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What's up with Wigan recently.. beat Liverpool, Man Utd, Arsenal, gave Chelsea a scare and now up 2-0 against Newcastle :o
Also... COME ON ARSENAL!
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On April 28 2012 23:20 Terminal wrote:
What's up with Wigan recently.. beat Liverpool, Man Utd, Arsenal, gave Chelsea a scare and now up 2-0 against Newcastle :o
Also... COME ON ARSENAL!
Survival instincts are pumping in.
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Man I would not want to face Wigan at the moment. Poor Newcastle 0_0 a defeat here may cost them champions league.
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On April 28 2012 23:10 Timurid wrote:Show nested quote +On April 28 2012 22:53 Rebs wrote:On April 28 2012 22:32 Ysellian wrote:On April 28 2012 22:11 Steveling wrote:
No sc4k, you forgot the reason why the whole talent drafting thing is viable in the us. The reason is because the new players come from other organizations(colleges) and these teams aren't in nba/nfl.
It would be pretty ridiculous if we applied it in football and random weak teams could fetch barcelonas or arsenals greatest talents and then compete against them with these same players that they spent money and effort and many years to develop. And yet it is perfectly normal for it to happen the other way around. Arsenal, and plenty of other top clubs, poach plenty of talented players from other professional teams a cross Europe before they can sign a contract (or just very cheap due to expiring contracts) only to end up selling them off for millions more. edit: Even within leagues top teams poach youngsters from lesser teams all the time. Just putting a stop to this from happening would be equal to the American drafting system. As some guy already mentioned you can weigh the merits of draft/cap vs the relative freedom of football and your grand kids would still be doing it. Its in many ways an apple to oranges comparison with respect to scope, fanbase, marketing, player base, teams, competition and god knows so much more. You cannot effectively administer a draft system in football. This is simply not possible and secondly its not fair. Football is to big to many people will suffer and the logistics are hardly manageable. Also even if you could, drafting is not exactly a great thing either all the time. Ask anyone with half a brain about the NBA this season and how more than half the league went on a tank spree to get good draft picks. Because 1 player can make a diff there its a different deal. And even then you barely have maybe 10 franchises who actually have titles. So its not exactly worked like a charm has it. But Im digressing. It has its benefits but its not going to work in football. As for caps and such, yea sure the FA's have to step in for that. UEFA is doing what it can. Ultimate responsiblity should be with the clubs. The punishments are there if you fuck up. Might want to ask what the players think about it while your at it. I dont see to many happy faces (spoilt fuckers init?). Lets be honest aside from Cesc, Wenger hasnt really "poached' anything from anywhere cept France. And more importantly for all his poaching great players he hasnt won the league in nearly 10 years. And the last time he did it, it was with a chalk full of oldschool badasses and the strong parts of the french national team that was on the back off winning everything possible, he assembled the team brilliantly no doubt. But the times seemed to have moved past that philosophy and I can only hope the circle back to it. Arsenal does turn a profit and does a great job at it. But they dont win anything. Football is about winning first as far as clubs are concerned atleast thats been the obsession thats led to this financial mess that is europe. Im sure alot of the people running these teams are alot more intelligent than the people with great (usually borrowed) ideas on message boards but alot of them do weigh the best approaches. Many are idiots. Not all of them, still the culture needs to break and that starts with fans being more accepting. Otherwise teams will be reluctant to change the status quo. Neither of which i see happening in the near future. We got Eisfeld from Dortmund, Toral and bellerin from camp mou, Dawkins from Northampton, chamberlain and walcott from southampton, and Ramsey from Cardiff. Also, Miyaichi and campbell. We poached other countries than france. RVP!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
facepalm.. alright dude you win, thanks for totally missing the point. Clearly poaching players now means just taking potentials for player development regardless of wether they are soon to be bonafide starters/superstars. Every fucking team takes players from all over the place lol. Thats what academies do Its not poaching unless it turns out to be a proven loss to the club you take them from and improves your club. Aside from Ox who is decent and looks good there isnt really any poaching going on. Sorry those are just examples of signings all clubs do for their reserves and training, on a pretty regular basis.
Also yay Rosicky ! Boss that midfield.
YAY Wigan ! I love that team so much haha. Always a story.
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Newcastle still have to face an in-form Chelsea and City lol.
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51500 Posts
6 goals in the Swansea-Wolves game and it's only 35 minutes in, what the fuck.
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On April 28 2012 23:32 Rebs wrote:Show nested quote +On April 28 2012 23:10 Timurid wrote:On April 28 2012 22:53 Rebs wrote:On April 28 2012 22:32 Ysellian wrote:On April 28 2012 22:11 Steveling wrote:
No sc4k, you forgot the reason why the whole talent drafting thing is viable in the us. The reason is because the new players come from other organizations(colleges) and these teams aren't in nba/nfl.
It would be pretty ridiculous if we applied it in football and random weak teams could fetch barcelonas or arsenals greatest talents and then compete against them with these same players that they spent money and effort and many years to develop. And yet it is perfectly normal for it to happen the other way around. Arsenal, and plenty of other top clubs, poach plenty of talented players from other professional teams a cross Europe before they can sign a contract (or just very cheap due to expiring contracts) only to end up selling them off for millions more. edit: Even within leagues top teams poach youngsters from lesser teams all the time. Just putting a stop to this from happening would be equal to the American drafting system. As some guy already mentioned you can weigh the merits of draft/cap vs the relative freedom of football and your grand kids would still be doing it. Its in many ways an apple to oranges comparison with respect to scope, fanbase, marketing, player base, teams, competition and god knows so much more. You cannot effectively administer a draft system in football. This is simply not possible and secondly its not fair. Football is to big to many people will suffer and the logistics are hardly manageable. Also even if you could, drafting is not exactly a great thing either all the time. Ask anyone with half a brain about the NBA this season and how more than half the league went on a tank spree to get good draft picks. Because 1 player can make a diff there its a different deal. And even then you barely have maybe 10 franchises who actually have titles. So its not exactly worked like a charm has it. But Im digressing. It has its benefits but its not going to work in football. As for caps and such, yea sure the FA's have to step in for that. UEFA is doing what it can. Ultimate responsiblity should be with the clubs. The punishments are there if you fuck up. Might want to ask what the players think about it while your at it. I dont see to many happy faces (spoilt fuckers init?). Lets be honest aside from Cesc, Wenger hasnt really "poached' anything from anywhere cept France. And more importantly for all his poaching great players he hasnt won the league in nearly 10 years. And the last time he did it, it was with a chalk full of oldschool badasses and the strong parts of the french national team that was on the back off winning everything possible, he assembled the team brilliantly no doubt. But the times seemed to have moved past that philosophy and I can only hope the circle back to it. Arsenal does turn a profit and does a great job at it. But they dont win anything. Football is about winning first as far as clubs are concerned atleast thats been the obsession thats led to this financial mess that is europe. Im sure alot of the people running these teams are alot more intelligent than the people with great (usually borrowed) ideas on message boards but alot of them do weigh the best approaches. Many are idiots. Not all of them, still the culture needs to break and that starts with fans being more accepting. Otherwise teams will be reluctant to change the status quo. Neither of which i see happening in the near future. We got Eisfeld from Dortmund, Toral and bellerin from camp mou, Dawkins from Northampton, chamberlain and walcott from southampton, and Ramsey from Cardiff. Also, Miyaichi and campbell. We poached other countries than france. RVP!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! facepalm.. alright dude you win, thanks for totally missing the point. Clearly poaching players now means just taking potentials for player development regardless of wether they are soon to be bonafide starters/superstars. Every fucking team takes players from all over the place lol. Thats what academies do Its not poaching unless it turns out to be a proven loss to the club you take them from and improves your club. Aside from Ox who is decent and looks good there isnt really any poaching going on. Sorry those are just examples of signings all clubs do for their reserves and training, on a pretty regular basis. Also yay Rosicky ! Boss that midfield. YAY Wigan ! I love that team so much haha. Always a story.
What are you talking about? Miyaichi and Campbell are both out on loan and have been doing pretty well. Dawkins is only 16. So he needs time to develop into a star player. The two from camp mou are 16 too. So they are still young and need time to develop. So these guys aren't pickups for the reserve teams. They are young and bright youth players that hopefully develop into star players for Arsenal. Also, saying oxlade is decent is an understatement.
Woohoo thank god for wigan. Now let the boys finish off stoke and we secure 3rd place!
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effin newcastle, I know they have nothing to win but my respect (and money for me)... :c
e. 4-0 now, and with an absolute stunner from Di Santo -.-
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On April 28 2012 23:48 HwangjaeTerran wrote:
effin newcastle, I know they have nothing to win but my respect (and money for me)... :c
e. 4-0 now, and with an absolute stunner from Di Santo -.-
Your fault really. Betting against a team fighting relegation on a decent streak? Poor bet man.
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On April 28 2012 23:42 Timurid wrote:Show nested quote +On April 28 2012 23:32 Rebs wrote:On April 28 2012 23:10 Timurid wrote:On April 28 2012 22:53 Rebs wrote:On April 28 2012 22:32 Ysellian wrote:On April 28 2012 22:11 Steveling wrote:
No sc4k, you forgot the reason why the whole talent drafting thing is viable in the us. The reason is because the new players come from other organizations(colleges) and these teams aren't in nba/nfl.
It would be pretty ridiculous if we applied it in football and random weak teams could fetch barcelonas or arsenals greatest talents and then compete against them with these same players that they spent money and effort and many years to develop. And yet it is perfectly normal for it to happen the other way around. Arsenal, and plenty of other top clubs, poach plenty of talented players from other professional teams a cross Europe before they can sign a contract (or just very cheap due to expiring contracts) only to end up selling them off for millions more. edit: Even within leagues top teams poach youngsters from lesser teams all the time. Just putting a stop to this from happening would be equal to the American drafting system. As some guy already mentioned you can weigh the merits of draft/cap vs the relative freedom of football and your grand kids would still be doing it. Its in many ways an apple to oranges comparison with respect to scope, fanbase, marketing, player base, teams, competition and god knows so much more. You cannot effectively administer a draft system in football. This is simply not possible and secondly its not fair. Football is to big to many people will suffer and the logistics are hardly manageable. Also even if you could, drafting is not exactly a great thing either all the time. Ask anyone with half a brain about the NBA this season and how more than half the league went on a tank spree to get good draft picks. Because 1 player can make a diff there its a different deal. And even then you barely have maybe 10 franchises who actually have titles. So its not exactly worked like a charm has it. But Im digressing. It has its benefits but its not going to work in football. As for caps and such, yea sure the FA's have to step in for that. UEFA is doing what it can. Ultimate responsiblity should be with the clubs. The punishments are there if you fuck up. Might want to ask what the players think about it while your at it. I dont see to many happy faces (spoilt fuckers init?). Lets be honest aside from Cesc, Wenger hasnt really "poached' anything from anywhere cept France. And more importantly for all his poaching great players he hasnt won the league in nearly 10 years. And the last time he did it, it was with a chalk full of oldschool badasses and the strong parts of the french national team that was on the back off winning everything possible, he assembled the team brilliantly no doubt. But the times seemed to have moved past that philosophy and I can only hope the circle back to it. Arsenal does turn a profit and does a great job at it. But they dont win anything. Football is about winning first as far as clubs are concerned atleast thats been the obsession thats led to this financial mess that is europe. Im sure alot of the people running these teams are alot more intelligent than the people with great (usually borrowed) ideas on message boards but alot of them do weigh the best approaches. Many are idiots. Not all of them, still the culture needs to break and that starts with fans being more accepting. Otherwise teams will be reluctant to change the status quo. Neither of which i see happening in the near future. We got Eisfeld from Dortmund, Toral and bellerin from camp mou, Dawkins from Northampton, chamberlain and walcott from southampton, and Ramsey from Cardiff. Also, Miyaichi and campbell. We poached other countries than france. RVP!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! facepalm.. alright dude you win, thanks for totally missing the point. Clearly poaching players now means just taking potentials for player development regardless of wether they are soon to be bonafide starters/superstars. Every fucking team takes players from all over the place lol. Thats what academies do Its not poaching unless it turns out to be a proven loss to the club you take them from and improves your club. Aside from Ox who is decent and looks good there isnt really any poaching going on. Sorry those are just examples of signings all clubs do for their reserves and training, on a pretty regular basis. Also yay Rosicky ! Boss that midfield. YAY Wigan ! I love that team so much haha. Always a story. What are you talking about? Miyaichi and Campbell are both out on loan and have been doing pretty well. Dawkins is only 16. So he needs time to develop into a star player. The two from camp mou are 16 too. So they are still young and need time to develop. So these guys aren't pickups for the reserve teams. They are young and bright youth players that hopefully develop into star players for Arsenal. Also, saying oxlade is decent is an understatement.
Im saying that when you call a player "poached" its because he turned out to be a star. Poaching is not signing young kids from parent clubs. Thats just signing kids. Every other player who does "well" on loan didnt get poached. Clubs do let them go you know. Its not like Arsenal just go and take them. Its only an effective coup and a poach when the parent club gave them up not realizing their worth. And ofcourse they have to be kids hell thats what it means. So no he hasnt "poached" many if any players aside from France and Cesc. There might be the odd example here or there but generally None of these players you mention have any "realised" worth as of now. Cesc did, Nasri did, even Flamini did lol. And fanboy arguements aside. That wasnt even important I hate it when people latch onto things that arent important to disprove something unrelated. I mean if your going to start couting those players then let me remind you of a certain Francis Jeffers or more recently Niklas Bendtner were they poached to? hardly. Every promising player is not "poached". Hes just signed. Its a poach when the club wins games and he had something to do with it.
And all that aside I dont care if he "poaches" players from Timbuktu.
It has gotten a grand total of 0 trophies, and I wished it wasnt the case. That was the important part. But you dragged it so far away trying to prove the masterclass of the Arsenal scouting system It doesnt even matter anymore. Thanks.
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On April 28 2012 23:57 Rebs wrote:Show nested quote +On April 28 2012 23:42 Timurid wrote:On April 28 2012 23:32 Rebs wrote:On April 28 2012 23:10 Timurid wrote:On April 28 2012 22:53 Rebs wrote:On April 28 2012 22:32 Ysellian wrote:On April 28 2012 22:11 Steveling wrote:
No sc4k, you forgot the reason why the whole talent drafting thing is viable in the us. The reason is because the new players come from other organizations(colleges) and these teams aren't in nba/nfl.
It would be pretty ridiculous if we applied it in football and random weak teams could fetch barcelonas or arsenals greatest talents and then compete against them with these same players that they spent money and effort and many years to develop. And yet it is perfectly normal for it to happen the other way around. Arsenal, and plenty of other top clubs, poach plenty of talented players from other professional teams a cross Europe before they can sign a contract (or just very cheap due to expiring contracts) only to end up selling them off for millions more. edit: Even within leagues top teams poach youngsters from lesser teams all the time. Just putting a stop to this from happening would be equal to the American drafting system. As some guy already mentioned you can weigh the merits of draft/cap vs the relative freedom of football and your grand kids would still be doing it. Its in many ways an apple to oranges comparison with respect to scope, fanbase, marketing, player base, teams, competition and god knows so much more. You cannot effectively administer a draft system in football. This is simply not possible and secondly its not fair. Football is to big to many people will suffer and the logistics are hardly manageable. Also even if you could, drafting is not exactly a great thing either all the time. Ask anyone with half a brain about the NBA this season and how more than half the league went on a tank spree to get good draft picks. Because 1 player can make a diff there its a different deal. And even then you barely have maybe 10 franchises who actually have titles. So its not exactly worked like a charm has it. But Im digressing. It has its benefits but its not going to work in football. As for caps and such, yea sure the FA's have to step in for that. UEFA is doing what it can. Ultimate responsiblity should be with the clubs. The punishments are there if you fuck up. Might want to ask what the players think about it while your at it. I dont see to many happy faces (spoilt fuckers init?). Lets be honest aside from Cesc, Wenger hasnt really "poached' anything from anywhere cept France. And more importantly for all his poaching great players he hasnt won the league in nearly 10 years. And the last time he did it, it was with a chalk full of oldschool badasses and the strong parts of the french national team that was on the back off winning everything possible, he assembled the team brilliantly no doubt. But the times seemed to have moved past that philosophy and I can only hope the circle back to it. Arsenal does turn a profit and does a great job at it. But they dont win anything. Football is about winning first as far as clubs are concerned atleast thats been the obsession thats led to this financial mess that is europe. Im sure alot of the people running these teams are alot more intelligent than the people with great (usually borrowed) ideas on message boards but alot of them do weigh the best approaches. Many are idiots. Not all of them, still the culture needs to break and that starts with fans being more accepting. Otherwise teams will be reluctant to change the status quo. Neither of which i see happening in the near future. We got Eisfeld from Dortmund, Toral and bellerin from camp mou, Dawkins from Northampton, chamberlain and walcott from southampton, and Ramsey from Cardiff. Also, Miyaichi and campbell. We poached other countries than france. RVP!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! facepalm.. alright dude you win, thanks for totally missing the point. Clearly poaching players now means just taking potentials for player development regardless of wether they are soon to be bonafide starters/superstars. Every fucking team takes players from all over the place lol. Thats what academies do Its not poaching unless it turns out to be a proven loss to the club you take them from and improves your club. Aside from Ox who is decent and looks good there isnt really any poaching going on. Sorry those are just examples of signings all clubs do for their reserves and training, on a pretty regular basis. Also yay Rosicky ! Boss that midfield. YAY Wigan ! I love that team so much haha. Always a story. What are you talking about? Miyaichi and Campbell are both out on loan and have been doing pretty well. Dawkins is only 16. So he needs time to develop into a star player. The two from camp mou are 16 too. So they are still young and need time to develop. So these guys aren't pickups for the reserve teams. They are young and bright youth players that hopefully develop into star players for Arsenal. Also, saying oxlade is decent is an understatement. Im saying that when you call a player "poached" its because he turned out to be a star. Poaching is not signing young kids from parent clubs. Thats just signing kids. Every other player who does "well" on loan didnt get poached. Clubs do let them go you know. Its not like Arsenal just go and take them. Its only an effective coup and a poach when the parent club gave them up not realizing their worth. hell thats what it means. So no he hasnt "poached" many if any players aside from France and Cesc. There might be the odd example here or there but generally None of these players you mention have any "realised" worth as of now. Cesc did, Nasri did, even Flamini did lol. Any fanboy arguements aside. That wasnt even important I hate it when people latch onto things that arent important to disprove something unrelated. I dont care if he "poaches" players from Timbuktu. It has gotten a grand total of 0 trophies, and I wished it wasnt the case. That was the important part. But you dragged it so far away trying to prove the masterclass of the Arsenal scouting system It doesnt even matter anymore. Thanks.
The game has change and many teams are spending batshit crazy now. I have a feeling Arsene is going to change his transfer philosophy this summer. Granted we haven't won due to various injuries, player departures, and just very sloppy play at times. The youth players that are mention above are all quality players and they'll be good in the future. Some players need time to develop not all are superstars right out of gate. Miyaichi, Coquelin, and Campbell (if he gets his work permits fixed) will probably have some playing time for arsenal next year.
AHHH sorry for the confusion i was confused there for awhile. I learn something new everyday.
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Pretty sad to see the Stoke fans booing Ramsey ://
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On April 29 2012 00:23 Neelia wrote:
Pretty sad to see the Stoke fans booing Ramsey ://
Some arsenal fans want ramsey to brake his leg again such sick people.
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Only 1 game without conceding a goal and Bayern has equalized the record for the best defense(they conceded only 21 goals 07/08). They play against Köln next week, so that should be doable.
Kinda funny when you consider that many people in Germany criticised them for the lack of quality in their defense.
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United Kingdom16710 Posts
There's just no way we (Arsenal) are going to vie for any trophies next season with this squad. If Van Persie wants to leave in the summer, I wouldn't really blame him. His best bet for winning titles is most likely away from the Emirates. So sad that we've become such a mediocre team over the past 6~7 years.
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On April 29 2012 00:32 clusen wrote:
Only 1 game without conceding a goal and Bayern has equalized the record for the best defense(they conceded only 21 goals 07/08). They play against Köln next week, so that should be doable.
Kinda funny when you consider that many people in Germany criticised them for the lack of quality in their defense.
Badstuber played a great season, cool headed and always solid.
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On April 29 2012 00:39 Telcontar wrote:
There's just no way we (Arsenal) are going to vie for any trophies next season with this squad. If Van Persie wants to leave in the summer, I wouldn't really blame him. His best bet for winning titles is most likely away from the Emirates. So sad that we've become such a mediocre team over the past 6~7 years.
Well, look at Nasri and cesc both out of the champions and 1 is out of the league hunt. RVP will sign with us again. If we sign top players like Verthogen from ajax and m'vila or Javi Martinez. Hopefully, we sign Belhanda what talent that guy is. We already signed podolski according to the daily mail. We make some good deals like these in summer we will become a contender on all fronts next year.
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I only used the word "poach" because it was used in a similar context in this article. Which was the point I was trying to make about that the same thing a draft system would force on teams already happens. Only players move towards the big teams (and at a much younger age as well). To implement a draft system would be impossible because we do not have the school system to back it up, but "fairness" is the worst of the counter-arguments.
edit: Oh and I'm not crying about it or anything. Our Youth academy do the same, but it happens and that is the issue.
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EPT
