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Godwrath
Spain10126 Posts
On February 11 2016 04:18 ref4 wrote: that's why I always bring 2 grenadiers on every mission: 1 with shredder and 1 with blast padding plus you can shred enemy armor with frag & plasma grenades Yeah, the thing is that a second shredder is even more useful. | ||
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Gorsameth
Netherlands21664 Posts
On February 11 2016 04:18 ref4 wrote: that's why I always bring 2 grenadiers on every mission: 1 with shredder and 1 with blast padding plus you can shred enemy armor with frag & plasma grenades I'd still bring 2 shredders :p But that seems to be the strength of the game. Even on Commander you can bring a large variety of setups and be successful. (no idea about Legendary). | ||
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xDaunt
United States17988 Posts
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hfglgg
Germany5372 Posts
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Godwrath
Spain10126 Posts
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Spazer
Canada8031 Posts
Everyone should read this. | ||
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daemir
Finland8662 Posts
And that activated a pod of 2 mutons and an archon. Gets better, apparently, the VIP cannot actually leave the cell, because I haven't hacked the door yet. So I'm like alright, sit tight I clear this and we...no, as soon as it's the aliens turn, the archon just flies through the locked hack door. And the door is _still_ locked. VIP by some miracle dodges the first melee swing, so I get a turn again and the VIP is yet again, stuck in the cell with the archon >_> So I go to plan B and blow the backwall of the cell with a plasma nade, make the VIP rush for a roof and as far as possible away, while I have overwatch set for the archon. Archon takes his turn, flies through 5 overwatches without taking a hit and then...and then turns and shoots the VIP through the roof above it. Like, actual, unhurt, solid roof. Right, when the game pulls bs like this on me, I don't feel bad restarting that mission. This archon apparently has wallhacks on. | ||
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xDaunt
United States17988 Posts
On February 11 2016 05:39 Spazer wrote: https://www.reddit.com/r/Xcom/comments/45279h/heres_how_weapon_accuracy_and_damage_works/ Everyone should read this. Very interesting. I definitely am going to look for some mods for my next playthrough. A few abilities and items definitely seem kinda undertuned. Late game swords immediately come to mind. Don't get me wrong -- I adore my blademaster ranger, and he is consistently the facilitator of my most spectacular plays -- but basic sword damage needs a solid buff to compete with late game shotguns. Fully upgraded shotguns outperform swords by roughly 100% late game (factoring in crits, accuracy, extra range, etc). | ||
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andrewlt
United States7702 Posts
On February 11 2016 05:20 hfglgg wrote: yeah you dont wanna get shot anyway and aliens tend to not shoot the one soldiers with blast padding anyway. That's why I'm not sold on the skill. I notice that aliens tend to use explosives only when they can hit more than 1 soldier with it. So it's either at least 2 soldiers with blast padding or I'm going to have another really hurt soldier. The silly wounds mechanic also makes medics pretty bad imo. | ||
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Blitzkrieg0
United States13132 Posts
On February 11 2016 06:08 daemir wrote: So this kind of bs happened. I had my scout ranger sneak up on a prison cell where I needed to get a VIP out. She climbed on a middle floor roof area and suddenly the prisoner spots her, through the roof I might add. That for some reason instantly took her out of concealment and the VIP became under my control. And that activated a pod of 2 mutons and an archon. Gets better, apparently, the VIP cannot actually leave the cell, because I haven't hacked the door yet. So I'm like alright, sit tight I clear this and we...no, as soon as it's the aliens turn, the archon just flies through the locked hack door. And the door is _still_ locked. VIP by some miracle dodges the first melee swing, so I get a turn again and the VIP is yet again, stuck in the cell with the archon >_> So I go to plan B and blow the backwall of the cell with a plasma nade, make the VIP rush for a roof and as far as possible away, while I have overwatch set for the archon. Archon takes his turn, flies through 5 overwatches without taking a hit and then...and then turns and shoots the VIP through the roof above it. Like, actual, unhurt, solid roof. Right, when the game pulls bs like this on me, I don't feel bad restarting that mission. This archon apparently has wallhacks on. I've seen Archons fly through a roof before, so shooting through them isn't much further off. | ||
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Spazer
Canada8031 Posts
On February 11 2016 06:13 xDaunt wrote: Very interesting. I definitely am going to look for some mods for my next playthrough. A few abilities and items definitely seem kinda undertuned. Late game swords immediately come to mind. Don't get me wrong -- I adore my blademaster ranger, and he is consistently the facilitator of my most spectacular plays -- but basic sword damage needs a solid buff to compete with late game shotguns. Fully upgraded shotguns outperform swords by roughly 100% late game (factoring in crits, accuracy, extra range, etc). I think swords are in an okay place. The way I see it, they're not meant as a replacement to shotguns - they're a supplement. I think the accuracy on swords is tuned to prevent them from being guaranteed damage - after all, being to mindlessly slash the last enemy on a map (dodge notwithstanding) is something Firaxis likely wants to avoid. Thus, we end up with the wonky situation where shotguns are straight-up better than swords at point blank. I think an "easier" fix for sword/shotgun accuracy would be to give swords +40% accuracy when not dashing. This puts them on par with shotguns, and avoids the situation where dashing slashes are guaranteed. I'm fine with swords dealing less damage than shotguns. It's a tradeoff for not using ammo. Lastly, the viability of swords in the lategame boils down to whether you took Reaper over Rapid Fire. Fortunately, Reaper is a pretty amazing perk. Obviously it's good at killing a bunch of wounded enemies, but it can also be treated like a free Run and Gun. You can dash up and sword someone, and now you have a free action (or two free actions with Implacable!). Now you have the choice of following up with another slash, running away (unlikely with Untouchable!), or even shooting someone with the shotgun. It's really flexible. | ||
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Gorsameth
Netherlands21664 Posts
On February 11 2016 07:19 Spazer wrote: I think swords are in an okay place. The way I see it, they're not meant as a replacement to shotguns - they're a supplement. I think the accuracy on swords is tuned to prevent them from being guaranteed damage - after all, being to mindlessly slash the last enemy on a map (dodge notwithstanding) is something Firaxis likely wants to avoid. Thus, we end up with the wonky situation where shotguns are straight-up better than swords at point blank. I think an "easier" fix for sword/shotgun accuracy would be to give swords +40% accuracy when not dashing. This puts them on par with shotguns, and avoids the situation where dashing slashes are guaranteed. I'm fine with swords dealing less damage than shotguns. It's a tradeoff for not using ammo. Lastly, the viability of swords in the lategame boils down to whether you took Reaper over Rapid Fire. Fortunately, Reaper is a pretty amazing perk. Obviously it's good at killing a bunch of wounded enemies, but it can also be treated like a free Run and Gun. You can dash up and sword someone, and now you have a free action (or two free actions with Implacable!). Now you have the choice of following up with another slash, running away (unlikely with Untouchable!), or even shooting someone with the shotgun. It's really flexible. Flexible is nice but lategame I would much rather have a way of killing tough enemies like the Andromeda in 1 action and Rapid Fire with a close range shotgun lets you do that. | ||
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Snotling
Germany885 Posts
I used to nuke half a screen with a grenade laucher proximity mine/advanced granade. And then finish them of with swordguy doing his rounds. Killing four, five or even six enemys without any risk is quite easy. On the other hand run and gun -> shotgun -> give another action with psiguy 1 ->shogun -> give another action with psiguy 2 -> shotgun works very well to (on turn were the dark lances are on cooldown. Also mindcontrolling two big enemys early on is op as fuck. And if anybody is in a bad position: Mimic beacon solves any problem in the game anyways.... Another really op..ähhm lucky thing: My Greandier executed two sectopods in the same mission. :D I also just finished my C/I run. (33 Missions 8 flawless, 8 soldiers killed, 384 or so aliens killed). Toward the end I skipped a lot of optional missions, because is had enough money and fully trained soldiers anyways Amazing last fight. + Show Spoiler + Somehow Dragon Ball x X-Com kinda works^^ Also nice setup for a TFTD remake :D | ||
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Godwrath
Spain10126 Posts
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Gorsameth
Netherlands21664 Posts
On February 11 2016 07:56 Godwrath wrote: Not really, gunslinger falls flat in lategame Having tried both in seperate campaigns I like the gunslinger more then I thought I would but it is important not to forget you still have a sniper rifle. Not counting squadsight your getting atleast 2 pistol shots in which is roughly equal to what a sniper would do, esp when you consider its 2x the chance to hit. It adds a lot of utility on the move which is great since your no longer able to just leave your sniper at spawn and dominate. Mostly tho the sniper skills are not that powerful imo. The only skill I sad about give up was Deadeye shot but Killzone misses to much and Death from Above doesnt do much anyway (since you cant snipe twice) That said. I did keep Serial because being able to clean up multiple far away enemies is just to good. Even tho 3 more pistol shots sounds great. For me Gunslinger is about a sniper who can still put out effective damage while moving. No need to go full Clint Eastwood with it. | ||
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nanaoei
3358 Posts
but that's not going to stop people from doing it (myself included) and typically only works against weakened grenade targets at range. let's just say that it's definitely not reliable, and pistols really fall off IMO even compared to sniper rifles. | ||
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hfglgg
Germany5372 Posts
i felt that gunslingers were vastly superior to snipers until the lategame when you have access to superior scopes, aim pcs and have to deal with enemies a fan fire gunslinger cant take out on his own anymore. snipers in the early to midgame are too unreliable and their damage is often wasted. edit: am i the only one who finds it strangely satisfying to look at the map at the end of a mission and see all the destruction you have caused? | ||
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Latham
9560 Posts
Does this happen often? No. But it happened now. And if I prefer to mod my grenadiers' weapons and leave the sniper rifles naked, I'd take a solider that can take out 2-3 weakened enemies from previous grenades over 1 bulking shot for 8 damage average. The only noticeable difference I can see is the "true" sniper has +20 aim for her main weapon over the gunslinger when he also uses his sniper rifle. | ||
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daemir
Finland8662 Posts
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Gorsameth
Netherlands21664 Posts
On February 11 2016 09:03 daemir wrote: Viability of gunslinger is directly tied to what kind of ammo item you give him. AP ammo since he suffers from it more then any other class. | ||
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