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Path of Exile - Page 133

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Guild invites: Message any of EvoSenseOfPride, ScionViableORly, neophyteWham, TheTouchOfGOLD in game
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sob3k
Profile Blog Joined August 2009
United States7572 Posts
Last Edited: 2012-08-19 03:04:43
August 19 2012 02:41 GMT
#2641
Well, I bought this game after being really sick of D3 and being really impressed with the passive tree....well, the passive tree is great but I have to say the game isn't very entertaing.

The combat is just so incredibly unresponsive I just cant handle it, bigger skills have absurdly slow animations and cast times, and your attack range is frustratingly low and uninterruptible. I feel like im playing diablo 1, and thats not a good thing. Trying to actually kite or dodge projectiles is like slogging through cement, and the hitboxes are irregular and unintuitive on any type of AOE. Enemies are ok, but many death animations are incredible unclear/slow, so its difficult to tell when you have actually killed something, which leads too a lot of swinging at air.

The potion system further dumbs down the fighting, as most of the time i feel like the best strategy is to stand still and spam while chugging pots to maximize DPS.

The items are obnoxiously enormous and your inventory is stupidly tiny, this combined with the limited ID scrolls and TP makes collecting loot a pain in the ass. The human response to finding something with mystery stats is to want to look at them, its basic curiosity. Unfortunately I have to sell probably more than 90% of my items unid, which also makes most of the items in the game seem more boring as they have no distinguishing characteristics you ever see.

Interface is not efficient in many cases, and is displays information crappily. As a basic example:

[image loading]


Skill gems redundantly use an entire line to show the gem level which is already shown in the title. The experience bar which is shown on the side of your screen and is relatively unimportant information is also redundantly shown in top billing, while the actual stats are separated by a fat lump of descriptive text you will only ever need to read once or twice.

[image loading]


Flasks measure their capacity in charges, then a drink uses some random number of charges....Why not just measure the capacity in actual uses (drinks) and cut out this completely pointless conversion? Why is the recovery and recovery time split into two lines? Why not just say "Mana Recovery: 100 over 7 seconds".

Not being able to equip items from the selling screen is obnoxious. Casting speed is not a visible stat in the character screen.

These small poor design decisions stack up and make the GUI clumsy and ugly. You want to see the information at a glance, not search through an excel spreadsheet.

The currency system is ok, but I wouldn't call it an improvement on gold by any measure. Its confusing and clumsy when there is no way to efficiently sort these 40 different tiny items that you have to walk to stash to unload every time you town to sell shit. There is a reason why people in the real world avoid barter systems when they can. Odd facts like the minumum selling price of one scroll fragment also results in strange situations where you can sell a stack of 10 transmutation shards for one scroll fragment...or split the stack into 10 individual transmutation shards and sell them individually for 10 scroll fragments....For player player trading, having to use these trinkets is just flat out clumsy, as nobody really understands their absolute value, people will end up using one or two as a default currency, so why not just make add gold and simplify the whole process?

I know the game is still under development, so I'm not saying its hopeless, but they have a long way to go before I would actually consider playing often or recommending it to friends.

EDIT: the music is really awesome
In Hungry Hungry Hippos there are no such constraints—one can constantly attempt to collect marbles with one’s hippo, limited only by one’s hippo-levering capabilities.
Birdie
Profile Blog Joined August 2007
New Zealand4438 Posts
Last Edited: 2012-08-19 03:27:51
August 19 2012 03:27 GMT
#2642
A lot of your complaints are intentional design features which a lot of players like
Red classic | A butterfly dreamed he was Zhuangzi | 4.5k, heading to 5k as support!
Pwere
Profile Joined April 2010
Canada1557 Posts
Last Edited: 2012-08-19 03:34:52
August 19 2012 03:33 GMT
#2643
@ Sob3k:

The combat will be smoothed out. They're aware that combat is incredibly slow and unresponsive at lower levels. I'm not sure how much they'll address this before open beta, however.

The potion system gets more complex as there are flasks that grant resistance, armor, boost damage, and other effects. The fact that you should basically always be drinking one is intended, and it makes boss fights different since you do not refill them indefinitely.

You're not supposed to ID everything, and this design has a few nice consequences. You'll leave a lot of stuff on the ground, just get used to it. ID what's good for your class/build, leave/sell the rest.

Next, the redundancy is because one is the Level of the Gem, and the other is the effective level of the gem. Some items increase the level of gems socketed in them, so that number is not always the same. This seems like nitpicking. There is plenty of room on the screen to show the stats and text.

Flasks measure in charges because some skills affect that number. You also know that you can spam a flask that require 8 charges a lot more than one that requires 18. As for the recovery and time, that's because flasks can have more than one effect over its duration.

I'm not sure for casting speed, but cast time is displayed if you mouse over individual skills.

As for currencies, most people feel that it makes the end game more interesting, because there is a currency sink. Moreover, it makes alts more relevant because they accumulate a fair amount of currencies even at lower levels, which means you aren't wasting your time until you hit the endgame. Finally, currencies won't be limited to one or two used as money, because all currencies have a relative value and most are actually useful. One person might value currencies differently than someone else. But I'll give you that it is hard to figure out their relative value without resorting to outside help.

I feel like some of your complains are due to a lack of understanding of how the whole system comes together. You're right on a few points too, mainly the last one:
The music really is awesome !
Silentenigma
Profile Joined July 2009
Turkey2037 Posts
Last Edited: 2012-08-19 04:03:58
August 19 2012 04:01 GMT
#2644
+ Show Spoiler +
On August 19 2012 11:41 sob3k wrote:
Well, I bought this game after being really sick of D3 and being really impressed with the passive tree....well, the passive tree is great but I have to say the game isn't very entertaing.

The combat is just so incredibly unresponsive I just cant handle it, bigger skills have absurdly slow animations and cast times, and your attack range is frustratingly low and uninterruptible. I feel like im playing diablo 1, and thats not a good thing. Trying to actually kite or dodge projectiles is like slogging through cement, and the hitboxes are irregular and unintuitive on any type of AOE. Enemies are ok, but many death animations are incredible unclear/slow, so its difficult to tell when you have actually killed something, which leads too a lot of swinging at air.

The potion system further dumbs down the fighting, as most of the time i feel like the best strategy is to stand still and spam while chugging pots to maximize DPS.

The items are obnoxiously enormous and your inventory is stupidly tiny, this combined with the limited ID scrolls and TP makes collecting loot a pain in the ass. The human response to finding something with mystery stats is to want to look at them, its basic curiosity. Unfortunately I have to sell probably more than 90% of my items unid, which also makes most of the items in the game seem more boring as they have no distinguishing characteristics you ever see.

Interface is not efficient in many cases, and is displays information crappily. As a basic example:

[image loading]


Skill gems redundantly use an entire line to show the gem level which is already shown in the title. The experience bar which is shown on the side of your screen and is relatively unimportant information is also redundantly shown in top billing, while the actual stats are separated by a fat lump of descriptive text you will only ever need to read once or twice.

[image loading]


Flasks measure their capacity in charges, then a drink uses some random number of charges....Why not just measure the capacity in actual uses (drinks) and cut out this completely pointless conversion? Why is the recovery and recovery time split into two lines? Why not just say "Mana Recovery: 100 over 7 seconds".

Not being able to equip items from the selling screen is obnoxious. Casting speed is not a visible stat in the character screen.

These small poor design decisions stack up and make the GUI clumsy and ugly. You want to see the information at a glance, not search through an excel spreadsheet.

The currency system is ok, but I wouldn't call it an improvement on gold by any measure. Its confusing and clumsy when there is no way to efficiently sort these 40 different tiny items that you have to walk to stash to unload every time you town to sell shit. There is a reason why people in the real world avoid barter systems when they can. Odd facts like the minumum selling price of one scroll fragment also results in strange situations where you can sell a stack of 10 transmutation shards for one scroll fragment...or split the stack into 10 individual transmutation shards and sell them individually for 10 scroll fragments....For player player trading, having to use these trinkets is just flat out clumsy, as nobody really understands their absolute value, people will end up using one or two as a default currency, so why not just make add gold and simplify the whole process?

I know the game is still under development, so I'm not saying its hopeless, but they have a long way to go before I would actually consider playing often or recommending it to friends.

EDIT: the music is really awesome


I agree about combat system.It is sometimes painful to chase a ranged mob for a minute because your attacks are too slow.Also sometimes there are necromancers in a place that you cant reach easily so have to kill 100 zombies to reach them.

Pot system is fine.Most of the time you should stand and kill stuff anyway.But sometimes you have to kite.I agree that kiting in this game sucks compare to D3.But one of reasons D3 sucked was endless kiting.You just had to kite a elite pack for 5 minutes.It was boring.

I completely agree about inventory too small and items are way too big.You shouldnt unid every item only items that you think it will be good for your class.You get good mats if you vendor unid items so they are still worthy even if you cant use.
I think you are nitpicking about gems.It is nothing huge.

There are items and skills effect flask charges etc.It doesnt change the gameplay nothing to worry about.

I think you are nitpicking again and you are forgetting you are still playing BETA.

One of reasons D3 failed was gold currency.It simplifies the too much.To not have gold currency in ARPG is a good thing imo similar to D2.It forces people to do stupid things like vase box farming.It also encourages people to hack/bot more.It is way easier to hack someone and steal all his gold with one click than remove all of his mats and his yellows/blues.Also it is way easier to buy 100k gold from a website than buying lots of mats from someone than exchange it for other mats.

I admit that game is not perfect but it is still very good considering it s still in closed beta.
日本語が上手ですね
dust7
Profile Joined March 2010
199 Posts
August 19 2012 10:18 GMT
#2645
Also sometimes there are necromancers in a place that you cant reach easily so have to kill 100 zombies to reach them.

Or you could, you know, just use any skill that cleans/shatters corpses like anybody else when fighting a tough necro pack.
Zhiroo
Profile Joined February 2011
Kosovo2724 Posts
August 19 2012 10:35 GMT
#2646
There's easy ways to deal with Nercos. Like Detonade Dead, Infernal Blow and Explosive Arrow also cold damage if you crit.
LoL EuW: Zhiroo - By starting this squabble you've proven nothing but how vast your stupidity is.
-Archangel-
Profile Joined May 2010
Croatia7457 Posts
August 19 2012 13:37 GMT
#2647
On August 19 2012 19:35 Zhiroo wrote:
There's easy ways to deal with Nercos. Like Detonade Dead, Infernal Blow and Explosive Arrow also cold damage if you crit.

And Raise Zombie.
Silentenigma
Profile Joined July 2009
Turkey2037 Posts
August 19 2012 17:12 GMT
#2648
Thanks for info:D
日本語が上手ですね
BLinD-RawR
Profile Blog Joined April 2010
ALLEYCAT BLUES51702 Posts
Last Edited: 2012-08-19 17:20:59
August 19 2012 17:17 GMT
#2649
On August 19 2012 22:37 -Archangel- wrote:
Show nested quote +
On August 19 2012 19:35 Zhiroo wrote:
There's easy ways to deal with Nercos. Like Detonade Dead, Infernal Blow and Explosive Arrow also cold damage if you crit.

And Raise Zombie.


best way to beat a necro is to play a necromancer yourself.
+ Show Spoiler +
Brood War EICWoo Jung Ho, never forget.| Twitter: @BLinDRawR
Southlight
Profile Blog Joined August 2007
United States11768 Posts
August 19 2012 18:06 GMT
#2650
On August 19 2012 08:30 Tennet wrote:
Show nested quote +
On August 19 2012 07:28 Southlight wrote:
I don't feel like playing until after the wipe

Use prewipe to experiment and make the stupid decisions.


Thing is, because currency and skill gems (which are hard as balls to get) carry over, I feel like experimenting with other characters/making dumb decisions still wouldn't be a "waste of time," so to speak :< Wish it would just go into release (open) already
oraoraoraoraoraoraoraora
-Archangel-
Profile Joined May 2010
Croatia7457 Posts
August 19 2012 18:18 GMT
#2651
On August 20 2012 03:06 Southlight wrote:
Show nested quote +
On August 19 2012 08:30 Tennet wrote:
On August 19 2012 07:28 Southlight wrote:
I don't feel like playing until after the wipe

Use prewipe to experiment and make the stupid decisions.


Thing is, because currency and skill gems (which are hard as balls to get) carry over, I feel like experimenting with other characters/making dumb decisions still wouldn't be a "waste of time," so to speak :< Wish it would just go into release (open) already

Nothing will carry over but character names and what you bought with real money + kiwis if you got them.
Zhiroo
Profile Joined February 2011
Kosovo2724 Posts
August 19 2012 20:07 GMT
#2652
On August 20 2012 03:18 -Archangel- wrote:
Show nested quote +
On August 20 2012 03:06 Southlight wrote:
On August 19 2012 08:30 Tennet wrote:
On August 19 2012 07:28 Southlight wrote:
I don't feel like playing until after the wipe

Use prewipe to experiment and make the stupid decisions.


Thing is, because currency and skill gems (which are hard as balls to get) carry over, I feel like experimenting with other characters/making dumb decisions still wouldn't be a "waste of time," so to speak :< Wish it would just go into release (open) already

Nothing will carry over but character names and what you bought with real money + kiwis if you got them.


Exactly so experiment at your hearts content. I've deleted so many characters so far testing out all kinds of things.
LoL EuW: Zhiroo - By starting this squabble you've proven nothing but how vast your stupidity is.
Southlight
Profile Blog Joined August 2007
United States11768 Posts
August 19 2012 20:09 GMT
#2653
I mean when you experiment, you rack up currency items, which carry over to the characters that do matter to you. The game does a really nice job of making every effort "not a waste of time," so it's hard for me to want to bother knowing a wipe is imminent :<
oraoraoraoraoraoraoraora
Tennet
Profile Joined January 2010
United States1458 Posts
August 19 2012 20:19 GMT
#2654
Your characters shouldn't matter before the wipe, because they will be wiped at open beta. Make the mistakes and stuff before the wipe. Try different builds for your class, try different things with the passive tree, get the skills you didn't pick etc.
"The harder it gets, the more you need to focus on the basics." - Seo Gyung Jong
beef42
Profile Blog Joined October 2008
Denmark1037 Posts
August 21 2012 23:32 GMT
#2655
Just bumping to reissue my general invitation to anyone wanting to run maps as a party. My character names are either BasementDweller or TheNewDeal, or you can PM me here on TL and we can work something out.

I long for company, and I'm not selfish about the loot. I have maps and alterations we can use, so that's not a problem either. Pweeeeeze TL.
-Dustin-
Profile Blog Joined July 2011
United States718 Posts
Last Edited: 2012-08-22 00:00:37
August 21 2012 23:48 GMT
#2656
I'd love to play with you beef but I can't get the game to update :\. I'll add a list of TL players that would like others to play with to the OP.

PM me here if you want your name added to the list of Path of Exile players looking for others to play with.
beef42
Profile Blog Joined October 2008
Denmark1037 Posts
August 22 2012 00:08 GMT
#2657
On August 22 2012 08:48 -Dustin- wrote:
I'd love to play with you beef but I can't get the game to update :\. I'll add a list of TL players that would like others to play with to the OP.

PM me here if you want your name added to the list of Path of Exile players looking for others to play with.


Have you attempted the procedure described here, (PackCheck)?

Should fix any corrupted files right up.
Erik_Olofsson
Profile Joined August 2012
1 Post
August 22 2012 00:16 GMT
#2658
sob3k: I have been working on a item hover update the last few days, and some of the problems you highlighted in your post have been fixed. The flask especially was problematic as you very accurately identified in your post. Here's a preview of what the new flask hover looks like. There is still time for tweaks, so please let me know if there's anything else that can be improved. [image loading]

beef42
Profile Blog Joined October 2008
Denmark1037 Posts
August 22 2012 00:23 GMT
#2659
Maybe you guys should ditch the help text? I think we get it by now and it's a whopping three lines.
-Dustin-
Profile Blog Joined July 2011
United States718 Posts
Last Edited: 2012-08-22 00:33:14
August 22 2012 00:29 GMT
#2660
On August 22 2012 09:08 beef42 wrote:
Show nested quote +
On August 22 2012 08:48 -Dustin- wrote:
I'd love to play with you beef but I can't get the game to update :\. I'll add a list of TL players that would like others to play with to the OP.

PM me here if you want your name added to the list of Path of Exile players looking for others to play with.


Have you attempted the procedure described here, (PackCheck)?

Should fix any corrupted files right up.

Oh no its nothing to do with the game client or anything. I'm currently on a very slow connection and it drops it so often that I can't get it to finish. I may try again in a couple days.

About the flasks I agree that the box shouldn't be filled with text but more info is always nice, but its probably something you will only read a few times when you start and then its pointless. Maybe you could have an option for more 'info' like a tutorial mode kinda thing that just displays how to and such on items. It'd be less spammy for the veteran players and more informative for the new players.
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