In a tabletop DnD session, pretty much every conversation / encounter is a group affair where each party member is able to jump in whenever, and any skill checks will, for the most part, be done by everybody involved. | ||
|
andrewlt
United States7702 Posts
I played Pathfinder: Kingmaker and Solasta recently and the constant skill checks annoyed me as well. Wasn't there an option in the old BG games where all skill check dice rolls outside combat are automatic 20s? Or was that in some other games from Black Isle or Obsidian? | ||
|
Salazarz
Korea (South)2591 Posts
On August 10 2023 23:55 andrewlt wrote: That sounds like a really weird decision. I like party based games more than single character ones. The fun is in planning a party that can cover as many bases as possible by having each character specialize in a few things. I played Pathfinder: Kingmaker and Solasta recently and the constant skill checks annoyed me as well. Wasn't there an option in the old BG games where all skill check dice rolls outside combat are automatic 20s? Or was that in some other games from Black Isle or Obsidian? Technically, you can have characters specialize in different things... But if a conversation has checks for, say, history and deception while it's your wizard who has points in history and rogue that has points in deception then you're basically SOL. | ||
|
HolydaKing
21254 Posts
Ofc I knew it but I wasn't considering it. | ||
|
Broetchenholer
Germany1951 Posts
Like, this feels either super buggy or the worst writing of all time, jesus. | ||
|
Merany
France890 Posts
* Yeah, inventory management sucks, I agree, biggest issue of the title, by far. Nothing that can't be fixed by patches though and they've already promised improvements soon. * Sure, camera needs improving too. My second biggest annoyance but I can live with that. Still, easy GOTY, having so much more fun than its likely contender, TotK. BG2 will always be my favorite of the series, if only because the SCS mod makes the battle an absolute blast. But a worthy successor nonetheless and a must play for all CRPG lovers. | ||
|
Broetchenholer
Germany1951 Posts
| ||
|
Velr
Switzerland10852 Posts
On August 10 2023 22:06 cha0 wrote: I am enjoying the game but as mentioned that dialogue system just plain stinks. Honestly feels downright silly that you have a party adventuring together trying to work towards some common goal but then whenever a dialogue is initiated all other members have to sit back and just watch the outcome play out(Besides occasionally throwing in quips at your handling of the situation). I'll admit I have not played any tabletop DnD and I see a lot of people online arguing that this single character dialogue is 'the way DnD is meant to be played' but regardless it doesn't sit well with me. Frankly absurd that your party member/companion would just stand next to you awkwardly watching you fail at answering a question that they know the answer to. Maybe it is built this way due to it being DnD but quite a big miss-step imo and I hope some mods come out in the future that allow you to switch characters (Though ideally Larian would have implemented 'group' convos where any member that is nearby would have their options appear and have whoever you are talking with react to having someone interject in the conversation). Uhm... The guy you initiate the talk with, is the one that does all the checks. So you can choose, just not on the fly mid conversation. Seems more realistic than a party of 4 guys talking to 1 guy and everyone just shouting at him once a question "tingles" their favorite stat. If a conversation is important to a character, you can usually "let him do the talking". My first playtrough was with a Druid (lategame 18 Dex, 18 Wisdom, 12 Cha), there were so many Wisdom options/checks, that I absolutely never felt my character would need to be a Charisma guy. I guess if your main guy is a pure Strenght/Dex/Con-Ape, this would feel diffrent but then again... Why do you play that if you don't want to play that? Also, you should just roll with most failed checks, it's part of the fun... At least on your first playtrough. | ||
|
CuddlyCuteKitten
Sweden2715 Posts
On August 18 2023 20:48 Velr wrote: Uhm... The guy you initiate the talk with, is the one that does all the checks. So you can choose, just not on the fly mid conversation. Seems more realistic than a party of 4 guys talking to 1 guy and everyone just shouting at him once a question "tingles" their favorite stat. If a conversation is important to a character, you can usually "let him do the talking". My first playtrough was with a Druid (lategame 18 Dex, 18 Wisdom, 12 Cha), there were so many Wisdom options/checks, that I absolutely never felt my character would need to be a Charisma guy. I guess if your main guy is a pure Strenght/Dex/Con-Ape, this would feel diffrent but then again... Why do you play that if you don't want to play that? Also, you should just roll with most failed checks, it's part of the fun... At least on your first playtrough. Quite a few conversations activate on the closest character, sometimes from combat. Also some checks are frequently skills or non conversation options. One example. You start a conversation with people trying to get into a burning building. There is a str check to kick in the door. Why would my 8 str sorcerer take that check when the massive tiefling barbarian is litterally right next to her? Would never happen in real DnD. Or when the game throws a religion check to examine a symbol and your cleric is next to you... Or any number of equally retarded examples. | ||
|
Apom
France656 Posts
On August 16 2023 23:11 Merany wrote: Still, easy GOTY, having so much more fun than its likely contender, TotK. Bold words with Starfield releasing in two weeks ;-) | ||
|
Artesimo
Germany567 Posts
When it comes to making your characters yours, the game is really disappointing to me. Character customisation is limited when you venture out of the generic, and almost 0 effort things like offering mirrored versions of all hairstyles, tattoos or scars would have been appreciated. My biggest gripe is with the available equipment and armour though, as there are simply too few equipments I like the appearance off, they often feel very generic fantasy. And even fewer actually match class fantasies, which is a shame. And that is even without caring for stats, once you look for good gear you either have the most generic character design in mind, or you will inevitable lose the ability to make the character "yours" in looks. Especially in my coop campaign it has hurt my enjoyment immensely that our party doesn't look the part because the other players would have had to cripple themselves for that. This feels extremely weird as this is usually the easy part with the hard part of being able to act like your RPG fantasy being mostly well met here. As immersion breaking as it would be, I never wished more for a cosmetics slot, even more than in divinity2, and I pray that eventually there will be a mod doing exactly that rather than the half baked modding solutions we had in divinity2/have for bg3 right now. There are also other gripes I have with gamemechanics, but those are just me despising the DnD system which larian has already done a great job at making palatable for me. So they are more of a personal preference. Another thing is the usual jankiness that comes with lots of NPCs and any sandbox related setting, those are just par for the course and I accept them as such. Its a great and very solid game, but for me, the shortcomings in roleplay in an RPG really take it down a peg and keep it from being a true masterpiece, together with the writing and presentation feeling like they fall off noticeably after maybe halfway into the 2nd act. And I guess the "solid" part also falls off after that when it comes to stability. Great start, some flaws, didn't stick the landing. Overall a great experience. | ||
|
Merany
France890 Posts
On August 19 2023 15:21 Apom wrote: Bold words with Starfield releasing in two weeks ;-) That duel has been settled long ago for me I watched 30 seconds of that stupid "shooter with spongy enemies" gameplay when they first showcased it and I knew it wasn't for me. (will probably play it anyway for everything else the game has to offer but 0 chance for GOTY in my book)But back on topic! Regarding companions and skill check and dialogs, I don't know, doesn't bother me that much. Companions interject regularly (wish there were more of those though) and there's been quite a few instances of "let other NPC do the talking" which I liked. On the other hand, it's been extremely rare that conversation initiate on an NPC I did not choose, talking maybe twice in a 100h save. Party based RPGs have been very, very player centric historically (BG1-2, Dragon Age) so that may be the reason I don't mind. The only game I can think of that did differently was Pillars of Eternity 2 but that came with another issue in that you generally have enough characters and skill points that you're able to cover all your bases and then, skill checks don't matter anymore. Anyway, nearing the end of act II, cannot wait to visit Baldur's Gate and still enjoying my time immensely! | ||
|
Slaughter
United States20254 Posts
| ||
| ||
StarCraft 2 StarCraft: Brood War Dota 2 League of Legends Counter-Strike Super Smash Bros Heroes of the Storm Other Games |
|
Replay Cast
Wardi Open
Monday Night Weeklies
OSC
WardiTV Winter Champion…
Replay Cast
WardiTV Winter Champion…
The PondCast
Replay Cast
Korean StarCraft League
[ Show More ] |
|
|
EPT
