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crazyman64335
United States7 Posts
Casters http://www.youtube.com/user/nickgracey http://www.youtube.com/user/DoWReplaysNet http://www.youtube.com/user/RedRupee http://www.youtube.com/user/RadicallyDreaming/ Elite Mod (Download this if you want to play Multiplayer, it's a complete overhaul adding a new race, tons of balancing fixes, and new units. One of the best mods available in my opinion) http://www.dawnofwar.info/index.php?page=elite/about Thanks for reading and happy mothers day! | ||
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Paramo
Mexico138 Posts
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Lyter
United Kingdom2145 Posts
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RolleMcKnolle
Germany1054 Posts
Imagine 2 squads chasing each other in circles around a tree. Replace tree with control point, and you have Dawn of War 2 | ||
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Manit0u
Poland17553 Posts
On May 13 2013 01:56 RolleMcKnolle wrote: because dow1 is just way superior in every aspect of gameplay, relic sucks huge champions and the gameplay(back when I played it) is best summarized with: Imagine 2 squads chasing each other in circles around a tree. Replace tree with control point, and you have Dawn of War 2 This is a very flawed view of the game. You could say that about SC2 too: Imagine 2 army blobs chasing each other in circles around a hill, you have SC2. DoW2 capping/decapping is similar to CoH. | ||
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murphs
Ireland417 Posts
DoW 1 was a million miles better, and that itself pales in comparison to StarCraft. I played DoW1 for years and I gave up DoW2 3 weeks after it came out. It is actually the worst game I have ever played and I say that as a long time PC gamer, a fan of the franchise and a fan/player of Warhammer 40k. I can confirm that reric were a bunch of fruiting kermits when it came to making DoW2. | ||
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crazyman64335
United States7 Posts
On May 13 2013 02:19 murphs wrote: It's not a competitive RTS. It's not even an RTS. DoW 1 was a million miles better, and that itself pales in comparison to StarCraft. I played DoW1 for years and I gave up DoW2 3 weeks after it came out. It is actually the worst game I have ever played and I say that as a long time PC gamer, a fan of the franchise and a fan/player of Warhammer 40k. I can confirm that reric were a bunch of fruiting kermits when it came to making DoW2. the worst pc game you've every played? i mean you're entitled to your own opinion obviously but i think that's WAY to extreme. There are tons of far worse games, perhaps you took the approach that many players took was because there was more strategy involved in the 2nd game that it isn't nearly as good as DOW1. The matches don't reach that level of epicness that often anymore, but when they do it makes them all the more sweeter. | ||
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crazyman64335
United States7 Posts
On May 13 2013 01:11 Paramo wrote: I tried retribution multiplayer when it came out but honestly all the different damage types and gear options made it a bit daunting. And after a while it was very hard to find a multipalyer game so I eventually stoped trying theres a steam group called L2P dawn of war 2. they often have open lobbies with a player named Codex who knows the game like the back of his hand. He tells players a ton of information which makes them fairly competitive regardless of gametime played. And sadly finding a multiplayer game is still rather difficult because players are afraid of that learning curve. I'd recommend giving that a shot if you are even remotely interested in the multiplayer. | ||
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murphs
Ireland417 Posts
On May 13 2013 02:43 crazyman64335 wrote: perhaps you took the approach that many players took was because there was more strategy involved in the 2nd game that it isn't nearly as good as DOW1. 1. Nice subtle insult 2. Bullshit And yes the worst game that I've ever played. DoW1 was the first multiplayer game that I played and I played it for 5 years. I had massive expectations for DoW2 and what I got made me want to vomit. The campaign was good, the multiplayer was criminal. There may be worse games out there, I'm sure there are. However DoW2 is the worst that I personally have played. | ||
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Yorke
England881 Posts
On May 13 2013 02:19 murphs wrote: It's not a competitive RTS. It's not even an RTS. DoW 1 was a million miles better, and that itself pales in comparison to StarCraft. I played DoW1 for years and I gave up DoW2 3 weeks after it came out. It is actually the worst game I have ever played and I say that as a long time PC gamer, a fan of the franchise and a fan/player of Warhammer 40k. I can confirm that reric were a bunch of fruiting kermits when it came to making DoW2. Ha! Love this post. Sums up my feelings too. So disappointing. | ||
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Manit0u
Poland17553 Posts
But I also liked WC3 and AoX more than BW and Diablo 1 more than Diablo 2. SC2 and D3 are complete and utter garbage in my eyes. Guess I just like different kinds of games to the majority of people... | ||
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murphs
Ireland417 Posts
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Godwrath
Spain10134 Posts
On May 13 2013 03:22 Manit0u wrote: I don't know. I was huge into DoW 1 (as I'm also a tabletop 40k fan/player) and I liked DoW 2 more. The only thing that killed it for me when it came out was GFWL bullshit. Later on playerbase just wasn't big enough. Same for me. But my problem was the imbalance the few first months (and mind you, i played nids, so i wasn't exactly in the short end of the stick). I just got bored eventually and never looked back. Maybe today it's an awesome game, but i can't be bothered since i don't have the expansions. Btw Manitou i want to kill matt ward for the latest high elves army book :d | ||
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Tobberoth
Sweden6375 Posts
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TehRei
Sweden261 Posts
I dunno. Personally I don't think that RTT-games are as viewer friendly or, for lack of a better word, "e-sports-friendly", which is why I think it's gotten so little recognition as a competitive game. But that's just my opinion, it's not facts by any stretch of the imagination. I'm not saying this to bash on you or your thread by the way, there are plenty of games that I feel are about as good as DoW2, but still get a lot more viewers and a more active scene than DoW2 seems to have. Sorry if my post read as being condescending or anything, it's just we're all different when it comes to games I guess. EDIT: The above poster also raises a good point. If they would've made DoW2 into a separate title instead of as a sequel, it should at the very least have been looked at with less hate by fans of the original. As a fan of the older Fallout games it would be similar to how Fallout: Tactics works out. It's in the same universe, but it's very different in how it's played. I don't much care for it, but it's sort of a spin-off, so it doesn't really bother me either. However, when Fallout 3 came out, branded as the sequel to Fallout 2, I was not happy. | ||
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cythaze
830 Posts
with chaos rising and to some extent retribution it got a lot better and a lot more balanced, but without any support (no prizemoney tournaments) it was just there to slowly die. atm i can´t find a game at my mmr at all under 10 mins, rofl... | ||
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crazyman64335
United States7 Posts
On May 13 2013 04:20 cythaze wrote: Reason why this got no regocnition as an esports is that any promotion efforts by the publishers happened when it was the most unbalanced game ever to be played competitivly (i remember german EPS having 13/16 players playing tyranid or something until patch 1.4.2)... with chaos rising and to some extent retribution it got a lot better and a lot more balanced, but without any support (no prizemoney tournaments) it was just there to slowly die. atm i can´t find a game at my mmr at all under 10 mins, rofl... yes finding matches is terribly annoying, steam chat particularly helpful in that regard. Elite mod is fairly populated and i can usually find a match in under 5 minutes almost always. Elite Mod also balanced out a ton of problems in the vanilla retribution and as for the no tournaments, there were 2 last month alone. i participated in one. | ||
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crazyman64335
United States7 Posts
On May 13 2013 03:22 murphs wrote: Anyway welcome to TL crazyman, it's not always this rough I assure you. haha thanks, i've apparently been on team liquid for some time now, but actually never knew it. thank god for password reset. | ||
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Catch]22
Sweden2683 Posts
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Raelcun
United States3747 Posts
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teapot
United Kingdom266 Posts
There are problems with the game, but I only think that people who have an understanding of the game can really comment on them, not the "DoW2 doesn't have base building" crowd. Actually thats not fair, anyone can criticize it, but I feel that some of the criticism is misguided and could possible be rectified with improved understanding of the game. | ||
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Derez
Netherlands6068 Posts
I can imagine that right now MP sucks due imbalanced stuff, but I've definately gotten my money's worth out of it. According to steam I've played it 122 hours total, makes it a great purchase. And yes, DoW1 was better. | ||
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KovuTalli
United Kingdom325 Posts
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Skirmjan
Italy190 Posts
On May 13 2013 03:22 Manit0u wrote: I don't know. I was huge into DoW 1 (as I'm also a tabletop 40k fan/player) and I liked DoW 2 more. The only thing that killed it for me when it came out was GFWL bullshit. Later on playerbase just wasn't big enough. But I also liked WC3 and AoX more than BW and Diablo 1 more than Diablo 2. SC2 and D3 are complete and utter garbage in my eyes. Guess I just like different kinds of games to the majority of people... A good majority of DoW1 veterans scorned DoW2, i'd say some 2/3s or something, with a higher dislike among the upper tiers of DoW1 competitions (go visit the RTSanctuary forums, former DoWsanctuary if you don't believe me) In fact, most of the DoW top players in the end came to Sc2 (Select and RAZERServyoa, to name 2) What really made us angry was the genre swap, from RTS to RTT. (as others have already said in the thread) The DoW series went from having base building, resource investments in macro, tech and micro to having an economy based almost entirely on territory control with games becoming land grabs and battles to gain the upper hand in the "resource lost" chart. Besides, the game speed/resource gain was slowed to a crawl making the game really CoH 1,5; however that wouldn't really be bad if it wasn't on an estabilished franchise and in a universe were it really doesn't make any sense... the 40k universe rules even estabilishes that against non-armor piercing fire cover is totally useless for people with space marine-level armor (also some heavier armored eldar/orks), and even ignoring all the races with morale-less fighters or very, very hard to break it's hard to accept that elite superhuman warriors somehow behave like volksgrenadier under fire and get suppressed by an enemy MG. The fact that you can't build anything anymore (Listening Post is gone) on your control points makes defending harder than attacking, as you need to spread out MGs and stuff to slow attacking forces down that would otherwise rush your point, decap it and leave. I don't even need to mention Relic patch support here, suffices to say that pretty much all of the expansions of DoW1 have at least a gamebreaking bug in their matchmaking service. Add to that i didn't like the fact that they pretty clearly cut content to make way for the expansions, as it had basically the same races as vanilla DoW minus Chaos and adding in it Tyranids:Chaos is a basic race that cannot be omitted from a 40K game, so you knew an expansion would come and add that, then the other essential the imperial guard. Obviously tho while most DoW1 expansions added 2 races, DoW2 added just one. So no, i'm sorry manitou, but it isn't even fair comparing it to Sc2 in any shape or form. (and that's besides being unable to due to genre difference) TL DR;+ Show Spoiler + 1)DoW2 wouldn't be a bad CoH clone, if it wasn't a WarHammer40.000 game and a step back towards arcade and casual audiencies (or, they tried that, i don't think they actually succeded) in comparison to the estabilished franchise it tried to build on. 2)It has lackluster support from a company infamous for that, if a problem arises in a Relic game, you don't expect it to be fixed 3)It's business model is... unconvincing? at least to me 4)It basically killed the franchise, in fact the proposed DoW3 now somewhat vaporware was supposed to be a step back towards DoW1 Imho+ Show Spoiler + in the RTT genre CoH and its clones are outclassed by more purist/realistic RTTs like Men of War, but that's a matter of taste entirely... i didn't dislike CoH, in fact i own it and had my fun, but it gets old really fast as it feels like a puzzle game "position your units better than your enemy's, since you basically have the same manpower" On May 13 2013 04:49 Catch]22 wrote: 100% pink or 100% silver armies, as every 12 year old player designed theirs, got old really fucking fast i don't see how people being trolls detracts from a game o.O | ||
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Godwrath
Spain10134 Posts
On May 13 2013 07:29 Skirmjan wrote: Besides, the game speed/resource gain was slowed to a crawl making the game really CoH 1,5; however that wouldn't really be bad if it wasn't on an estabilished franchise and in a universe were it really doesn't make any sense... the 40k universe rules even estabilishes that against non-armor piercing fire cover is totally useless for people with space marine-level armor (also some heavier armored eldar/orks), and even ignoring all the races with morale-less fighters or very, very hard to break it's hard to accept that elite superhuman warriors somehow behave like volksgrenadier under fire and get suppressed by an enemy MG. While i agree on some points, i find others subjective (chaos not being included in vanilla for example, was perfectly fine for me). I will point out game mechanichs. Cover is useless for MEQ against torrent fire because game mechanichs on wh40k allow for it, it doesn't make sense neither it is realistic (all about cover saves is unrealistic when it's not stacked to regular armour). And to be honest, as a competitive 40k player (the tabletop only, because i left DoW2 long time ago  ) is one of the biggest issues in the game right when it comes to balancing armies. It's exactly the reason why most xeno armies suck compared to MEQ if they do not have the numbers to back it up and 6th edition widened the gap with the nerf to cover saves and so many capture missions. Also, "superhumans" are not stupid, why would they run straigh to an MG, not to speak that ATSNKF still exists and for the sake of the gameplay, it had to be done that way.So in short, good riddance. | ||
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ToT)OjKa(
Korea (South)2437 Posts
Sure, 1 always had little imbalances and sometimes blown out ones which were fixed, but the game was always fun. Because there was so much crazy shit and abilities in that game, people would always keep adapting and create new strats and techniques. 2 is just so emotionless. I like Company of Heroes, it's a sick game but the half-baked version that DoW2 became was just so boring. Even when you've pretty much got the map you have to wait around. Game had a myriad of problems and it's a big shame Relic took it into RTT so poorly. | ||
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KaiserJohan
Sweden1808 Posts
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HeatEXTEND
Netherlands836 Posts
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Manit0u
Poland17553 Posts
On May 13 2013 19:35 ToT)OjKa( wrote: Dawn of War 1 was hella superior. I think if it had all the streaming capabilities we had today it would have been even more popular. Shit was fast, furious and visceral. Sure, 1 always had little imbalances and sometimes blown out ones which were fixed, but the game was always fun. Because there was so much crazy shit and abilities in that game, people would always keep adapting and create new strats and techniques. 2 is just so emotionless. I like Company of Heroes, it's a sick game but the half-baked version that DoW2 became was just so boring. Even when you've pretty much got the map you have to wait around. Game had a myriad of problems and it's a big shame Relic took it into RTT so poorly. New strats all the time? 90% of the games you would see the same 1 or 2 strats/race over and over again. For Chaos you could expect Raptor spam or rush to Hellions, Orks didn't do much past shoota boyz spam with big mek support, DE mandrake spam etc. Most of the strats revolved around just spamming some low tier units and hard tech to uber goodness, on some occasions you didn't even need to tech as some strats were do or die early spam without much chances for transition into mid-late game if it failed or fast tech to spam higher tier unit. In summary, you would pick a unit and spam it in hopes of succeeding. DoW2 required more mixed-arms armies to be successful which was an improvement in my eyes. | ||
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murphs
Ireland417 Posts
On May 14 2013 04:26 Manit0u wrote: New strats all the time? 90% of the games you would see the same 1 or 2 strats/race over and over again. For Chaos you could expect Raptor spam or rush to Hellions, Orks didn't do much past shoota boyz spam with big mek support, DE mandrake spam etc. Most of the strats revolved around just spamming some low tier units and hard tech to uber goodness, on some occasions you didn't even need to tech as some strats were do or die early spam without much chances for transition into mid-late game if it failed or fast tech to spam higher tier unit. In summary, you would pick a unit and spam it in hopes of succeeding. DoW2 required more mixed-arms armies to be successful which was an improvement in my eyes. OjKa is talking about vanilla pre 1.3. The game was mad back then, in a good way, then reric lost the fruiting plot. DoW1 sucked after vanilla but give me that over the musical chairs of DoW2 any day. | ||
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ShadowArm
23 Posts
-Dawn of War 2 will receive a Massive birthday Update http://www.dawnofwar.com/news/2016/02/27/bug-patch-update-retribution -Necron Lord Announced(after 5 years), and its Free for all for 5 days, then it will return for its normal price, for all those who owns Retribution http://www.dawnofwar.com/news/2016/02/27/introducing-the-necron-overlord Here's the Trailer with Lord Inquisitor Mordecai Toth being the Announcer once again, since DoW 1 -Sega is working hard on DoW Publicity lately, the last Make love not War had DoW2, CoH2 and TW:Attila, and it ended with DoW2 Crushing DEM OVER THE DEFFROLLA, The Dawn of War 3 Domain was registered last year and the are a lot of hints that Relic its working already on DoW II behind the Curtains, people are asking for more DoW 1 with a bit of SC2 Cutscenes(and Animated Unit portraits) and DoW2 Cover System http://www.dawnofwar.com/news/2016/02/22/winners-of-make-war-not-love -Classic DoW MP On steam is now Playing Ultimate Apocalypse mod for SS, Fried's Sister of battle mod Was Updated for SS, DowPro too -Dawn of War 2 MP community is still divided between Vanilla and the Mod with the Protegees of the SIlver Baby Carrier(Elite Mod) -Also for Other 40k Games related News: Eternal Crusade is doing great, Eldar looks polished(plans for Helmet less Space Elfs soon along with banshees), Orks are on their way, and the 1st large maps will be released soon(thanks to the weekly progress streams) And BattleFleet Gothic Armada will have MODS, so if someone wants to do a SC Fleet Mod with Protoss, Zerg and Terran Fleet DO IT!, i want to see the Spear of Adun Ramming Against the Necron World Engines GeeDubs is Somewhat hinting that they are moving 40k to the End times Plot on the Tabletop, Curse of the Wulfen Pt1 was the Wolftime Well, Sorry for the necro, but since there's no Warhammer Games general thread | ||
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