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Vindicare605
United States16129 Posts
On March 14 2012 13:49 RowdierBob wrote: Holy shit, Mayo. 25 shots for 14 points. Wow. We got lucky that he shot that poorly because Speights and Marc were just hammering us constantly especially off turnovers. Honestly the Grizzlies are looking REALLY good right now. I can see them making it out of the west just as easily as I can see anyone else, especially if Zach Randolph can get healthy by the time the postseason gets here. | ||
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nemY
United States3119 Posts
On March 14 2012 13:44 RowdierBob wrote: It's a good thing. Warriors weren't going anywhere this year anyway. If they suck it up enough now (possible) they can keep their pick. Next season will be the big one for the Warriors. They just had their best game of the year, but... it was vs the Kings so hard to take serious. I get the idea that they're going to try to suck their way into a lotto pick, but it's going to be painful to watch with Bieds starting and playing so much every night. Fact is though they've got a ways to go before they reach Sacramento's level of tanking... How good can an Ellis/Jennings backcourt really be? I mean I feel like an Ellis/Curry backcourt was destined to fail so how can an Ellis/Jennings backcourt really be any more successful? | ||
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Riskr
Germany403 Posts
If I count defense alone as a criteria,i´ll take him over all above. Well we all know that the j from marion isn´t in the books in terms of sober technics. But don´t forget he was an All-Star 20+ pps player for years. One of the best rebounders at that position also,and he is still a great post up player. And pls name a small forward who even played center from time to time,if needed be,i cant remember anyone,maybe Sheed ( but i count him as 4). | ||
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iLoveKT
Philippines3615 Posts
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Holcan
Canada2593 Posts
On March 14 2012 13:54 Riskr wrote: Yes i am,maybe the matrix offense days are gone,but the 1 on 1 defense is unmatched. If I count defense alone as a criteria,i´ll take him over all above. Well we all know that the j from marion isn´t in the books in terms of sober technics. But don´t forget he was an All-Star 20+ pps player for years. One of the best rebounders at that position also,and he is still a great post up player. And pls name a small forward who even played center from time to time,if needed be,i cant remember anyone,maybe Sheed ( but i count him as 4). what's that matter? you askes fot better wing defenders than marion, then gave some bias excuse to why marion is better. batum, wallace, artest, prince are all comparable to marions d, the people I listed are top of the game. marion is good, and a pivatol reason they won, but he isn't some sort of defensive god. i.imgur.com/im87V.jpg | ||
Jibba
United States22883 Posts
 In fact, all strong SFs generally have their way with him (including Richard Jefferson.) He generally does great against Kobe and Durant and the like, but he's at a major disadvantage against anyone who can body him.I don't know if I'd rank him as high as those other perimeter defenders for that reason. Richard Jefferson ffs... | ||
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Riskr
Germany403 Posts
And no they are not better wing defenders,thats the point. | ||
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Holcan
Canada2593 Posts
On March 14 2012 14:55 Riskr wrote: sure its biased,like your statements aren´t............................................. And no they are not better wing defenders,thats the point. I don't care for any of those players I mentioned, except for Prince, how is that bias? Bias that I asses them from an objective standpoint, perhaps. My guess is you have no clue who Luc M'Bah Moute even is, and that tells me something right there. On March 14 2012 14:37 Jibba wrote: Just for the record, Prince has a history of being abused by Lebron. In fact, all strong SFs generally have their way with him (including Richard Jefferson.) He generally does great against Kobe and Durant and the like, but he's at a major disadvantage against anyone who can body him.I don't know if I'd rank him as high as those other perimeter defenders for that reason. Richard Jefferson ffs... Yea, thats probably true, I definitely have rose tinted glasses when thinking about Prince. But I can definitely see what you're are saying when people body him to get separation. | ||
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Riskr
Germany403 Posts
I don't care for any of those players I mentioned, except for Prince, how is that bias? Bias that I asses them from an objective standpoint, perhaps. My guess is you have no clue who Luc M'Bah Moute even is, and that tells me something right there. Of course i know him,maybe thats why they got ellis...that tells me something right there.... And your opinions are always bias as are mine,from an objective standpoint marion is better than them. | ||
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Holcan
Canada2593 Posts
of course everyone else in the world thinks its lebron james or moute, but they are just biased and wrong. | ||
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Riskr
Germany403 Posts
For some unknown and obscure reason (probably cuz your a Lebron/Moute fan) they are the best wind defenders. of course everyone else in the universe thinks marion is great too(even Kobe),defending point guards etc.,but they are unknowledgable and biased. l | ||
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Holcan
Canada2593 Posts
is marion top 10? yup. top 5? perhaps. top 3? not while there is allen, lebron and moute guarding wings. I'm not a fan of any of these players, or teams mentioned, btw. you are a mavs fan though, I can tell by the german tag beside your name. | ||
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Riskr
Germany403 Posts
But that doesnt disregard the fact that he is Top 3. Does Allen or Moute shut down Lebron or Kobe? Even some of the top pg´s like Chris Paul? Have they done what Marion did last playoffs? Ask yourself honestly that question. I never claimed that Moute or Allen are not top notch on their assignment. Some even consider Marion defensive player of the year,despite the struggle of the mavs. You see i am not the only one who thinks this way. Now pls stop calling me an biased mavs fan with zero knowledge of the game...i watched nba regularly since the jordan era. | ||
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Holcan
Canada2593 Posts
Honestly that question is answered, that yes, Allen has played in big moments and shut down big players, and Moute does as well. Anyways, we are arguing semantics at this point, you are still biased though, and until you diversify your knowledge of other players, I WILL call you out on it. It isn't my responsibility for you to be aware that Tony Allen is often regarded as the best wing defender, or that Lebron James is a defensive beast, or that Moute always specifically guards the opponents hardest players. You asked me to name a better wing defender, I named three, stop getting into a fit because you don't agree about a subjective term like "top wing defender". Now if you are asking if they have a ring? I'd combat that having a ring means nothing in terms of being a good wing defender, as that is only one small aspect of a larger picture. | ||
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igotmyown
United States4291 Posts
And Pau Gasol trade rumors with the Bulls. Lakers fans, remember how Pau's not good enough, go trade him for Boozer. Or Noah, you can't depend on that soft spaniard. | ||
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Riskr
Germany403 Posts
And yes i watched 2 games of Memphis vs OKC last year.( i´m also a Z-Bo fan since Portland.....) I am biased,the point is you claim you are not.... And I WILL call you out on that. It isn´t also my responsibility to point out that Marion is at least on the same level as they are,or even better,and is even regarded as defensive player of the year... Yes and you pointet out YOUR opinion. And "only one small aspect of a larger picture" to show up when it matters most?no comment on that.... | ||
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RowdierBob
Australia13537 Posts
I'd say Moute is the best on-ball defender in the NBA, but maybe I'm biased. I remember last year when the Bucks easily had the worst offense in the NBA but would win games purely because of Moute locking down the wings and Bogut dominating the middle. It was like the Pistons of 04 (except they couldn't score, obv...). | ||
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Riskr
Germany403 Posts
And who truly the best is,is a matter of opinion. But claiming Marion is not on pair with them is wrong. He did great against the Heat. Against Kobe?not so much. | ||
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Ace
United States16096 Posts
As for Marion, he's good. But I wouldn't even rate him top 5 wing defenders especially if we are including PGs. There is so much to being a good wing defender and while Marion is really good - there are a lot of insanely great wing defenders in the league even taking out superstars. Bah a Moute, Battier, Allen, Lowry, Conley, Rondo, Afflalo, Deng, Iggy, Gerald Wallace. There are many ways to rate defense and these guys usually pass the check mark in all areas. It doesn't mean Marion isn't any good but that all of these guys are really special. | ||
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igotmyown
United States4291 Posts
Ignore the headline, the most satisfying explanation of the Knicks that I've seen While D'Antoni's offense calls for Anthony to plant himself on the wing at the 3-point line, he often creeps in to his favorite spot in the floor -- the area between the elbow, the arc and the post. That kills the Knicks' ability to run the high pick-and-roll and ruins the spacing that is so critical to D'Antoni's offense. When Anthony first returned -- and it still appears to be the case -- Lin would bring the ball upcourt and try to run D'Antoni's system. When Anthony would abandon the offense, Lin would not pass him the ball, which irritated Anthony, sources said. So when Lin tried to talk to Anthony on the court, Anthony would turn his back to the point guard and tune him out. The two never had heated exchanges, though, and the players tried to come to a compromise, agreeing to run D'Antoni's system while also mixing in post-ups for Anthony. "But it's just a mess because D'Antoni's system is not designed for that | ||
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